2008 Osteopathic Student Resources for Anesthesia

[Ventdoc2be]

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Just wanted to start an up-to-date thread for osteopathic students interested in Anesthesia (esp. for 3rd years), so we could get some feedback, assistance, ect...

Some questions...
1. Step 2 USMLE- should we take it, or will Step 2 COMLEX suffice?
2. Any programs out there that are "DO friendly"?
3. Any programs that are NOT "DO friendly"?
4. How many programs should we apply to? Do we need to cast a wider net since we are DO's?
5. What I need to know to do well (okay, extremely well) on my rotation/subI?
6. What months should I do my "interview" rotations?

Thanks in advance to anyone willing to give advice. It is much appreciated!

 

[flipcyde]

I know there are others out there with more experience but thought I'd share my thoughts since people on this site have been pretty helpful for me when I had questions.

1. It's always advisable to make the playing field even. Furthermore, you should do anything that will strengthen your application and make programs choose you over an equally qualified applicant, whether it be DO or MD. So definitely take Step 2. It's my opinion that it's much easier to do well in.

2. There are plenty of programs that are DO friendly. Apply where you want to go and let the strength of your application speak for itself. I received interviews at some great places, some were at these "elite" programs and some were at lesser known programs. Bottom line: apply where you'd like to end up. It's pretty easy to click on interested programs in ERAS. Although some may argue that it'll cost a couple bucks more, in the end it'll be worth it.

3. I've heard prior to applying that Sinai, Cornell, Columbia and NYU are DO unfriendly. I did not receive invitations from those programs but perhaps there are some DO's out there that did. You can ask around.

4. It has been suggested that you should plan on ranking ten programs. I think I applied to over 25 programs. Cancelled about 6 interviews. Planning on ranking 8. Will be happy to match in my top 3. I'll let you know how things turn out on March 18th.

5. I'll defer to a great post for this question: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=374930

6. Ideally you should do them early if you haven't secured an anesthesia letter during your third year. If you have, I'd suggest doing them anytime in August through October.

Hope this helps and good luck!

 

[amyl]

hey -- another OMS IV here -- i second everything flip said and will add a few to the DO unfriendly list: louisville, UT knoxville, emory, mgh... i have heard of DO interviews at MUSC and VT but they have no DO residents --

 

[Ventdoc2be]

Another question: With only one elective available 3rd year, do you recommend doing a research elective or an Anesthesia elective? 😕

 

[amyl]

can you do research in anesthesiology? you need a letter of rec from an anesthesiologist -- do which ever one you think will get you a better letter.

 

[nvshelat]

What exactly does DO unfriendly mean? That there are no DO residents there? Couldn't that just mean it's competitive or has no DO schools in the area?

Or is there actual prejudice still against them?

On a side note, I went to have an upper endoscopy done... and me and the anesthesiologist are shootin the **** while waitin around and he finds out im a med student... he asks where im at school, i say new york osteopathic... he says, oh my brother in law went there... they still giving tests every monday i said no not anymore. the gi doc says tests every monday thats brutal. anesthesiologist says yeah they tried to be as good as the allopathic schools so they tested them a lot.

mind you, this is with me as the patient that day. So, bottom line, i wouldn't be surprised if it was the latter.

 

[flipcyde]

What exactly does DO unfriendly mean? That there are no DO residents there? Couldn't that just mean it's competitive or has no DO schools in the area?

Or is there actual prejudice still against them?

On a side note, I went to have an upper endoscopy done... and me and the anesthesiologist are shootin the **** while waitin around and he finds out im a med student... he asks where im at school, i say new york osteopathic... he says, oh my brother in law went there... they still giving tests every monday i said no not anymore. the gi doc says tests every monday thats brutal. anesthesiologist says yeah they tried to be as good as the allopathic schools so they tested them a lot.

mind you, this is with me as the patient that day. So, bottom line, i wouldn't be surprised if it was the latter.

Mind you, this is all hearsay, but I believe the definition of a competitive applicant is very program dependent. For the majority of programs, I would assume great board scores and doing well in school have something to do with it. For others, someone coming from, lets say Stanford, will carry infinitely more weight than someone coming from a DO school, irrespective of their class rank or USMLE board score. These are the programs that I consider DO unfriendly. They may still interview a super stud DO applicant -- I have no idea since I've never had a chance to talk to the program directors of these schools. More likely, they just screen out all DO applicants using ERAS filters even before seeing their actual application. I have nothing against them. Everyone has their own method of evaluating the quality of their applicants. Again, to reiterate, you should spend the extra couple of bucks and click on those "DO unfriendly" programs, rock the boards and let the chips fall where they may. So, while these questions may provide some fodder for discussion, it really makes no difference in the end. Apply and see what happens. Good luck!

 

[amyl]

there are programs, utknoxville, louisville and MGH, that point blank do not take DOs. they say this. regardless of quality. a good candidate DO i know did away rotations at UT and went there for undergrad...he may be the first DO they take, but trust me he will be exception. other programs (and i have talked to the PDs) admit prejudice against comlex and some will admit prejudice against DOs...not that they won't take them but that they have to be outstanding DOs. other programs say they just want the best people -- thus 220 by DO = 220 by MD. In general, I think most programs fall in the middle category -- they will take DOs but only if they have better numbers, etc.

 

[Arch Guillotti]

there are programs, utknoxville, louisville and MGH, that point blank do not take DOs. they say this.

Hmm. I interviewed at Louisville when I was on the trail. I can't remember hearing that they were "DO-unfriendly". I didn't get a very good vibe from them and actually ended up ranking them last. The vibe didn't have anything to do w/being a DO, the whole interview experience was just really mediocre.

 

[Arch Guillotti]

there are programs, utknoxville, louisville and MGH, that point blank do not take DOs. they say this. regardless of quality. a good candidate DO i know did away rotations at UT and went there for undergrad...he may be the first DO they take, but trust me he will be exception.

According to this post from a DO former chief resident at UT-Knoxville, you are misinformed and propagating incorrect information.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=462753&highlight=knoxville+do

 

[amyl]

sorry i should be more clear: recently no DOs. years ago they did take DOs but since the new man in charge there have been no DO residents and no new DO faculty. a friend who rotated there, that is not a DO, heard directly from his mouth that he won't take DOs. sorry for the misunderstanding, no misrepresentation meant, just trying to save the OP some $.

 

[Ketamininus]

Just wanted to start an up-to-date thread for osteopathic students interested in Anesthesia (esp. for 3rd years), so we could get some feedback, assistance, ect...

Some questions...
1. Step 2 USMLE- should we take it, or will Step 2 COMLEX suffice?
2. Any programs out there that are "DO friendly"?
3. Any programs that are NOT "DO friendly"?
4. How many programs should we apply to? Do we need to cast a wider net since we are DO's?
5. What I need to know to do well (okay, extremely well) on my rotation/subI?
6. What months should I do my "interview" rotations?

Thanks in advance to anyone willing to give advice. It is much appreciated!

I am a CA-2 resident in an Osteopathic anesthesiology residency this year. Let me do my best to answer your questions.

1. Just COMLEX vs. USMLE + COMLEX is a tough decision. Despite the fact that there is a percentile assigned to COMLEX scores, there are some allopathic program directors who feel like they can't compare the percentiles between the two exams equitably. As for which programs those correspond to, I don't remember...but don't hesitate to call and ask them how they feel about it. I was in a quandary because I didn't take my USMLE step 1 and couldn't afford the time or money to do both to catch up with that by the time I applied. That said, I didn't want to consider programs that would not look at my board scores (which were well above average) in the same light as comparable USMLE scores. Any perceived slight when I talked to the program's office/director by phone got that program tossed in my application junk heap.

2 and 3. Because I was applying to both Osteopathic and Allopathic programs, I didn't apply to as many MD programs as many people do. I've heard that many of the programs in the Northeastern part of the U.S. aren't all that great with D.O.'s but that's purely hearsay. I found that none of the Chicago-area residencies (Rush, Loyola, Northwestern) offered to interview me or even sent me an acknowledgment of my application. There were some "prestigious" ones who did offer an interview, such as Johns Hopkins and the Cleveland Clinic, so that gave me some solace. I know that Ohio State, Penn State, Indiana, Kentucky, Maryland, Case Western do take D.O.'s in their programs on a regular basis.

4. How "wide a net" you need to cast depends on both the confidence you have in your credentials and the likely size of the applicant pool in general. I knew that I had an "in" with a D.O. program, so I took the "bird in the hand" option and cast a smaller net out there. The applicant pool now (judging by how many apps we get) has only gotten bigger, so I would say apply to many programs...but never apply to any where you wouldn't want to go in the first place. Until the 2 match days are synchronized (which I hope happens soon), there's always a chance that matching in the D.O. match will yank you from the M.D. match. That's the risk you take with that.

5. On your electives, take the standard advice. Show up early and stay late. Never turn down a chance to do ANYTHING, even something as mundane as pushing a patient back to the O.R. or PACU. Be assertive, but not pushy, with the attendings and staff. Show that you have a well-developed work ethic and that you can get along with everyone. Your intubation skills will all be for naught if people at your electives hate your guts. Don't be afraid to ask for feedback halfway through and scout out people for recommendations if you think that you may not apply there. Always, ALWAYS send a thank you note to the PD and remind them of your interest in their program, if applicable.

6. Interview rotations are best done during "interview season," or from August through November. I would suggest avoiding July elective rotations. There's a ton of new residents and interns, and you can get lost in the shuffle there at the bottom of the food chain.

Just show that you'll be a dependable, reliable resident who has some good base knowledge, is eager to learn, and are willing to work hard and you'll likely portray yourself in the best possible light. Good luck and feel free to ask any other questions if you feel the urge.

- Ket

 

[Ventdoc2be]

1. So how many Anesthesia rotations/sub I's do you recommend doing?

2. Any other electives you recommend, ie. pulmonary med, critical care med?

3. If you could go back and redo your 4th year of medical school, which changes would you make?

 

[amyl]

i would do two general anesthesia rotations, and icu rotation preferably in an icu where anesthesiology runs the unit. take an easy rotation for dec and jan so you can interview. if you have another month pulm or cards i guess. then book silly stuff for the end of fourth year. you will need a mental vacation before intern year -- i have rural medicine/primary care stuff for the rest of the year.

 

[mcfreak]

Another question: With only one elective available 3rd year, do you recommend doing a research elective or an Anesthesia elective? 😕

I would do it in anesthesia, unless you REALLY want to go to a big research program.

 

[mcfreak]

Just wanted to start an up-to-date thread for osteopathic students interested in Anesthesia (esp. for 3rd years), so we could get some feedback, assistance, ect...

1. Step 2 USMLE- should we take it, or will Step 2 COMLEX suffice?
look at some of the programs you might want to go to and find out what they want. some require USMLE others are ok with just COMLEX

2. Any programs out there that are "DO friendly"?
If you can find a list of current residents, friendly programs will have DO's residents. I know UC Davis, West Penn, and Mercy of Pittsburgh (now UPMC Mercy) are very DO friendly. I've heard that the Texas programs are pretty friendly too.

3. Any programs that are NOT "DO friendly"? I've heard that UCLA, UCSD, UCSF, and UPMC are not so much. They rarely take DO's. You have to have really good scores and/or know someone.

4. How many programs should we apply to? Do we need to cast a wider net since we are DO's?
In general I don't think so. The advise I have gotten has revolved on how good you step 1 is. If it is a high score, 10-20 programs, if it is an average score or you are applying to a lot of top programs, 40-50 programs.

5. What I need to know to do well (okay, extremely well) on my rotation/subI?
read, be willing to work long hours, try to get into a room (face time) with the attendings involved in the selection process (chair, PD), be a nice person that they could see spending 3 years with

6. What months should I do my "interview" rotations?
Jun-November. And get your ERAS application in as soon as possible

 

[mcfreak]

1. So how many Anesthesia rotations/sub I's do you recommend doing?
1-3

2. Any other electives you recommend, ie. pulmonary med, critical care med?
ICU is a must. Pulm is good. ER is not bad, because you get critical care experience and codes. Cardiology is good too.

 

[Green912]

Myself and a couple of my classmates interviewed at UPMC last year. They did have a few D.O. residents also. I didn't know a soul.

 

[Jape]

Is Loyola a DO friendly place? I am interested in their program because it is in Chicago, has a 4 year program (includes intern year), and has a pretty good CV fellowship available.

 

[amyl]

Myself and a couple of my classmates interviewed at UPMC last year. They did have a few D.O. residents also. I didn't know a soul.

i am a DO and interviewed at upmc this year. i do not know of any DOs that got invites there without usmle though. chief resident is a DO.

 

[Ventdoc2be]

Can you tell me why you chose Anesthesiology with the influx of nurse anesthetists out there??

 

[VentdependenT]

Is Loyola a DO friendly place? I am interested in their program because it is in Chicago, has a 4 year program (includes intern year), and has a pretty good CV fellowship available.

Yes they take DO's. All Chicago programs do. Yes, even University of Chicago lets those slackers in. Well, there is one exception. Cook County. If english is your native language you may not get in there. That is a joke, sort of. They almost exclusively take FMG/IMG/USIMG. Why? Dunno.

I'll be doing that CV fellowship next year.

 

[VentdependenT]

1. So how many Anesthesia rotations/sub I's do you recommend doing?

2. Any other electives you recommend, ie. pulmonary med, critical care med?

3. If you could go back and redo your 4th year of medical school, which changes would you make?

1) Two is plenty
2) SICU/CV-ICU (an absolute must. Be smart and take it somewhere at an anesthesia run unit), MICU, Surgery Sub-I (yup I said it), Trauma Surgery, ER (IV's, lines, suturing always fun, early cracks at gomers with "surviving sepsis" protocols, nascent arrythmia management, asthma disasters, trauma, etc..), Pulm, Cards.
3)none

 

[Indie4]

Can anyone comment on what they have heard about the DO anesthesia programs? I've been told that some aren't worth applying to. Which ones are considered good programs, if any? Im trying to set up my "audition rotations" and could use some guidance.

 

[SaintFrances]

OHSU
U Utah
U Colorado

I am looking at setting up some away rotations at these sites and wonder if it is worth my time, money, and effort if they do not like DO applicants. My board scores are a little above average for anesthesia and I am in the top 1/2 of my class, but have heard that the above programs are pretty competitive due to location. I really want to do an away though to help improve my chances of matching, but only if it will actually HELP my chances of matching.
(BTW: I am not a resident of any of the above states. I have heard rumors that unless you are from Colorado it is very difficult to get in there - is this true?)

 

[amyl]

pm'ed you.

 

[bluewater]

I am a CA2 at an ACGME program and will be a chief as a CA3 (and a DO, wow).

Here is my take on the DO anesthesiology residencies-
Ask yourself what you want to get out of your training. Do you plan to be comfortable with major trauma, transplants of all types (heart, lung, liver, kidney, pancreas) and lots of big cases? I am sure there may be several DO programs that can provide this, but there will many less programs on the DO side than the ACGME side.

I have several friends that are going through the osteo residencies now and the experiences we have are very different. Will they be trained well, I think so, but I have had many more wild and cray experiences just because I am at a busy Level I trauma center.

Aside from the differences in hospitals, if you simply look at the numbers of spots then you will see a major advantage in applying to an ACGME program.

Also, once you begin your residency, no one will care where you went to school- you will be judged by your skills, knowledge base and your interaction with your peers.

Best Wishes

 

[Arch Guillotti]

There is scant information on DO gas residencies on this board although there was a resident that posted a few times a few months ago. Unfortunately his name escapes me at the minute. I'll echo what the previous poster said. ACGME is THE gold standard and IMHO the only way to fly. Depending on where you want to work and what type of work you want to do after your residency is complete, the DO route might prove to be a stumbling block.

 

[Ketamininus]

There is scant information on DO gas residencies on this board although there was a resident that posted a few times a few months ago. Unfortunately his name escapes me at the minute. I'll echo what the previous poster said. ACGME is THE gold standard and IMHO the only way to fly. Depending on where you want to work and what type of work you want to do after your residency is complete, the DO route might prove to be a stumbling block.

Arch, you need to have more information before you go spouting this sort of mis-information about how AOA-approved residencies compare with ACGME ones. Actually, you use the word might...so you are at least leaving open the possibilities.

I am going to be a CA-3 in a D.O. residency later this year, and I have been very forthcoming (both in open forum discussion and in private messages) about the advantages and disadvantages of D.O. residencies for anesthesiology. The main employment scenario that does not favor anesthesiologists who come out of D.O. residencies are positions in academic anesthesia, as the didactic training can be suspect. Other than that, D.O.'s from those programs can do every other kind of case that anyone graduating from an ACGME-accredited residency can do.

Having been in the interview-for-jobs phase of my career for a little while, I can tell you that no one either cares that I'm a D.O. or what residency that I was trained in...just that I'll finish it and become board certified. When you're board certified, it simply doesn't matter to 99% of the workforce whether your board certification comes from the ABA or AOCA.

- Ket

 

[craigkes]

I am very curious about the DO's at OHSU as well. If anyone has any information regarding this I would be happy to listen. Thanks.

 

[amyl]

ask again after match day.... a friend and great DO candidate who did an away there ranked it first...

 

[Arch Guillotti]

Arch, you need to have more information before you go spouting this sort of mis-information about how AOA-approved residencies compare with ACGME ones. Actually, you use the word might...so you are at least leaving open the possibilities.

I am going to be a CA-3 in a D.O. residency later this year, and I have been very forthcoming (both in open forum discussion and in private messages) about the advantages and disadvantages of D.O. residencies for anesthesiology. The main employment scenario that does not favor anesthesiologists who come out of D.O. residencies are positions in academic anesthesia, as the didactic training can be suspect. Other than that, D.O.'s from those programs can do every other kind of case that anyone graduating from an ACGME-accredited residency can do.

Having been in the interview-for-jobs phase of my career for a little while, I can tell you that no one either cares that I'm a D.O. or what residency that I was trained in...just that I'll finish it and become board certified. When you're board certified, it simply doesn't matter to 99% of the workforce whether your board certification comes from the ABA or AOCA.

- Ket

Alright dude, I am glad you responded. You are the first and only osteopathic gas resident that I can remember has posted on this forum, and I have been around here for a while. Most if not all of the information I have read on SDN is secondhand type of stuff so it is good to hear from someone who is an actual resident in a program.

I have been looking around at several jobs in very large private practice groups. One of them is the kind of group that most people on this forum dis on a regular basis - long track to partnership position with the possibility that you may get canned towards the end to bring in a new sucker. I don't really think I am going to work for them but I am looking at them anyway.

Another group is smaller with more reasonable partnership track. Both have a few DO's, though there aren't many of us in that particular part of the country. Every DO in each group either did a military residency or an allopathic one. No one did a DO gas residency. There are also guys at each group (MD's) that did their residency training at the program I currently am in. This can only help me in the grand scheme of things. My residency is regarded pretty favorably all around. If two persons who are otherwise equal were applying for the same job in either group, and one person did a DO gas residency (which I can guarantee you is an unknown entity around here) and the other did an allopathic one at a well-known program and they already have folks from that group - who do you think they are going to choose? Either the DO from an unknown gas program or the DO from a known gas program that already has their graduates working there?

I say that they will favor the graduate of the ACGME program that they are already familiar with, hands down.

I am not hating on you or DO residencies, and I never said that you couldn't do a particular case.

I am just reporting what is my opinion and my experience, FWIW dude.

 

[Ketamininus]

Alright dude, I am glad you responded. You are the first and only osteopathic gas resident that I can remember has posted on this forum, and I have been around here for a while. Most if not all of the information I have read on SDN is secondhand type of stuff so it is good to hear from someone who is an actual resident in a program.

I have been looking around at several jobs in very large private practice groups. One of them is the kind of group that most people on this forum dis on a regular basis - long track to partnership position with the possibility that you may get canned towards the end to bring in a new sucker. I don't really think I am going to work for them but I am looking at them anyway.

Another group is smaller with more reasonable partnership track. Both have a few DO's, though there aren't many of us in that particular part of the country. Every DO in each group either did a military residency or an allopathic one. No one did a DO gas residency. There are also guys at each group (MD's) that did their residency training at the program I currently am in. This can only help me in the grand scheme of things. My residency is regarded pretty favorably all around. If two persons who are otherwise equal were applying for the same job in either group, and one person did a DO gas residency (which I can guarantee you is an unknown entity around here) and the other did an allopathic one at a well-known program and they already have folks from that group - who do you think they are going to choose? Either the DO from an unknown gas program or the DO from a known gas program that already has their graduates working there?

I say that they will favor the graduate of the ACGME program that they are already familiar with, hands down.

I am not hating on you or DO residencies, and I never said that you couldn't do a particular case.

I am just reporting what is my opinion and my experience, FWIW dude.

Arch, I wasn't flaming you for your comments. We cool.

This sounds like the proverbial "If a tree falls in the forest when no one's around, does it make any noise?" problem. Just because some of the D.O. gas programs lack any real reputation or prestige, does it mean their residents are less qualified? Obviously the answer is no.

It actually continues to amaze me how much that medicine operates on the perception-is-reality and reputation-as-quality viewpoints when it comes to residency programs. It just strikes me as a narrow view to think that a graduate from a reputed top-tier program (just choose a big name) is somehow more qualified than someone who comes out of a program with less (or no) reputation to speak of.

One of the issues at play here is sheer numbers. There are 120+ ACGME-approved residencies for anesthesia and only 11 AOA-approved residencies. Each D.O. gas residency takes about 2 residents per year, meaning there are no more than around 70 or so residents out there at any given time. Why so few? Ask the AOA...they're the certifiying body for our residencies. The small numbers are why a certain percentage of D.O.'s seek out ACGME-approved programs, if only to give themselves a better shot at getting a spot when so few are available for the AOA-approved programs. There's the viewpoint on their relative quality, but that's a whole 'nother discussion.

- Ket

 

[LonghornJPS]

The small numbers are why a certain percentage of D.O.'s seek out ACGME-approved programs, if only to give themselves a better shot at getting a spot when so few are available for the AOA-approved programs. There's the viewpoint on their relative quality, but that's a whole 'nother discussion.

I don't know anything about the AOA anesthesiology programs, so I am unable to comment on those specifically.

However, I've experienced both AOA training and ACGME training. I did an AOA internship which was very weak. Then I moved and did a year as a General Surgery resident at another weak AOA program. After careful consideration, I made the decision to switch to an ACGME program. It was the best decision I ever made! MCW may not be perfect, but it honestly offers MUCH better training than both AOA programs I attended.

 

[Ventdoc2be]

Just wanted to find out where people matched this year??

 

[Indie4]

Couple questions:
1) How important are away rotations? It looks like I will only have 2 months for auditions at other programs (august and oct). I have picked my top 2 to rotate with, but there are many other programs I want to apply to as well. I know in the osteopathic world, rotating is very high on the priority list for successful matching. How does this compare in the allopathic world?
2) What is a Sub-I rotation?

 

[amyl]

sub-I means you function as an intern...more responsibility. Aways can really really help but it is not like the osteopathic world where it is hard to match without an away...i matched where i didn't rotate.

 

[Indie4]

sub-I means you function as an intern...more responsibility. Aways can really really help but it is not like the osteopathic world where it is hard to match without an away...i matched where i didn't rotate.

Did you by chance rank the place you matched higher than the place(s) you rotated?

 

[amyl]

yeah i matched at my number one.... ccf -- somewhere on here we all posted our rank lists if you want to see where all we interviewed. i don't think i put enough thought into where i did my aways. none of them were bad programs but they all ended up not being the right thing for me for various reasons although i would have been happy enough at all of them...

 

[Indie4]

yeah i matched at my number one.... ccf -- somewhere on here we all posted our rank lists if you want to see where all we interviewed. i don't think i put enough thought into where i did my aways. none of them were bad programs but they all ended up not being the right thing for me for various reasons although i would have been happy enough at all of them...

Thanks. Im glad to hear it's not as crucial as with the DO programs to have rotated. I will do as many as I can, but in the end there is not enough time to rotate with every program I have interest in.

 

[Kubed]

Bumping this back up for any lost DO anesthesia souls like myself.

 

[LonghornJPS]

The Medical College of Wisconsin will interview DOs with a USMLE score of 210 or better. http://www.mcw.edu/display/router.asp?docid=6715

We have a couple DOs in every class and one of the Chief Residents is a DO this year.
http://www.mcw.edu/display/docid1821.htm

 

[lilzelda2]

Hi, I'm a DO student interested in Anesthesia. I took the USMLE Step I and got a 238 (99), I'm trying to decide whether I should take Step II or not. I really want to match in a program in NYC and wondering whether not taking Step II would hurt my chances.

Any input would be helpful.

 

[SaintFrances]

Hi, I'm a DO student interested in Anesthesia. I took the USMLE Step I and got a 238 (99), I'm trying to decide whether I should take Step II or not. I really want to match in a program in NYC and wondering whether not taking Step II would hurt my chances.

Any input would be helpful.

As you probably guessed, if you do better on Step II it could help you. Also, if you do worse, it could hurt you. That's pretty much the long and short of it...

Personally, my score went up by 17 points on Step II, and in each of my past 3 interviews, at least one interviewer has commented on this fact. How does it really affect my rankings? Who the hell knows. I have heard from some people that Step II scores are getting more important. I have also heard from others that Step II scores cant really be used to compare applicants since many applicants do not yet have these scores back when the programs are making decisions. Basically, I see Step II as one more opportunity to show a program that you can take the same test as the MD applicants and score highly. The kicker is that you really should aim to score highly...this is easier said than done sometimes. I have a friend who scored in the 240's on Step I and in the 220's on Step II. Study hard, hope for the best, then apply WIDELY.

 

[Arch Guillotti]

Hi, I'm a DO student interested in Anesthesia. I took the USMLE Step I and got a 238 (99), I'm trying to decide whether I should take Step II or not. I really want to match in a program in NYC and wondering whether not taking Step II would hurt my chances.

Any input would be helpful.

I would not take Step II. You may think about calling the programs you are interested in and asking if they require Step II to be ranked, which I do not think many programs do.

Your score is very good. I wouldn't roll the dice.

 

[fascinoma]

I agree with Arch.

Speaking from my own experience (with a similar step I score and no Step II) there were only 2 programs that asked about Step II. In both cases I asked, "Why? Is there an issue with my Step I score?" One program said there was no issue, they were just curious. The 2nd told me it was a requirement to match there...so I did not rank them.

After interview season was over I scheduled my COMLEX II--didn't want to pay for both COMLEX and USMLE exams if I didn't need them--studied, but had no stress about it and still did great (with the exception of cranial OMM questions...grr...).

Good luck.

 

[ImNoSuperman]

So if DO decide to take USMLE Step II, do the programs that require/suggest Step II want CK and CS or can one get away with just CK?

 

[sethco]

So if DO decide to take USMLE Step II, do the programs that require/suggest Step II want CK and CS or can one get away with just CK?

Just take the CK, don't bother with the CS. May vary by program so you may want to check, but almost all just want the CK for interview purposes.

It costs enough money to take the COMLEX.

 

[ImNoSuperman]

Just take the CK, don't bother with the CS. May vary by program so you may want to check, but almost all just want the CK for interview purposes.

It costs enough money to take the COMLEX.

Thanks Sethco, I was hoping/figuring that... and yeah, I'm already scoping out corners on which I can sell my body to pay for the COMLEX PE. Oh, anyone in Toledo... the corner of Glendale and Detroit is mine... it's within walking distance of my house.

Ok... back to Family guy.

 

[premedmind]

Bumping an old thread here, but which anesthesia residency programs are DO friendly in the Northeast? More specifically NY/NJ?