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darkandtwisty

5+ Year Member
Apr 26, 2009
66
0
Ohio
Status
Resident [Any Field]
I know I have a ways away to worry about this, as I will be a P1 in 2 weeks, but I am very curious about how P3 and P4 years work. I'm attending Scholl, so I don't know if it's different for different schools during 3rd and 4th year. I've heard that we travel around the country for months at a time for rotations. How does that work with living/apartments. Do you stay in hotels? I'm sure I'll learn more about this during orientation and as the years pass by. I really appreciate the help and advice. Thank you!
 

arez10

10+ Year Member
May 3, 2008
105
8
Status
Resident [Any Field]
I know at Temple, 3rd year we just stay in the Philadelphia area. 4th year we do 5-7 externships (5 if you want 2 vacation months) and then the rest is still in Philly. On your externships, you have to either find a subletted apartment for 1 month, stay with friends/family if you know someone in the area, or go to an extended stay hotel. It's supposed to be a very expensive year so you're given more loan money.
 

Sig Savant

10+ Year Member
Aug 12, 2008
296
2
Terre Haute
Status
Podiatry Student
darkandtwisty,

This is an excellent question as there is much variation between each school, and you rarely hear about it before you choose a school.

At NYCPM, we have 4 rotations of 3 months: Surgery, Ortho, Med A, Med B. The entire year you are in the foot clinic at school or one of three hospitals: Metropolitan, Lincoln or Harlem hospital. You also have class daily from 730-9am. I know some schools do not have class, some have core rotations at different places, so look out for those answers.
 
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Adam Smasher

persona non grata
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jul 24, 2008
243
42
USA
Status
Podiatrist
D&T,
I am a P3 at the Scholl College, so I can relate to you my experiences/expectations for the years ahead. However, be advised that things may change.

At the conclusion of my P2 year, I had two weeks off. That was my summer vacation, though it wasn't much of a vacation since I was studying for boards. We then began a sequence of four Capstone courses, with a two week intermission in July for boards. Capstones continue until December, which is when things start to become more free-form.

The next 18 months, we go on clerkships. Part of the time you're in Chicago doing required stuff, and part of the time you're anywhere you want to be doing elective stuff. Your schedule is based partly on choice, partly on luck. No matter what, though, you'll have to be traveling back and forth between Chicago and your elective rotations.

Living arrangements can be costly. Some clerkships provide housing for the month, but otherwise you'll have to look for apts to sub-lease. If that doesn't work, try to find an extended stay in the area. You'll have to do the research ahead of time on how much things cost, so choose your rotations carefully, because you can't change once your schedule is set! For my part, there are a many places I'm interested in, but I'm lucky enough to have family/friends in most of the cities I want to visit. :cool:
 
Jun 10, 2011
61
0
Status
Podiatrist
I know I have a ways away to worry about this, as I will be a P1 in 2 weeks, but I am very curious about how P3 and P4 years work. I'm attending Scholl, so I don't know if it's different for different schools during 3rd and 4th year. I've heard that we travel around the country for months at a time for rotations. How does that work with living/apartments. Do you stay in hotels? I'm sure I'll learn more about this during orientation and as the years pass by. I really appreciate the help and advice. Thank you!
I would have asked that question a long time ago.
 

darkandtwisty

5+ Year Member
Apr 26, 2009
66
0
Ohio
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Well I guess it's good I asked now. I had a few PMs that helped answer my question. They told us a little about it at my interview, but it wasn't in depth. Thanks everyone for your help.
 

Adam Smasher

persona non grata
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jul 24, 2008
243
42
USA
Status
Podiatrist
Adam Smasher,

When the P3s do the schedule lottery do you feel there is one schedule that is more beneficial then the others? Or does it really not matter what schedule you pick? Can students trade schedules? Thanks in advance.

AB
AB,

The short answer is that they are all basically equal. Some have certain perks, like getting 8 electives in before CRIPS as opposed to 7, or you get to have your last month be an elective--i.e. vacation. I chose a schedule that has me doing a Chicago core in january so I could continue with my apt in IL for one more month. There are other plusses and minuses to consider which faculty will present to you next spring.

Yes, you can trade, but it is frowned upon for money to change hands in the process.
 

Podophile

is looking for work
Oct 28, 2010
154
12
Golden Corral
Status
Podiatry Student
4th year is rough. Terrible. Awesome. Tiring. Boring. Uncomfortable. Interesting. Challenging. Humbling. Makes your feet hurt. Makes you dependent on caffeine.

It can be any or all of the above depending on the month.

If you pick a bad program, you could be bored to tears and hate the entire month. But you'll probably get plenty of sleep not stress too much.

If you stay with a buddy and end up sleeping on a couch, you will be uncomfortable. Weekends will be good though.

If you pick a really intense program, you'll get up seemingly in the middle of the night and fall asleep as soon as you get home. You may hate this, but you might like this too.

Some programs are more academic and you will constantly be asked questions. If you like the challenge, this may push you to learn and you'll get a lot out of it and show up the next day more prepared. If you don't, well you'll be miserable.

I guess the point is "it all depends". You have to first establish what you want in a residency. Do you REALLY want to get up @ 3 am everyday for rounds? Do you mind attendings with egos or a strict hierarchical structure? Would you rather just do surgery and some light clinic and then go for beers on weekends? Or do you have a family that you want to spend every night and weekend with?

So first, write down what YOU want in a residency program. This will probably include location considerations. If this is important to you, don't pretend its not. But schedule at least one month in a totally different geographic area so you get a different perspective and exposure than you are used to.

Next, start researching programs. Believe it or not, your school attendings are really the last people you should ask. Don't even bother. They will tell you to go where their personal friends work and normally they know very little about the actual programs.

The best people to ask are students who RECENTLY clerked at that program. Don't ask them "How did you like it?". That is far too subjective. Ask specific questions w/ concrete answers. "How confident are the 3rd years in the OR? Do 1st/2nd years DO any of the cases or are they just retracting? How many cases are double scrubbed and if so does the senior ever let the junior do anything or teach them how to do the case? Do the residents hang out outside of the hospital (if that matters to you)", etc

Asking current residents and recent grads of the program is also fairly useless. They just are not going to talk $*** about their program unless it was just god awful. You can ask them about their jobs or job offers (not $)

Another good research tool is just spending a day with the director, even as a 1st or 2nd year. If you can't stand them for a day, you know you wouldn't do it for 3 years. I can usually tell if I'm going to like someone within 15 minutes. This is a great way to cross programs off the list. I only did this once, but I know it saved me from wasting a month. Very politely email his/her secretary and rarely will you be denied.

Now you'll probably have quite a list of programs. I recommend adding @ least one very academic/intense program that will challenge you and force you to learn, whether you want this sort of program or not. Then schedule it FIRST. This will kick you in the butt and help you establish a good work ethic. So the next month you will 1) look awesome and on top of things, quoting journal articles, be prepared, and be oozing with confidence and 2) you'll hopefully keep reading and know what pace you should keep, so if you're on a lighter month, you'll still get a lot out of it. This will make you look better on subsequent months and help you prepare for interviews.

I would then go to my first pick the next month. Read up on the attendings and THEIR research and be able to quote that ###*, ESPECIALLY if they are doing a case in an area that they have published. You are studying for a test, and the right answer is whatever that attendings opinion on the subject happens to be.

Then schedule other programs as you see fit taking into account travel distance. I recommend adding something different such as a program that has a lot of wound care or other special feature that you've had no exposure to.


Ok, I'm too tired to keep going, but keep your eyes open when on rotations. You'll have to live it to see if you like it or not so don't believe everything you hear (especially from those far removed from residency training).
 
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