3rd year med students entering 08-09 path interview process

[dingozlife]

Im having a dilemma here regarding taking the usmle step2 and now beginning to enter the 2008-2009 path residency interview process.. Im at a DO school and scheduled Comlex2 and usmle2 in july 1 week apart. i did medicine/surgery last semester and ending on OB/gyn and peds before studying for step2's. my concern is that i may score lower on usmle2 compared to usmle1 and this may hurt me in the interviews... should I reschedule usmle step2's mid fall to avoid score-report on ERAS or not take it at all since im already taking Comlex2?

something similar has occurred to me when i applied to med school, i did decent on mcat 1st time take and tried to score better 2nd try but actually did worse. this came up during the interview process and didnt match that year and had to reapply after taking mcat 3rd time to get a score a bit better than the 1st score.

i dont want to get ranted for posting scores so ill just say for an applicant with a range of 225-240 on usmlestep1 (im not going to try to score alot better on step2) i have concern that i may do worse on step2 b/c i've always been inconsistent with same amount of preparation.. what do you guys suggest? any input would be greatly appreciated, thank-you

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[Arctic Char]

well, hmmm. i'm also a 3rd year, so i can relate your issues of dates and what not. i also debated about whether to do step 2 in july or postpone. i decided that my step 1 was good enough to instill some confidence that if i study hard for step 2 i'll do as well if not better (btw - 225-240 is quite a range . . . ? but it may not be such an issue . . . again, ?? just and MS3 here). and i related that to the importance of doing electives in path during july, august and september in order to secure letters and demonstrate my sincere interest in path, and i decided i'd take step 2 ASAP in july.

anyway, since i haven't taken step 2 yet, i can't comment, really. but i figured i'd offer out what i've planned . . .

good luck! all the best

 

[vegasdo]

I wouldn't take USMLE step 2 so early if you do not plan on doing better than step 1. I believe the only reason to take step 2 early is to try and do well and show off that score during the application process if you did not happen to do well on step 1. Your step 1 score is pretty good and should get you plenty of interviews.

Also, you might not even need to take the USMLE step 2. It all depends on where you are trying to go.

 

[Tiki]

Everyone says not to take it early, but I sure am glad I took CK early, and I did well on Step 1. The reason why I'm glad I took it early is because my knowledge level was highest coming off of third year, and has continued to drop throughout fourth year. Some people would say that if you do well on Step 1, you don't need to do well on Step 2 CK, so it doesn't matter. But I scored even higher on Step 2 CK, and I really feel it boosted my application to have two good step scores, especially considering my application was lacking in publications and research.

 

[dingozlife]

I know I may get slaughtered by listing out the places im considering, but here it goes: UCI, UCLA, UCSD, UCDavis, UTSW, Baylor, NYU, Cleveland, cornell, columbia, aecom, etc. im not looking for super research medical center but something with good academic setting/didactics with variety of "oh wow!" i've never seen one of those diseases before!" and having to relentlessly look up the pathophys b/c not doing so will make you dwell on it, anyways... what i mean is do these places look at whether u've taken step2 yet and with good scores as well?

 

[docbiohazard]

Everyone says not to take it early, but I sure am glad I took CK early, and I did well on Step 1. The reason why I'm glad I took it early is because my knowledge level was highest coming off of third year, and has continued to drop throughout fourth year. Some people would say that if you do well on Step 1, you don't need to do well on Step 2 CK, so it doesn't matter. But I scored even higher on Step 2 CK, and I really feel it boosted my application to have two good step scores, especially considering my application was lacking in publications and research.

Ditto everything Tiki said. Take it early and get it out of the way, if at all possible. You'll do better on it, you won't have to sweat it, and it's unlikely to hurt you. You can also set your application such that ERAS won't report your score unless you want them to... If it was a choice between "Take a surg path elective in the summer" vs. "Take Step 2" I'd do the elective so you could get more exposure and a good LOR before applications go out, but still, I recommend doing it as early as possible. I'm studying for Step 3 now and I can't believe how much I've forgotten in <9 months.

I know I may get slaughtered by listing out the places im considering, but here it goes: UCI, UCLA, UCSD, UCDavis, UTSW, Baylor, NYU, Cleveland, cornell, columbia, aecom, etc.

You mentioned Baylor & UTSW, not sure if you're referring to Baylor in Dallas or Baylor in Houston... if you're considering Houston, might I also suggest Methodist in Houston. The residents there seem very happy, and have excellent didactics, not to mention the best benefits / salary of any residency in the state. Check it out...

BH

 

[dingozlife]

Thanks for the helpful info!

 

[DarksideAllstar]

Everyone says not to take it early, but I sure am glad I took CK early, and I did well on Step 1. The reason why I'm glad I took it early is because my knowledge level was highest coming off of third year, and has continued to drop throughout fourth year. Some people would say that if you do well on Step 1, you don't need to do well on Step 2 CK, so it doesn't matter. But I scored even higher on Step 2 CK, and I really feel it boosted my application to have two good step scores, especially considering my application was lacking in publications and research.

Just to play Devil's Advocate, I took my Step 2 CK a full year and 8 months after my third year rotations had been completed. I studied sporadically for three weeks and scored 10 points higher than on Step 1. My point is that if you worked hard during third year and you know your ****, then you will do fine on it regardless of when you take it-- it might just take a little extra time for the info to come back to you. I'm of the firm opinion that if you scored above a 230 on Step 1 and you do not have complete and utter confidence that you will get higher than that on Step 2, you should wait until Jan-Feb to take Step 2 CK.

I don't know how much it hurts not having a Step 2CK score in your file when programs evaluate candidates-- I doubt it contributes much unless you go from having a mediocre Step 1 score to a stellar Step 2 score or vice versa.

Step 2 CS on the other hand-- just take that as soon as third year is over and get that $1000 monkey off your back.

 

[green mantis]

I'm a DO, & I just finished my residency at UCI. They didn't require the USMLE. During my 4 years, there's always been at least 1 DO resident. I think there are 2 currently. UCD, UTSW, & Baylor (Houston) didn't appear to require the USMLE either. I got interviews at these 3 hospitals. I didn't get interviews at UCLA or UCSD, & I didn't apply to the other institutions you've listed.

I don't know what the people here think, but it's my opinion not to take the USMLE unless you know you can score as well or better than the COMLEX. Otherwise, it only hurts you. Some programs may require you to take it, so in those cases, you're out of luck.

I'm not sure how the COMLEX is administered these days. When I took it, it was still pencil / paper & only offered twice / year. I took it the 1st chance I had to get it out of the way. We didn't have the CS portion yet.

Keep in mind that some programs have more than enough qualified MD applicants, so there's no need for them to take a DO (unless you're stellar). Some institutions are just not DO-friendly (Oregon & Washington).


----- Antony

 

[dingozlife]

thats really helpful to know, i may postpone usmle2 till dec but still take comlex2 july to get out of the way.

mantis- im interested in rotating at uci in september, how was your residency training like for u?

 

[Tiki]

Just to play Devil's Advocate, I took my Step 2 CK a full year and 8 months after my third year rotations had been completed. I studied sporadically for three weeks and scored 10 points higher than on Step 1. My point is that if you worked hard during third year and you know your ****, then you will do fine on it regardless of when you take it-- it might just take a little extra time for the info to come back to you. I'm of the firm opinion that if you scored above a 230 on Step 1 and you do not have complete and utter confidence that you will get higher than that on Step 2, you should wait until Jan-Feb to take Step 2 CK.

I don't know how much it hurts not having a Step 2CK score in your file when programs evaluate candidates-- I doubt it contributes much unless you go from having a mediocre Step 1 score to a stellar Step 2 score or vice versa.

Step 2 CS on the other hand-- just take that as soon as third year is over and get that $1000 monkey off your back.

Yes, but you were a way better applicant than me, so CK probably wouldn't do as much for you as I feel it did for me. You had a post-sophomore fellowship , right? (not to mention some amazing board scores). I was a good applicant (high 230's on Step 1, top 1/4 of the class, but only one abstract) so I think rocking CK helped me score some interviews I might not have gotten otherwise. But who really knows?

I do agree with the fact that you should only take it early if you plan to study hard and rock it.

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

Im having a dilemma here regarding taking the usmle step2 and now beginning to enter the 2008-2009 path residency interview process.. Im at a DO school and scheduled Comlex2 and usmle2 in july 1 week apart. i did medicine/surgery last semester and ending on OB/gyn and peds before studying for step2's. my concern is that i may score lower on usmle2 compared to usmle1 and this may hurt me in the interviews... should I reschedule usmle step2's mid fall to avoid score-report on ERAS or not take it at all since im already taking Comlex2?

something similar has occurred to me when i applied to med school, i did decent on mcat 1st time take and tried to score better 2nd try but actually did worse. this came up during the interview process and didnt match that year and had to reapply after taking mcat 3rd time to get a score a bit better than the 1st score.

i dont want to get ranted for posting scores so ill just say for an applicant with a range of 225-240 on usmlestep1 (im not going to try to score alot better on step2) i have concern that i may do worse on step2 b/c i've always been inconsistent with same amount of preparation.. what do you guys suggest? any input would be greatly appreciated, thank-you

Boss, why are you even taking USMLE Step II CK? You did well enough on USMLE Step 1. Stop right there. Take COMLEX II and III and be done with it.

No need to take USMLE Step II CK. I highly doubt anyone will care.

 

[yaah]

Boss, why are you even taking USMLE Step II CK? You did well enough on USMLE Step 1. Stop right there. Take COMLEX II and III and be done with it.

No need to take USMLE Step II CK. I highly doubt anyone will care.

Because I think some programs (don't ask me which ones! I don't know!) require step II.

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

Because I think some programs (don't ask me which ones! I don't know!) require step II.

You may be right. I, too, have heard this but only in some IM programs. Never thought Path programs would care so much especially considering the OP is not a FMG.

OP, maybe you should contact the Path programs you're interested in and ask them. If it's not necessary why dump ~$500 into NBMEs pockets (not to mention the risk of doing WORSE on USMLE Step II!).

G'luck.

 

[dingozlife]

Yeah, that seems to be the best bet to contact PD, thanks for the advice

 

[raspberry009]

Step 2 CS on the other hand-- just take that as soon as third year is over and get that $1000 monkey off your back.

Well said!!

 

[deschutes]

Because I think some programs (don't ask me which ones! I don't know!) require step II.

New Hampshire requires Step 2 to be passed by Feb 1 of the year residency starts, for statewide medical licensure reasons. I don't know about other states. And I don't know if the requirement applies to both CK and CS.

 

[myofibroblast]

This is a very interesting thread because I was curious about this myself. I have talked to a couple D.O. pathologists and they said don't bother with the USMLE because most programs except COMLEX and those that don't, probably won't take D.O.s anyway. Then I have heard others tell me that it's "career suicide" if you don't take the USMLE on top of it. I will be a D.O. student and I have never been an outstanding standardized test-taker so I highly doubt I would perform good enough on the USMLE to make a difference. I have some time to think about it, though.

 

[dingozlife]

I called a PD and he suggested that applicants' comlex scores were a bit lower in national averages compared to usmle national averages (probably referring to ppl who take both). When he computes the comlex he takes into account this. He was referring to both comlexI/usmleI & comlexII/ usmleII. I still don't know how this works completely, im guessing that ppl who take both exams, tend to do better on usmle, probably they were trying to do well on it and just passing comlex to meet requirements to graduate. I guess if you neglect studying OMM it would account for this difference.