4 more years!

[Irish Football]

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1) America is not a democracy. It's a federalist presidential constitutional (representative) republic.

2) The electoral system, in its original incarnation, serves to both protect states rights (thus establishing the difference between a Constitutional Amendment, which must be ratified by the States, and the passage of a federal bill), as well as protect minority rights from the tyranny of the majority. Just because a majority of people in America want something does not mean that should be foisted upon every citizen in the country - that's why the States even exist in the first place.

It's important to inform yourself as to how the process actually works, and why it works the way it does.

Appreciate the info, I'll definitely look into this.

 

[Anathema]

I was referring to the poster's comment about how America is not a democracy because it is called a Republic in the pledge of Allegiance. I said "Not so simple" because the terms democracy and republic can have varying levels and meanings. Please don't lecture me on what I know or don't know, I'm really not in the mood. I've seen your posts on SDN and respect you and enjoy reading your contributions here. Please don't start anything with me about semantics and/or personal attacks.

I respect your presence on SDN as well, but my reference to the Pledge of Allegiance really is that simple. We're a constitutional republic and not a democracy. Bearstronaut did a great job to summarizing what I was trying to say in my posts.

 

[lobo.solo]

1) America is not a democracy. It's a federalist presidential constitutional (representative) republic.

2) The electoral system, in its original incarnation, serves to both protect states rights (thus establishing the difference between a Constitutional Amendment, which must be ratified by the States, and the passage of a federal bill), as well as protect minority rights from the tyranny of the majority. Just because a majority of people in America want something does not mean that should be foisted upon every citizen in the country - that's why the States even exist in the first place.

It's important to inform yourself as to how the process actually works, and why it works the way it does, before disagreeing with it.

👍 Interestingly we claim ourselves leaders of democracy. how ironic!

 

[CuttingCorneas]

I was referring to the poster's comment about how America is not a democracy because it is called a Republic in the pledge of Allegiance. I said "Not so simple" because the terms democracy and republic can have varying levels and meanings. Please don't lecture me on what I know or don't know, I'm really not in the mood. I've seen your posts on SDN and respect you and enjoy reading your contributions here. Please don't start anything with me about semantics and/or personal attacks.

I'm not trying to start anything, and I'm sorry if you feel that way. But a lot of people are uninformed about why the system works the way that it does, and I feel it would be best to clear up any confusion. The above poster was very thorough in his/her explanation; I would have written a longer/less snarky response but I have an exam tomorrow and figured brevity was the best choice.

Edit: "above poster" = Bearstronaut

 

[LauraJo08]

Is it too late to apply to schools in WA?

 

[calvnandhobbs68]

Appreciate the info, I'll definitely look into this.

Oh you mean you'll "look into" the basic info of how the voting and representation system works in the country you live in? Stop being butthurt, you should have learned this in first year government class.

 

[deleted127837]

I was referring to the poster's comment about how America is not a democracy because it is called a Republic in the pledge of Allegiance. I said "Not so simple" because the terms democracy and republic can have varying levels and meanings. Please don't lecture me on what I know or don't know, I'm really not in the mood. I've seen your posts on SDN and respect you and enjoy reading your contributions here. Please don't start anything with me about semantics and/or personal attacks.

It's not semantics, it has nothing to do with the pledge of allegiance (which was created long after the government was), and democracy and republic both have very defined meanings when it comes to government. I'm not saying you don't know what you're talking about - I think people have been pretty rude in this thread, and emotions are wild because of the election and I'm sorry for that - but it's important to understand the whys and hows.

To everyone else: Jesus, lighten up. This is not an inquisition. People are allowed to be wrong on the internet without personal attacks and bigotry.

Edit: my posts are slow because my internet is slow because I'm slow 🙁

 

[Irish Football]

I'm not trying to start anything, and I'm sorry if you feel that way. But a lot of people are uninformed about why the system works the way that it does, and I feel it would be best to clear up any confusion. The above poster was very thorough in his/her explanation; I would have written a longer/less snarky response but I have an exam tomorrow and figured brevity was the best choice.

Edit: "above poster" = Bearstronaut

We're cool, good luck on your exam! 🙂

 

[Served]

This thread is equivalent to trying to order a hamburger at a library.

 

[Irish Football]

Oh you mean you'll "look into" the basic info of how the voting and representation system works in the country you live in? Stop being butthurt, you should have learned this in first year government class.

Yeah, I really had no idea what an electoral college even was before I came to this thread tonight. Silly me. Did you see Donald Trump's Twitter account tonight? Clearly he and I are the only ones in this country who don't know how our voting system works.

 

[deleted127837]

This thread is equivalent to trying to order a hamburger at a library.

This. This will be remembered.

 

[Irish Football]

It's not semantics, it has nothing to do with the pledge of allegiance (which was created long after the government was), and democracy and republic both have very defined meanings when it comes to government. I'm not saying you don't know what you're talking about - I think people have been pretty rude in this thread, and emotions are wild because of the election and I'm sorry for that - but it's important to understand the whys and hows.

To everyone else: Jesus, lighten up. This is not an inquisition. People are allowed to be wrong on the internet without personal attacks and bigotry.

Edit: my posts are slow because my internet is slow because I'm slow 🙁

thanks Bearstronaut, I agree with this. I'd like to believe I've been a positive contributor to SDN, and aside from trolls, I've tried to treat other posters well. I understand what an online forum is but jeez...

 

[deleted127837]

👍 Interestingly we claim ourselves leaders of democracy. how ironic!

thanks Bearstronaut, I agree with this. I'd like to believe I've been a positive contributor to SDN, and aside from trolls, I've tried to treat other posters well. I understand what an online forum is but jeez...

To be fair, lobo12's comment represents where the misunderstanding comes from. The US represents itself as the wellspring of democracy on the world stage. While we are not truly a democracy, we encapsulate the ideal:

"Democracy is a form of government in which all eligible citizens have an equal say in the decisions that affect their lives"

While a true democracy government results in the citizens making decisions about their country largely sans representation, the ideal is alive, somewhere, in the United States government, and that's what we try to bring to the world stage.

Edit: President Obama's acceptance speech almost addresses some of this.

 

[Irish Football]

To be fair, lobo12's comment represents where the misunderstanding comes from. The US represents itself as the wellspring of democracy on the world stage. While we are not truly a democracy, we encapsulate the ideal:

"Democracy is a form of government in which all eligible citizens have an equal say in the decisions that affect their lives"

While a true democracy government results in the citizens making decisions about their country largely sans representation, the ideal is alive, somewhere, in the United States government, and that's what we try to bring to the world stage.

See, this is all I was saying in the beginning, that this "idea of democracy" (or whatever you want to call it), would seem to suggest that everyone's voice is equal, and that the electoral college doesn't seem to represent that. I used the word "democracy" and then everyone jumped on me.

 

[DavetheMD]

And yes, America is a republic.

Fixed that for you.

 

[lobo.solo]

To be fair, lobo12's comment represents where the misunderstanding comes from. The US represents itself as the wellspring of democracy on the world stage. While we are not truly a democracy, we encapsulate the ideal:

"Democracy is a form of government in which all eligible citizens have an equal say in the decisions that affect their lives"

While a true democracy government results in the citizens making decisions about their country largely sans representation, the ideal is alive, somewhere, in the United States government, and that's what we try to bring to the world stage.

Edit: President Obama's acceptance speech almost addresses some of this.

my comment???

It's quite ironic IMO. It is not a true democracy, but it projects that romanticized idea of bringing democracy to other countries.

 

[DavetheMD]

my comment???

It's quite ironic IMO. It is not a true democracy, but it projects that romanticized idea of bringing democracy to other countries.

The greater irony is how many U.S. citizens think they live in a democracy.

 

[deleted127837]

See, this is all I was saying in the beginning, that this "idea of democracy" (or whatever you want to call it), would seem to suggest that everyone's voice is equal, and that the electoral college doesn't seem to represent that. I used the word "democracy" and then everyone jumped on me.

America doesn't really fit into a category very well. Our governmental system is by design as unique as our population is diverse. The original democrat/republican political fights were about whether states or the federal government should be in power, and that was essentially what the Civil War was about (the Confederacy was pure states' rights, and the Union maintained a federal government). It's only grown more complex with time.

The electoral college provides a sum representation of the federal government - the number of electoral college representatives a state has is equivalent to the number of House representatives and Senators they have. Thus, the number of people in the college represent both the state's representation in the government by population (the House, potentially large numbers), and the state's equal representation with the other states (the Senate, always 2 Senators). The electoral college allows for this normalization to be applied to the race for President, thus providing some measure of normalization for both simultaneously. It's the nature of the federal system - when you vote for president, you are not voting for the president. You are voting for your state to back the president's being named head of the Union. The result is that your individual vote is not necessarily equal to someone's vote from another state, and so, to get back to our original argument, we are not a democracy - equal voice - but uphold the ideal, that all voices matter.

There's a lot of consequences of a popular vote system that stem from this, greatest of which is an undermining of state's rights (and their role in the Union), as well as the fact most people live in/around cities, and so a popular vote all but destroys the need to represent (/pander to) people in rural or semi-rural areas. Underserved FTW.

I'm tired, so I'm not sure that makes as much sense as I'm intending.

Edit: Cleaned it up.

 

[487806]

Is it too late to apply to schools in WA?

Let's try to hijack a random thread by posting some meaningless question so someone could help me. My interests are way more important than others. Who cares that Obama won? I'm more interested in med schools!

LauraJo, you lost your credibility. Stop trying to hijack threads, and create your own thread if you're so concerned. If you're trying to be funny, the joke's on you.

 

[487806]

Oh you mean you'll "look into" the basic info of how the voting and representation system works in the country you live in? Stop being butthurt, you should have learned this in first year government class.

He doesn't want to accept defeat. It's on! 😛

 

[La Presse]

Damn. Agent B has gone rogue.

 

[eggs13]

Let's try to hijack a random thread by posting some meaningless question so someone could help me. My interests are way more important than others. Who cares that Obama won? I'm more interested in med schools!

LauraJo, you lost your credibility. Stop trying to hijack threads, and create your own thread if you're so concerned. If you're trying to be funny, the joke's on you.

 

[Anathema]

Let's try to hijack a random thread by posting some meaningless question so someone could help me. My interests are way more important than others. Who cares that Obama won? I'm more interested in med schools!

LauraJo, you lost your credibility. Stop trying to hijack threads, and create your own thread if you're so concerned. If you're trying to be funny, the joke's on you.

I hope you know that they posted that b/c WA legalized marijuana right? Not everyone is a troll or a hijacker.

 

[487806]

I hope you know that they posted that b/c WA legalized marijuana right? Not everyone is a troll or a hijacker.

Irrelevant. That guys's trying to act pretty satirical by posting typical sdn school questions here, hoping to use the same reason as yours. Well, as I said earlier, the joke's on her.

 

[Anathema]

Irrelevant. That guys's trying to act pretty satirical by posting typical sdn school questions here, hoping to use the same reason as yours. Well, as I said earlier, the joke's on her.

Actually it is pretty relevant to this thread. The joke's on you if you can't take a joke.

 

[LauraJo08]

Let's try to hijack a random thread by posting some meaningless question so someone could help me. My interests are way more important than others. Who cares that Obama won? I'm more interested in med schools!

LauraJo, you lost your credibility. Stop trying to hijack threads, and create your own thread if you're so concerned. If you're trying to be funny, the joke's on you.

Whoa dude, chill. Sounds like you REALLY need to look into WA and CO schools. I hope that your interpersonal skills in person surpass those of the message board persuasion.

 

[487806]

Whoa dude, chill. Sounds like you REALLY need to look into WA and CO schools. I hope that your interpersonal skills in person surpass those of the message board persuasion.

All right. I may have fallen victim to the SDN Neurotic Syndrome. Typically, after continuous posts and threads regarding schools in the peak of the application procesd are rather annoying, so first thing I note when I read your post was a hijack attempt. Typically, if this was written by a regular member, I wouldn't care. So I guess my hijack radar fell. Also, you need to look at my previous posts if you think i'm not interpersonal. Infrequent members, fewer than 100 posts in more than 6 months, and radical newbies spark cynicism for me

 

[LauraJo08]

All right. I may have fallen victim to the SDN Neurotic Syndrome. Typically, after continuous posts and threads regarding schools in the peak of the application procesd are rather annoying, so first thing I note when I read your post was a hijack attempt. Typically, if this was written by a regular member, I wouldn't care. So I guess my hijack radar fell. Also, you need to look at my previous posts if you think i'm not interpersonal. Infrequent members, fewer than 100 posts in more than 6 months, and radical newbies spark cynicism for me

Haha no hard feelings. But I will say that just because one hasn't racked up triple digit postings in a short amount of time does not mean one lacks validity. I have followed these forums for awhile now but don't feel the need to respond or give my opinion on every issue. SDN posting hierarchy is amusing.

 

[Praefectus]

Whoa dude, chill. Sounds like you REALLY need to look into WA and CO schools. I hope that your interpersonal skills in person surpass those of the message board persuasion.

Is it too late to apply? 😉

 

[487806]

Haha no hard feelings. But I will say that just because one hasn't racked up triple digit postings in a short amount of time does not mean one lacks validity. I have followed these forums for awhile now but don't feel the need to respond or give my opinion on every issue. SDN posting hierarchy is amusing.

That's actually the most sensible thing I have heard. I apologize for acting like a neurotic idiot (probably because of Election Day hangover 😛), so I guess we're good. Friends?

 

[stscrivener]

blah. time to get ready for the largest physician shortage in Modern American History? Eh, i guess we can wait til tomorrow.

I'll interpret this shortage as an advantage for me, because I'm a couple years away from applying to medical school, and hopefully this helps me get in.

 

[Aerus]

I thought this thread was going to be a troll thing where the title is "4 more years!" and the thread says "I just got in med school! 4 more years of school! 😀" or something along those lines.

 

[xXIDaShizIXx]

Sorry to punch you in the face twice in one night, but God is about as real as Santa Claus!

Get over it!

OBAMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2012!!!

SUCK IT CONSERVATIVES!!!! 😛😛😛

What happened to the power of prayer?!?!? hahahahaha!


(Ok... celebration over. GOODNIGHT!)

That was hilarious.

 

[syoung]

I thought this thread was going to be a troll thing where the title is "4 more years!" and the thread says "I just got in med school! 4 more years of school! 😀" or something along those lines.

I think we're all in the same boat in that regard... Except it's a 2 term thing for us, guaranteed (almost)

 

[MedPR]

^ This.

Although, as the Mayans called it, and all the apocalypse callers, the world ends 12/21/2012, soooo.... all things won't matter (deficit, taxes, obamacare, etc)

You're an intelligent one.

This thread is equivalent to trying to order a hamburger at a library.

The cafe in my library serves hamburgers!