7/8 Year BA/MD or BS/MD Programs

[eatpraylove]

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I am currently in 11th grade and I was looking into BA/BS/MD program. I am very interested in the GW BA/MD program because you don't have to take the MCAT. However, I do not know enough about the GW program. What are the requirements SAT, GPA, SAT II? How many people get in? Are there any other 7/8 year programs that don't require the MCAT?

 

[La Presse]

Sounds like a google Search is in order. GPA and test scores are usually on the High side. Mount Sinai does not have a bs-md program. But to be guaranteed an acceptance at their school, you must have a 3.6 and 1400 composite ( math and verbal).


Sent from my iPad using SDN Mobile app.

 

[ClemsonFirst]

Look up MSAR on aamc.org You have to pay for full access but tells the schools with a bacc/MD program and statistics about them

 

[yuiness]

I would advise you to think hard about whether you actually want to do one of these programs and how flexible they are about letting you out if you change your mind. I've had many friends that started college as premeds, but then changed their mind somewhere along the way. I think it's really hard to know as a high school student whether medicine is the right career for you, most people haven't done a great deal of career exploration at that point yet.

 

[Brachyury]

Look up MSAR on aamc.org You have to pay for full access but tells the schools with a bacc/MD program and statistics about them

Your local library may have a copy

 

[Slowpoke]

Please heed the warning of yuiness.

There is absolutely no rush to start medical school. Live a little!

 

[Medstart108]

Please heed the warning of yuiness.

There is absolutely no rush to start medical school. Live a little!

You'd live a little if you got into a BA/MD or BS/MD program because you wouldn't be worrying about getting the right GPA, studying for the MCAT or getting the right ECs.

 

[MusicJunkie]

You'd live a little if you got into a BA/MD or BS/MD program because you wouldn't be worrying about getting the right GPA, studying for the MCAT or getting the right ECs.

While this may be true, as others have pointed out, a lot of students change their minds about what they want to do with their lives. In high school, sometimes it's difficult to really know what you want, who you are, or where exactly what you want to go because you're in the process of major change and defining who you are. The last thing you want is to commit to this, decide later on that this isn't what interests you, and then to feel stuck.

I'm not saying that the OP will change their mind about medicine, but to think carefully about whether they want to make this decision or not. It's not one to take lightly, that's all.

 

[Medstart108]

While this may be true, as others have pointed out, a lot of students change their minds about what they want to do with their lives. In high school, sometimes it's difficult to really know what you want, who you are, or where exactly what you want to go because you're in the process of major change and defining who you are. The last thing you want is to commit to this, decide later on that this isn't what interests you, and then to feel stuck.

I'm not saying that the OP will change their mind about medicine, but to think carefully about whether they want to make this decision or not. It's not one to take lightly, that's all.

This is true. However, if you really think you love medicine, you won't be the only one who starts medicine straight from high school. In the UK, Australia, India, China, Singapore, Indonesia and pretty much every country that follows the british system, medical school starts straight from high school and drop out rates are very very low less than 3%.

Its definitely possible to decide before university. However, that necessitates thinking about careers early. Never choose BA/MD programs unless you have had some experience in hospitals/ researching careers long before you apply.

Also a note. Generally, people who can get into BA/MD programs at a mid-tier university could probably do the normal route and go to a higher tier college/med school. BA/MD is lets be real mostly if you want to be a bit more relaxed and have that guarantee. Although during the interview, always emphasize how the BA/MD would give you the security and allow you to explore medicine earlier than others will 😛

 

[UnofficialBSMD]

The truth about BS/MD programs is that you are not locked into the program. You can gladly drop out of the program and continue for whatever pursuit you are interested in. There are distinct advantages which include getting into a field early that will be super competitive, letting you do research and networking helping your residency application.

However, disadvantages include going to mid-tier school and possibly going to a top-tier school. You only have 3 years to decide if you want to change your mind.

Personal rant: "Living your life" is this basket statement people just say. I think you make of life what you want. I am super happy that I am graduating at 25 and have opportunities to do fellowships that actually matter.

 

[taechris]

Thank you everyone that has replied so far. I am getting good responses and they're getting me to think more. If I do commit to the bs/dds program however, I am pretty much locked into it. Detroit Mercy's undergrad program isn't exactly the most competitive program out there to be quite frank and with the three years spent, my application will look really weak in comparison to other students that got the four years. Taking into account that I will have to choose one path or the other THIS YEAR, what would you do? (including reasoning would be appreciated 🙂)

 

[taechris]

Oh man, wrong thread. I'm so sorry man, it was an accident and I have no idea how to delete posts. *Walk of shame out of thread*

 

[DocYay]

I'm currently in my third year of medical school at NEOMED and went through the BS/MD Program. I was Valedictorian of my graduating class.

GPA: 4.69 weighted, 3.94 unweighted.
ACT: 33.
EC:
President of Key Club
President of Student Council
VP National Honor Society
VP Pep Club
Varsity volleyball player
600 volunteer hours at the local hospital
Hospice volunteer
involvement with church

Programs like this look for:
1. good character/ethics: they want someone who will do the right thing and stand by good morals/values. During my interview, i was asked several ethical questions such as if my best friend was cheating in a class, what do you do?

2. commitment to medicine: They want to see that you're passionate about the field and motivated. You have to be 100% sure you want this. Commitment is usually seen through EC's like volunteering at the hospital.

3. Friendly personality: they want people who are outgoing and who can easily build rapport with others. This is a general characteristic of doctors. They want team players... lets face it, once you're a doc, you have to work with other doctors, pharmacists, nurses, ect.

The program at NEOMED requires you to take the MCAT and get a score of 24. Don't be fooled by the low MCAT score, this is pretty hard to do especially after only 2 years of undergrad. You can do the program in 2 or 3 years. If you opt for the 3rd year, you can take classes at your host school or somewhere else (abroad).

Lastly, the concern most people have is... will i have a life. The answer is YES! I was able to go home every 2-3 weeks and I went out with my friends at least once a week. The rest of the week you HAVE to study. Average study days are about 10 hours daily... so basically when you don't have class, you study. With that said, the nice thing is that you have about 30 other people in the program. You all help each other out and carry each other along. Average credits a semester was about 21. Through undergrad you WILL learn how to study efficiently. Overall, I would recommend a bs/md program to anyone who is 100% SURE they want to become a physician. Yes, you can drop out but it's a waste of money and time. If you're not fully sure, go the traditional way. The nice thing about Neomed's program is that you have a seat in medical school right out of high school.

 

[mmmcdowe]

Having tutored a lot of BS/MD and BA/MD students in medical school, I would personally say that my impression is that they lack the same level of study skills that I have seen in most medical students, but then again that may simply be a skewed sample. My primary criticism of these programs is that they often make you sacrifice your university choice. Rather than going to a top university, may of these programs plop you down in a less competitive one. This is well and good if you stay in the program, but if you change your mind/fail out of the program/decide you want to apply to other medical schools, you might regret it. I don't remember the exact number, but MANY students end up dropping out of the program for one reason or another If you can get into a good BS/MD or BA/MD program, you are likely going to be competitive enough to get into a better medical school the traditional way. People make a big deal about the MCAT, but you still have to pass your USMLE exams, which are much harder than the MCAT anyways...

 

[goofball]

Having tutored a lot of BS/MD and BA/MD students in medical school, I would personally say that my impression is that they lack the same level of study skills that I have seen in most medical students, but then again that may simply be a skewed sample. My primary criticism of these programs is that they often make you sacrifice your university choice. Rather than going to a top university, may of these programs plop you down in a less competitive one. This is well and good if you stay in the program, but if you change your mind/fail out of the program/decide you want to apply to other medical schools, you might regret it. I don't remember the exact number, but MANY students end up dropping out of the program for one reason or another If you can get into a good BS/MD or BA/MD program, you are likely going to be competitive enough to get into a better medical school the traditional way. People make a big deal about the MCAT, but you still have to pass your USMLE exams, which are much harder than the MCAT anyways...

Top universities are incredibly expensive though, and it doesn't help that much in terms of med school admissions unless you're gunning for a Top 20. Going to Harvard/Yale/MIT would be great if you wanted to be an Ibanker, but it isn't necessary for a physician.

 

[mmmcdowe]

Top universities are incredibly expensive though, and it doesn't help that much in terms of med school admissions unless you're gunning for a Top 20. Going to Harvard/Yale/MIT would be great if you wanted to be an Ibanker, but it isn't necessary for a physician.

Top Universities are not necessarily expensive, they often have excellent financial aid (especially some of the publics in the top tier). It doesn't help you in terms of the name much, but if that is the environment that you are going to thrive in, then that is where you should go. Happiness cannot be overrated, and if going to a top university is going to be conducive of that for you then that should be your choice, so long as it is financially.

Secondly, there is a big difference between going to a decent big public university and a small, low tier university that really doesn't have much going on. I'm not saying you have to go to Harvard instead of a BS/MD, but you should go to a university with the resources and scope to give you access to the full range of possibilities.

 

[goofball]

Top Universities are not necessarily expensive, they often have excellent financial aid (especially some of the publics in the top tier). It doesn't help you in terms of the name much, but if that is the environment that you are going to thrive in, then that is where you should go. Happiness cannot be overrated, and if going to a top university is going to be conducive of that for you then that should be your choice, so long as it is financially.

Secondly, there is a big difference between going to a decent big public university and a small, low tier university that really doesn't have much going on. I'm not saying you have to go to Harvard instead of a BS/MD, but you should go to a university with the resources and scope to give you access to the full range of possibilities.

It's hard to thrive against colleges full of top students. Unfortunately, with med schools putting a premium on raw GPA numbers, this matters more than it should. 🙁


Also, if someone is about going to a big-name university, Brown, Northwestern, Rice, Boston, and Case are all top-tier institutions with BS/MD programs that would be happy to accommodate them. And I wouldn't call any of the other institutions with BS/MD programs "low tier." You'll get a decent university experience wherever you go, it's just what you make of it. 🙂

 

[UnofficialBSMD]

Having tutored a lot of BS/MD and BA/MD students in medical school, I would personally say that my impression is that they lack the same level of study skills that I have seen in most medical students, but then again that may simply be a skewed sample. My primary criticism of these programs is that they often make you sacrifice your university choice. Rather than going to a top university, may of these programs plop you down in a less competitive one. This is well and good if you stay in the program, but if you change your mind/fail out of the program/decide you want to apply to other medical schools, you might regret it. I don't remember the exact number, but MANY students end up dropping out of the program for one reason or another If you can get into a good BS/MD or BA/MD program, you are likely going to be competitive enough to get into a better medical school the traditional way. People make a big deal about the MCAT, but you still have to pass your USMLE exams, which are much harder than the MCAT anyways...

I do think BS/MD do struggle, but I think that some of them peaked in high school. It really does depend on their attitude throughout college and medical school. Many BS/MD students are really successful and go onto great things. I know personally of couple BS/MD students who are doing residency in #1 rated program in their respective fields.

Medical school the traditional way is getting more difficult. People with good GPA and MCAT are denied from good medical schools all the time. If you can make life easier for you in college, why not? Just be prepared to work hard in medical school.

Top Universities are not necessarily expensive, they often have excellent financial aid (especially some of the publics in the top tier). It doesn't help you in terms of the name much, but if that is the environment that you are going to thrive in, then that is where you should go. Happiness cannot be overrated, and if going to a top university is going to be conducive of that for you then that should be your choice, so long as it is financially.

Secondly, there is a big difference between going to a decent big public university and a small, low tier university that really doesn't have much going on. I'm not saying you have to go to Harvard instead of a BS/MD, but you should go to a university with the resources and scope to give you access to the full range of possibilities.

Most top universities are not know for their financial aid packages. Many people pay full price at top universities versus getting full ride at mid-tier universities.

Most BS/MD are part of bigger universities or have the option to go to a bigger program. I think you should do more research before making such broad statements about BS/MD program. Yes, I do agree that BS/MD programs do want to take smarter students from Havard and Ivy's but the universities aren't known for being super terrible.

It's hard to thrive against colleges full of top students. Unfortunately, with med schools putting a premium on raw GPA numbers, this matters more than it should. 🙁


Also, if someone is about going to a big-name university, Brown, Northwestern, Rice, Boston, and Case are all top-tier institutions with BS/MD programs that would be happy to accommodate them. And I wouldn't call any of the other institutions with BS/MD programs "low tier." You'll get a decent university experience wherever you go, it's just what you make of it. 🙂

Totally agree with this statement