A few non-trad concerns. . .

[Mdr1985]

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Hey everyone,

Without going into too much detail. . . I'm a 5 year paramedic at a local fire department who just finished an associates in nursing (thought I wanted to do CRNA, but realized in the process I absolutely want to purse becoming a physician). I plan to transfer with an associates from CC to VCU and work for an undergrad in biology this fall, though the possibility of getting a BSN instead is still on the table as well. I'll be transfering in as a junior, and best case scenario be applying to medical school the summer after my junior year (one year from now). So there's the quick background.

Concern 1: Having recently realized my interest in puruing medical school, I haven't been doing everything I could over the past 5 years to ensure a top notch application. My grades will be fine (3.7ish), I'm hoping and planning (with the right amount of preparation!) for a 30-35 MCAT (I know that's quite a range), I'm going to shadow, plan to research if possible, and I certainly have clinical experience (field paramedic, working in ER as EMT, and a little nursing), but I'm definitely lacking in the volunteer and leadership areas. I'm of course going to do everything I can in the next year before application (as well as the follwing year) to get good volunteer experience and pursue leadership roles in what I enjoy, but I'm concerned this will appear too last minute and 'just for the medical school application' to adcoms.
I'm trying my hardest to search my past 5 years to find leadership experience, but honestly other than being a paramedic and 'leading' the EMS calls by being the attendant in charge, I don't have much. During the last 5 years as a paramedic/firefighter I was either the 'newbie' or (the past three years in nursing school) been so focused on school that I didn't really pick up/pursue leadership roles here at work. Likewise, because I've been so busy working full time and being in school full time, I don't have any leadership roles in school either. Not making excuses or anything, but it is what it is. In small ways, such as helping teach new paramedics around the station, precepting new medics, and generally (and unofficially) being a mentor to students in nursing school having trouble, I suppose I've had some leadership, but I'm not sure how much that's stretching it since it's all very unofficial and couldn't really be 'verified' short of calling my fellow nursing school students and/or employees. Same thing goes for volunteer, just hasn't really happened for most of the same reasons mentioned above.
So, what does everyone think about the final year before application making sure to have good leadership and volunteer experience being too 'last minute', and/or seeming too 'just for your med school app'? Any suggestions of how to answer the question "why did you only start the last year" if I'm ever asked? From my situation/past experience, can anyone see things I might be able to use as leadership? How much could I use simply being a paramedic and thus the 'attendant in charge' of the ambulance? What about all the 'unofficial' stuff I mentioned?

Concern 2: I was initially planning on getting my BSN because I wanted to do CRNA, then when I realized I wanted to medical school I initially thought I'd still stick with the BSN and do the prereqs along the way (turned out to be a little cheaper this way, and allowed me to work a bit more). . . however. . . I'm beginning to look at it differently, and I was hoping for some input from the wise.
Fact is, I simply don't have any interest in nursing, nursing theory, nothing. . . and really don't want to do BSN. Truly what I want to do is get a biology major, it interests me considerably more. The main reason I'd still consider BSN is nothing more than logistics (a bit less expensive, easier, and I could work more/save money), and the fact that it provides a bit more of a back up plan (I don't want a back up plan really, but I'm not sure if I'm being irresponsbile not having one, especially being a bit older than most applicants-28 yo upon application). I know a lot of people say medical schools don't care about what you major it, but I'm already looking at having to explain "why medicine and not nursing" and I figured (in addition to it being more intersting to me) majoring in Biology would make it easier to say "see here, this is where I realized my interests, and completely changed paths". If I did Biology I'd have to quit my job (the BSN is mostly online, BIO is not), but it would also afford me more opportunity that many traditional students have (research with faculty, etc. ). What thoughts does everyone have regarding my situation and BIO vs. BSN? I'm trying to ask as many people as I can to supplement my thinking and decision.

You all are wonderful, I'd be so lost without this website! Thanks in advance everyone!

M

 

[Marcus Brody]

Dude. Do not stay in nursing, are you nuts? 😱 You are a medic and an LPN (?), this is practical stuff, borderline-interesting, even. But now you need to show you can handle a rigorous academic schedule with bio101, chem, physics, organic, and all the other crap.

 

[rHinO1]

Concern #1 (lack of leadership) is a non issue. Most people who apply to medical school haven't held a true leadership role (club president, sports team captain, volunteer group coordinator, etc...). However, the type of experiences you described, escpecially as a medic preceptor, indicate you have the potential to be a leader. More importantly, your experiences will hopefully provide you with lots of good things to discuss in your personal statement, secondary essays, and interviews. So don't worry about this. If you want to, try to get a leadership position after you transfer to VCU, but don't let this stress you out. It is a non-issue.

Concern #1 continued (lack of volunteer experience), you definitely need to get this. Because your clinical experience is on the stronger side, you can, and should, pursue non-clinical opportunities. Also, supplementing your clinical experience by shadowing a physician would be a good idea. Personally, I had ~1 year of full time emt work and ~4 years of hospital experience as a tech, so for volunteer work I taught cpr and coached youth sports. I also shadowed two specialties for ~30 hours total.

Concern #2 (BSN vs. Biology), I think you would be better off pursuing a biology degree. You will be able to knock out the pre-reqs as part of your degree, you will be in a live classroom with professors that can write you LOR, and the education would be better background for the pre-clinical years in medical school. Most importantly, you said you want to pursue a degree in biology, while you no longer have any interest in being a nurse. That pretty much says it all, only someone who wants to be a nurse should get a BSN. Besides, you have your RN, right? You can always fall back on that, and go back for your BSN later if you change your mind.

If you really want to be a doctor, then you should go for it. You are fortunate that your 3.7 is still competitive, and therefore, you are still in the game.

 

[Catalystik]

-I simply don't have any interest in nursing, nursing theory,
-really don't want to do BSN.
-I want to do is get a biology major, it interests me considerably more.
-If I did Biology I'd have to quit my job
-the BSN is mostly online, BIO is not),

What thoughts does everyone have regarding my situation and BIO vs. BSN?

Get the BS in Biology. Med schools generally aren't particularly friendly to distance learning yet (unless you're active military), and you don't want to find out, as some SDNers have, that their on-line classes need to be repeated.

 

[gravitywave]

the experience you already have as a medic is leadership experience, far more so in fact than what the majority of matriculants have. just be sure to point that fact up in your essays/experience descriptions when applying. it will also come up at interviews and you must sell it.

absolutely, positively do not pursue nursing any further. get a degree in anything, it doesn't have to be Bio. why would you have to quit your job? take night classes instead.

 

[LizzyM]

In the last 8 years have you done anything in service to those in your community and not been paid for it? This could include coaching, tutoring, scouting, organizing a food drive or outreach to the homeless, volunteering at a blood drive, teaching Sunday School or singing in the choir (or other similar activities in your faith community), even cleaning parks or building playgrounds.

 

[Mdr1985]

Thank you all so very much for your insight. I'm glad to have what I was already leaning towards re-affirmed-the degree in BIO, and I also appreciate the input everyone has had regarding my EC's.

If I may. . . regarding online classes and medical schools potentially not accepting and/or frowning apon them. Since I'll be going the biology route, all of my junior and senior year (including all pre-req's) will be in person. . . however, there are two potential issues I'd appreciate anyones insight towards. . . 1.) I will be a transfer student, transfering to VCU with an associates in science-general studies from my community college, and matriculating as a junior. While my junior and senior year will be all in person, NEARLY ALL of my associates degree was earned online through my community college. Is this going to matter or hurt my chances in any way? 2.) the only in person classes I took at my community college were my two semesters of chemistry. . . while it's good these were at least taken in person, they are still med school pre-reqs taken at a community college. . . again, will this hurt my chances in any way?

Lastly, if anyone had any insight into the volunteering issue I brought up and how this may be viewed (being a bit last minute, and how to answer the question of why last minute should it arise, based on my situation. . . ), I'd love to hear your thoughts. . . and of course anyone elses thoughts on any of this! Thanks again to everyone who has responded 🙂

 

[rHinO1]

Thank you all so very much for your insight. I'm glad to have what I was already leaning towards re-affirmed-the degree in BIO, and I also appreciate the input everyone has had regarding my EC's.

If I may. . . regarding online classes and medical schools potentially not accepting and/or frowning apon them. Since I'll be going the biology route, all of my junior and senior year (including all pre-req's) will be in person. . . however, there are two potential issues I'd appreciate anyones insight towards. . . 1.) I will be a transfer student, transfering to VCU with an associates in science-general studies from my community college, and matriculating as a junior. While my junior and senior year will be all in person, NEARLY ALL of my associates degree was earned online through my community college. Is this going to matter or hurt my chances in any way? 2.) the only in person classes I took at my community college were my two semesters of chemistry. . . while it's good these were at least taken in person, they are still med school pre-reqs taken at a community college. . . again, will this hurt my chances in any way?

Lastly, if anyone had any insight into the volunteering issue I brought up and how this may be viewed (being a bit last minute, and how to answer the question of why last minute should it arise, based on my situation. . . ), I'd love to hear your thoughts. . . and of course anyone elses thoughts on any of this! Thanks again to everyone who has responded 🙂

As far as taking chemistry at the cc, you should be fine. I did two years at cc, then transferred to a 4-year school. At the cc, I took genchem, 1 semester of physics, and general bio. I finished physics, ochem, and majored in human biology at the 4-year school. My cc course work never came up in a single interview. As long as you do well after you transfer, nobody will doubt your ability to perform academically.

In regard to online classes, it may depend how they are listed on your transcript. I took a couple of online courses through the cc (a math course, and an English course), and they are listed just like a live course. Therefore, nobody can even tell they were online. Generally, as long as your 4-year school accepts the courses when you transfer, then you should be fine (particularly since they are not pre-reqs).

For your volunteer work, if you can do a few hours a week over the course of 6 months to a year, it will look better than if you cram it all in to a couple of months. Just do something you find interesting/rewarding, and try to do as much as you can. Just keep in mind, you also have some strengths in other areas of your app. The idea is to be well rounded, and have a lot of experiences to draw from when interviewing/writing essays.

 

[gravitywave]

As far as taking chemistry at the cc, you should be fine. I did two years at cc, then transferred to a 4-year school. At the cc, I took genchem, 1 semester of physics, and general bio. I finished physics, ochem, and majored in human biology at the 4-year school. My cc course work never came up in a single interview. As long as you do well after you transfer, nobody will doubt your ability to perform academically.

In regard to online classes, it may depend how they are listed on your transcript. I took a couple of online courses through the cc (a math course, and an English course), and they are listed just like a live course. Therefore, nobody can even tell they were online. Generally, as long as your 4-year school accepts the courses when you transfer, then you should be fine (particularly since they are not pre-reqs).

For your volunteer work, if you can do a few hours a week over the course of 6 months to a year, it will look better than if you cram it all in to a couple of months. Just do something you find interesting/rewarding, and try to do as much as you can. Just keep in mind, you also have some strengths in other areas of your app. The idea is to be well rounded, and have a lot of experiences to draw from when interviewing/writing essays.

👍 if the uni you're transferring to is giving you credit toward the bachelors for the online stuff, and all your pre-reqs were taken in a real classroom, you have no problems. i'd think this is true even if it's clear from your transcripts that you'd taken online courses.

volunteering is not a big deal. an afternoon a week for six months will cover it nicely.

 

[Catalystik]

NEARLY ALL of my associates degree was earned online through my community college. Is this going to matter or hurt my chances in any way?

You might call the admissions offices of schools you'd most likely apply to (or check the website) and ask about their policy regarding distance learning. Some schools are slowly becoming more liberal on this issue and they vary in their opinion, but best you understand early on exactly where you stand rather than be surprised later on.

It was a good decision to take the Gen Chem at a brick and mortar school. I am unaware of any school that allows the science prerequisites with lab to be taken on-line.

 

[docelh]

Concern 1: Having recently realized my interest in puruing medical school, I haven't been doing everything I could over the past 5 years to ensure a top notch application. My grades will be fine (3.7ish), I'm hoping and planning (with the right amount of preparation!) for a 30-35 MCAT (I know that's quite a range)

What is the basis for this self-assessment? You got a 3.7 in vocational online courses at a community college. I assure you that the pre-med courses will be a different ballgame.

Just be careful about 1) time management and 2) your arrogance.

A fellow student is a paramedic non-trad. She was banking on a 3.7 too, and it didn't happen. She got/is getting her ass handed to her in gen chem and bio. Upon initial analysis, it seems to me that she frankly overcommitted herself to many things and couldn't take care of business.

btw, our chem lab TA not so discretely passed back our last exam... A lot of F's. No curve either.

Peace.

 

[Mdr1985]

Thank you again for everyone's replies, your input has helped me tremendously. Docelh, I appreciate your 'warning', really I do. You are absolutely right, I have not taken many of the tougher science courses, nor have I ever even attended a four year institution, and thus can really do nothing more than guess and hope as to what my GPA will be. I believe it to be a well thought out guess though, here's why. . . My community college GPA is a 4.0, which includes A's in both chemistry courses (taken in person, though yes, still at a CC). . . I also did all of that while working full time. When I move on to a four year institution this upcoming fall, I will be working VERY part time (and only if/when I'm able to handle it). . . so, I feel like hoping for and 'guessing' a 3.7 isn't too terribly out of the ballpark, though perhaps I'm in for a surprise (hope not), certainly not trying to be arrogant.
Ah, but this all leads me to another question, hopefully all of you that have been so helpful might be willing to help me out on this one too and offer some insight (I can't get enough!). . .
Due to the ways classes line up, pre-reqs needed for such and such a class, etc., it's looking like it's going to take me 6 semesters to finish my degree in BIO (even though I'm transfering in with an A.S., the main reason for this being that my A.S didn't include many sciences because I wanted to take those at a university). . . in a perfect world I could possibly pull it off in four semester, but because you need basic bio before cell bio, then cell bio before genetics, etc. etc. . . you get the picture, your ideal four semesters can easily become six. . . anyways, the way it all lines up actually leaves my last two semesters with only 9 credit hours each, and I'm wondering if this would look bad in any way. Should I try an tack on some extra classes to at least make it 12 credits (full time)? Here's my tentative plan, any general thoughts would of course be wonderfully appreciated:
Fall 11 - 13 credit hours (bio, phys, ochem)
Spring 12 - 13 credit hours (bio2, phys2, ochem2) - I figured it'd be a good idea to take/lump together all the pre-req's that the MCAT mainly tests right before I take the MCAT to best prepare (along with then taking lot's of test prep in the summer before taking the test). . . anyone disagree with this thougth process? Sound like a good plan?
Summer-study for MCAT, take MCAT, possible research.
Fall 12 - 16 credit hours (cell bio, ecology, biomed research intro, biochemistry, seed plant bio)
Spring 13 - 13 credit hours (Comparative vertebrate anatomy, genetics, spanish)
Summer - Apply supper early to medical schools, research (hopefully a nice internship or something similar)
Fall 13 - 9 credits (Cancer cell bio, Intro to research, spanish)
Spring 13 - 9 credits (Cancer cell bio lab, Reserach and Thesis/seminar-try to get published)
Then hopefully I'll find something good to be doing over the summer, maybe even something abroad. . . and with fingers crossed, start medical school the coming fall. So, how does that curriculum look so far as what adcoms would like to see? Will the two final semesters with only nine credits hurt me, or will it not matter since my other four semesters were 13 or 16 credits? Should I take extra classes that final fall/spring, or just really enjoy/focus on research and other EC's (those final two semesters will of course be post application, but I of course may not get in somewhere and would want the time spent before the next summer/application to only strengthen my next application attempt). . . So that's all, I just like bouncing my plans off of you all for insight, advice, thoughts, etc. Thanks so much in advance!
M