a potentially huge risk, but i think i am gonna go for it...what do you think?

[gearsofwar3]

so i've asked around SDN quite a bit, and I think i am going to screw my school's committee letter and just apply RIGHT NOW, even though it isnt exactly early. I have a 41 mcat and rock solid everything else, and i am not gonna wait any longer.

the problem is this: I was disciplined by my university over accidentally taking some music sheets out of the library. The sanction i received was very light (the lowest level - a reprimand), but one of the committee members seem to think that i intentionally stole the sheets, which is absolutely not true. (Just think about it, if i was found guilty of stealing, there's no way in Hell that my school - a large public school anal about honor code infractions - would have let me off with just a reprimand. i would have gotten suspended at best and expelled at worst).

when applying, I am not planning on disclosing this stupid incident. and below is my reason. I am not that worried that something like this would keep me out of med school given my other credentials, but if i list this record on the AMCAS, then whatever med school i end up going will know that i was disciplined by my undergraduate institute. This means that i'll potentially have to KEEP addressing this issue on the residency app and even licensure apps. One of my med school friends (who's applying to residencies soon) told me that some of her peers had difficulty getting into competitive residencies because of thier undergraduate disciplinary records. At first i couldn't believe this, but it seems that undergraduate records won't just go away after matriculating into med school - it seems that they will ALWAYS stick with me until i die, which is something i definitely dont want to happen.

if i don't reveal this record, then there's no way that med schools will know about it. yes, it is always possible for a school to contact my university's dean's office and spot check people, but we all know that there's a better chance the world will end in 2012 than that happening. fortunately, my undergrad don't keep low-level sanctions on file forever, so once my record gets deleted, i am home free. on the other hand, if i list this on the amcas, it will stay in the system forever, forcing me to always explain this incident 10, 20, 30 yrs down the road. simply put, i will not be writing residency applications and have to worry AGAIN about a meaningless undergrad record.

am i doig the right thing? please don't give me the usual "be honest" lecture. if you were in my position, what would u do?

---

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[notbobtrustme]

Not getting a committee letter while an undergrad is a huge red flag.

 

[gearsofwar3]

i've graduated already. and i've heard from this forum that plenty of ppl screw the committee letter and that some med schools reveal that most of thier applicants dont send in committee letters even when their schools offer them.

 

[SpacemanSpifff]

i've graduated already. and i've heard from this forum that plenty of ppl screw the committee letter and that some med schools reveal that most of thier applicants dont send in committee letters even when their schools offer them.

Where did you see this claim? LizzyM has stated several times that at her school (and others) this is a point of concern.

I was in your position just before applying. While in undergrad I was slapped with a conduct reprimand, the lowest level of disciplinary action, for covering a smoke detector in my dorm room as a freshman. My undergrad deleted the record after I graduated. Knowing that I had much more to lose than gain by lying, I included this incident on my AMCAS.

The only inconvenience this has created has been in the form of dean's certification letters to Temple and MCW, to ensure that my description of the incident and sanctions were accurate. It hasn't stopped me from being invited to a couple interviews. Then again, maybe I was rejected at Mayo due to the heinous nature of the offense? Could have been my very average GPA and MCAT. Probably the reprimand though.

tl;dr: I would include it. It hasn't hurt me thus far, and your application appears to be much stronger than mine. You'll be a-ok, I'm sure.

 

[BoondocksDoc]

i will not be writing residency applications and have to worry AGAIN about a meaningless undergrad record.

am i doig the right thing?

No. You are not doing the right thing. You are actively lying about your record on an application that very clearly states that you must disclose.

Either:
a) No one checks and no one cares that you specifically avoided a committee letter. You get accepted and hopefully learn how to be accountable for your actions before you're a healthcare provider.
b) An ADCOM member thinks it interesting or weird that you have no letter, even though most people from your institution do. They call up their old buddy on your committee to ask why. You get screwed.

Your record is not meaningless. The meaning for adcoms is that you now have some sort of pattern of stealing, lying, not being able to resolve conflict and then trying to manipulate your way out of the consequences. I wish you luck in the process and think your best luck will come with disclosing, even if you still don't get the committee letter.

 

[Nandrolone]

if u feel this is the best choice, then stick with it...i'd take most of the advice offered in this thread as a grain of salt, since there's a lot of people out there who want you to fail (less competition= better chances for them; it's nasty yes, but it's reality).

If u take this route, don't hide anything, write an statement on what happened, and be willing to provide sufficient evidence. Contrary to what people say, it's not a huge red flag... idk why people keep saying that...I've had several friends get in without committee letters...SDN is full of neurotic pre-meds who freak out when they misspell a word in their PS and stuff like that.

 

[MDWannabe90]

..SDN is full of neurotic pre-meds who freak out when they misspell a word in their PS and stuff like that.

so true

I don't think it's a big deal to not have a committee letter, I won't have one but then again my school doesn't offer them so I don't really have a choice.. But i do think it is risky what you want to do, because disclosing could result in a few less interviews but nothing drastic I'm sure you will still get in somewhere, but if you do what you are planning on doing and not disclose it and then get caught you really are screwed. Not just necessarily for this cycle but if you apply to those same schools again they might remember you? I'm not sure you better seriously think about it.

But the fact that someone on your school committee thinks you committed the crime or whatever and doesn't believe you probably isn't good.. I sure wouldn't want someone like that writing me a letter of reference.

 

[gearsofwar3]

i am not really concerned that this will keep me out of med school. my main concern is that IF i put this down on the amcas, this record will be entered into the system, and that ill have to KEEP thinking/explaing about this down the road when applying to residencies and such. i am worried enough about this right now, and i dont want to keep worrying about it after getting into med school.

then again, i am aware of the consequences should i choose not to report this. such a difficult decision...

 

[Barcu]

Why would you take this risk?

Not reporting something will ruin you, no matter how minor the offense is. You got good advice in the other thread. Report it and get people to back you up. Have someone higher than your committee write a letter (like a dean), explaining the lower penalty.

Don't be stupid. Yes this will be on your record. If your version of events are true, this will not keep you out of med school. Not reporting it and someone finding out WILL keep you out of med school.

 

[gearsofwar3]

Since you are a med student, do you know whether or not residencies and beyond will keep on asking for undergraduate records? this is my main concern and the reason behind not wanting to disclose. i am not worried about acceptance to med school at this point, i am worried that after four years and $200,000 in debt, i'll face significant obstacles with residencies because of this. it doesnt seem fair that what happened during undergrad keeps on being brought up.

Why would you take this risk?

Not reporting something will ruin you, no matter how minor the offense is. You got good advice in the other thread. Report it and get people to back you up. Have someone higher than your committee write a letter (like a dean), explaining the lower penalty.

Don't be stupid. Yes this will be on your record. If your version of events are true, this will not keep you out of med school. Not reporting it and someone finding out WILL keep you out of med school.

 

[Nandrolone]

Why would you take this risk?

Not reporting something will ruin you, no matter how minor the offense is. You got good advice in the other thread. Report it and get people to back you up. Have someone higher than your committee write a letter (like a dean), explaining the lower penalty.

Don't be stupid. Yes this will be on your record. If your version of events are true, this will not keep you out of med school. Not reporting it and someone finding out WILL keep you out of med school.

i respectfully disagree. the absence of a letter is definitely suspicious, yes... but it is equally as risky to let someone on the committee who obviously doesn't like you (doesn't believe your story and finds you guilty of a disciplinary action) write a letter for you. A lack of a letter is easy to explain, while a negative comment from a established committee member is not...

But you, on your own, must report it...you can't hide it...lol

 

[LizzyM]

Given your high MCAT, be sure to apply to WashU.

 

[gearsofwar3]

Given your high MCAT, be sure to apply to WashU.

no thanks. i dont think my GPA is high enough.

 

[deleted127837]

.

 

[LizzyM]

i am not really concerned that this will keep me out of med school. my main concern is that IF i put this down on the amcas, this record will be entered into the system, and that ill have to KEEP thinking/explaing about this down the road when applying to residencies and such. i am worried enough about this right now, and i dont want to keep worrying about it after getting into med school.

then again, i am aware of the consequences should i choose not to report this. such a difficult decision...

I was on your side and believed that it was an honest mistake in the library but now that you plan to be dishonest when completing the AMCAS application, I see you in a different light.

 

[Nandrolone]

I was on your side and believed that it was an honest mistake in the library but now that you plan to be dishonest when completing the AMCAS application, I see you in a different light.

oh wow...i reread the post, and i just simply thought u weren't gonna go with the committee letter...but now, u are lying on an application.....can't believe i wasted my time responding...hope u get caught and never make it to med school.

 

[Doctor Strange]

I could have sworn I read this somewhere already... Either way, you know the right thing to do. The fact that you're even considering lying about this on your application says a lot about your character, and you will no doubt have all hell rain down on you if you're caught.

It's a minor offense, man. Just take the bullet and stay clear of the dark side.

 

[An MD Hopeful]

I can understand your concern. But really, risking getting caught is just NOT worth it. Then you'll never even get into medical school to begin with and can forget about residency at all.

It truly sounds like a really minor incident/accident. I doubt that it will hurt you if you report it. But it definitely will hurt you if you don't report it and get caught.

 

[circulus vitios]

I was on your side and believed that it was an honest mistake in the library but now that you plan to be dishonest when completing the AMCAS application, I see you in a different light.

Don't hate the player, hate the game?

He made an honest mistake and his school is screwing him for it, real hard. Integrity is important but what do you expect him to do: blacklist himself at schools with rigid committee letter requirements, or skirt the truth by omitting a stupid and inconsequential rule infraction for a smaller chance of being blacklisted?

edit: Nevermind, didn't see he was foregoing the committee letter in either case. 😳 But I still don't blame the guy. His school is screwing him over.

 

[Praefectus]

Don't lie. Schools can retroactively rescind your MD over stuff like that. Try explaining that to a residency interviewer.

 

[pasiley]

Accidentally taking some sheets out of the library will not haunt you for the rest of your life. The sheets are not a big deal unless you make them a big deal by hiding it.

The crazy committee member on the other hand is a big deal. However, they are not the only person on the committee. Some people are just bitter and think the worst of people. Remember, they are just 1 person and there are probably other more sensible members on the committee who want to see their students succeed. Think about this, how many pre-meds have at least 1 person on the committee that secretly (or not so secretly) can't stand them? Plenty.

People are crazy. You can't control these people but you can't overreact to them and do crazy things in response either. It just validates their claims. Stop being shady about this. You're just making yourself look more guilty.

 

[TheWeeIceMan]

Not saying this will necessarily happen, but you probably have enough info posted on SDN for someone in an adcom to figure out who you are, if they really wanted to. It's just not worth the risk IMO. All school disciplinary records aren't created equally. I have a hard time believing that this will do anything close to blacklisting you.

 

[Dmr6186]

Don't hate the player, hate the game?

He made an honest mistake and his school is screwing him for it, real hard. Integrity is important but what do you expect him to do: blacklist himself at schools with rigid committee letter requirements, or skirt the truth by omitting a stupid and inconsequential rule infraction for a smaller chance of being blacklisted?

edit: Nevermind, didn't see he was foregoing the committee letter in either case. 😳 But I still don't blame the guy. His school is screwing him over.

That's why people said to get other people to back him up if at all possible, like the dean. Maybe it was a stupid mistake. But do med schools know that? NO. All they know is that this person has an incident on their record, and guilty or not, it IS his responsibility to explain it. And what if it comes up on his background check? Then what? He will be rejected the day before class starts because they found the very thing he didn't report.

Also, I'm just playing devils advocate and not accusing anybody, but if i remember his story correctly, it also took a couple days for the SCHOOL to call him to tell him what he did. Which means he never went in his bag again while doing his project during those next couple days? He probably knew he took them but was lazy to bring them back. If he would've walked to the library and plopped those sheets on the counter and said "whoops" on his own, this would not have happened to him. He's damn lucky he wasnt charged with theft by the police for taking expensive music sheets worth thousands of dollars. Guarantee you this is what his school's pre-med committee has discussed and that's why they can't write a good letter for him. He's either seriously absent minded or seriously stupid.

If you don't like the system, don't play the game. Sorry to be harsh but it's the truth. You're a grown up now. Act like it. You wanna be responsible for other people's lives? Be responsible for your own first.

 

[circulus vitios]

That's why people said to get other people to back him up if at all possible, like the dean. Maybe it was a stupid mistake. But do med schools know that? NO. All they know is that this person has an incident on their record, and guilty or not, it IS his responsibility to explain it. And what if it comes up on his background check? Then what? He will be rejected the day before class starts because they found the very thing he didn't report.

Also, I'm just playing devils advocate and not accusing anybody, but if i remember his story correctly, it also took a couple days for the SCHOOL to call him to tell him what he did. Which means he never went in his bag again while doing his project during those next couple days? He probably knew he took them but was lazy to bring them back. If he would've walked to the library and plopped those sheets on the counter and said "whoops" on his own, this would not have happened to him. He's damn lucky he wasnt charged with theft by the police for taking expensive music sheets worth thousands of dollars. Guarantee you this is what his school's pre-med committee has discussed and that's why they can't write a good letter for him. He's either seriously absent minded or seriously stupid.

If you don't like the system, don't play the game. Sorry to be harsh but it's the truth. You're a grown up now. Act like it. You wanna be responsible for other people's lives? Be responsible for your own first.

I disagree with this part. You're not familiar with "the system," are you? He was screwed the instant he accidentally borrowed those sheets.

 

[Josh7]

Stealing sheet music is such a specific crime too. I can't believe you would post it where a lot of faculty see because I am sure some will recognize you from SDN.

Do not lie on your AMCAS. That is very unethical and based on this thread you seem to be a somewhat shady character...

 

[Dmr6186]

I disagree with this part. You're not familiar with "the system," are you? He was screwed the instant he accidentally borrowed those sheets.

Maybe so. It depends on who he would've brought the sheets to. Also, some people are more forgiving than others, depending on a variety of variables. However you're right, legally, he was screwed the moment they went in his bag and walked out with them (I really am trying to wrap my head around this).

 

[dmf2682]

Maybe so. It depends on who he would've brought the sheets to. Also, some people are more forgiving than others, depending on a variety of variables. However you're right, legally, he was screwed the moment they went in his bag and walked out with them (I really am trying to wrap my head around this).

Cousin is that you?

 

[TeddyBoomBoom]

Perhaps I am being simplistic, but it just seems to me that lying on your application is in general basically a bad idea...

 

[MaenadsDance]

Stealing sheet music is such a specific crime too. I can't believe you would post it where a lot of faculty see because I am sure some will recognize you from SDN.

Do not lie on your AMCAS. That is very unethical and based on this thread you seem to be a somewhat shady character...

Exactly. Too dumb to return the music, too dumb to figure out it's better to tell the truth and move ahead with a clean conscience, and too dumb to ask about it on SDN without blabbing all of the specifics out loud.

 

[mehc012]

This kind of lying is why they always ask some (I would have thought easy) ethics question. I always thought that was silly, since it's clear what kind of answer they're going for. Apparently, though, you just don't get it. Integrity is a hugely important quality on applications; they have plenty of highly intelligent applicants, so why would they take a liar even if their stats are good?

You can either explain it, get into med school, and not have it be an issue again (since people will know it passed your adcoms' scrutiny) or you can lie about it, get caught, and likely not get in at all. You instantly destroy all credibility for your 'it was an accident' story if you lie about it. That means it's not "I'll try hiding it, and if that doesn't work I'll try explaining it" but rather "I'll try hiding it, and if that doesn't work they can assume I actually do steal valuable documents."

If you do get in, you'll have to wonder if you could have actually gotten in on your own merit without cheating and lying. Yes, I consider lying on an application to be analogous to cheating.

The fact that you even consider lying on your app this way is more than a red flag.

 

[Ashley1989]

The truth is always more important than the consequences or whatever minor inconvenience you might have to go through by explaining and re explaining this to your grave.

Do yourself a favor and be honest, you seem like a great applicant so do the right thing.

 

[TipToad]

OP,

Seriously

 

[LessonZero]

The fact that you are trying to rationalize such an obviously dishonest action (intentional lying and concealment) is truly laughable. Risking everything to cover up such a minor offense simply makes no sense, and your consideration of lying suggests far worse things about your character than your original minor discplinary action. Unfortunately, the specificity of this incident and your revelealed MCAT score make any attempts by adcoms to connect your application to this post a rather trivial task (on the off-chance that any current adcom members happen to frequent this site and come across this thread). In any case, this is your decision, so feel free to take the risk and abandon any sense of integrity for the sake of convenience and the pursuit of your goals.

 

[mirimonster]

am i doig the right thing? please don't give me the usual "be honest" lecture. if you were in my position, what would u do?

I was too lazy to read your whole post, but I came upon this gem. Really? You ask if you're doing the right thing and then say "don't tell me to be honest?" Clearly you already know the answer to your own question. Why you would go blabbing about your intended dishonesty on a public forum frequented by adcoms is beyond me. Good luck in life.

Given your high MCAT, be sure to apply to WashU.

Curious - why?

Because WashU requires a Dean's Certification thingy, meaning OP would be SOL.

Thank you OP, I now understand why not having a committee letter is a huge red flag. Also, enjoy explaining your lack of committee letter on every single application.

 

[Ashley1989]

My question is this: if you're okay with lying on your application, who is to say you're not lying about the music sheets? You're making yourself look pretty bad (or at least would be if you lied), and omitting it makes you look guilty. This will come back to bite you in the rear end one way or another.

You don't want the whole honest lecture but rather what we would do. Well I think a majority of people would not lie on their app.

 

[IlDestriero]

I was too lazy to read your whole post, but I came upon this gem. Really? You ask if you're doing the right thing and then say "don't tell me to be honest?" Clearly you already know the answer to your own question. Why you would go blabbing about your intended dishonesty on a public forum frequented by adcoms is beyond me. Good luck in life.






Because WashU requires a Dean's Certification thingy, meaning OP would be SOL.

Thank you OP, I now understand why not having a committee letter is a huge red flag. Also, enjoy explaining your lack of committee letter on every single application.

For someone who has already graduated, explaining the lack of a committee letter takes one sentence. It's reasonable to say you left the area and had done so much more after graduation that the committee wasn't in a good position to represent you and you couldn't come back for an interview. The end. Perhaps not entirely correct, but a reasonable answer that an interviewer or committee wouldn't black ball you for believing. I didn't have a committee letter, I didn't play the game and the wacko pre med advisor who ran the show wouldn't be able to accurately represent me, she hardly knew me at all. Not because of a lack of commitment, but a decision not to waste my time with a nut job and the other followers. Of note, the "independent pre meds" in my class did very well, while the "followers" had more limited success. Her helpful recommendations, like take insanely hard weeder engineering and computer science major classes, were actually detrimental. Yeah, I want her letter.:screwy:
YMMV.
P.S. I smell trolling, but responded anyway to give an alternate opinion for other grads considering dumping the committee letter.

 

[TheShaker]

i've graduated already. and i've heard from this forum that plenty of ppl screw the committee letter and that some med schools reveal that most of thier applicants dont send in committee letters even when their schools offer them.

OP, perhaps you got that idea from the list of schools that I sent you who have personally told me that they do not care about committee letter. There is one exception to this, if you come from a heavy feeder school then you probably need it. I go to a small insignificant state school, they probably don't even know who we are. I don't know where you went for undergrad, but that's something to consider.

On the part about lying on your AMCAS, I don't know if I'm understanding correctly. When does your university delete your "crime"? If it will be deleted by the time you apply for residency then I think it will be fine. I don't think they will look at your AMCAS for residency since it uses a whole different application service. When you apply for residency, just don't include it since it will be deleted and as far as recorded history goes, you never did the "crime". Of course, if I'm mistaken, then someone should correct me. I've never applied to residency. 😳

As for if you should be lying on your AMCAS, I don't think you should. The morality part is up for interpretation and I really don't see a huge deal since I see it more as a white lie than anything. If you were charged with something heavier, then maybe not. I think you should just disclose it since the risk is not worth the reward. If you get caught, there is a possibility that you will never be able to apply to medical school ever again. If you just disclose it, maybe a few narrow minded schools will throw you out but most won't even care, especially with a letter from the dean explaining the incident. Take everyone's advice, maybe not because of moral reasons, but to be safe in this delicate application process.

 

[kami333]

It's kind of remarkable how the OP's story went from him realizing he had accidentally taken them himself and the library staff turning him in when he voluntarily went to return them to not realizing he had taken them until the dean called him in. I'm generally not one to judge but this situation seems a bit off to me...

 

[kpcrew]

Well, if I were planning on having a lie by omission on my application, I wouldn't post it to a publicly available forum where anyone could stumble upon it.

 

[mirimonster]

For someone who has already graduated, explaining the lack of a committee letter takes one sentence. It's reasonable to say you left the area and had done so much more after graduation that the committee wasn't in a good position to represent you and you couldn't come back for an interview. The end. Perhaps not entirely correct, but a reasonable answer that an interviewer or committee wouldn't black ball you for believing. I didn't have a committee letter, I didn't play the game and the wacko pre med advisor who ran the show wouldn't be able to accurately represent me, she hardly knew me at all. Not because of a lack of commitment, but a decision not to waste my time with a nut job and the other followers. Of note, the "independent pre meds" in my class did very well, while the "followers" had more limited success. Her helpful recommendations, like take insanely hard weeder engineering and computer science major classes, were actually detrimental. Yeah, I want her letter.:screwy:
YMMV.
P.S. I smell trolling, but responded anyway to give an alternate opinion for other grads considering dumping the committee letter.

Not sure that you know what's going on in this thread....OP isn't just dumping the committee letter, he's dumping it because he doesn't want to explain an institutional action, which is a very different story. There are of course many legitimate reasons to forego the committee letter, including graduation.

 

[ur2l8]

My friend got into Yale and Emory with an alky minor violation freshman year...he reported it.

Just report it. No one will care about something 4 or 7 or 8 years ago. Good luck

 

[ur2l8]

I personally call troll lol 🙂

 

[IlDestriero]

Not sure that you know what's going on in this thread....OP isn't just dumping the committee letter, he's dumping it because he doesn't want to explain an institutional action, which is a very different story. There are of course many legitimate reasons to forego the committee letter, including graduation.

I'm not addressing that bit of ******ation.😉
However, some, including lizzy repeatedly assert that not having the committee letter is a "big red flag" even for this guy, who has clearly said that he graduated. I don't agree that most schools see it that way. Perhaps hers does, perhaps she does, perhaps

 

[xXIDaShizIXx]

Honestly, I would still wait.
​

 

[triquetrum13]

Honestly, there is a simple solution. Report the incident on AMCAS, don't get the committee letter, and if anyone asks why explain it to them that one of the committee members thinks you're a criminal and would surely give you bad review. Not that difficult, and all your problems are solved. The only thing not solved is having to "keep dealing with it" but honestly it doesn't seem that serious and takes a 10 second explanation, assuming your telling the truth.
And seriously? lying on the AMCAS? dont screw yourself, you have a 41 on the MCAT, dont waste that.

 

[An MD Hopeful]

Honestly, there is a simple solution. Report the incident on AMCAS, don't get the committee letter, and if anyone asks why explain it to them that one of the committee members thinks you're a criminal and would surely give you bad review. Not that difficult, and all your problems are solved. The only thing not solved is having to "keep dealing with it" but honestly it doesn't seem that serious and takes a 10 second explanation, assuming your telling the truth.
And seriously? lying on the AMCAS? dont screw yourself, you have a 41 on the MCAT, dont waste that.

...I think a better explanation is IlDestriero's idea:

For someone who has already graduated, explaining the lack of a committee letter takes one sentence. It's reasonable to say you left the area and had done so much more after graduation that the committee wasn't in a good position to represent you and you couldn't come back for an interview.

 

[tennis1234]

so i've asked around SDN quite a bit, and I think i am going to screw my school's committee letter and just apply RIGHT NOW, even though it isnt exactly early. I have a 41 mcat and rock solid everything else, and i am not gonna wait any longer.

the problem is this: I was disciplined by my university over accidentally taking some music sheets out of the library. The sanction i received was very light (the lowest level - a reprimand), but one of the committee members seem to think that i intentionally stole the sheets, which is absolutely not true. (Just think about it, if i was found guilty of stealing, there's no way in Hell that my school - a large public school anal about honor code infractions - would have let me off with just a reprimand. i would have gotten suspended at best and expelled at worst).

when applying, I am not planning on disclosing this stupid incident. and below is my reason. I am not that worried that something like this would keep me out of med school given my other credentials, but if i list this record on the AMCAS, then whatever med school i end up going will know that i was disciplined by my undergraduate institute. This means that i'll potentially have to KEEP addressing this issue on the residency app and even licensure apps. One of my med school friends (who's applying to residencies soon) told me that some of her peers had difficulty getting into competitive residencies because of thier undergraduate disciplinary records. At first i couldn't believe this, but it seems that undergraduate records won't just go away after matriculating into med school - it seems that they will ALWAYS stick with me until i die, which is something i definitely dont want to happen.

if i don't reveal this record, then there's no way that med schools will know about it. yes, it is always possible for a school to contact my university's dean's office and spot check people, but we all know that there's a better chance the world will end in 2012 than that happening. fortunately, my undergrad don't keep low-level sanctions on file forever, so once my record gets deleted, i am home free. on the other hand, if i list this on the amcas, it will stay in the system forever, forcing me to always explain this incident 10, 20, 30 yrs down the road. simply put, i will not be writing residency applications and have to worry AGAIN about a meaningless undergrad record.

am i doig the right thing? please don't give me the usual "be honest" lecture. if you were in my position, what would u do?

I would do the same thing...People here are so self-righteous.

The wording of the question:
"Were you ever the recipient of any institutional action by any college or medical school for unacceptable academic performance or conduct violation even though such action may not have interrupted your enrollment or required you to withdraw?"

Look carefully, and it says action (not warning, not reprimand, but action). Actions are steps taken by the university to punish you, even though they may not have interrupted your enrollment or required you to withdraw. So think receiving an F in a class, suspending you for a semester, requiring you to take an alcohol education class. A warning is to prevent you from receiving such actions. For those self-righteous people on this form, would you report your parking ticket to amcas??? Because technically it's a conduct violation. There's a reason they put this question on amcas, it's to filter out the morally messed up people. If you think getting a warning makes you morally wrong, go ahead an put yes on this section. Otherwise, don't make yourself look bad.

 

[circulus vitios]

My question is this: if you're okay with lying on your application, who is to say you're not lying about the music sheets? You're making yourself look pretty bad (or at least would be if you lied), and omitting it makes you look guilty. This will come back to bite you in the rear end one way or another.

You don't want the whole honest lecture but rather what we would do. Well I think a majority of people would not lie on their app.

Oh, SDN.

 

[Ashley1989]

Oh, SDN.

Look at the OPs post history. The story changed from him finding the sheets, freaking out and returning them immediately to the dean calling him after three days because they caught him on security video or something of the sort. The OP didn't happen to stumble across the sheets after three days and they had to call him?

Quite the change of story... Quite the change.

 

[dayswellspent]

For someone who has already graduated, explaining the lack of a committee letter takes one sentence. It's reasonable to say you left the area and had done so much more after graduation that the committee wasn't in a good position to represent you and you couldn't come back for an interview. The end. Perhaps not entirely correct, but a reasonable answer that an interviewer or committee wouldn't black ball you for believing.
YMMV.

I graduated a year ago and I don't have a committee letter. I was a little worried about it, but after reading your story, I feel a lot better about not having one. Thanks! 🙂