AA - thoughts on overrepresentation as well

[Ryo-Ohki]

---

Members don't see this ad.

heh heh

 

[bongsen]

What does my post have to do with being immature? You could have the opinion that I was wrong or ignorant, but immature...well, you are just being a poopy head 😡

I can compete just fine thank you. My point was and is that Asians choose the professions they choose for (in my opinion) shallow reasons.

So bite me 😀

Do you ever think that some Asian people might actually like the prospect of helping people? You are horrifically wrong, dear nelson. 👎

 

[Fermata]

everyone knows that diversity was an old, old wooden ship used in the Civil War era....read the sig

Haha.

The best line in the movie was the "optical illusion" bit. 😀

 

[Swack]

gambling is gambling...but your career is different. im talking about how asians go down the straight and narrow when it comes to education.

I think it's related. They want high yields, so they gamble. They want high yields from their kids as well but in the form of job prestige/money, so they gamble it by trying to coerce them into medicine. It's not guaranteed either, how many asians set out to be doctors only to fail?

 

[jlee9531]

i guess i could be an exception to the money making rule.
im asian.
i support AA.
sure i dont mind the money, but im not one to go all crazy and threaten to leave medicine from the prospect that our salaries will go down if we switch to a universal healthcare type system.....

as long as i make more than the 15-20K i am supporting my family on right now, i really dont give a crap on how much i make. i know what i want to do and am glad to have an opportunity to do it.

my mom came over here to give her kids better opportunities in life. we took advantage. she made sure we tried our best to get into a good college, but after that it was basically up to us. ill end up in medicine and my brother will get to do what he likes in history. all she cares about now is who we marry haha. too bad i know thats one area, she prolly wont agree with my decision...oh well 😉 i know best.

 

[MEG@COOL]

Sadly enough this happened to my Vietnamese friend. He wanted to become an engineer, but his parents pushed him into medicine. He was depressed for many months when they made the decision for him..poor guy 🙁.

Wow this suprises me.... I thought engineering was one of the careers highly regarded by asians. Get a masters degree in engineering.... Decent money can be had.

 

[Skoundrel]

People are in it for the money! People need to be able to help themselves before they can be in a position to help others. First get paid, then you can afford to work for free!

 

[AznDoc]

I guess if this whole med school thing comes crashing down then I'll pursue a career in stand-up comedy. It should have dawned on me that comedy was for me when I realized that I was only asian who had ever failed math 😱 . Just kidding guys, have a good day. 👍

 

[euromd]

HOw about 3.15 sci 3.4 non sci and a 24 MCAT with LOTS of experience as medical assistant and research. (I am traditional)
-taj

If you're black you'll get in. If you're white, you won't. that's AA at its finest.

-S

 

[4 Ever]

If you're black you'll get in. If you're white, you won't. that's AA at its finest.

-S

actually he was asking but posted in the wrong thread. Though, even with AA, i think those are still on the lower end of acceptances

 

[Swack]

Wow this suprises me.... I thought engineering was one of the careers highly regarded by asians. Get a masters degree in engineering.... Decent money can be had.

Engineering is highly regarded, but medicine is definitely a notch up.

 

[SanDiegoSOD]

as long as i make more than the 15-20K i am supporting my family on right now, i really dont give a crap on how much i make. i know what i want to do and am glad to have an opportunity to do it.

Would you be content with $50k a year? Because if so, DAMN, that's more of a commitment to the principle of medicine then I have. I just cant validate 12 years of work (4 under, 4 med, 4 res) to get paid any less than $200k a year. Though that's just me.

 

[Quynh2007]

actually, for my country (Vietnam) medicine is not that great. When I went on tour this summer, I meet a family of 4, both parents used to be doctors, but the profession doesn't pay that well, and they no longer practice. I think the one profession in vietnam that is most highly regarded is teaching since it is very expensive to go to school. Funny how the professions have reverse roles.

 

[wends]

Would you be content with $50k a year? Because if so, DAMN, that's more of a commitment to the principle of medicine then I have. I just cant validate 12 years of work (4 under, 4 med, 4 res) to get paid any less than $200k a year. Though that's just me.

ive lived a comfortable life with parents making about 50,000 a year (both together). but i know what you mean....if im a doctor, i already have so much stress and **** to worry about....i dont want to add financial strain to the mix....imagine worrying about patients all day, come home, and worry about whether you can pay mortgage, kids to college....i think i'll bust. plus, i want to pay back my loans!!! 😳

 

[Swack]

actually, for my country (Vietnam) medicine is not that great. When I went on tour this summer, I meet a family of 4, both parents used to be doctors, but the profession doesn't pay that well, and they no longer practice. I think the one profession in vietnam that is most highly regarded is teaching since it is very expensive to go to school. Funny how the professions have reverse roles.

I am half Vietnamese, half Chinese and it's surprising to hear you say medicine is not that highly regarded in the Vietnamese community. Maybe it's because my Vietnamese side is ghetto (Hue) . There are not a lot of Vietnamese US educated doctors, a majority of the oriental doctors are Chinese.

 

[euromd]

actually he was asking but posted in the wrong thread. Though, even with AA, i think those are still on the lower end of acceptances

24 MCAT is pretty solid AA material, his gpa is a little low however, but his research makes up for sh*tty marks. adcoms do look at that.

I also didn't mention which schools...

and umm, in case it's not obvious - DEATH TO AFFIRMATIVE ACTION - time to prove yourselves just like everyone else does. HARD WORK!

-S

 

[Quynh2007]

I am half Vietnamese, half Chinese and it's surprising to hear you say medicine is not that highly regarded in the Vietnamese community. Maybe it's because my Vietnamese side is ghetto (Hue) . There are not a lot of Vietnamese US educated doctors, a majority of the oriental doctors are Chinese.

I didn't say highly regarded, I said high paying. Any profession in Vietnam is pretty highly regarded as it is extremely competitive to even get into a Professional School/university.

 

[Swack]

I didn't say highly regarded, I said high paying. Any profession in Vietnam is pretty highly regarded as it is extremely competitive to even get into a Professional School/university.

You said it's not that great, so I thought you were referring to reputation, oops . But yea, I do agree with you that competition is heavy in Vietnam.

 

[tao]

*first post*

i just have to comment that this is a ridiculous thread.

it's funny how almost all the comments about how asian and jewish people think, are coming from white people.

 

[4 Ever]

*first post*

i just have to comment that this is a ridiculous thread.

it's funny how almost all the comments about how asian and jewish people think, are coming from white people.

I think its the KKK med students speaking up. I wonder when theyll start putting up the burning crucifix on this thread.

 

[wends]

i think its hurtful to make generalizations in general..... 🙁 , in all seriousness, to make such statements only arouse defensiveness and anger 😡

 

[euromd]

i think its hurtful to make generalizations in general.....

no need to say more. it's funny enough.

-S

 

[Peterock]

There is affirmative action in sports. Please look at all those white QB's in the NFL and the way Yao Ming is protected by the refs in the NBA.

At least AA attempts to help people who have been discriminated against (and will always be discriminated against).

 

[4 Ever]

There is affirmative action in sports. Please look at all those white QB's in the NFL and the way Yao Ming is protected by the refs in the NBA.

At least AA attempts to help people who have been discriminated against (and will always be discriminated against).

This is the saddest presentation of AA in sports I have ever heard or read. There is no such thing as AA in sports. Do you think that athletes are chosen because of their lower skills + ethnicity? No, they are chosen BECAUSE of their talent (unlike in medical school). If you really think Yao and Favre type athletes are their because of AA, you're mistaken. Furthermore, if Yao was so protected, then why was Shaq able to spew out racial comments without an apology. Reverse racism is just as bad as racism but the difference is that Shaq can scream racism if it hits him, but throw it out and its not racism then. Gimme a break

 

[Peterock]

This is the saddest presentation of AA in sports I have ever heard or read. There is no such thing as AA in sports. Do you think that athletes are chosen because of their lower skills + ethnicity? No, they are chosen BECAUSE of their talent (unlike in medical school). If you really think Yao and Favre type athletes are their because of AA, you're mistaken. Furthermore, if Yao was so protected, then why was Shaq able to spew out racial comments without an apology. Reverse racism is just as bad as racism but the difference is that Shaq can scream racism if it hits him, but throw it out and its not racism then. Gimme a break

Blah blah blah. There are political reasons for for just about everything. Wang Zhi Zhi (he doesn't even belong in the NBDL) and Yao Ming are good examples of political favortism in sports, so is Najera in Dallas (please the big hispanic population). It's funny watching Yao Ming labor up the court after 4 mins of playing and he's suppossed to be an all star. Haha. You think the NBA doesn't want the viewership and money from 1 billion people in China? 🙄

The vast number of white QB's is a definite an example of racism. It is seen as a cerebral position as well as an athletic one. So why are black so few black people allowed to play the QB position starting from the high school level? Hrmm... The worst part is that you guys don't even realize that blacks are still discriminated against even in almost all-black sports.

Sports and entertainment definitely have elements of discrimination, AA, etc. I'd hate to burst the naive bubble you're living in.

I'm curious, what is your ethnicity and class background? 🙂

 

[jlee9531]

Would you be content with $50k a year? Because if so, DAMN, that's more of a commitment to the principle of medicine then I have. I just cant validate 12 years of work (4 under, 4 med, 4 res) to get paid any less than $200k a year. Though that's just me.

50K???? dude...i would feel hella rich if i had 50K a year to live on.
i get to do a job i want, more than double my current income, and actually have health insurance.

yes i could easily be happy off that.

 

[Peterock]

50K???? dude...i would feel hella rich if i had 50K a year to live on.
i get to do a job i want, more than double my current income, and actually have health insurance.

yes i could easily be happy off that.

Exactly. If all med schools costs what say my state school cost (<10k/yr) than I'd gladly accept 50k. Bottom line is that most of the people in this process are from wealthy homes and are in only in this to stay wealthy. If the money changed, their suppossedly "pure" aspirations would change as well.

 

[4 Ever]

Must not have had a real job. With 50K (post residency), you would keep probably 30K of it or so. So then let's say you spend 1000/month for rent for the year, thats 12k ... car loans, car insurance, bills, malpractice insurance, educational loans etc . Yeah, realistically, when you're earning 50k after finishing medical school, then you'll realize it isn't enough for what you do.

Furthemore, your bottom line opinion just shows how delusional your view of the other applicants is. I guess we're all just rich folk out to gain our own fortune. You've figured it out.


Regarding your AA in sports, that is just a load of crock. But you must be right, I guess more black people need to be playing basketball and football. In football, the RB's, FB's, defensive/offensive line, WR's are mostly black. but HEY, there HAS to be something done about AA in the position of QB. And we definitely need more black people in basketball right? 🙄

Get off your racial high horse. Maybe YOU need to get out of your own little racist bubble. You're only defending AA when it suits you but not if it suits others. God forbid you have some Indian PG for the LA lakers getting the MVP award - you would be the first in line to protest such a thing then right?

 

[wends]

how is thread still alive? 😕

 

[DrThom]

how is thread still alive? 😕

because stubborn, indignant people keep posting in it....

ah, when will people learn you can't change others opinions...

 

[DrThom]

Well I guess I just posted in it...does that make me stubborn and indignant...

DAMMIT

 

[jlee9531]

Must not have had a real job. With 50K (post residency), you would keep probably 30K of it or so. So then let's say you spend 1000/month for rent for the year, thats 12k ... car loans, car insurance, bills, malpractice insurance, educational loans etc . Yeah, realistically, when you're earning 50k after finishing medical school, then you'll realize it isn't enough for what you do.

Furthemore, your bottom line opinion just shows how delusional your view of the other applicants is. I guess we're all just rich folk out to gain our own fortune. You've figured it out.


Regarding your AA in sports, that is just a load of crock. But you must be right, I guess more black people need to be playing basketball and football. In football, the RB's, FB's, defensive/offensive line, WR's are mostly black. but HEY, there HAS to be something done about AA in the position of QB. And we definitely need more black people in basketball right? 🙄

Get off your racial high horse. Maybe YOU need to get out of your own little racist bubble. You're only defending AA when it suits you but not if it suits others. God forbid you have some Indian PG for the LA lakers getting the MVP award - you would be the first in line to protest such a thing then right?

i support a family of 3 off of 15-20K. I may not be able to afford health insurance, but car insurance, rent, food etc...gets taken care of if you manage your money wisely.

after taxes if that 50K salary ended up being 30K, I would still be able to live off that decently since its what im doing right now, just with a lot less.

but hey its all a matter of lifestyle and how you want to live. if someone came from a well to do family and they were used to that standard of living, and saw that medicine didn't pay well like it used to in the past, i can easily understand why they would consider another choice in careers.

for other people that are not as fortunate, its just an amazing opportunity to be able to contribute to society in a way that physicians do and get paid well for it (compared to what low paying job their parents' may have been doing) at the same time.

but of course am i in no way advocating for doctors' salaries to drastically decrease or anything like that. i understand the tough road that all of us have to go through in order to get that degree. and for all the time, money and effort we put in, we should be adequately compensated. sure i'd be happy with 50K because i've never experienced anything even close to that amt. But if my end salary ended up being a 150K, would it be better? sure. who wouldn't want extra financial security? to be able to pay off their loans quicker, get a nice house and car, and be able to get their SO all the nice things they deserve...I do.

but i consider all these things bonuses. i had my reasons to pursue medicine and would have went into it regardless.

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

A lot of the subsidies you have at your current income level will not exist when you start earning $50K/year.

 

[Peterock]

A lot of the subsidies you have at your current income level will not exist when you start earning $50K/year.

Your making assumptions that this person receives welfare or even pays taxes.

And to 4ever... I doubt you've worked half the jobs I have. Again, please state your ethnicity and what your parents do for a living and the type of jobs you've held before you try to act all wordly. I'm sure it will make your pompousness all the more laughable!

50,000/yr is more money than the average couple makes in my state. I your statements show how ignorant you are over money, and how accostomed you are to a spoiled materialistic lifestyle.

 

[jlee9531]

no welfare here. i wish i had access tho.

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

You're not in Section 8 or any sort of subsidized housing?

As far as your health insurance or lack thereof, I assume your kids have at least modified Medicaid health insurance through the state.

 

[SanDiegoSOD]

Exactly. If all med schools costs what say my state school cost (<10k/yr) than I'd gladly accept 50k. Bottom line is that most of the people in this process are from wealthy homes and are in only in this to stay wealthy. If the money changed, their suppossedly "pure" aspirations would change as well.

If medicine paid $50k a year, then the skill of your average physician would be much lower then it currently is. Most highly intelligent people would take their skill sets to other proffesions where they can be compensated at much higher rates. High salaries in medicine are necessary to keep people motivated enough to complete the 12 year process.

 

[jlee9531]

You're not in Section 8 or any sort of subsidized housing?

As far as your health insurance or lack thereof, I assume your kids have at least modified Medicaid health insurance through the state.

nope. nada. I am the eldest son in a family without a dad taking care of an ill mom and my younger brother. but dont feel like revealing everything about my family 😉. but luckily my brother now being in college has school insurance.

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

Ah, yes. The good old Mom Subsidy. Many people on welfare seem to lack this strong family support and cohesion.

I doubt the skill of the average physician would drop if wages were artificially lowered and held to $50K. That's because there will be no physicians (besides the independently wealthy do gooders). You can earn $50K+ with just a BS degree. Why work hard and go to school for 4 additional years just to take a pay cut?

 

[4 Ever]

Your making assumptions that this person receives welfare or even pays taxes.

And to 4ever... I doubt you've worked half the jobs I have. Again, please state your ethnicity and what your parents do for a living and the type of jobs you've held before you try to act all wordly. I'm sure it will make your pompousness all the more laughable!

50,000/yr is more money than the average couple makes in my state. I your statements show how ignorant you are over money, and how accostomed you are to a spoiled materialistic lifestyle.

You want to feel like a *******? then let me tell you what you want to hear:

I am a South Asian and I came to this country about 12 years ago. My parents were born in a village where my father worked his ass off (mother died at the age of 12 and father the age of 16) to get a college degree (one of the first in the family) where my mother was strictly a housewife. When we first started living here, my dad had to work his job in another country which left my mother (who spoke very little english) to raise 3 kids in a foreign country with the lack of her verbal skills. We were on welfare for a few years and my mother worked in a factory - a lot of overtime. Slowly we were able to get off welfare thanks to the due diligence of my mother and patience of my father living thousands of miles away. Recently, my father was able to retire from his other job and came here. He was unemployed for a year while he tried to find a job and then he studied his ass off to get certified as a Flight Dispatcher (his previous job) in this country.

I personally worked as a cart pusher for a grocery store (1yr), then worked at mcdonalds (2yrs) followed by jobs on campus. I kept none of my paychecks because I had no need to spend it all on me when my mother was working so much overtime. I was able to get scholarships and grants to help pay my way through college.

My family has what it has because of how hard it worked to get here. We came from having absolutely nothing to having a decent lifestyle (the so-called luxorious lifestyle that you state I have). I am not ignorant of the money that my family has or spends because we've earned it through hard work. I will always work to have what my parents wanted me to have - a great future where I don't have to go through what my parents went through. My other siblings had their own choice of what field they wanted to pursue and I was the only one going for medicine. There was no pressure from my family for me to go into medicine - it was a personal choice.

I guess i've shattered all your nonsense drivel about who you think i am so now I ask you the same questions you have asked me. Also, what state DO you live in? If the cost of living is lower in your state, then hell 50k is great.

 

[hy2026]

After reading all the responses, I just realized how great America truly is. It seems like there are a lot immigrants (or their children) who want to be doctors. Can you imagine any other country in the world that would allow so many immigrants to go into medicine, law...etc?

Yes racism still exists, and aa is good for some, bad for others, but overall we live in a great country.

God bless

 

[Blake]

After reading all the responses, I just realized how great America truly is. It seems like there are a lot immigrants (or their children) who want to be doctors. Can you imagine any other country in the world that would allow so many immigrants to go into medicine, law...etc?

Yes racism still exists, and aa is good for some, bad for others, but overall we live in a great country.

God bless

Hey, you forgot Canada too. 😉 😀

 

[Peterock]

If medicine paid $50k a year, then the skill of your average physician would be much lower then it currently is. Most highly intelligent people would take their skill sets to other proffesions where they can be compensated at much higher rates. High salaries in medicine are necessary to keep people motivated enough to complete the 12 year process.

For the most part, I beleive this to be true.

Though many people in academia are not fueled by money, but by ego.... many professors who make ~100k/yr push out 20-50 papers don't make the salaries that a specialty surgeon make...

these fields still have high quality individuals

 

[Skoundrel]

24 on the MCAT and 3.0 gpa I think are exceptional for a person to achieve. Especially when that person?s dad is in prison, mom is addicted to drugs; they have to take care of their 5 siblings, also having to dodge bullets and gangs on the way to school, plus working 40 hours a week while going to college. Education unfortunately becomes less of a priority when you are hungry and you do not know if you will have a roof over your head tomorrow. The reality of the situation is over half of you whining spoiled brats would fall in to obscurity if you had to deal with even a fraction of the adversity that most DISADVANTAGED students had to deal with. Just being a minority is not enough but what did you have to over come to get where you are?? ADD, give me a break. When you people with ADD get more time on the MCAT then everybody else should as well!