abp certlink?

[SEpathguy]

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I just signed up for this. Anyone else doing it? I like the idea of potentially not having to take the test, but wondering how big of a pain this will be. The details on exemption from the test are quite vague. And I'm pretty sure that within the next week or so I'll have a dream where I miss one of the questions and guys in black suits show up at my front door to find and rip up my board certificates, then I lose my job and my family starves.
FYI - registration for this exciting opportunity closes tomorrow (American Board of Pathology)

 

[LADoc00]

yah I just signed up for this as well but am expecting it be an epic disaster ala prior MOC misadventures...

 

[Napoleon1801]

Along for the ride, not sure what to expect...

 

[Euchromatin]

I also decided to give it a whirl. I honestly don't know why I am...I heard you can take the regular q10 year exam remotely now if you set up a webcam and it would probably be less time consuming to prep for and take vs doing small batches of questions periodically. I also haven't been having any problems accumulating enough SAMs. I'm guess I'm hoping the questions will either be a good refresher and/or opportunity to learn a few things (and if not, I can "give feedback" about it) and perhaps the ABPath might improve their internet skillz. I suppose, at worst, if the whole thing flops and I have to take the full exam anyway, they'll give me a $500 "exam refund."

 

[pathslides]

Just finished the first assessment. Honestly this is great I think. Couple questions a day at work. Relevant to actual practice. I hope this become the new standard for moc instead of a 10 year exam.

 

[octopusprime]

Just finished the first assessment. Honestly this is great I think. Couple questions a day at work. Relevant to actual practice. I hope this become the new standard for moc instead of a 10 year exam.

Agree...did a few questions on a whim and it's an infinitely better process than the all-day exam IMO...if i have time I can knock out 20 questions in one sitting, or just do 1 or 2 every few days/weeks over the ~4 mos period you have to complete them.

 

[bauber]

How many total questions are there per assessment? You can stop and start and it saves progress? Is there a time limit?

 

[Daddydoc]

How many total questions are there per assessment? You can stop and start and it saves progress? Is there a time limit?

I had 20 total questions with 5 minutes per question. You can stop between each question, but once you start a question you must finish it.

 

[yaah]

I like it too, except for the fact that every other question seems to be a micro question. Maybe that's just a product of the early, testing phase though. I think it is a quantum leap better than having to do the 10 yearly exam.

 

[BU Pathology]

The ABP put a lot of thought into developing this program, to ensure that practicing pathologists are knowledgeable and not yoked to a 10 year single high stakes exam.

 

[deleted314957]

The ABP put a lot of thought into developing this program, to ensure that practicing pathologists are knowledgeable and not yoked to a 10 year single high stakes exam.

Perhaps they have, but to what end? I think the bigger picture is being missed by
everyone EXCEPT the poor paths out in the field. And that is: has
this whole recert fiasco EVER been OBJECTIVELY demonstrated
to improve care? It certainly generates lots of revenue for ABP,
ABMS, etc. and provides a “feel good” illusion for government and/or
admin types. It just seems like the physician community has
given up on shutting this nonsense down and has obligingly
rolled over. We have checked our spines at the front door of the hospital.

 

[Guest8]

I just did my first 20 questions and it was certainly far easier than studying for a month and having to fly to Tampa to take a test written decades ago with slides from the same era. But I do agree that there was far too much micro and far too much cytology. I'm AP/Dermpath and half my dermpath questions involved microbiology/infectious disease. I don't even do cytology. Very weird question selection so far.

 

[deleted314957]

Indeed, “very weird question selection” that has little or nothing to do with ones skills, practice or competency. QED
Why?

 

[Thrombus]

Indeed, “very weird question selection” that has little or nothing to do with ones skills, practice or competency. QED
Why?

Because the academic nannies in their ivory towers are completely out of touch with those who take care of the great majority of the patients in this country! This whole ABP scheme is so insulting! WHY THE HELL DO THEY THINK THEY CAN TAKE AWAY OUR RIGHT TO WORK BASED ON SOME LOUSY, NON-EVIDENCE BASED, NEGATIVE VALUE CREATING TEST AFTER DECADES OF TRAINING AND WORKING!! ITS ABSOLUTE BULLSHET!!!! BULLSHEET!!!!

 

[jp123ok]

I just took the first 20 questions of the ABPath CertLink. I think that the ABP has done a very good job with the platform. It is very user friendly and they provide a discussion after each question explaining the answers. The questions were mostly reasonable. They also provide you with a comparison of how you are performing on the test relative to others.

In terms of the rationale for this sort of testing, I think that it is entirely reasonable to expect that pathologists demonstrate their continuing competence to practice. I only wish that all pathologists would be required to do this sort of testing because I have certainly worked with elderly pathologists who were no longer competent to practice. Unfortunately, the pathologists who have been in practice for decades have non-time limited board certification and are therefore not required to do any additional testing. If they were, we might finally see mass retirement and an improvement in the job market.

 

[chooks]

I won't get into how I really don't understand what the point of MOC is given the existing CME/SAM requirement, other than as a money grab by the greater ABMS.

That being said, I just finished up my first 20. I focused on areas of my sub-specialty and the questions were refreshingly more appropos than I thought they would be. However, there were a couple that I would never sign out in real life the way they want the question answered. I think the concept of being able to track your strengths and weaknesses is a better mechanism for improvement than a one-shot test at 10 years. It certainly is more in the spirit of continuous improvement and learning your strengths and weaknesses over time. If we are stuck with a system, I think this is better than the prior test at 10 years. I do think that these activities should count toward CME though (maybe they do -- but my impression is they don't).

 

[Euchromatin]

I don't remember the exact details off the top of my head, but I seem to recall that if you actually do most of the questions over the course of a given year (I think there was some minimum amount - maybe all the questions in at least 3 of 4 quarters?) that your CME/SAM requirements for that year would be decreased.

 

[yaah]

As far as most of the questions being micro, what I have heard is that the initial question base is somewhat limited. So as the program grows, it will get better. This initial phase is sort of a "testing" phase to see if it works and such. THey must have someone who is really into micro as an initial volunteer for writing questions.

As far as whether this is a useful thing and whether it should be fought - there are a lot of problems but it's also true there is a lot of pressure from those outside medicine to "do something" to ensure that practicing physicians are at the very least up to date on knowledge and practice, and don't deviate significantly from good practice. Does it actually "save lives"? Prbably not. But does it at least ensure that physicians continue to acquire CME and go through hoops to prove competence?

I once talked to a person involved in malpractice coverage, and every year they would put on a seminar at various hospitals that was an hour long education on malpractice risks and mitigating risks and such. I asked if this program actually helped anyone avoid malpractice - they said that that was less important, but the simple fact of a doctor being able to take time out of their day to attend a session, to be interested enough to come and get the credit, and to be able to successfully read their mail and understand that they needed to show up was enough. The doctors who actually showed up to the sessions were much less likely to get sued than the ones who did show up - and it had nothing to do with the topic of the session, just the fact of showing up was correlated with risk. Those who didn't show up often had significant interpersonal issues (such as a substance abuse problem, a poor attitude, a lazy attitude, significant outside work issues that infected their work performance, etc).

So it may be similar. Those physicians who are able to demonstrate the simple concept of competence in getting through their day and meeting all the requirements are likely to be successful and adequate practioners. Those who don't, that's a red flag.

 

[Torsed]

I did certlink and it was breeze.

I just did my 10 year MOC and it was misery and totally irrelevant to what I do all day. I'll take the questions a few a quarter over that stupid 3.5 hr test misery.

 

[pac45]

I'm impressed with the abp certlink.

 

[Pingu]

I liked it but it gave me 7 or 8 FNA questions and I didn't select cytology as one of my areas of focus. So their question bank must be extremely limited.

 

[LADoc00]

I did it and now that want me to do another round? WTH. Is this like every few months rinse and repeat crap? Where is overall program description, I cant find it.

 

[Pathological_Liar]

I did it and now that want me to do another round? WTH. Is this like every few months rinse and repeat crap? Where is overall program description, I cant find it.

Yes, we've basically signed up to answer boards questions on fungal conidia and the Lewis blood group for the rest of our careers.

IveMadeAHugeMistake.gif was pretty much my reaction, and I have no idea why people are praising this.

 

[pathslides]

Yes, we've basically signed up to answer boards questions on fungal conidia and the Lewis blood group for the rest of our careers.

IveMadeAHugeMistake.gif was pretty much my reaction, and I have no idea why people are praising this.

Cu you would be a ***** to think a 10 year test is better.

 

[Pathological_Liar]

Cu you would be a ***** to think a 10 year test is better.

Gotta disagree with you there fam. 800 questions taken in 3 month installments over 10 years isn't more appealing to me than the alternative, especially now that the bar is raised due to underachievers getting to reference books.

New plan is just to make as much money as possible in 8 years and FIRE before recert.

 

[Med Director New England]

The pass rate for the 10 yr re-certification exam since 2016 is almost 99% (from ABP newsletter)....I took it a few yrs back without any preparation and thought the test was easy. This was back when you couldn't use any references. Took me a couple of hours on a sat afternoon to complete the exam remotely. I personally would rather have once bigger inconvenience once / 10 yrs than to have a mini evaluation / inconvenienc that comes around 4 x / yr, but to each their own. Even a very marginally skilled pathologist is not really at risk of failing the 10 yr exam, assuming the pass rate continues to be this high.

I agree with the comments questioning the value of MOC and dont get me started on the conflicts of interests. I see that ABP has actually changed the name now to continuing certification (CC) - I suppose to try to distance themselves from the anti-MOC movement. The process to me still seems exactly the same as it always has been now with the choice of the 10 yr exam or the quarterly learning assessment. It does seem our CC overall is not as bad as what is happening to Internists, but if there ever is an organized pathologist driven anti-MOC / CC effort I would be in.

The most laughable part of MOC to me is the grandfathering. If this really is a good thing all paths should have to do - would love to see the uproar if ABP did this

 

[Med Director New England]

Sorry forgot to ask

To those who do the quarterly questions -
what is the cost?
and are you exempt from SAMs ?

 

[chooks]

The most laughable part of MOC to me is the grandfathering. If this really is a good thing all paths should have to do - would love to see the uproar if ABP did this

My understanding is that the board certification used in years past had no expiration or end date, hence the grandfathering. By virtue of how BE used to work, ABP can't require a MOC for those cases. But I agree with you and would still love to see equal board requirements for everyone!

 

[path24]

Move toward a required monthly subscription based service. Good business model.

I'll take the stupid test. Agree with Med Director.

 

[Med Director New England]

Hello all
I remember this was discussed some time ago on SDN.

like many others who have already re-cert’ed once via the closed book exam I was auto-enrolled in this program and recently completed my 2020 Q1 questions.

Pleasantly surprised to find this is being offered for FREE. No additional costs to what we pay for The MOC/CC or whatever it goes by now. Also counts for 5 hrs of SAMs / yr or half of your required SAMs.

My 15 Qs took about 5 mins and where pretty straightforward. Overall pretty pleased and having done the test I will say now this looks like a better way.

I still in general disagree with MOC//CC / some folks being grandfathered, etc. But I do applaud the board for making this free. I don’t think the biennial costs went up much so this is a cost saving (by removing the cost of the test)

 

[Napoleon1801]

Hello all
I remember this was discussed some time ago on SDN.

like many others who have already re-cert’ed once via the closed book exam I was auto-enrolled in this program and recently completed my 2020 Q1 questions.

Pleasantly surprised to find this is being offered for FREE. No additional costs to what we pay for The MOC/CC or whatever it goes by now. Also counts for 5 hrs of SAMs / yr or half of your required SAMs.

My 15 Qs took about 5 mins and where pretty straightforward. Overall pretty pleased and having done the test I will say now this looks like a better way.

I still in general disagree with MOC//CC / some folks being grandfathered, etc. But I do applaud the board for making this free. I don’t think the biennial costs went up much so this is a cost saving (by removing the cost of the test)

Free for now... Give them time and I'm sure they'll monetize this.

 

[Thin7588]

HELP!! Is anyone out there? I had a traumatic brain injury, and couldn't do my CERTLink (couldn't focus on a computer screen for more than like, 5 min without excruciating headache). Anyway, they auto- un-enrolled me. I've been just teaching pathology to M1/M2 since off disability.
My brain is totally back, but I haven't practiced in 3 years! I have only two opportunities to take the full CC-exam.
I'm doing AP/CP (50 questions) and cytopathology 150 questions. Please, any study advice? It seems like, even though I'm recovered, I'll lose that 7 years MD-PhD, 4 years residency, cytopath fellowship, pathology practice.... while I'm still paying loans.
Anyone out there who has been doing mostly research/teaching/academic stuff and not practicing?
PLEASE any study advice?????

 

[gbwillner]

HELP!! Is anyone out there? I had a traumatic brain injury, and couldn't do my CERTLink (couldn't focus on a computer screen for more than like, 5 min without excruciating headache). Anyway, they auto- un-enrolled me. I've been just teaching pathology to M1/M2 since off disability.
My brain is totally back, but I haven't practiced in 3 years! I have only two opportunities to take the full CC-exam.
I'm doing AP/CP (50 questions) and cytopathology 150 questions. Please, any study advice? It seems like, even though I'm recovered, I'll lose that 7 years MD-PhD, 4 years residency, cytopath fellowship, pathology practice.... while I'm still paying loans.
Anyone out there who has been doing mostly research/teaching/academic stuff and not practicing?
PLEASE any study advice?????

That sucks, I am sorry.

Re: study- I am not sure it will help much for CertLink. You only do a few questions, and they can be from anywhere in Path for the core AP section. I think that the Dx questions are fairly bread and butter and few. While sometimes you first need to make a Dx to answer the question, often times they just tell you what the Dx is and then ask you some ancillary question, like what is the pertinent Hx, what the right IHC stain is, what the relevant molecular marker is. Some of the questions are very esoteric and may be specific to a publication that I suspect they are expecting you to look up while taking the test. In fact, you are allowed to use whatever resources you want during the test except other people.

 

[Med Director New England]

HELP!! Is anyone out there? I had a traumatic brain injury, and couldn't do my CERTLink (couldn't focus on a computer screen for more than like, 5 min without excruciating headache). Anyway, they auto- un-enrolled me. I've been just teaching pathology to M1/M2 since off disability.
My brain is totally back, but I haven't practiced in 3 years! I have only two opportunities to take the full CC-exam.
I'm doing AP/CP (50 questions) and cytopathology 150 questions. Please, any study advice? It seems like, even though I'm recovered, I'll lose that 7 years MD-PhD, 4 years residency, cytopath fellowship, pathology practice.... while I'm still paying loans.
Anyone out there who has been doing mostly research/teaching/academic stuff and not practicing?
PLEASE any study advice?????

I would call the ABP and explain your circumstances and ask for an extension to the CERT link that you missed. I am pretty certain they’ll allow you back in so that you can avoid the full CC / MOC exam.

that said the pass rates on the 10 yr re-cert exam is extremely high. If you passed your initial boards on the first try I would imagine you’d easily pass the re-cert w/o any preparation. The year I took my re-cert exam the pass rate was 100% - literally no one out of several hundred folks failed. Back then it was closed book - that I know has changed - but the pass rate is still almost 100%. Makes you wonder what is the point of all this....

and sorry to hear this

 

[LADoc00]

Holy crap! Im so sorry dude. I think you need to get in touch with ABP directly and explain they WORK FOR YOU and not vice versa and they need to come up with a solution that you can accomplish given your history.

THIS is one of the many things I hate most about medicine: a field in which you are supposed to have endless empathy for the drug addicted lady on her 4th miscarriage but when doctors get sick the system expects them to suck it up, carry on or get cut. Endless hypocrisy especially from elements that are purely bureaucratic. College students think long and hard if medicine is still something you want to pursue. Trust me, they will throw your body into a mass grave the second you have even minor COVID symptoms and put another warm body in your place, then when they throw the dirt over you while you are still gasping for air, they will call you greedy for wanting to get paid.

 

[deleted314957]

Don’t forget the American’s with disabilities Act. It is quite powerful and may make anyone who tries to put any impediment in your way think twice.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[deleted642280]

I've been doing certlink for 2 years and have liked it. I also got too many micro questions at first until I figured out I could change the settings and set it to 80% my specialty plus 20% mandatory core (everything else). Now it's a good review and mostly decent questions that remind me of things I forgot and should be teaching to the residents for their own boards.