ABPS email, RE: need for residency positions

[PADPM]

---

Members do not see this ad.

I just received this email from the ABPS and thought some of you may find it interesting. It is copied and pasted verbatim:

[FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]

[FONT=Trebuchet MS,Verdana,Helvetica,sans-serif]Residency Training Positions Needed​

​

​

​

.. [FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif] Perhaps by now many of you are aware of the pending shortage of available residency positions that will occur with the 2010 graduates. Estimates of residency positions needed range from 45 (based on the number of authorized positions approved by the Council on Podiatric Medical Education [CPME] as of March 1, 2009) to 80 (based on the actual number of positions available in this year's Centralized Application Service for Podiatric Residencies [CASPR]) match.

Recent efforts by several organizations, including the CPME, the American Association of Colleges of Podiatric Medicine (AACPM), the Council of Teaching Hospitals (COTH), the Joint Residency Review Committee (JRRC), and others has resulted in the potential of 49 new positions for the 2010-2011 training years. While this is good news, there will still be a need for more training positions based on the expected number of students graduating in 2010.

A Workforce Study recently completed by the Center for Health Workforce Studies at the School of Public Health at the University of Albany found that "the nation's eight colleges of podiatric medicine would have to triple their graduates between now and 2014 in order to meet the growing population demands." Why? The study found "there is an increase in the number of foot problems as a result of growing obesity, diabetes and aging rates that have a direct impact on the profession." Further, the median age of practicing podiatrists is 45, contributing to future occupational demands as these physicians move towards retirement in 10 - 15 years.

To avoid a residency training position shortage and to meet the increasing demand for podiatric services, it is essential that individuals, institutions, committees, and boards do all that they can to respond to the need create more opportunities for resident training. The Board of Directors of the American Board of Podiatric Surgery strongly encourages its members who currently have residency programs to evaluate your ability to increase the number of training positions. Also, for those of you located in an area or state where there is no current training program, or if you have interest in starting a program, there are numerous resources to assist you. The CPME or the COTH can guide you in the development process. Their are links to there sites in the right column as well as mailing information.
.

 

[JackedUp]

Thank You for posting this PADPM. Although this residency shortage could possibly be disastrous for certain people, I feel like this is very encouraging news. Just knowing that CPME, AACPM, COTH, AND JRC are working hard and their efforts are providing results, in the form of new residency spots, should make us all slightly less worried.

 

[PADPM]

I posted this as a positive, not a negative. In my opinion, it shows that the ABPS is attempting to react to the fact that there is an anticipated shortage of spots, and is reaching out to it's members as one way of dealing with this situation.

If I were a student, I would certainly be concerned, but at least I would feel better knowing that attempts are being made to remedy the problem and that the upper echelon is aware of the problem and looking for solutions.

It's better than having them bury their heads in the sand and having a bunch of disgruntled grads in a few years!

 

[XCdude]

1. Why was this allowed to happen?
2. Why did the upper echelon not anticipate this?
3. Why are schools not financially penalized for accepting more students than there are resources for adequate post-graduate training?
4. Why has it taken so long for all the organizations to formally acknowledge the shortage?
5. Why has their response to the problem been so delayed?
6. Why has no real progress toward a solution been made?
7. Why have they lied to the students?
8. Why was this allowed to happen?

 

[JEWmongous]

I'm surprised the CPME allowed Azpod and especially Western to come into being when data showed there were not enough residency spots. With the mandatory requirement of 2 year/3 year residencies, what are unmatched and unscrambled grads supposed to do???

Furthermore, why does the CPME allow some student caps to be so high? 135 at ohio = unnecessary IMO.

 

[PodunkUDPM]

really? class size at ocpm is 135 (class of 2013)??? 125 used to be the limit. Thats what it was for our class, i think that was counting 5 year students as well... it's 105 right now...

 

[JEWmongous]

really? class size at ocpm is 135 (class of 2013)??? 125 used to be the limit. Thats what it was for our class, i think that was counting 5 year students as well... it's 105 right now...

Well the dean said it during my interview. I asked about the max and was told 135. I thought 125 as well...whatever it is, still the biggest pod class.

 

[PodunkUDPM]

Wow. It's definitely possible. They got reaccredited last year and maybe were able to up the class size with that. That would definitely be pretty lame...

 

[msuDPM]

really? class size at ocpm is 135 (class of 2013)??? 125 used to be the limit. Thats what it was for our class, i think that was counting 5 year students as well... it's 105 right now...

I am in the OCPM class of 2013 and we were told on the first day of orientation that there is 125 of us. (not sure if that is including 5-years or not, they just said they 'accepted 125 of us.'

 

[JEWmongous]

I am in the OCPM class of 2013 and we were told on the first day of orientation that there is 125 of us. (not sure if that is including 5-years or not, they just said they 'accepted 125 of us.'

Ok yea I thought it was 125. I am pretty sure that is all new students, not counting the 5 year people.

Of course they accept a lot more than 125 though, as people accepted will not always matriculate at a given program

 

[whiskers]

The question in my mind is, if a school accepts 125 students is there an honest INTENTION of graduating that many?

Or are statistically tracked test bank questions and "other means" used to arbitrarily (or selectively) thin down the class numbers to particular levels without regards to academic ability while accepting tuition money.

If there are not enough residency positions from the beginning, I find it absurd that the profession this probably would reinforce any lawsuit by those who are unfortunate enough to get caught on the wrong side of the pod curve.

The profession really needs to address this dirty little secret in my opinion as it casts an unprofessional light on the profession as a whole.

It should be the policy of every school to accpet the number of students that they actually anticipate on graduating plus or minus a few... Not DOZENS.

 

[PoddyMan]

I'm surprised the CPME allowed Azpod and especially Western to come into being when data showed there were not enough residency spots. With the mandatory requirement of 2 year/3 year residencies, what are unmatched and unscrambled grads supposed to do???
Furthermore, why does the CPME allow some student caps to be so high? 135 at ohio = unnecessary IMO.

Western hopes to have 38 new residency positions available for its new class of 38 by the time they graduate; I believe they are already nearly halfway there. How about all the other schools attempt to create new slots for their additional students?

 

[NormColeman4MN]

Western hopes to have 38 new residency positions available for its new class of 38 by the time they graduate; I believe they are already nearly halfway there. How about all the other schools attempt to create new slots for their additional students?

Well there are mad big differences between yall and OCPM champ. Smart thinking by your administration in addition to having a smaller class size than they predicted!

 

[PodunkUDPM]

Well there are mad big differences between yall and OCPM champ. Smart thinking by your administration in addition to having a smaller class size than they predicted!

Don't worry, the class size will grow. Same with AZPOD they just aren't allowed to have a large class right now.

 

[NormColeman4MN]

Don't worry, the class size will grow. Same with AZPOD they just aren't allowed to have a large class right now.

Right but I'd much rather have an affiliated program with great entrance stats and board scores (which I am positive will happen) than a subpar program, huge class, and just filling seats to make $$$

 

[hamlinbeach]

Right but I'd much rather have an affiliated program with great entrance stats and board scores (which I am positive will happen) than a subpar program, huge class, and just filling seats to make $$$

If you are still referring to OCPM, while I do agree that we let some subpar students in, who end up failing, or dropping to a five year program, or failing boards the first time or a combination of the three all in the name of $$$... I disagree that we are a subpar program academically. Every professor I've had (be it our own faculty or faculty from Case Western Reserve or the Cleveland Clinic) has taught us in a manner that reflects our role as health professional students, and one day in charge of medicating, treating, or performing surgery on a patient. No professor has ever skimped and said ""but you all will be podiatrists, so we will skip this", or anything along those lines. While I disagree with much of the way in which OCPM is run, I believe I am getting a solid education from caring and thoughtful professors who know their stuff.

 

[PoddyMan]

Well there are mad big differences between yall [Western] and OCPM champ. Smart thinking by your administration in addition to having a smaller class size than they predicted!

Don't worry, the class size will grow. Same with AZPOD they just aren't allowed to have a large class right now.

Right but I'd much rather have an affiliated program with great entrance stats and board scores (which I am positive will happen) than a subpar program, huge class, and just filling seats to make $$$

Western has no intention on expanding its class size in the near future, nor will it accept students just to fill 50 seats (which it easily could have done). Norm has hit the nail on the head, so to speak.

 

[PodunkUDPM]

Western has no intention on expanding its class size in the near future, nor will it accept students just to fill 50 seats (which it easily could have done). Norm has hit the nail on the head, so to speak.

I'll believe it when I see it. The only reason they opened up a school in the first place is to get a piece of the pie. There was no need for a school.

 

[longstech]

CPME will not cap the schools anymore than they are currently. They have stated, as well as APMA that there is due to be a shortage of podiatrists in the near future (i want to say starting around 2014) so they believe that the numbers where they are currently are fine as they will not even come close to providing the number of podiatrists to alleviate the shortage that they are anticipating. In fact, they would like to see more podiatry schools open in the future (this would have to be years from now i would think).

When they were asked how we can continue to have a large amount of students coming in, but not enough residencies for each student (at the present moment) and what their thoughts were, they stated that they believe that there will not be a residency shortage. Enough programs will either open up additional spots or new programs will be opened to alleviate the problem. Their goal is to have 110% of available residency programs to the number of incoming students.

I wanted to point out that Ohio is not the only school with a high enrollment cap. NYCPM has a cap at 109, 2012 enrollment is at 90, Scholl's cap is 98 2012 enrollment is 95, Temple's cap is 100 2012 enrollment is 99, Ohio's cap is 125 2012 enrollment is 116. Each of these schools has a much higher enrollment than any of the other schools. I have already stated in other posts that I think OCPM accepts too many students.

.

 

[ldsrmdude]

Western hopes to have 38 new residency positions available for its new class of 38 by the time they graduate; I believe they are already nearly halfway there. How about all the other schools attempt to create new slots for their additional students?

I think that it is great that Western is working to get new residencies. I wonder how they are counting whether they created the new spot for their students as compared to positions that were already in the works that Western just has an affiliation with... Sounds a bit like tracking the number of jobs "created or saved" by the stimulus plan; it's pretty hard to get solid numbers. If they are really spots that Western has created that wouldn't have been there otherwise, that is impressive.

Don't worry, the class size will grow. Same with AZPOD they just aren't allowed to have a large class right now.

I don't know when/if AzPOD will grow their class size. Since we became fully accredited a year or two ago, I think we could accept more students than what we have in the past. The class of 2013 has only 33 students, so I don't think that we are going to be growing our class sizes very much in the near future. Then again, I don't have any inside info on the subject.

 

[PoddyMan]

I'll believe it when I see it. The only reason they opened up a school in the first place is to get a piece of the pie. There was no need for a school.

A piece of what pie? You're very wrong. All of the scenarios I've seen project a significant deficit of active DPMs by the year 2030. A large number of allopathic schools are opening for similar reasons.

The reason Western is opening is because of an increased need for podiatric services now and in the near future:

1. There is a significant need in Los Angeles, San Bernardino, and Riverside counties (southern CA) for podiatric health care (diabetic foot)
2. According to the US Department of Labor, the demand for podiatric medical care should grow substantially in the coming years. Baby-boomers and the elderly will need more services as the are living longer
3. More DPMs will be needed due to "greying" of the profession

 

[Feli]

Don't worry, the class size will grow. Same with AZPOD they just aren't allowed to have a large class right now.

Don't assume the affiliated programs need to grow. Would they like to? Sure, any program loves to have more students/tuition - even "non-profit"s. However, the pod programs with major university support don't need to accept anyone. They don't depend entirely on pod student tuition+fees to pay for buildings, staff and admin salaries, etc etc.

For example, Barry's current cap is around 65. The new Grad Med Sciences building is finished, and the pod lecture room and labs seat about (drumroll) 65-70 people. Obviously not planning on drastically increasing annual pod enrollment anytime soon... if application numbers go up, selectivity will just increase (and attrition rate would likely decrease).

It's great to see longstech's post that some to the bigger schools are having their enrollment caps trimmed a bit by CPME in coming years. Was that info from CPME.org or just mentioned in an APMSA meeting? I couldn't find it on the website. I think it'd be a great idea to keep trimming or holding off on growth at the bigger cap schools (with how fast their cap decreases being based on how far below national avg board pass rates they keep scoring) while letting the smaller, newer pod training programs slowly grow (based on their maintaining high board pass rates and residency placements). It looks like that's exactly the long term plan, and that is certainly the direction we need to continue moving in... great work by APMA/CPME 👍

 

[longstech]

It's great to see longstech's post that some to the bigger schools are having their enrollment caps trimmed a bit by CPME in coming years. Was that info from CPME.org or just mentioned in an APMSA meeting? I couldn't find it on the website. I think it'd be a great idea to keep trimming or holding off on growth at the bigger cap schools (with how fast their cap decreases being based on how far below national avg board pass rates they keep scoring) while letting the smaller, newer pod training programs slowly grow (based on their maintaining high board pass rates and residency placements). It looks like that's exactly the long term plan, and that is certainly the direction we need to continue moving in... great work by APMA/CPME 👍[/QUOTE]

The CPME cap info we received from the CPME liaison (so directly from CPME). The enrollment info I got from the reports from each of the schools which provides us with the total number of students in each class.