ACGME accredited Sports Medicine Fellowships

[SportsMed09]

Just wondering if anyone knew of which programs are getting ACGME accreditation for sports medicine. I saw on the UC Davis website that they will have this starting this upcoming academic year. I knwo I'm WAY far away from this, but I'm just curious. What other places will have that soon?

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[cbest]

Also VERY interested to hear about this...

 

[cubsfan]

This is not anything official--but I THINK for a hospital and/or attending to have a sports medicine fellowship he/she must be board certified. I anticipate that once attendings pass the boards, many more hospitals/PM&R Deptartments Any will offer Sports Med Fellowships in the future (i.e. after the 2008-09 academic year)

 

[axm397]

the first batch of potential fellowship directors took their exams last year (may or june???) so i would think they will start popping out in the next year or two. The AAPM&R is offering a review course for the sports medicine exam and the faculty members of that course have already taken and passed those exams so you might be able to get some info that way http://aapmr.org/education/sportsmed_fac.htm

 

[cbest]

What is the likelihood that a good number of ACGME accredited PM&R sports medicine fellowships will start popping up in the next 5 years or so? Any idea if the combined 'Sports and Spine' fellowships will ever get ACGME accreditation?

 

[Disciple]

What's a good number. 10-20?

I think some of the FP programs will start to take PM&R residents as well. Some of these programs may start hiring sports boarded Physiatrists and join forces instead of having another fellowship at the same institution.

The ACGME Sports PIFs likely have some serious sports intensive requirements, so someone in an accredited sports/spine fellowship might get short changed on the interventional training.

On the other hand, I'd spend 18 months if it got me board certification in sports and interventional skills up through implants and vertebral augmentation.

 

[SportsMed09]

"I think some of the FP programs will start to take PM&R residents as well. Some of these programs may start hiring sports boarded Physiatrists and join forces instead of having another fellowship at the same institution."


Since in the end everyone in a sports medicine fellowship would be taking the same accreditation exam, would it be better for the specialty to stick to its own program, rather than having physiatrists going to FP programs? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of getting ACGME accreditation for physiatrist fellowships? Or am I misunderstanding what you are saying?

 

[Disciple]

In my opinion, I don't see the board certification as being the end all be all for sports medicine. I see it kind of like the ABEM certification. You don't need it to practice. It's more or less to look nice on your resume.

Sure, we're good at MSK, but in practice you'll be expected to manage the other stuff as well, and it's not trivial by any stretch of the imagination.

From a purely training standpoint(not inter-specialty political), if I had the choice betweeen an accredited PM&R sports fellowship and an accredited FP fellowship with good PM&R faculty, I'd go to the FP fellowship.

 

[medicineman1]

Disciple- just out of curiousty why do you feel that why?

 

[olafa]

It doesn't seem likely that a FP program would have PMR as its faculty.
My guessing would be that they'll have other FP-sportmed faculty. And honestly I probably would NOT want to do a FP fellowship for the fact that they would probably have some component of the primary care aspect and mangement of HTN/DM etc rather than all musk/sports.
Ofcourse these are all assumptions.

In my opinion, I don't see the board certification as being the end all be all for sports medicine. I see it kind of like the ABEM certification. You don't need it to practice. It's more or less to look nice on your resume.

Sure, we're good at MSK, but in practice you'll be expected to manage the other stuff as well, and it's not trivial by any stretch of the imagination.

From a purely training standpoint(not inter-specialty political), if I had the choice betweeen an accredited PM&R sports fellowship and an accredited FP fellowship with good PM&R faculty, I'd go to the FP fellowship.

 

[Disciple]

It doesn't seem likely that a FP program would have PMR as its faculty.

And why is that? It would only make the program stronger and eliminate the need for creation of a 2nd fellowship.

A few PM&R sports fellowships already do this.

I don't think the interdisciplinary animosity exists in sports med as it does in some of our other subspecialties.

There aren't any high paying procedures in sports-med to fight over and people generally do it because they enjoy it.

Most of the sports docs I've met have been eager to learn from base specialties other than their own.

 

[Disciple]

Disciple- just out of curiousty why do you feel that why?

Well,

I'm a Physiatrist, so I lack knowledge/skills in sports related IM/Peds issues.

A combined FP/PM&R sports fellowship would enhance my musculoskeletal skills, while correcting my deficiencies in primary care related aspects.

Best of both worlds.

 

[MSKalltheway]

Wouldn't doing an FP sports fellowship not allow for the opportunity to learn spinal procedures like a PM&R sports/spine fellowship would? From what I have read, it seems like though the benefits of going FP would be getting accreditation and learning more primary care, but you would miss some of the rehabilitation and more complicated procedures that sports/spine would give you. Do I have this right? Please let me know if I am incorrect in this thought!

 

[Disciple]

Wouldn't doing an FP sports fellowship not allow for the opportunity to learn spinal procedures like a PM&R sports/spine fellowship would?

Yes, but no Physiatrist has created the perfect fellowship yet.

Ideally, if you wanted everything, you would have something like, an 18 month sports accredited sports & spine fellowship. 9 months sports (with PM&R and FP faculty) and 9 months procedurally heavy spine, or 12 and 6 if you had decent interventional training in residency.

Maybe by the time you're a PGY-4, such a fellowship will exist.

 

[olafa]

Sounds good and very ideal however, if one did an accredited sports and spine fellowship- correct me if I am wrong- one would NOT be allowed to sit for the pain boards even if their training both residency/fellowship gave them the experience. To be interventional pain certified by ABMS one needs the ACGME accreditated INTERVENTIONAL PAIN fellowship training.
From what I have been told, some states are beginning to say that the "other pain board" doesn't qualify one to state they "board certified." To say you are board certified you need ABMS. I am not sure how many states (ampahab can probably help out with those details) are falling in line with this new guideline. But it puts those who did a fellowship, AND not ACGME in a bad situation. I wonder also how this would affect those already certified with the "other boards?"
amphab - sorry to volunteer you but you seem keen on the legistlation...

Yes, but no Physiatrist has created the perfect fellowship yet.

Ideally, if you wanted everything, you would have something like, an 18 month sports accredited sports & spine fellowship. 9 months sports (with PM&R and FP faculty) and 9 months procedurally heavy spine, or 12 and 6 if you had decent interventional training in residency. quote]

 

[Disciple]

True, you cannot become subspecialty pain boarded without an accredited "pain" fellowship. However, you are misunderstanding a few points.

1. The "other pain board (ABPM)" has only ever been reconized in 3 states (CA, TX, FL), maybe 2 now.

2. In most instances, you don't need to be "pain" boarded for procedural insurance reimbursement. Take a look at spine injecting radiologists as an example. You may need hospital priviledges for priviledges elsewhere, but that is more of an issue of economic credentialling (e.g. exclusive hospital contracts by OR anesthesia groups), not necessarily your pain board status. And finally, if you go to work for a large group (Ortho/Neurosurg), or if you do procedures in your office it won't matter.

and if it does become a problem, there are already multiple solutions being developed by several key organizations, one of which is your own specialty board.

Read here:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=6196461&postcount=46

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=501642&highlight=ABIPP

3. You've probably heard that reimbursements for interventional pain procedures are dropping. Once that is all said and done, I doubt anyone will be willing to put forth the effort to enact legislation as to who and who can't perform procedures.

In 5-10 years, for a graduating PM&R resident wanting to do sports and lots of procedures, I would go for CAQ sports med and CAQ Interventional Spine (or equivalent), 18 month fellowship. Get the training you need in as little time possible so you can get on with your life. Efficiency is key.

 

[Disciple]

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[Hemisphere]

This is not anything official--but I THINK for a hospital and/or attending to have a sports medicine fellowship he/she must be board certified. I anticipate that once attendings pass the boards, many more hospitals/PM&R Deptartments Any will offer Sports Med Fellowships in the future (i.e. after the 2008-09 academic year)

I believe this is something official: http://www.acgme.org/acWebsite/downloads/RRC_prRev/New_sportsmedicinePM&R06012000PRsforR&C.pdf

check out section III-B: The fellowship director should be board certified OR "possess qualifications judged to be acceptable by the RRC."

Therefore, if I am reading this correctly this should encourage "sports-experienced" sports/spine fellowship directors to apply for accreditation, even if they are not board-certified in sports medicine.