ACOM vs. CUSOM, 2017 edition

[harkas]

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Hi everyone,

I've been accepted to both schools and need to decide where to put down a deposit (and potentially attend) at this point. I have had interviews at other schools but I won't hear back before the deadline so here I am. I've read old threads on this topic but they were before the match.

I think I know which one I want to choose but would like to rule out anything I didn't think of. I would also appreciate any suggestions on what to add to this list (both pros/cons) for others. Current students, I would love your opinions as well.

Me
- interested in minority health/LGBTQ primary care
- significant other is in NYC area
- auditory learner (I enjoy going to class)


ACOM
- academic division of SAMC with residencies TBD and great clinical rotations
- Alabama has a large AA population
- Cheap cost of living
- 3 hours from Atlanta (would love to train in that region)
- students were very happy and are doing amazing things (won international sim competition and hold national positions)
- lots of time for audition rotations in 4th year
- 100% match

- Match: https://www.acomedu.org/wp-content/...sidency_Placement_Match_Results_FINAL_PDF.pdf

Cons
- based on my own research, board score average isn't amazing, around national average
- 60% mandatory attendance
- Dothan is VERY rural


CUSOM
- very supportive faculty w/open door policy
- INSANE sim lab
- has research that I'm interested in/"the research triangle"
- opportunities to rotate at great hospitals with other schools (Wake Forest)
- associated with well established home institution that has nursing and PT program
- great board scores (~40% scored above 600 according to interview day)
- cheap cost of living
- very close to Raleigh
- 1.5 hour cheap flight from S.O.
- 9 week blocks with 1 week vacations
- 1 block (four weeks of vacation) built into 3rd and 4th year
- OPTI and they are working on ACGME accreditation
- 100% match

- Match: I swear I found this once before. Does anyone know where this info is on their website? I can't find it.

Cons
- school reassured me they have minority populations but I didn't see many while I was in NC with exception to Fayetteville (very subjective)
- unclear the quality of rotations
- 80% mandatory attendance
- christian school and I am not religious (ish, they're not intense or pushy at all about it like LUCOM)

*Both have a mandatory dress code but ACOM is more lax because you are allowed to wear scrubs every day. This has no bearing on my decision.

 

[moyamoya6]

I'm from a big city, and I don't find Dothan rural. To me, it's a step below suburban, but not rural. It had all the basic necessities for the first two years, and I saw it as a good place to not get distracted and focus on my studies. Everyone in Dothan has been nice to me, and I'm a non-white student.

ACOM and SAMC are working on opening their IM residency program summer of next year, if you're interested in IM and staying in Dothan.

Pro is having majority of 4th year free for audition rotations and ACOM "paying" for our COMLEX I and II CE, COMSAEs A-E, question banks - COMBANK and board vitals, and subscriptions to Pathoma (awesome pathology lectures and videos) as well as CramFighters (to help organize board prep schedules). Also, I really like our clinical and OPP faculty.

Con is the mandatory board prep program - Wolfpacc - at the end of second year, hospice rotation, and weak molecular medicine faculty.

 

[harkas]

I'm from a big city, and I don't find Dothan rural. To me, it's a step below suburban, but not rural. It had all the basic necessities for the first two years, and I saw it as a good place to not get distracted and focus on my studies. Everyone in Dothan has been nice to me, and I'm a non-white student.

Yeah, you're right. I think by rural I was thinking more along the lines that it's pretty isolated. There is not much in the surrounding area outside of Dothan. It definitely has everything you need to live in a town. I know some of the students mentioned some bars too.

Pro is having majority of 4th year free for audition rotations and ACOM "paying" for our COMLEX I and II CE, COMSAEs A-E, question banks - COMBANK and board vitals, and subscriptions to Pathoma (awesome pathology lectures and videos) as well as CramFighters (to help organize board prep schedules). Also, I really like our clinical and OPP faculty.

Con is the mandatory board prep program - Wolfpacc - at the end of second year, hospice rotation, and weak molecular medicine faculty.

Thanks for adding that, I forgot about this. The paying is a huge pro.

 

[moyamoya6]

Yeah, you're right. I think by rural I was thinking more along the lines that it's pretty isolated. There is not much in the surrounding area outside of Dothan. It definitely has everything you need to live in a town. I know some of the students mentioned some bars too.



Thanks for adding that, I forgot about this. The paying is a huge pro.

If you have any specific questions, feel free to ask or PM.

 

[getfat]

- INSANE sim lab

Wouldn't put this very high on the list. My school has an insane sim lab but we've hardly used it 1st term. It that seems like it would be a good idea but would you should focus more on curriculum and quality of teaching.

- students were very happy and are doing amazing things (won international sim competition and hold national positions)

Agreed with this part. There is a reason a couple schools are starting the #WeWantACOM trend. Idk what specifically they do over there that makes their PCS experience unique but maybe others could go into better detail.

connected to academic hospital with residencies and great clinical rotations

Idk if this is exactly true at the moment. Maybe it has changed since I interviewed last year but a lot of their "academic hospital" relationships were still in the works. Maybe you will experience it when you reach 3rd/4th year but I wouldn't treat it as a sure thing because you also have "lottery based selection" for rotations (like most DO schools).

 

[pb_kines]

Wouldn't put this very high on the list. My school has an insane sim lab but we've hardly used it 1st term. It that seems like it would be a good idea but would you should focus more on curriculum and quality of teaching.


Agreed with this part. There is a reason a couple schools are starting the #WeWantACOM trend. Idk what specifically they do over there that makes their PCS experience unique but maybe others could go into better detail.


Idk if this is exactly true at the moment. Maybe it has changed since I interviewed last year but a lot of their "academic hospital" relationships were still in the works. Maybe you will experience it when you reach 3rd/4th year but I wouldn't treat it as a sure thing because you also have "lottery based selection" for rotations (like most DO schools).

The hospital affiliation is correct. The school itself is the academic division of a regional healthcare system.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

connected to academic hospital with residencies and great clinical rotations

The hospital affiliation is correct. The school itself is the academic division of a regional healthcare system.

No, SAMC is not an academic medical center. They are trying to open an IM program but even then it is not an academic medical center. Agreed rotations are fairly decent, but wth very few ward based rotations.

OP I personally would choose CUSOM. They have a very low attrition rate, rotations about as decent as ACOM, and I personally would choose NC over AL. The board scores have been better than ACOMs based on what people have said on SDN. The religion thing shouldn’t be an issue as they are about as religious as the Jesuits.

 

[pb_kines]

No, SAMC is not an academic medical center. They are trying to open an IM program but even then it is not an academic medical center. Agreed rotations are fairly decent, but wth very few ward based rotations.

OP I personally would choose CUSOM. They have a very low attrition rate, rotations about as decent as ACOM, and I personally would choose NC over AL. The board scores have been better than ACOMs based on what people have said on SDN. The religion thing shouldn’t be an issue as they are about as religious as the Jesuits.

Just to be clear, I wasn't trying to say that the hospital was an academic medical center, but that the school itself is the academic division of the hospital.

 

[TheWolfOfMainStreet]

Just to be clear, I wasn't trying to say that the hospital was an academic medical center, but that the school itself is the academic division of the hospital.

Can confirm this is true. The dean of the school is the "Chief Education Officer" of the hospital per the org chart showed at my interview.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Just to be clear, I wasn't trying to say that the hospital was an academic medical center, but that the school itself is the academic division of the hospital.

Yes, the other poster said SAMC was an academic hospital which isn’t the case so I just wanted to clarify. I actually really like the way ACOM was set up. My interviewer last year was the CMO of SAMC and I thought they had a really good vision for the school.

 

[GBCrzzyy]

I believe that they did make an announcement recently that they will in fact be opening IM residencies at SAMC. I'm only first year so I don't have input on board prep yet but the couple 3rd years I've met seem to be very happy. They seem to be doing a great job at weeding out the bad rotations.

As far as PCS goes, I'm not sure how other schools do it but I think we get a great experience at ACOM. We have already been working with standardized patients and I was on one of the SimComp teams this year so I got to work in the SimCenter all semester. I believe that our curriculum introduces the SimCenter next semester though. They definitely start very early with exam and patient interview skills which is nice. The first years have already had their first FOSCE and we have our first OSCE coming up in a couple weeks. Again, I don't know how other schools work it but ACOM starts very early with it and gives lots of feedback on your progress.

I'm biased so I'm obviously going to say you should choose ACOM so take that with a grain of salt lol. I did decide not to continue with my application at CUSOM after I heard back from ACOM though.

 

[moyamoya6]

The average for the 2019 class this past summer

First time pass rate: 93.7%
Average COMLEX score: 515

 

[harkas]

Wouldn't put this very high on the list. My school has an insane sim lab but we've hardly used it 1st term. It that seems like it would be a good idea but would you should focus more on curriculum and quality of teaching.

I can't remember from my interview. But I think CUSOM uses it more often. Can anyone from the school confirm this?

Idk if this is exactly true at the moment. Maybe it has changed since I interviewed last year but a lot of their "academic hospital" relationships were still in the works. Maybe you will experience it when you reach 3rd/4th year but I wouldn't treat it as a sure thing because you also have "lottery based selection" for rotations (like most DO schools).

No, SAMC is not an academic medical center. They are trying to open an IM program but even then it is not an academic medical center. Agreed rotations are fairly decent, but wth very few ward based rotations.

Just to be clear, I wasn't trying to say that the hospital was an academic medical center, but that the school itself is the academic division of the hospital.

My bad, I misspoke. I'll change that in my original post.

 

[harkas]

I believe that they did make an announcement recently that they will in fact be opening IM residencies at SAMC. I'm only first year so I don't have input on board prep yet but the couple 3rd years I've met seem to be very happy. They seem to be doing a great job at weeding out the bad rotations.

Agreed. I have heard very positive things about the rotations at ACOM, but I haven't heard much about how rotations are going at CUSOM.

If any student has experience with CUSOM rotations, I would love your opinion! I know there was a sour post awhile back from supposed faculty who said they were terrible but it had proved to be unreliable for the most part.

 

[deleted610572]

I'm from a big city, and I don't find Dothan rural. To me, it's a step below suburban, but not rural. It had all the basic necessities for the first two years, and I saw it as a good place to not get distracted and focus on my studies. Everyone in Dothan has been nice to me, and I'm a non-white student.

ACOM and SAMC are working on opening their IM residency program summer of next year, if you're interested in IM and staying in Dothan.

Pro is having majority of 4th year free for audition rotations and ACOM "paying" for our COMLEX I and II CE, COMSAEs A-E, question banks - COMBANK and board vitals, and subscriptions to Pathoma (awesome pathology lectures and videos) as well as CramFighters (to help organize board prep schedules). Also, I really like our clinical and OPP faculty.

Con is the mandatory board prep program - Wolfpacc - at the end of second year, hospice rotation, and weak molecular medicine faculty.

And now a mandatory opp rotation

 

[pb_kines]

And now a mandatory opp rotation[/QUOTE

Yeah... I am not fond of that. I was accepted at ACOM, just interviewed at CUSOM. I loved the atmosphere at ACOM but if I get accepted at CUSOM that's where I'm going.

 

[moyamoya6]

Yes, mandatory OPP rotation during 3rd year back in Dothan.

 

[deleted610572]

Yeah... I am not fond of that. I was accepted at ACOM, just interviewed at CUSOM. I loved the atmosphere at ACOM but if I get accepted at CUSOM that's where I'm going.

Not to mention it was sprung mid semester on the students who had their 3rd year electives planned out

 

[0dee]

I'd choose CUSOM but I haven't interviewed at ACOM. However, they both seem very similar but Campbell has higher board pass rate, and more students scored on the higher end of the spectrum compared to ACOM. Also, their rotation sites are great, I am pretty sure you do your year long rotations at one location instead of running around different locations, and most of those hospitals have residency programs. So you'd spend your time with a team in a ward based setting. Now, I don't know how much it helps to have residency programs created by CUSOM, but they have accredited/pre-accredited ACGME programs in IM, FM, EM, surgery, OB, and derm.

Here is the match list for CUSOM from last years' thread.
Part 2

 

[MADD!!!]

CUSOM is definitely the better of the two choices. CUSOM is progressing at a faster rate than ACOM. Ex. CUSOM already has a lab up and running with a few publications while ACOM was still in construction of building a lab as of last year (it may have finished by now?) but you see the difference in how fast each school is developing.

CUSOM students did well on their boards and I think their curriculum is better than my school to be honest for board prep. They make you take practice board exams from beginning of second year through to get prepared. With time I think CUSOM is going to be a top contender... they just need time to get their name spread (which even the Dean acknowledged during our interview).

 

[moyamoya6]

CUSOM is definitely the better of the two choices. CUSOM is progressing at a faster rate than ACOM. Ex. CUSOM already has a lab up and running with a few publications while ACOM was still in construction of building a lab as of last year (it may have finished by now?) but you see the difference in how fast each school is developing.

CUSOM students did well on their boards and I think their curriculum is better than my school to be honest for board prep. They make you take practice board exams from beginning of second year through to get prepared. With time I think CUSOM is going to be a top contender... they just need time to get their name spread (which even the Dean acknowledged during our interview).

ACOM's curriculum is okay. They make us take practice board exams from the middle of first year to get us used to the board style questions and content.

 

[harkas]

Also, their rotation sites are great, I am pretty sure you do your year long rotations at one location instead of running around different locations, and most of those hospitals have residency programs. So you'd spend your time with a team in a ward based setting. Now, I don't know how much it helps to have residency programs created by CUSOM, but they have accredited/pre-accredited ACGME programs in IM, FM, EM, surgery, OB, and derm.

Here is the match list for CUSOM from last years' thread.
Part 2

Yes, that’s correct about the rotation sites.

I don’t know how much it helps either but I’m happy to see that’s CUSOM is working on pre accreditation. I’m a bit jaded hearing about some schools STILL not talking about ACGME/USMLE as if it isn’t a fact of life already. Higher standards make the better doctor so get on with it. CUSOM brought it up during interview day immediately and talked about USMLE pass rates as well (don’t remember what they were but they were pretty good for a new school).

Thanks for the link!!

CUSOM is definitely the better of the two choices. CUSOM is progressing at a faster rate than ACOM. Ex. CUSOM already has a lab up and running with a few publications while ACOM was still in construction of building a lab as of last year (it may have finished by now?) but you see the difference in how fast each school is developing.

Where did you find their publications?

Research Facilities | Medicine | Campbell University

That’s their research facilities page and it looks like they’re doing great (although I can never tell from the website).

 

[MADD!!!]

Yes, that’s correct about the rotation sites.

I don’t know how much it helps either but I’m happy to see that’s CUSOM is working on pre accreditation. I’m a bit jaded hearing about some schools STILL not talking about ACGME/USMLE as if it isn’t a fact of life already. Higher standards make the better doctor so get on with it. CUSOM brought it up during interview day immediately and talked about USMLE pass rates as well (don’t remember what they were but they were pretty good for a new school).

Thanks for the link!!



Where did you find their publications?

Research Facilities | Medicine | Campbell University

That’s their research facilities page and it looks like they’re doing great (although I can never tell from the website).

I saw an article a year ago on their announcements how they got a second publication in...

 

[SirCourageWolf]

Can anyone comment upon ACOM's relationship with SAMC staff specifically? And whether there is an atmosphere at the hospital that is open to med students and residents? In my experience, some hospitals and specific dept's that have been operating independently will have a little reluctance to student encroachment.

 

[deleted610572]

Can anyone comment upon ACOM's relationship with SAMC staff specifically? And whether there is an atmosphere at the hospital that is open to med students and residents? In my experience, some hospitals and specific dept's that have been operating independently will have a little reluctance to student encroachment.

Be more specific. SAMC also had students prior to ACOM with AMEC. The IM residency seems to always be on campus during events. I believe they are wide open since the dean is also on the hospitals board

 

[harkas]

Does anyone know if WHERE students match in residency matters? I really want to match in the NY/NJ region and CUSOM had like ~50 matches in that area in fields I'm interested in. Is this largely based on the student or the school?

I'm also asking because schools like KCU that have an excellent track record and match list but only had about ~5 matches in that region this past year. If one was interested in the east coast, would they be better off at CUSOM than an established school like KCU?

 

[Palmtreez]

Does anyone know the current attrition rates at each school?

 

[deleted610572]

Does anyone know the current attrition rates at each school?

ACOMs is about 8-10%

 

[moyamoya6]

Does anyone know if WHERE students match in residency matters? I really want to match in the NY/NJ region and CUSOM had like ~50 matches in that area in fields I'm interested in. Is this largely based on the student or the school?

I'm also asking because schools like KCU that have an excellent track record and match list but only had about ~5 matches in that region this past year. If one was interested in the east coast, would they be better off at CUSOM than an established school like KCU?

Residency is usually based on the students and where they prefer to go. Some people want to avoid certain programs because of geographic location and some people don't care about location. It's all about preference.

Maybe a lot of the students at CUSOM are from the NY/NJ area and want to do residency near home, or maybe KCU have more students who are interested in staying in the Midwest. It all depends.

 

[physgal]

Cusom has a lot of free food🙂

 

[UserUnidentified420]

I believe that they did make an announcement recently that they will in fact be opening IM residencies at SAMC. I'm only first year so I don't have input on board prep yet but the couple 3rd years I've met seem to be very happy. They seem to be doing a great job at weeding out the bad rotations.

As far as PCS goes, I'm not sure how other schools do it but I think we get a great experience at ACOM. We have already been working with standardized patients and I was on one of the SimComp teams this year so I got to work in the SimCenter all semester. I believe that our curriculum introduces the SimCenter next semester though. They definitely start very early with exam and patient interview skills which is nice. The first years have already had their first FOSCE and we have our first OSCE coming up in a couple weeks. Again, I don't know how other schools work it but ACOM starts very early with it and gives lots of feedback on your progress.

I'm biased so I'm obviously going to say you should choose ACOM so take that with a grain of salt lol. I did decide not to continue with my application at CUSOM after I heard back from ACOM though.

Same.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Can anyone comment upon ACOM's relationship with SAMC staff specifically? And whether there is an atmosphere at the hospital that is open to med students and residents? In my experience, some hospitals and specific dept's that have been operating independently will have a little reluctance to student encroachment.

SAMC basically started the school so I’m going to go out on a limb and say they are very supportive of their med students. My interviewer last year was the hospital CMO.

 

[Palmtreez]

Can anyone comment on the comlex scores for both schools? Also if there is any data regarding USMLE for either school?

 

[nooneyouknow]

Can anyone comment on the comlex scores for both schools? Also if there is any data regarding USMLE for either school?

Piggybacking off of this, I couldn't find the match list for CUSOM for last year either.

 

[moyamoya6]

Can anyone comment on the comlex scores for both schools? Also if there is any data regarding USMLE for either school?

Most recent COMLEX I average 515, first time pass rate 93.7% for class of 2019. No data for USMLE. Maybe 1/3 of the class took it.

 

[moyamoya6]

ACOM recently got an AOA ENT and ACGME dermatology match.

 

[PygmyPuff]

@moyamoya6 was the ACGME derm match a previous AOA program?

 

[moyamoya6]

@moyamoya6 was the ACGME derm match a previous AOA program?

Yea, it looks like it.