Hi all, I've started to become interested in psych, but I was hoping to hear from everyone about their two cents about the field ... pros/cons, why they chose it, and any things I can do in the next couple years to get more information about the field. Thanks 🙂
advice for ms1
- Thread starter dorian24
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Follow some shrinks around. Read about it. Ask your advisor. The psych club should have one--if that applies to your school. The same way you find out about anything.
Do your homework.
The only pro's and con's you need are those that pertain to how to self-motivate and self-educate.
Knowing those.
The type of questions you ask would advance like...at least...87 levels.
Do your homework.
The only pro's and con's you need are those that pertain to how to self-motivate and self-educate.
Knowing those.
The type of questions you ask would advance like...at least...87 levels.
6
666357
Why they chose it
1. It's more interesting than other specialties.
2. I wake up at 8:00a.m. and I'm out of the office by 5:00pm.
3. I don't have to wear a white lab coat
4. I don't have to stick my fingers in any bodily orifices.
5. I don't have to stand in one place for hours on end looking down at an operating theater.
6. It's more interesting than other specialties.
Pros
1. Successful private practice is much easier to achieve than other specialities (neglibile overhead)
2. Grossing mid-six figures annually (after overhead)- though in full disclosure I have a busy pt load (~17-20 patients daily; all outpt)
3. I wear jeans and sneakers to work.
4. There's more demand for shrinks than there are available. I lowered my new patient intake to offset attrition before the end of my first year.
5. An unexpected pro for me what discovering an aptitude and interest in running a business. You'll learn little to nothing about business or the business-side of medicine in your formal training. Taking that plunge means taking a leap of faith while turning down multiple seemingly lucrative offers in hand.
Cons
1. Get tired sometimes about listening to other people's problems all day then have to come home and hear about family/friend's problems.
2. Private practice has its own challenges (hiring, firing, balancing staff work schedules, etc)
3. Adhering to boundaries with Axis II patients can lead to negative online reviews (but in all fairness this occurs with any specialty)
4. Loss of general practice skills. I hate the thought of coming up on a MVC or being in a place when someone asks, "Is there a doctor in the house?" (Of course, I could pursue CME's or other training to keep these skills and knowledge up to snuff, but with everything else on my plate it's on the bottom of my list)
Any things I can do in the next couple years to get more information about the field.
1. Tell the program director you're interested in psych and ask to be paired up with a good attending.
2. Do a Sub-I
1. It's more interesting than other specialties.
2. I wake up at 8:00a.m. and I'm out of the office by 5:00pm.
3. I don't have to wear a white lab coat
4. I don't have to stick my fingers in any bodily orifices.
5. I don't have to stand in one place for hours on end looking down at an operating theater.
6. It's more interesting than other specialties.
Pros
1. Successful private practice is much easier to achieve than other specialities (neglibile overhead)
2. Grossing mid-six figures annually (after overhead)- though in full disclosure I have a busy pt load (~17-20 patients daily; all outpt)
3. I wear jeans and sneakers to work.
4. There's more demand for shrinks than there are available. I lowered my new patient intake to offset attrition before the end of my first year.
5. An unexpected pro for me what discovering an aptitude and interest in running a business. You'll learn little to nothing about business or the business-side of medicine in your formal training. Taking that plunge means taking a leap of faith while turning down multiple seemingly lucrative offers in hand.
Cons
1. Get tired sometimes about listening to other people's problems all day then have to come home and hear about family/friend's problems.
2. Private practice has its own challenges (hiring, firing, balancing staff work schedules, etc)
3. Adhering to boundaries with Axis II patients can lead to negative online reviews (but in all fairness this occurs with any specialty)
4. Loss of general practice skills. I hate the thought of coming up on a MVC or being in a place when someone asks, "Is there a doctor in the house?" (Of course, I could pursue CME's or other training to keep these skills and knowledge up to snuff, but with everything else on my plate it's on the bottom of my list)
Any things I can do in the next couple years to get more information about the field.
1. Tell the program director you're interested in psych and ask to be paired up with a good attending.
2. Do a Sub-I
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I'm an applying MS4
My pros:
1. Love spending a long time with each patient
2. I think psychiatric interviews are super fun and interesting
3. I absolutely despise doing procedures
4. Pay is fabulous for the hours worked
My cons:
1. There is the ever present stigma of some people thinking you will not be a real doctor/ I've had people on other clerkships assume I have crappy board scores and such because I'm applying psych (I don't)
2. Overall pay lower than other specialties
Pros >>>> Cons in my book.
I also became interested as an MS1. I did some psych research between MS1 -2 and continued that throughout. I did a psych elective and another psych sub-I early in 4th year to get good letters. I went to every possible psych dinner event to score free food and mingle with the department. Doing all that makes me feel like I have a decent idea what I am getting myself into!
My pros:
1. Love spending a long time with each patient
2. I think psychiatric interviews are super fun and interesting
3. I absolutely despise doing procedures
4. Pay is fabulous for the hours worked
My cons:
1. There is the ever present stigma of some people thinking you will not be a real doctor/ I've had people on other clerkships assume I have crappy board scores and such because I'm applying psych (I don't)
2. Overall pay lower than other specialties
Pros >>>> Cons in my book.
I also became interested as an MS1. I did some psych research between MS1 -2 and continued that throughout. I did a psych elective and another psych sub-I early in 4th year to get good letters. I went to every possible psych dinner event to score free food and mingle with the department. Doing all that makes me feel like I have a decent idea what I am getting myself into!
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#4 Pro negates #2 con. You can work harder in psych but most don't. #1 con doesn't last long and if it does you can always go through a second analysis.
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OP. Perhaps I was harsh.
But here's a tip. Whatever your calculus. For whatever the end. Recruiting mentors is a vastly underestimated skill.
You need to figure out how to be compelling to them. How to interest them. How to be useful.
To do this, you need to be able to imagine them as full human beings who arrived ahead of you in training by any number of fascinating and completely unique circumstance.
The way you've asked the question could only be interesting to an applicant who is crunching their own decision calculus.
The Mac triad commented only as one tangent interested him/her.
And that was the one person who could've given you a seasoned interesting answer.
What I was being harsh about was the child like notion that ones own tedious process is so interesting that a full essay is worth a potential advisor's time.
Rethink that approach to being advised.
It always surprises me how bad we are at recruiting mentors. And obtaining worthwhile advice.
But here's a tip. Whatever your calculus. For whatever the end. Recruiting mentors is a vastly underestimated skill.
You need to figure out how to be compelling to them. How to interest them. How to be useful.
To do this, you need to be able to imagine them as full human beings who arrived ahead of you in training by any number of fascinating and completely unique circumstance.
The way you've asked the question could only be interesting to an applicant who is crunching their own decision calculus.
The Mac triad commented only as one tangent interested him/her.
And that was the one person who could've given you a seasoned interesting answer.
What I was being harsh about was the child like notion that ones own tedious process is so interesting that a full essay is worth a potential advisor's time.
Rethink that approach to being advised.
It always surprises me how bad we are at recruiting mentors. And obtaining worthwhile advice.
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Yes, very much so (retaining them is even more difficult!) As I have written elsewhere getting several mentors is very important at every stage of your career. I think I was probably not a very good mentee but have learned from my ways. And having mentored several students, I know very quickly who to dump and who to keep. I don't think students really understand the art of being a good mentee, so I am going to explain this:
1. remember to always work around your mentor's schedule, they are taking the time to help you. no matter how busy you think you are they are even busier
2. always reply as quickly as possible to any email, even if just to acknowledge. never wait several days to do so, there is never an excuse to do so.
3. if you are working on something with your mentor, give them updates of how you are doing, don't wait until you have something to show them
4. it is up to you to put in the hard work. you will only get as much out of the mentoring relationship as you put in. if you want opportunities, ask for them, make yourself open, be the first to suggest something, be eager and responsive
5. remember that many people in academic are fragile narcissists and part of your job is to inflate their egos. conversely, be mindful that the smallest perceived offense can shatter your relationship and potentially your reputation (this was always my biggest failing and surprise as a mentee)
6. remember it is on you to schedule time to meet with them, not wait for them to suggest it. If you want regular meetings, you should be the one asking for it. It is always okay to ask (not demand). those who don't ask, don't get
7. keep them informed of how you are doing (for example if you have won an award, published a paper etc etc), don't be shy about doing so
8. don't feel like a nuisance, it is okay to keep pestering (within reason - get the hint if you've ruined it)
9. formulate goals for what you want from the relationship and from your future
10. be appreciative and respectful of the time, effort and interest your mentor is putting into you
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Concentrate on becoming a good, well-rounded, competent doctor right now. Worry abou becoming a good psychiatrist after that.
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Step 1...a low score or a repeat...can really hold you back and many good programs may not even look at you if you have a repeat. Pass on first attempt and do well as well as you can.
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Holy **** playa!
Though I'm hearing this more and more now in the private world, as the facilities world is now offering 300k+ not uncommonly.
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Why I chose psychiatry (largely similar to reasons already posted):
1) Interesting disease (though there are a relatively limited number of diagnoses, any one individual always has an interesting story for how their illness presented - can't really say the same about hypertension, diabetes, etc.)
2) Due to the above, the work is less monotonous
3) Understanding patients' experiences is critical to diagnosis and management, which generally means getting to know your patients to a better degree than most other fields of medicine
4) The chronicity of many psychiatric patients, i.e., playing "the long game"
5) Fewer hurdles to a larger variety of practice styles (i.e., independent private practice)
6) Interest in therapy and non-pharmacological treatments for illness
7) Nice lifestyle
Not necessarily in that order. These things will also be variable depending on your practice setting. But that, I think, is one of the strengths of psychiatry (and medicine generally): there are a bunch of different environments to practice in, all with their various pros and cons. You have more options to practice in a setting that you personally find fulfilling and interesting. What may be fulfilling/interesting to one person may not necessarily be so to another.
In addition to harping on mentorship as mentioned above, I would try and get a breadth of exposure in psychiatry and any other fields you are thinking about. The classic academic practice is not the only practice setting, and frankly a minority of physicians end up practicing in that setting. You tend to get a narrow view of medicine in medical school and training because you're only exposed to the academic environment for the most part. I think it's important to talk with folks that aren't in that setting to get a sense of what's possible and what other people are doing because while you may not find work in the academic setting interesting, there are many other settings that may suit your interests more.
1) Interesting disease (though there are a relatively limited number of diagnoses, any one individual always has an interesting story for how their illness presented - can't really say the same about hypertension, diabetes, etc.)
2) Due to the above, the work is less monotonous
3) Understanding patients' experiences is critical to diagnosis and management, which generally means getting to know your patients to a better degree than most other fields of medicine
4) The chronicity of many psychiatric patients, i.e., playing "the long game"
5) Fewer hurdles to a larger variety of practice styles (i.e., independent private practice)
6) Interest in therapy and non-pharmacological treatments for illness
7) Nice lifestyle
Not necessarily in that order. These things will also be variable depending on your practice setting. But that, I think, is one of the strengths of psychiatry (and medicine generally): there are a bunch of different environments to practice in, all with their various pros and cons. You have more options to practice in a setting that you personally find fulfilling and interesting. What may be fulfilling/interesting to one person may not necessarily be so to another.
In addition to harping on mentorship as mentioned above, I would try and get a breadth of exposure in psychiatry and any other fields you are thinking about. The classic academic practice is not the only practice setting, and frankly a minority of physicians end up practicing in that setting. You tend to get a narrow view of medicine in medical school and training because you're only exposed to the academic environment for the most part. I think it's important to talk with folks that aren't in that setting to get a sense of what's possible and what other people are doing because while you may not find work in the academic setting interesting, there are many other settings that may suit your interests more.
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+1
I dunno, when I tell people I have an interest in neuropsychiatry/brain stimulation and pain management, I don't get stigma, people are usually fascinated (medical and non-medical). So whatever, I think this whole 'psych stigma' thing is over played...or maybe I just could care less.
1. As I always quote the medscape stats, 70% of Psychiatrists work LESS than 40 hours/week. You put in cards/GSurg hours, and your pay will also reflect that hard work.350-400k is very doable.
2. I personally think lifestyle is overrated. Don't go into psych just for lifestyle, you better enjoy it. I would much rather do General Surgery 100 hour weeks than Family Medicine 40 hour weeks. And there are psychiatrists who work damn hard. I know psych here that start at 6:30am in the morning (ECT, M/W/F), and do private practice until 7-8pm. 12-14 hour days...as an attending. But thats the beauty of Psych, you can work 20 hours/week or 60 hrs/week, whatever you want. Very flexible field.
3. Someone mentionned low board scores/easy speciality to match into. While this is true historically, I've detailed in other posts the climbing scores/competitiveness of psych is increasing. Its obviously not ROAD worthy, and probably never will be, but you no longer can fail the steps and still assume you'll match into psych. Those days are long gone.
If you want to do psych, and you are MS1/MS2. I would highly suggest shadowing a Psychiatrist if possible, outpatient, inpatient, ER, consult service. Thats the other thing about psych, there are so many workplace settings, ranging from methadone clinic to inpatient unit to a jail. So you need to sample them all to get a real taste/grasp of psychiatry.
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Yeah, I've got email job offers (granted its middle of nowhere places like small town texas or wisconsin) for 350k with benefits.
