Advice for possible reapplication to mainly DO schools?

[Etan19197]

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I have applied this cycle to mostly DO schools and a couple low tier MD schools in my region. Unfortunately, I did not have a physician LOR so my DO options are slightly limited despite sending in my primary to a couple of these schools. I know I didn't apply with my best application and am looking for advice on how to spend another year if needed working on my app. Currently sitting at 1 DO interview that I somewhat regret applying to after hearing some of their policies.

So here are my stats: White male, slightly low SES, first-generation college student.

uGPA: 3.31 sGPA: 3.18 Slight upward trend plus a 4.0 last semester. Degree: Biochemistry and Molecular Biology Graduated May 2018

MCAT: 507 (127/124/126/130)

Research: Work full-time at chemical company in R&D but not clinical nor biochemistry. Everything I do is strictly chemistry. Been full-time since this July. Expected: 1800 hours

Clinical Experience: Volunteered 150 hours, in Endoscopy and as patient escort.

Employment: Resident Manager throughout college-960 hours, Patient Waiter in hospital through college-1800 hours, currently employed in lab.

Non-clinical volunteering: Helped out high school baseball team, but nothing else. Huge discrepancy in app.

Other ECs: I played NCAA D2 baseball, about 2000 hours.

LOR: 3 strong letters from former employer, a nurse I worked with, and a biochem prof, and 1 from former orgo prof, not so sure about that one. Will get one from employer at research lab for next cycle.

PS: I felt my PS was strong and have had many others read it who agreed. Basically an adversity essay and how certain life experiences motivated me to become a physician.

So overall I know I didnt apply with my best application and now I'm paying for it. Looking to see if my current plan sounds good for reapplication if I need to.

1. Shadow a DO/MD and get a LoR. I have an office that will allow me to but since I work it will take months to get 40 hours. I have submitted primary app to some DO schools that require a letter, so I would be submitting secondary in December after I receive a physician letter smh.
   
   
2. Gain some non-clinical volunteering experience, preferably in underprivileged area. I've emailed some groups but no response yet.
   
   
3. This is where I am unsure, my MCAT is about 6 points lower than my average FL, which were taken under testing conditions. So I am considering taking the MCAT again, maybe in April, however I am working full time now so it will require a lot more work and idk if its worth it? Also contemplated doing some sort of SMP or post-bacc, but I read that since nobody does grade replacement anymore, it might not be worth it since I have ~140 credit hours since I transferred schools and switched majors.
   
   
4. Submit on time. Early as possible. smh took my MCAT June 30th, and was complete for all schools August-October. So I was late.

Should I even apply to low tier MD schools next cycle? I did this time and have 1 R so far from my undergrad (lol). If anyone has any advice that I didn't mention, or anything to add at all please let me know. I know I still have time left, but I want to start to work on my app now so I can improve it considerably if I don't get in. Thanks!

 

[Lnsean]

I'd focus on DOs....throw in some low tier MDs into the mix but your gpa is too low and your app doesnt anything to redeem itself. The research is irrelevant if there's no publication...anyone can claim they put in 1800 hours...but with no publication what are you even doing? One would start wondering.

Maybe shadow a DO physician and get an LOR.

 

[Etan19197]

I'd focus on DOs....throw in some low tier MDs into the mix but your gpa is too low and your app doesnt anything to redeem itself. The research is irrelevant if there's no publication...anyone can claim they put in 1800 hours...but with no publication what are you even doing? One would start wondering.

Maybe shadow a DO physician and get an LOR.

I figured that but my job is more industry based, and from what I’ve heard publications don’t exist since we’re a large company anything that is breakthrough material is patented and pushed to corporate. Sucks and I kinda wished I would’ve taken a scribe job but the pay is great.

 

[PapaGuava]

Your stats and ECs are pretty decent, so like @Lnsean had mentioned, if you could shadow a DO and get an LOR it would give you an extra boost.

 

[Etan19197]

Bump, anyone else want to offer some advice?

 

[I'mJustCurious]

I would take extra upper-level science courses for next semester to boost that sGPA and perhaps volunteering for your community. Your MCAT should be fine for DO schools, but getting a DO LOR would help.

 

[toedrag]

Definitely obtain a physician letter. DO letter would be great for DO schools, but if you happen to find a MD who can write you a stronger letter/ build a stronger longitudinal relationship with, then go with the MD to write you a letter. IMO, you'd be pretty much a shoe-in for any DO school if you apply early next cycle. For MDs, you'd have to apply strategically to school's within your MCAT range.

Some of those formal post bac/ SMPs are a 100k investment if you take into account COL, etc. It's a steep price for GPA repair but it can definitely be worth it.

 

[btuck]

Definitely obtain a physician letter. DO letter would be great for DO schools, but if you happen to find a MD who can write you a stronger letter/ build a stronger longitudinal relationship with, then go with the MD to write you a letter. IMO, you'd be pretty much a shoe-in for any DO school if you apply early next cycle. For MDs, you'd have to apply strategically to school's within your MCAT range.

Some of those formal post bac/ SMPs are a 100k investment if you take into account COL, etc. It's a steep price for GPA repair but it can definitely be worth it.

Most are only ~50K being that they are one year. Check out Rosalind Franklin, Drexel, Temple, Loyola, Georgetown, Jefferson, Tulane

 

[toedrag]

Most are only ~50K being that they are one year. Check out Rosalind Franklin, Drexel, Temple, Loyola, Georgetown, Jefferson, Tulane

Mine was 60k total for 2 years in a major city (40K COL over the course of those two years).

 

[Etan19197]

Mine was 60k total for 2 years in a major city (40K COL over the course of those two years).

First off thanks for the reply. This is somewhat why I didn't mention any GPA repair (even though I could use it). From my research online, I could get into a DO school which I'm completely content with given my current stats. I feel like if I do get a DO letter, that would open up a few more opportunities next cycle in which I can apply. On top of that I think if I could rack up some community service as well that would make my app a little more impressive. I would hate to spend more than 50k to fix my gpa if I don't exactly need to. Seeing as how I just had a DO interview it obviously isn't being looked at as a red flag or anything even if it was a lower stat DO school.

 

[Shotapp]

First off thanks for the reply. This is somewhat why I didn't mention any GPA repair (even though I could use it). From my research online, I could get into a DO school which I'm completely content with given my current stats. I feel like if I do get a DO letter, that would open up a few more opportunities next cycle in which I can apply. On top of that I think if I could rack up some community service as well that would make my app a little more impressive. I would hate to spend more than 50k to fix my gpa if I don't exactly need to. Seeing as how I just had a DO interview it obviously isn't being looked at as a red flag or anything even if it was a lower stat DO school.

You don't need to waste 50k on an smp to get into a DO school. Get a DO letter, bump sgpa to 3.2 if possible, keep up volunteering, and apply super early next cycle.

 

[Goro]

You don't need to waste 50k on an smp to get into a DO school. Get a DO letter, bump sgpa to 3.2 if possible, keep up volunteering, and apply super early next cycle.

And Shadow a d o as well

 

[farmmd]

I am on the same boat as you. I have a 3.7 gpa but a low MCAT. I did get some interviews but I am looking forward to reapplying. My best advice to you is

1. Only retake the MCAT if you feel that you will improve your score by more than 1 pt or 2. Studying is time consuming and MCAT cost money. I would rather spend that money in applying to more schools.

2. Get a DO/MD letter. It will open so many doors to possible schools to get into.

3. Overall, it looks like you have a good application. I would only suggest to take maybe 1 or 2 upper level science course, not to improve your gpa, but to show them you can handle difficult courses while working full time. I did a post bacc. program and I would only suggest it if it gives you an interview to a med school after completion.

Good Luck!

 

[Etan19197]

I am on the same boat as you. I have a 3.7 gpa but a low MCAT. I did get some interviews but I am looking forward to reapplying. My best advice to you is

1. Only retake the MCAT if you feel that you will improve your score by more than 1 pt or 2. Studying is time consuming and MCAT cost money. I would rather spend that money in applying to more schools.

2. Get a DO/MD letter. It will open so many doors to possible schools to get into.

3. Overall, it looks like you have a good application. I would only suggest to take maybe 1 or 2 upper level science course, not to improve your gpa, but to show them you can handle difficult courses while working full time. I did a post bacc. program and I would only suggest it if it gives you an interview to a med school after completion.

Good Luck!

Lol I just want redemption on the MCAT more than anything. I'm certain I can score way higher, but like I said last time I studied for it I wasnt working full time so I don't feel like its the best idea if I can get into DO schools with a 507. Stupid test. In terms of the science courses, do you really think that will help? I would either have to enroll in a 4 year school closer to home or even a community college but I heard schools advise against community colleges.

 

[farmmd]

Lol I just want redemption on the MCAT more than anything. I'm certain I can score way higher, but like I said last time I studied for it I wasnt working full time so I don't feel like its the best idea if I can get into DO schools with a 507. Stupid test. In terms of the science courses, do you really think that will help? I would either have to enroll in a 4 year school closer to home or even a community college but I heard schools advise against community colleges.

If your aim is to improve the GPA, then courses would be the way to go (even if they are online). Since you have already graduated from a four-year then I would think taking classes at a university would be better. In my case, I decided to complete an EMT accelerated 6 wk program and I am currently working as an EMT. I noticed that my interviewers liked that, so just something to consider.

Also, you have a better MCAT then me, I think your score is great for applying DO. I would focus more on something to help the GPA or strong activities that show motivation toward medicine.

Just what I think, I am no expert or anything. Just a pre-med trying to get admitted.

 

[GypsyHummus]

I’m going to go against the grain here.

I think your science GPA is too low with the coupled MCAT score. Mcat is strong for DO, but to overcome a sub 3.2, you need a 510+ unless you bring something special to the table (URM, military, etc). You kind of have that with the athletics, so you might still get in.

Deff focus on DO schools. GPA and MCAT is way to low for MD. You need around the 3.7-3.8 mark science and a 510+ for MD unless you come from a lucky state. Then the bar is lowered to 3.5 and 508.

I wouldn’t retake the mcat unless you know you can score a 510+. A 510+ forgives a lot of past academic transgressions for DO schools.

I think if you can hike up that science to a 3.3, you should be good. If you don’t get in this year, Maybe look into taking some extra upper level science classes to prove you can handle the tough science curriculum. If not, look into SMPs, they were designed for people like you ( higher mcat, lower GPA). You might still get in somewhere tho, so fingers crossed.

Always have a (smart) backup plan.

 

[Dr. Anonymouss]

Get the 40 hours of shadowing and a letter of rec from a DO, that is crucial when applying to DO school. Focus on DO because your scores align more with DO, than MD, the 124 on chem/phys is the reason I am telling you not to keep your hopes up for MD. Still apply to low tier MD, but put most of your hope into DO. Get clinical experience wether that's a job or volunteering and volunteer your time with the needy/underrepresented. For an example, I am tutoring the GED in Spanish to latinos. Apparently you can take that test in Spanish, something I didn't know... But yeah just focus on a plan and build the app.

 

[Etan19197]

Get the 40 hours of shadowing and a letter of rec from a DO, that is crucial when applying to DO school. Focus on DO because your scores align more with DO, than MD, the 124 on chem/phys is the reason I am telling you not to keep your hopes up for MD. Still apply to low tier MD, but put most of your hope into DO. Get clinical experience wether that's a job or volunteering and volunteer your time with the needy/underrepresented. For an example, I am tutoring the GED in Spanish to latinos. Apparently you can take that test in Spanish, something I didn't know... But yeah just focus on a plan and build the app.

Thanks for the advice. The 124 was in Cars but I get what you're saying. I've already set my school list and aside from my instate MD schools, there's only 2-3 low tier MD schools. About 12 DO schools but by then I will definitely have shadowing and a letter. In terms volunteering, I have been working at a food pantry and in a free clinic. So hopefully adding research, experience with the underserved, and shadowing with a letter will give me a better shot next year.

 

[Blanky]

A 3.4 cGPA 3.3 sGPA would look a heck of a lot stronger. Your MCAT is fine for DO. A DO LOR would go a long way.

 

[Etan19197]

A 3.4 cGPA 3.3 sGPA would look a heck of a lot stronger. Your MCAT is fine for DO. A DO LOR would go a long way.

I know it definitely would.. 🙁

 

[Blanky]

Have you calculated what 20-30 upper level science classes would do if you got say a 3.9 in them?
Taking a year off and doing a postbac may get you into a much nicer school.

 

[Etan19197]

Have you calculated what 20-30 upper level science classes would do if you got say a 3.9 in them?
Taking a year off and doing a postbac may get you into a much nicer school.

Yes I have been looking into Waynes BMS program and if I 4.0 the 36~ ish credits I would walk out with 3.45 sGPA and cGPA. However I think that I decided I would apply next cycle. In this gap year I have shadowed a primary care DO and received a LOR, gained research, 70 hours non clinical volunteering, and 20-30 hours free clinic volunteering in hopes of fixing everything but my GPA. If next cycle doesn't work out, then I will apply to the BMS program. Too risky?

 

[Blanky]

You will have more freedom with a DIY post bac between the amount and which courses you take. I definitely think you can get accepted into a DO school somewhere... If you do the post bac you would likely have multiple accepts at better DOs.
That should be what your decision is based off...
1. Get in somewhere (DO with lower stats) next year
2. Get in a great DO after the post bac year

 

[Etan19197]

You will have more freedom with a DIY post bac between the amount and which courses you take. I definitely think you can get accepted into a DO school somewhere... If you do the post bac you would likely have multiple accepts at better DOs.
That should be what your decision is based off...
1. Get in somewhere (DO with lower stats) next year
2. Get in a great DO after the post bac year

That sounds like a more plausible plan. I was only considering the BMS program since I heard a lot of medical schools in Michigan show love to those who do well. Plus, if I did do the BMS program there's a chance I would have to retake my mcat since its a 2 year program but I haven't done the math to figure that out.

Since I'm working full-time, do you have any advice on how I would go about a DIY post bacc? I would have to take the courses at a 4 year uni but since I'm working maybe only take 2 classes per term? I have 79 science credits so I would probably be best off taking higher level courses I haven't taken yet correct?

 

[Blanky]

I worked all through my degree and I took 12 credits per semester and included summer semester you could take 9,9,9 for 27 credits or 12,12,12 for 36 in one year.

 

[Etan19197]

I worked almost full time through undergrad as well however my schedule was flexible. I work a set schedule 9-5 now which is going to suck if I want to take classes. I've been looking at the local universities and neither of them offer upper level science courses at night smh.

 

[Blanky]

Then you may have to start looking for a flexible job. Maybe a scribe position although the pay will suck it pays off come resume time.

 

[Etan19197]

True. I just received a II from my top DO school so I'm reallllyy hoping I don't need to do that lol

 

[dial1010usa]

True. I just received a II from my top DO school so I'm reallllyy hoping I don't need to do that lol

All the best but they will ask you why DO if you haven't shadow a doctor.
Get DO/MD LOR asap.
Try to get scribe job which helps a lot or take some time off like half day here and there and shadow a DO.

 

[Etan19197]

All the best but they will ask you why DO if you haven't shadow a doctor.
Get DO/MD LOR asap.
Try to get scribe job which helps a lot or take some time off like half day here and there and shadow a DO.

I have a DO that I have been in contact with and has agreed to let me shadow him however there are some regulations since he works for a major hospital chain so I might need some paperwork. Regardless, I will have shadowed him by my interview date!

 

[deleted807068]

True. I just received a II from my top DO school so I'm reallllyy hoping I don't need to do that lol

When did you start applying? How many II's do you have already? How much does the Wayne BMS cost? I think since you would not need a large amount of science credits to bump your SGPA to a 3.3, it would be better to do DIY postbac and save some money & lots of time.

 

[Etan19197]

When did you start applying? How many II's do you have already? How much does the Wayne BMS cost? I think since you would not need a large amount of science credits to bump your SGPA to a 3.3, it would be better to do DIY postbac and save some money & lots of time.

I was complete at most schools August through October so I applied pretty late. This will be my second interview. My first resulted in a waitlist. And yeah I agree, the more I look into the BMS program the less I want to do it. Realistically I think I would need like 15-20 credits to get my sGPA to a 3.3. I’m not totally sure what the price of the program is though.

 

[deleted807068]

I was complete at most schools August through October so I applied pretty late. This will be my second interview. My first resulted in a waitlist. And yeah I agree, the more I look into the BMS program the less I want to do it. Realistically I think I would need like 15-20 credits to get my sGPA to a 3.3. I’m not totally sure what the price of the program is though.

Yeah applying late would hinder your chances + you don't have shadowing, volunteering, or a DO LOR. Regardless you still have 2 II + more to come which shows your potential. Worst case you don't get in this year, like everybody said, kill your volunteering/shadowing/and get killer LOR from DO doctor. Maybe take 1-2 classes to boost science to at-least 3.2+? Apply early and you will be set.

 

[Etan19197]

Good to hear! I have already started volunteering through a pretty large food pantry organization and am still waiting for this DO to call me back. I will probably give him a call tonight. Thanks for the advice!