mercaptovizadeh

ἀλώπηξ
10+ Year Member
Oct 16, 2004
6,887
987
Status
How do you best impress the attendings/residents? I'll be the only medical student on the team, along with the resident, the attending, and a social worker.

Also, what resources are best for preparing for the shelves? I ordered pre-test and FA for psych (are these good enough or do I need something else?) and am looking for tips on what sources are good for the neuro shelf.
 

UCLAstudent

I'm a luck dragon!
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Sep 6, 2002
5,046
7
36
CA
Visit site
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Pretest and FA were perfect for psych. That was that I used (took the shelf this morning). For neuro, I'm using Case Files and Pretest. My shelf is on Friday.
 
OP
mercaptovizadeh

mercaptovizadeh

ἀλώπηξ
10+ Year Member
Oct 16, 2004
6,887
987
Status
Pretest and FA were perfect for psych. That was that I used (took the shelf this morning). For neuro, I'm using Case Files and Pretest. My shelf is on Friday.
Thanks for your response. Your advice, as always, is helpful.

Actually, I have another question stemming from the clerkship. My resident is very kind, very easy-going and she's sending me home around lunchtime to study. She says that until we admit new patients (it's a really slow psych ward) or until the beginning of next week (I guess whichever comes first), she doesn't want assign me an (old) patient. Instead, she just has me come in to round with her, I read a bit in the morning, ask her questions, and then she sends me home. Also, the attending is never around (like 45 minutes and then leaves to go to another site) and we just go over what we rounded (he doesn't actually round), and then he leaves. In contrast to her, he's kind of on the unpleasant side (seems quite arrogant), but he's that way with everyone (not me in particular). We'll no longer be working with him in a two weeks and then the "main" attending (for the remaining weeks) will be presiding.

Anyone have any advice given this situation? Should I just play along and wait until she assigns me patients or have I missed the boat by following her instructions and not being pro-active enough. Also, there's no "pre-pre-rounding" (i.e. me coming in before the resident)...just the rounding with the resident.

On the first day of the rotation she also said that at her school they called the psych rotation "psych vacation" and that her philosophy was primarily to learn by reading. What should I make of this? I have no idea if I should just follow the resident's instructions and try to ask good questions and show that I'm learning (which I was trying to do today) or if I should do things on my own initiative (but what at this point?)?
 

smq123

John William Waterhouse
Staff member
Administrator
10+ Year Member
Jan 9, 2006
13,934
3,561
Status
Attending Physician
Anyone have any advice given this situation? Should I just play along and wait until she assigns me patients or have I missed the boat by following her instructions and not being pro-active enough. Also, there's no "pre-pre-rounding" (i.e. me coming in before the resident)...just the rounding with the resident.

On the first day of the rotation she also said that at her school they called the psych rotation "psych vacation" and that her philosophy was primarily to learn by reading. What should I make of this?
I actually really hated when residents said that. I mean, it's nice of them and all, but then why bother coming it at all? And isn't the philosophy of FIRST and SECOND year to "learn by reading"? How, then, does third year differ? :confused: Ugh.

Is this your first rotation? My main concern is is that if you have so few responsibilities now, then you'll be reamed out during your next rotation (and God help you if it's something like surgery, OB, or Internal Med). You'll go to your second rotation without knowing how to write a good progress note, without knowing how to really admit a patient, etc.

I would try to at least have the resident TEACH you how she's writing her progress notes...and what she looks for in a med student note. That'll teach you something useful.
 

UCLAstudent

I'm a luck dragon!
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Sep 6, 2002
5,046
7
36
CA
Visit site
Status
Resident [Any Field]
For neuro, I'm using Case Files and Pretest. My shelf is on Friday.
Just got my neuro shelf score back and scored > 95th percentile using Case Files and Pretest. Case Files is kinda new/unproven, so I was kind of hesitant about using it instead of Blueprints, but apparently it's enough.
 

DrDre311

Makaveli
10+ Year Member
Apr 14, 2008
655
3
LBC
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Thanks for your response. Your advice, as always, is helpful.

Actually, I have another question stemming from the clerkship. My resident is very kind, very easy-going and she's sending me home around lunchtime to study. She says that until we admit new patients (it's a really slow psych ward) or until the beginning of next week (I guess whichever comes first), she doesn't want assign me an (old) patient. Instead, she just has me come in to round with her, I read a bit in the morning, ask her questions, and then she sends me home. Also, the attending is never around (like 45 minutes and then leaves to go to another site) and we just go over what we rounded (he doesn't actually round), and then he leaves. In contrast to her, he's kind of on the unpleasant side (seems quite arrogant), but he's that way with everyone (not me in particular). We'll no longer be working with him in a two weeks and then the "main" attending (for the remaining weeks) will be presiding.

Anyone have any advice given this situation? Should I just play along and wait until she assigns me patients or have I missed the boat by following her instructions and not being pro-active enough. Also, there's no "pre-pre-rounding" (i.e. me coming in before the resident)...just the rounding with the resident.

On the first day of the rotation she also said that at her school they called the psych rotation "psych vacation" and that her philosophy was primarily to learn by reading. What should I make of this? I have no idea if I should just follow the resident's instructions and try to ask good questions and show that I'm learning (which I was trying to do today) or if I should do things on my own initiative (but what at this point?)?

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Go home! Play outside! You have the rest of your life to spend in hospitals!

Also, the psych shelf was probably the easiest one. Don't sweat it.
 

DrDre311

Makaveli
10+ Year Member
Apr 14, 2008
655
3
LBC
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Just got my neuro shelf score back and scored > 95th percentile using Case Files and Pretest. Case Files is kinda new/unproven, so I was kind of hesitant about using it instead of Blueprints, but apparently it's enough.
The NBME does not report shelf exam scores as percentiles (unless your med school does that for people within the class). Scores for clinical shelf exams are indexed to mean score of 70 +/- 8 for a representative group of first time test takers at an appropriate stage of training.

95 is still a good score.
 

UCLAstudent

I'm a luck dragon!
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Sep 6, 2002
5,046
7
36
CA
Visit site
Status
Resident [Any Field]
The NBME does not report shelf exam scores as percentiles (unless your med school does that for people within the class). Scores for clinical shelf exams are indexed to mean score of 70 +/- 8 for a representative group of first time test takers at an appropriate stage of training.

95 is still a good score.
Really? For every shelf I've taken, I've gotten both a raw score and a national percentile --- my evals always say, "UCLAstudent's score on the written examination was XX, placing her at the XXth percentile nationally." Unless I'm totally missing something, the link you pasted does not mention percentiles --- it just states that the raw score is not equal to the percentage correct.
 

DrDre311

Makaveli
10+ Year Member
Apr 14, 2008
655
3
LBC
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Really? For every shelf I've taken, I've gotten both a raw score and a national percentile --- my evals always say, "UCLAstudent's score on the written examination was XX, placing her at the XXth percentile nationally." Unless I'm totally missing something, the link you pasted does not mention percentiles --- it just states that the raw score is not equal to the percentage correct.
Strange that your shelf score had your SDN SN on it.

I suppose that's my error because my school never gave us the actual NBME report--they just gave us the actual 2 digit score. I have no idea where any of my shelf scores placed on a national percentile basis. I assumed that kind of thing was kept in the depths of some administrative file on my med school's relative performance vs. other med schools.
 

diosa428

SDN Angel
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Feb 24, 2005
2,662
9
Status
Strange that your shelf score had your SDN SN on it.

I suppose that's my error because my school never gave us the actual NBME report--they just gave us the actual 2 digit score. I have no idea where any of my shelf scores placed on a national percentile basis. I assumed that kind of thing was kept in the depths of some administrative file on my med school's relative performance vs. other med schools.
My school also gives us our national percentage. It's probably just school specific.
 

DrDre311

Makaveli
10+ Year Member
Apr 14, 2008
655
3
LBC
Status
Resident [Any Field]
My school also gives us our national percentage. It's probably just school specific.
It's still weird that UCLAStudent got her score with her SDN SN on it. Unless that's her real name. In which case her parents went a little overboard.
 

UCLAstudent

I'm a luck dragon!
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Sep 6, 2002
5,046
7
36
CA
Visit site
Status
Resident [Any Field]
It's still weird that UCLAStudent got her score with her SDN SN on it. Unless that's her real name. In which case her parents went a little overboard.
Clearly my parents were not looking beyond medical school when they named me. What will I do when I'm a resident?
 

Ashers

Bacteria? Don't exist.
10+ Year Member
Apr 5, 2006
5,257
13
Land of Entrapment
Status
Attending Physician
Also, the psych shelf was probably the easiest one. Don't sweat it.
Around my school, the scuttlebutt is that OB/gyn was the easiest and the hardness of psych depended on if one's already had medicine.

Clearly my parents were not looking beyond medical school when they named me. What will I do when I'm a resident?
:laugh:

As residents and attendings, we should continue to be as eager to seek knowledge as students, so you're still good to be called: UCLAstudent. ;)
 

MrBurns10

Excellent, Smithers
Moderator Emeritus
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jul 14, 2005
2,750
9
36
www.espn.com
Status
Resident [Any Field]

tr

inert protoplasm
Gold Donor
15+ Year Member
Nov 17, 1999
1,588
548
Status
Attending Physician
How do you best impress the attendings/residents? I'll be the only medical student on the team, along with the resident, the attending, and a social worker.

Also, what resources are best for preparing for the shelves? I ordered pre-test and FA for psych (are these good enough or do I need something else?) and am looking for tips on what sources are good for the neuro shelf.
1) I thought you thought psychiatry was garbage. Unless you are planning to enter psychiatry, your grade in this particular rotation isn't going to matter much. Given that, I wouldn't waste too much energy worrying about it.

2) I would just treat this as the best learning experience it can be, whatever that means for you. If you feel you learn better by following patients (I certainly do), then I would try to pick up a couple. It may make your life more interesting and rewarding. Alternatively, if the idea of talking to psych patients doesn't thrill you and you'd rather study on your own, I'd do that. It's hard to tell which strategy would be best for your grade, and in any case refer to Point 1; so I'd just leave the grade calculation out of it and do what works for you.

3) Out of curiosity, aren't you an early-years MD-PhD? How come you're into the clinicals already?
 

DrDre311

Makaveli
10+ Year Member
Apr 14, 2008
655
3
LBC
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Around my school, the scuttlebutt is that OB/gyn was the easiest and the hardness of psych depended on if one's already had medicine.



:laugh:

As residents and attendings, we should continue to be as eager to seek knowledge as students, so you're still good to be called: UCLAstudent. ;)
I definitely didn't experience that.

I thought the surgery, medicine and peds shelves were easy, psych was super easy, and my absolute worst shelf grade was OB. I'm not kidding, I destroyed surgery and medicine, which everyone says are hard, and did awful on the OB exam. Maybe I just had a bad day taking that test, but I did terrible on it.
 

diosa428

SDN Angel
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Feb 24, 2005
2,662
9
Status
It's still weird that UCLAStudent got her score with her SDN SN on it. Unless that's her real name. In which case her parents went a little overboard.
Yeah... at least I know the NBME hasn't figured out my SDN sn yet :smuggrin:
 

diosa428

SDN Angel
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Feb 24, 2005
2,662
9
Status
It does? where?
Mmm my psych shelf had it in the comments section of gradebook. If you ask, I think your ob/gyn grade is given to you as national percentage. I'm not sure which number they give you for medicine, but I think it's raw score, not percentage. Idk about surg b/c I never bothered asking for my score.