Advice on studying vs skipping class

[Ironheme]

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Since you guys were so helpful with the last question I had, hope you don't mind another one. I've been pretty dedicated in going to classes, but I'm drowning in the amount of material expected to learn. I find that uninterrupted weekends I get a lot of studying done, but M-F sucks. Half the days I have class from 9-6, with a few hours mixed of free time. Like 1 hour between one class or a couple hours in between another. I find it really hard to study during this time on campus cause the library is usually pretty packed and I like having my books around + having large blocks of uninterrupted time cause it takes me a bit to get into the groove of studying. I'd like to pick and choose which classes to go to (like anatomy lab and lecture), but I'm not sure how that would work out. I'm a reader/writer learner, not at all visual or auditory.

That said I feel pretty guilty if I skip class. We don't have recorded lectures, but lecturers do tend to post their slides (except for the ethics class). I know that if I skip the less important classes (ex. ethics) I'll probably pass just fine but won't do amazing.

So I suppose the question is those are you that went to class with a 9-6 schedule, did you actually manage to make the studying work? And those that didn't, would it be productive in my case to attend class or can I make it work by not going? They emphasize people that go to class have higher grades. No mandatory attendance except for the ethics class. I'm just having a hard time finding time to study and am getting behind with half my days being a 9-6 class schedule. I'm usually drained by the end of the day, add in travel time, shower/getting ready, making food/etc, it's usually closer to 8 pm by the time I'm sitting down. And I'm exhausted at that point.

 

[Brewmeister]

That said I feel pretty guilty if I skip class. We don't have recorded lectures, but lecturers do tend to post their slides (except for the ethics class). I know that if I skip the less important classes (ex. ethics) I'll probably pass just fine but won't do amazing.

On the contrary, you will probably do better than if you went to class, and much better on Step 1 which is what really counts.

They emphasize people that go to class have higher grades.

This is a huge load of BS. I dunno why medical schools don't respect the fact that different people have different learning styles and that not everyone benefits from sitting on their ass in a lecture hall for 8 hours a day. I found that the majority of people who went to lecture in my class were those who didn't have the drive to actually learn the material; they would sit in lecture to fool themselves that they were actually being productive.

 

[DoctwoB]

Since you guys were so helpful with the last question I had, hope you don't mind another one. I've been pretty dedicated in going to classes, but I'm drowning in the amount of material expected to learn. I find that uninterrupted weekends I get a lot of studying done, but M-F sucks. Half the days I have class from 9-6, with a few hours mixed of free time. Like 1 hour between one class or a couple hours in between another. I find it really hard to study during this time on campus cause the library is usually pretty packed and I like having my books around + having large blocks of uninterrupted time cause it takes me a bit to get into the groove of studying. I'd like to pick and choose which classes to go to (like anatomy lab and lecture), but I'm not sure how that would work out. I'm a reader/writer learner, not at all visual or auditory.

That said I feel pretty guilty if I skip class. We don't have recorded lectures, but lecturers do tend to post their slides (except for the ethics class). I know that if I skip the less important classes (ex. ethics) I'll probably pass just fine but won't do amazing.

So I suppose the question is those are you that went to class with a 9-6 schedule, did you actually manage to make the studying work? And those that didn't, would it be productive in my case to attend class or can I make it work by not going? They emphasize people that go to class have higher grades. No mandatory attendance except for the ethics class. I'm just having a hard time finding time to study and am getting behind with half my days being a 9-6 class schedule. I'm usually drained by the end of the day, add in travel time, shower/getting ready, making food/etc, it's usually closer to 8 pm by the time I'm sitting down. And I'm exhausted at that point.

If you get more out of not going to class, then don't go to class. Guilt should not be a part of the equation. Their "emphasis" is highly skewed, they want people to come to class to have a good audience when they pull clinicians away to give talks, and it's also a non-representative sample, as the people who go to lecture are those who get a lot out of going to lecture. When I go to lecture, my mind wanders and I get little done. In a small group room or library, I can power through 2 lectures in time it takes my class to go through one, and have leftover time to use outside sources includng Goljan, gunnertraining, BRS physio, etc.

 

[MrBigglesworth]

If you aren't getting anything from class, don't go. I literally can't sit through more than an hour without getting squeamish. That being said, there is study areas in the building where class is. I study there instead of going to class. I think it is important to listen to the lectures (sped up) and if they don't record, you should get a recorder and place it in the class room while you study.

 

[Alvarez13]

Class is for suckers 😀

 

[Ghost22]

This is a huge load of BS. I dunno why medical schools don't respect the fact that different people have different learning styles and that not everyone benefits from sitting on their ass in a lecture hall for 8 hours a day. I found that the majority of people who went to lecture in my class were those who didn't have the drive to actually learn the material; they would sit in lecture to fool themselves that they were actually being productive.

This. Our school made a big fuss about learning HOW you learn and taking advantage of that fact and then they make an even bigger fuss when some of those folks determine class attendance isn't necessary for their style.

Makes zero sense.

I used to feel guilty, then I saw my grades.

For reference; our lectures are recorded so I have the option of listening, but I don't most of the time (I'm a visual and read/write learner).

 

[Elbowstoopointy]

Stay home and get work done. Class is slow, and more of a social event

 

[Ironheme]

Thanks for the all the replies.

I thought I might have been missing the superhuman gene of being able to attend long days of class and studying on top of it. I definitely feel I don't have time/energy to do both. I don't get much out of the lectures. If you ask me something about what we learned a couple hours before the terms will sound familiar but I definitely would not be able to explain it. The material I've studied on my own however, that I can explain with np and understand everything about it. Our lecturers usually just read straight from the powerpoints. A couple of them will add here and there, but for 95% of the material it's just straight from the slides.

Lol Alvarez.

Ghost22, what were you grades before and after if you don't mind me asking?

 

[Dr Love]

Like Mark Twain said, don't let school get in the way of your education.

 

[JimmyChitwood]

Class is an absolute waste of time. Don't feel guilty. You are paying for your education and like people have mentioned above, not everyone learns by having some PhD read their slides to you verbatim. The only classes I attend are the ones that have guest lectures (almost always MDs) that have taken time out of their practice.

The amount of time you spend in class and your happiness are inversely related.

 

[katiesb]

For me, listening to lectures for select classes is the best method for me. Our school doesn't have lectures recorded for us, but my classmates have been very good at uploading most lectures to a shared drop-box. It depends on the instructor though. Some are really obvious about what points they think are important/like to test on, and add explanations that make the material easier to understand. To me, it takes less brain effort to listen to a lecture at home than read through the notes and book and try to synthesize it myself. I can also listen to like 4 in a row, I may get antsy, but I don't get the same brain-numbing effect as I do when I read for the same amount of time. That's just me personally tho!

 

[Masticate3Xaday]

Class is a waste of time. I end up falling asleep anyway. All the videos of the lectures are online. IMO, most lectures are a waste of time since all information on almost anything has been written down in a textbook. The only lectures worth going to are ones were problem sets and examples are actually talked about.

 

[Masticate3Xaday]

Education is also set up out of tradition. Lectures are given because that is what they used to do in the old days...before the printing press became widely available and before most information was easily recorded, written and copied, and disseminated. We live in 2011. Every single bit of information in medical school has already been written down and copied many times over in text. There's no need to attend lecture anymore. In fact, with the rise of the internet, most university education is obsolete. Let's be honest here. Anyone with a library card and internet access at home could probably learn 99% of all the material in med school that we do (provided they have the will). Lectures are an arcane and obsolete tradition within education. In fact, I'd even take it to the extreme....I'd let anyone in the general public take step 1....hell if they pass they obviously know the science to become a doctor. I'd then make med school required after that just to gain clinical experience and not to learn textbook medical science.

 

[Jack is Back]

Class is a waste of time. I end up falling asleep anyway. All the videos of the lectures are online. IMO, most lectures are a waste of time since all information on almost anything has been written down in a textbook. The only lectures worth going to are ones were problem sets and examples are actually talked about.

I agree with most of your points, but some lectures have concepts emphasized, which means that you can study those key points and end up being more efficient.

 

[adaptation1]

honestly, I would go to ANY lecture where the lecturer was truly passionate about the material, and if she was truly present to teach and impart her experience in the field. whether the material is relevant to step 1 or testable is a non-issue issue for me. time is not an issue for me either. i have more than enough time to waste for 3-4 hours of lectures.

I don't mind "wasting" time on things about which people are passionate. I can learn from their experiences, and I think the things they have to impart and say are important, because they_care_about it.

but that's not the case. we have professors who read off slides without any reference to their personal experience with the material on hand. professors whose purpose seems more to obfuscate than to teach and assist understanding. professors who are there simply fulfilling a duty and don't seem engaged in the material at all.

And so I skip class. who cares, really. I will concede that some material in med school is just not compatible with the lecture-format, no matter how you look at it.

 

[Masticate3Xaday]

Really what's the point of lecture? All the material in the first 2 years of med school are already in textbooks or can be found by using a google search/watching youtube vids/pubmed. Like I said before, I wouldn't have a problem at all allowing anyone in the public to take Step 1...if they pass, then let them into med school. Med schools could then be used to train people entirely in the clinic (which is more important anyway), sort of like an apprenticeship like how people in trades are trained. It would save everyone over $100,000 in deb,t as well as time, if they could learn all of the first 2 years of med school on their own time and simply take step 1. It's really insane to think we're all paying ridiculous sums of money and racking up huge swaths of debt just so we can have the privilege of attending lectures that are increasingly becoming obsolete and something that we could have learned on our own with a library membership, only $1000 worth of textbooks, and by watching free youtube vids.

Let the public take step 1, save kids hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, and you can alleviate a ton of problems with regards to the uneven distribution of specialties that physicians pursue.

 

[Morsetlis]

Don't forget that there isn't a class on how to lecture. As a result, the naturally gifted teaching professors are a boon... but sometimes you get a loon for your lecturer and you wonder "could this guy be replaced by Morgan Freeman and still give me the same educational experience of powerpoint-reading?"

 

[Jack is Back]

Don't forget that there isn't a class on how to lecture. As a result, the naturally gifted teaching professors are a boon... but sometimes you get a loon for your lecturer and you wonder "could this guy be replaced by Morgan Freeman and still give me the same educational experience of powerpoint-reading?"

100% chance Freeman would be better than half my school's lecturers.

[YOUTUBE]lbIqL-lN1B4[/YOUTUBE]

@1:18

 

[Ironheme]

The Mark Twain quote is funny, and that video wow. That's wicked good, and apparently he's fooled a lot of people into thinking he's Arnold Schwarnegger.

Today is starting off great so far. I feel a little bad for skipping class, but I just read through/studied the lecture notes and I feel like I could explain the material. I looked up things I didn't know, which I felt might not have been answered in lecture. Not to mention I did it in half the time lecture takes. We'll see how this works out, but it's awesome so far. I don't feel wiped like I normally do after class, and I did sleep in. There is one lecturer that is actually really good, but it's for an elective class (food and nutrition) we're required to take (to be more well rounded), and the final exam is 100% from the slides. I will try to go to that one if I'm on campus but otherwise it's not worth breaking the studying so far.

Thanks guys for all the replies. Really appreciate it. I hope this works out a lot better than what I've been doing so far.

 

[Jack is Back]

Whatever you decide to do, don't let guilt or duty to your school play any role in it.

Your job is to learn the material in whatever way is best for you. If this way gets you more sleep and better grasp, then obviously do it.

You'll do more for your school by being a competent and happy physician than you will struggling and being a warm body in a seat.

 

[gravitywave]

The Mark Twain quote is funny, and that video wow. That's wicked good, and apparently he's fooled a lot of people into thinking he's Arnold Schwarnegger.

Today is starting off great so far. I feel a little bad for skipping class, but I just read through/studied the lecture notes and I feel like I could explain the material. I looked up things I didn't know, which I felt might not have been answered in lecture. Not to mention I did it in half the time lecture takes. We'll see how this works out, but it's awesome so far. I don't feel wiped like I normally do after class, and I did sleep in. There is one lecturer that is actually really good, but it's for an elective class (food and nutrition) we're required to take (to be more well rounded), and the final exam is 100% from the slides. I will try to go to that one if I'm on campus but otherwise it's not worth breaking the studying so far.

Thanks guys for all the replies. Really appreciate it. I hope this works out a lot better than what I've been doing so far.

welcome to the dark side. it's unlikely you'll go back

i'd say my class attendance is about 10%. every so often i'll go to a lecture for the hell of it, and i do go to labs/small groups just because i'm afraid i won't ever get around to the material if i don't go. but sitting in lecture for hours on end never worked for me; OP has described a situation near-identical to my own.

the lectures are recorded here, and tbh the lecturers are for the most part quite good. it's just not for me.

 

[Valadi]

welcome to the dark side. it's unlikely you'll go back

i'd say my class attendance is about 10%. every so often i'll go to a lecture for the hell of it, and i do go to labs/small groups just because i'm afraid i won't ever get around to the material if i don't go. but sitting in lecture for hours on end never worked for me; OP has described a situation near-identical to my own.

the lectures are recorded here, and tbh the lecturers are for the most part quite good. it's just not for me.

I'll second what 95% of other med students agree on; lectures are unnecessary. I think I probably made 10% in my first 2 years as well, and I stopped listening to the recorded lectures after 1st year as well.

If you know the textbook, you know the material. Period. Where do you think these guys learned it from?

 

[Ironheme]

Fair enough. I think it's so deeply ingrained that good student is the one that goes to class and I get nervous about missing things if I don't go. I think that is something I will have to get over. Not to mention I would say we currently have 75% class attendance with people shocked that I stopped going. I don't know how they do it, but I can't pull long class hours and study on top of it. From what I can tell they don't study on the days with long hours, but try to make up for it other days. They've also had the class before. I thought about what some of you said here, and I did find myself spacing out in lecture a few times and not really learning what the prof was talking about (anatomy lecture). It just seemed like something I'd have to sit down and memorize on my own anyways. Sure you can tell me muscle proximal/distal attachment is here/there, but it's something I can get out of a textbook and retain better anyways. I scored a 1 and 3 on visual and auditory learning on the VARK test.

It's too early to tell if this is working as there was mandatory class today so I was stuck for 6 hours on campus (1 hour break) and we have a mandatory thing tomorrow (yes Saturday) for 3 hours. Sunday I should have a lot of time, and next week I'll get a lot of time to myself by skipping class.

 

[MossPoh]

My grades went up dramatically when I stopped going to lecture. I still went to school, but I just studied on my own during the times they were doing lectures. I went from struggling to get C+/B's at the beginning to getting solid A's with more material during second year.

 

[Ironheme]

My grades went up dramatically when I stopped going to lecture. I still went to school, but I just studied on my own during the times they were doing lectures. I went from struggling to get C+/B's at the beginning to getting solid A's with more material during second year.

From a traditional teaching standpoint that seems so counterintuitive. I have a hard time imagining a prof going: skip class to get better grades! I never thought I'd be the type to skip class when I was pre-med, but now I can completely understand the sage advice of my elders on SDN.

 

[Morsetlis]

Yeah, except that there are teachers, and then there are professors who can get a PhD but can't teach worth ****.

 

[Guevara M.D.]

There are actually several issues at work here. It's not as simple as "going to class equals high grades" or "class is a waste of time".

Yes, the Old Cliche is true: people learn in different ways. Some people can only absorb and digest material when someone explains it to them and some people can only understand something after drawing a diagram. So yes, if you find yourself not getting anything out of class then by all means do not feel guilty about skipping class to study. It's perfectly legitimate.

HOWEVER, the problem is that too many people are just not objective enough to know how they study best. I am currently an M3 and I can tell you from first hand experience that half of the people that claim loudly that "class is a waste of time" NEED to go to class. They have zero discipline and love to sleep in. It's as simple as that. My grades increased exponentially once I stopped lying to myself, admitted that I just loved sleeping in and started going to class regularly.

It's not really about the lecturers. You can't depend on them, their quality is not consistent. It's about discipline. If you wake up early and go to class and then study again afterwards you are seeing the material multiple times in multiple ways. Too many medical students just don't have the discipline that is necessary to adequately study and memorize 400+ pages of text in three weeks.

So yes...if you TRULY learn best on your own skip class. But be honest with yourself first.

 

[Ironheme]

There are actually several issues at work here. It's not as simple as "going to class equals high grades" or "class is a waste of time".

Yes, the Old Cliche is true: people learn in different ways. Some people can only absorb and digest material when someone explains it to them and some people can only understand something after drawing a diagram. So yes, if you find yourself not getting anything out of class then by all means do not feel guilty about skipping class to study. It's perfectly legitimate.

HOWEVER, the problem is that too many people are just not objective enough to know how they study best. I am currently an M3 and I can tell you from first hand experience that half of the people that claim loudly that "class is a waste of time" NEED to go to class. They have zero discipline and love to sleep in. It's as simple as that. My grades increased exponentially once I stopped lying to myself, admitted that I just loved sleeping in and started going to class regularly.

So yes...if you TRULY learn best on your own skip class. But be honest with yourself first.

I took the VARK test, I'm kinesthetic first and foremost, reader/writer second, and auditory/visual are close to 0 unfortunately. What you mention here was why I was very nervous about skipping any class, hence me going religiously for the first few weeks. I do remember when I did skip class before I didn't have the discipline to go through the material afterwards.

The problem I am having now is not having enough time to study after long hours of class because I was completely drained. I do like to sleep in, but I also get up and study. I will keep what you said in mind to see how disciplined I am. I enjoy learning the material, but I just didn't have the energy to do it with so many classes, or classes that would be sporadically scheduled throughout the day. I got back a little while ago from a class we had today.

If you guys are curious, I'll report back in a week to let you know how the not going to most classes (there's a couple I want to go to) and studying is working out.

 

[RFHawks]

I also am considering not going to class. My current strategy has been to preview everything for the day, go to lectures, go home and review it all. However, by the time I get home I am so sick of biochemistry my motivation and focus are not where they should be and I rarely make it through all of my review. I got almost nothing out of previewing so I condensed that to a brief flip through of the lectures just to get a general sense of structure (less than 5 min/lec). I realize that almost nothing soaks in during lecture. I couldn't explain the ins and outs of cholesterol synthesis and regulation even after listening to it for an hour.

My learning takes place when I sit down to review and mentally test my knowledge of what I just read. Only then do I understand it. Hence, I have been thinking about skipping lectures that aren't mandatory and just doing my "review" during those times. I haven't taken this test you are talking about, but I don't learn something by listening to someone talk about it. I have to go through it on my own by myself.

For those of you that skip, what do you do to study? Textbooks? Watch online lecs? Only study the slides?

I find that reading textbooks is too time consuming and wrought with information irrelevant to the test that I will forget anyway. I have toyed with the idea of only studying the lecture slides, but studying them more often.

 

[SlickNickMD]

On the contrary, you will probably do better than if you went to class, and much better on Step 1 which is what really counts.




This is a huge load of BS. I dunno why medical schools don't respect the fact that different people have different learning styles and that not everyone benefits from sitting on their ass in a lecture hall for 8 hours a day. I found that the majority of people who went to lecture in my class were those who didn't have the drive to actually learn the material; they would sit in lecture to fool themselves that they were actually being productive.

GREAT RESPONSE

I should add that after the clinical years most of your medical education is self directed learning, I'm glad I literally taught myself through the first 2 years of med school

 

[Ironheme]

An update: so big thank you for all the advice again and first exams I'm in the top quarter of the class or so, which I realize doesn't mean much in the long run. But it tells me that studying rather than going to class works for me. I'm a lot less stressed and not getting freaked out by rumors started by other students on what's due when.

Though, I can't say I'm looking forward to MS2. I feel my life right now is sleep, eat, study, and on the rare occasion go out with friends. I'm usually too busy studying/working to worry about the things I used to worry about at the beginning of MS1 (do I know enough, how can I possibly learn all this material, so and so said this was on the test). I am basically just working as hard/smart as I can and hope it's enough to do well.

And I heard MS2 is worse. On the bright side this cycle should temporarily be interrupted by Christmas break...

 

[MilkmanAl]

I know I missed the party on this one, but I wanted to highlight a couple things:

HOWEVER, the problem is that too many people are just not objective enough to know how they study best. I am currently an M3 and I can tell you from first hand experience that half of the people that claim loudly that "class is a waste of time" NEED to go to class. They have zero discipline and love to sleep in. It's as simple as that. My grades increased exponentially once I stopped lying to myself, admitted that I just loved sleeping in and started going to class regularly.

This paragraph just plain makes no sense. Why can you not sleep in and study on your own? I did. My grades increased by a solid letter grade with about 1/3 the studying (plus not wasting my time in class during the day). Anectdotal evidence on both sides, sure, but at least at UAMS, not going to class is pretty clearly the method of choice. Most of my class had similar results once they bit the bullet and stopped attending lecture.

It's about discipline. If you wake up early and go to class and then study again afterwards you are seeing the material multiple times in multiple ways. Too many medical students just don't have the discipline that is necessary to adequately study and memorize 400+ pages of text in three weeks.

Or you could get up at whatever time you want, go through the material in 15-20 minutes per lecture instead of 50+, and then do it again later that day and still have spent less time on it than if you'd seen it once in class. As for memorizing 400+ pages of info in 3 weeks, that's what every single medical student does for every test. The national drop-out rate is something on the order of 8%, so even if we're being overly generous and assuming that everyone making up that 8% quit because he/she couldn't handle the work load, I'm calling BS on your lack of discipline claims.


OP, I'm glad you found a route that works for you. M2 is more work, but I doubt you'll see your lifestyle change all that much. You'll have everything refined and streamlined at that point and will be prepared to handle more info.