Advice on what I should do

[coolkul]

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I've started studying for the MCAT. However, I'm having issues trying to figure out how I will get shadowing and clinical hours. I'm a non-traditional applicant. I volunteered and briefly shadowed (very informally) a few doctors during that volunteering stint. I volunteered for about 6 months and got about 100-150 hours. Shadowing is significantly less than that, like maybe 10 hours because I wasn't able to start until really late.

Here's the problem with both of those situations. I volunteered many years ago when I was pre-med in college. Now that I'm a few years post graduating undergrad, I'm having difficulty trying to get recent shadowing or clinical hours. Another problem is that my shadowing hours are pretty much worthless as I just tagged along with different doctors for an hour or so while volunteering. They didn't really even seem to think much of it and because my hours are stretched over multiple doctors I don't have any contact with, it will be hard to even include that on my app. Another concern is that the volunteer head at the hospital no longer works there and I don't know how to get my hours verified. Also, while I had patient contact, I didn't do much while volunteering. The only valuable thing I got from it was talking to patients here and there, listening to docs, and understanding how the hospital ward I was in worked. Also learned that there are some terrible patients out there, but also some really nice ones.

Some things happened in my life and I decided that I couldn't pursue medicine. I was apprehensive and I had a lot of things going on that really made me question medicine. However, after completing my master's I feel so much regret about not following a dream I've had since I was a kid. At the end of the day, I like learning about medicine and think I will always live in regret doing something else. I went to some grand rounds for a hospital when I was doing research and I kept thinking that I wanted to learn about all the things that were presented.

Because of my situation I'm seriously thinking about applying next year, regardless of how i do on the MCAT. I might be able to shadow a doctor here and there in the next 3-4 months, get around 40-50 hours shadowing and send applications, but that's too risky while trying to study. Another reason I want to push for later is that I might get a paper published later this year, but significantly after applications would be submitted. I timed my MCAT studying and test date so that it would be around when apps open up. It'll be a little later than when most schools open up their apps, but it would be close.

Based on my situation what do you guys think? Should I apply next year? The main reason why I wanted to apply this year is that I don't want to keep waiting. I'll be two years older by the time I would start med school if I apply 2019 and in the mean time I will have to find a job to keep myself afloat for two years.

This is pretty much what I would be applying with:
3.8+ overall GPA, 3.8+ BPCM GPA, 1 year undergrad research, 1.5 years of master's research at a major hospital (non-clinical research), 100+ hours hospital volunteering, unknown MCAT, no shadowing (maybe 30-50 hours if I manage something in the next 3ish months).

 

[Jasmine2022]

You clearly have a lot going through you mind, and rightly so. Therefore, let's break this down.

First, you should wait to apply until you have the best application you can put together. This includes a solid MCAT score, MEANINGFUL clinical and nonclinical volunteering, and shadowing to go along with your already strong academic profile. You already have some volunteering, but what I took from your post is that you really didn't get anything out of it. Typically, your shadowing and volunteer experiences are the things you can write about in your personal statement and secondary apps, as well as discuss during interviews to show that you are a dynamic person with PASSION for medicine and have observed the basic day-to-day work of a physician.

It sounds to me like you are trying to cram as much as possible in while studying for the MCAT to be prepared for the next cycle. As someone who did exactly that and had to re-apply, I highly recommend taking a step back and assessing what you are truly capable of over the next few months. If you feel you can adequately address every aspect of a great medical school application, go ahead and apply. But if not (and this sounds to be the case), it truly isn't the end of the world to wait an extra year. Applying costs money and can be a significant drain on your emotional wellbeing if you do not get accepted. Better to do it right the first time than to have to go through it all again should you not get an offer. I say commit the time to the MCAT, get a great score, and fill in the gaps in your volunteerism to create an awesome narrative over the next year.

I'm 37 and won't graduate until I'm 41. Heaven help me if I choose to go into a field with a longer residency or one that requires a fellowship, as I won't be in practice until I'm nearly 50. I don't know your age, but if I could go back and do it a little differently, I would have waited to apply.

 

[Goro]

Here's the problem with both of those situations. I volunteered many years ago when I was pre-med in college. Now that I'm a few years post graduating undergrad, I'm having difficulty trying to get recent shadowing or clinical hours.

Start networking with doctors you know, like your family doctor.

OR do your volunteering, and network with doctors you meet doing that.
Not all volunteering needs to be in a hospital. Think hospice, Planned Parenthood, nursing homes, rehab facilities, crisis hotlines, camps for sick children, or clinics.

Some types of volunteer activities are more appealing than others. Volunteering in a nice suburban hospital is all very well and good and all, but doesn't show that you're willing to dig in and get your hands dirty in the same way that working with the developmentally disabled (or homeless, the dying, or Alzheimers or mentally ill or elderly or ESL or domestic, rural impoverished) does. The uncomfortable situations are the ones that really demonstrate your altruism and get you 'brownie points'. Plus, they frankly teach you more -- they develop your compassion and humanity in ways comfortable situations can't.



Do NOT apply until you have the best possible app. Med schools aren't going anywhere.

 

[stickgirl390]

I had a similar back story to yours. I didn’t decide to persue medicine until 3 years after I graduated college. After I made that decision, it took 3 more years before I had an application strong enough to earn an acceptance (current app cycle). If medicine is your passion, then whatever decisions/choices you make should be to ensure you get accepted into medical school. If starting your career at a younger age so you can buy a home/start a family/etc is your passion, then maybe reevaluate your options.

 

[coolkul]

Thanks guys. I really appreciate the advice. I think my decision to apply next year are justified. I don't mind taking another year off, but I think I'm letting societal pressure get to me. Reading all of your advice has made me feel stronger about this. I shouldn't apply early for superficial reasons.

I have some other questions about non-clinical volunteering. When I submit an application am I required to put number of hours that I spent doing that? I had some nonclinical volunteering that I didn't mention earlier, but as is the case with my hospital volunteering it has been a while and most of the people involved (officers of clubs, supervisors) are no longer in charge, so how can this be verified? I was also an officer of another club, but we didn't mark down how many hours were spent. I think it these were meaningful experiences, not for my desire to do medicine, but for helping people, and I would like to talk about these things.

 

[WIMNFamilyMed]

Thanks guys. I really appreciate the advice. I think my decision to apply next year are justified. I don't mind taking another year off, but I think I'm letting societal pressure get to me. Reading all of your advice has made me feel stronger about this. I shouldn't apply early for superficial reasons.

I have some other questions about non-clinical volunteering. When I submit an application am I required to put number of hours that I spent doing that? I had some nonclinical volunteering that I didn't mention earlier, but as is the case with my hospital volunteering it has been a while and most of the people involved (officers of clubs, supervisors) are no longer in charge, so how can this be verified? I was also an officer of another club, but we didn't mark down how many hours were spent. I think it these were meaningful experiences, not for my desire to do medicine, but for helping people, and I would like to talk about these things.

Nothing you’ve done is required to be put down, but non clinical volunteering would never be against you. It would also do well to show how you spent your time IE not being a lazy bum on the streets.

What you put is entirely up to you - just make sure it’s meaningful to you and somehow you can relate it to your desire to enter the medical field and the app reader will care about it.

Former club officers names and stuff is fine. Most schools do not contact people and verify hours/experiences.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

The contact just needs to be someone who can verify what you did if they decide to call (which they probably won’t). If you keep in touch with any of the people who were there when you volunteered, you can list them. You can also call the org and ask them if they can verify your hours.

 

[Med Ed]

Thanks guys. I really appreciate the advice. I think my decision to apply next year are justified. I don't mind taking another year off, but I think I'm letting societal pressure get to me. Reading all of your advice has made me feel stronger about this. I shouldn't apply early for superficial reasons.

I have some other questions about non-clinical volunteering. When I submit an application am I required to put number of hours that I spent doing that? I had some nonclinical volunteering that I didn't mention earlier, but as is the case with my hospital volunteering it has been a while and most of the people involved (officers of clubs, supervisors) are no longer in charge, so how can this be verified? I was also an officer of another club, but we didn't mark down how many hours were spent. I think it these were meaningful experiences, not for my desire to do medicine, but for helping people, and I would like to talk about these things.

From what you have shared I don't think that clinical exposure (volunteering/shadowing) is the big gap in your application. It's non-clinical volunteering. Putting in some significant time with Habitat for Humanity (or something along those lines) will help your odds more than anything else. Some applicants assume they can supplant this with campus clubs and activities, but that's not an effective solution in this era.

With regard to what to list, how many hours to claim, and who to provide contact info for, the key thing is to act in good faith. That just means you make the best possible effort to account for your experiences truthfully. We get it that the supervisor of something you did four years ago might have moved on and be unreachable. That's not your fault, and it's not really a problem if you are honest in what you report. The people who should sweat an EC audit are the ones who have wildly exaggerated their activities (or outright made things up).

 

[coolkul]

From what you have shared I don't think that clinical exposure (volunteering/shadowing) is the big gap in your application. It's non-clinical volunteering. Putting in some significant time with Habitat for Humanity (or something along those lines) will help your odds more than anything else. Some applicants assume they can supplant this with campus clubs and activities, but that's not an effective solution in this era.

With regard to what to list, how many hours to claim, and who to provide contact info for, the key thing is to act in good faith. That just means you make the best possible effort to account for your experiences truthfully. We get it that the supervisor of something you did four years ago might have moved on and be unreachable. That's not your fault, and it's not really a problem if you are honest in what you report. The people who should sweat an EC audit are the ones who have wildly exaggerated their activities (or outright made things up).

Thank you for the feedback. Yeah, I do think I'm lacking non-clinical work that shows that I went above and beyond. There's a sizeable gap between undergrad and now, that I haven't really made up. I never really sought out outside volunteer opportunities that weren't offered through school clubs. My non-clinical hours include being an after-school mentor/tutor for students at an elementary school as part of a mentor group at my university. I did that for a couple of years (2-3), including recently when I was a master's student. I was also an officer my last year of college for a club that I was involved since my freshman year. Unfortunately, the old president gave up on the club, by the time a new group took over (including myself) we had difficulty getting it started again, but we did work on recruitment and organizing a fundraiser. While I wish that experience was more meaningful, it is something that I did in college that was somewhat important. All of these things were supervised by the students themselves, not some professor of college faculty member. So there's no one to verify, but I'm definitely not making stuff up.

On a side note, I think one of the reasons why I didn't do more volunteering was because I felt like I wasn't making much of an impact and I feel a little bit of guilt that what I'm doing is exploitative because I can put it on my application. It's not that I don't like helping people, but I feel like a bit of an imposter when I look at volunteer projects and think I'm not really doing this for purely noble reasons. I don't know if any pre-med people felt this way, but I felt like mentioning that. I'm wondering if others had that feeling too.

I didn't feel this about tutoring kids because I actually enjoyed that and was actually doing something, but a lot of other volunteer opportunities for pre-meds seemed like stuff where I had no impact, it was just there for people like me to put on my app. I will look into Habitat for Humanity because I've been interested in that for a few years and I think it's something that I feel like where I'd be doing something useful.