Advised to seek a masters program to prove ability to complete an MD program

[AhLee679]

Hello!



I had a meeting with my advisor a month ago where we discussed my intent to apply to med school this next spring (I’m currently a junior in a biochem program). She seemed concerned about the fact that I had withdrawn from classes in Fall 2020, returned to school in Spring 2022, withdrew again in Fall 2023, then returned in Spring 2023. She flat out stated that I will need to get a masters to demonstrate that I am fit to complete an MD program.

I explained to her that my first withdrawal was to care for my grandmother, who, at the time, was undergoing dialysis and needed assistance in every aspect of her life. After she passed, I managed to rent a house with some old friends of mine and returned to school. The roommates got into a disagreement with each other, moved out, and left me to pay rent by myself, hence the second withdrawal.
I have been working really hard toward this goal for a long time, and I’ve remained focused through a lot of really tough obstacles. It’s kinda frustrating to even think that I would have to go through another two years of school and debt just to do it yet again for four years of school, all because I was willing to take responsibility in my personal life.

All of this is really just a long-winded way of asking for a second opinion. Will these two gaps really impact my application enough to where I should consider a masters program first?

Thanks in advance!

For reference:
- Cumulative GPA: 3.91
- Science GPA: 3.87
- I have not taken the MCAT. I am preparing to do so in the early spring. I know that the MCAT weighs heavily in decisions, so I’d appreciate opinions that consider potential MCAT scores (i.e. don’t apply under 508, etc.)
- State of residence: NY
- Ethnicity: White
- Undergraduate category: first two years private, graduating from state (transferred for financial reasons)
- Clinical experience: Ongoing with 1800+ as an MA/scribe in urgent care. Previous experience with home health care (not sure exactly how many hours, I have it written down somewhere, but at least 250).
- Research experience: Currently developing a thesis and preparing a seminar (two different projects) for my graduation requirements. Between those two I will get, at the very least, 100+ hours by May. Also working with a professor to help him develop a procedure in a clinical psychology study for which I will be an RA.
- Shadowing experience: Scheduled for 16 hours in dermatology next month. Have connections with urology and orthopedic surgery, but I’m waiting until December for those because I don’t have time to fit anything else into my schedule right now.
- Volunteer experience: Ongoing with 100+ (worked with a youth group, now working with underprivileged children. No clinical volunteering). I used to be the president of a musical production crew in high school, but that was like 7 years ago.
- Extracurriculars: I’ve captained a billiards team every week for the past year and have been in a league for two years overall. Nothing else extraordinary. I spend most of my time working, studying, and caring for my younger brother.
- Relevant honors or awards: Just the deans list every semester currently.

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[Moko]

I had a meeting with my advisor a month ago where we discussed my intent to apply to med school this next spring (I’m currently a junior in a biochem program). She seemed concerned about the fact that I had withdrawn from classes in Fall 2020, returned to school in Spring 2022, withdrew again in Fall 2023, then returned in Spring 2023. She flat out stated that I will need to get a masters to demonstrate that I am fit to complete an MD program.

I explained to her that my first withdrawal was to care for my grandmother, who, at the time, was undergoing dialysis and needed assistance in every aspect of her life. After she passed, I managed to rent a house with some old friends of mine and returned to school. The roommates got into a disagreement with each other, moved out, and left me to pay rent by myself, hence the second withdrawal.
I have been working really hard toward this goal for a long time, and I’ve remained focused through a lot of really tough obstacles. It’s kinda frustrating to even think that I would have to go through another two years of school and debt just to do it yet again for four years of school, all because I was willing to take responsibility in my personal life.

All of this is really just a long-winded way of asking for a second opinion. Will these two gaps really impact my application enough to where I should consider a masters program first?

Thanks in advance!

For reference:
- Cumulative GPA: 3.91
- Science GPA: 3.87
- I have not taken the MCAT. I am preparing to do so in the early spring. I know that the MCAT weighs heavily in decisions, so I’d appreciate opinions that consider potential MCAT scores (i.e. don’t apply under 508, etc.)
- State of residence: NY
- Ethnicity: White
- Undergraduate category: first two years private, graduating from state (transferred for financial reasons)
- Clinical experience: Ongoing with 1800+ as an MA/scribe in urgent care. Previous experience with home health care (not sure exactly how many hours, I have it written down somewhere, but at least 250).
- Research experience: Currently developing a thesis and preparing a seminar (two different projects) for my graduation requirements. Between those two I will get, at the very least, 100+ hours by May. Also working with a professor to help him develop a procedure in a clinical psychology study for which I will be an RA.
- Shadowing experience: Scheduled for 16 hours in dermatology next month. Have connections with urology and orthopedic surgery, but I’m waiting until December for those because I don’t have time to fit anything else into my schedule right now.
- Volunteer experience: Ongoing with 100+ (worked with a youth group, now working with underprivileged children. No clinical volunteering). I used to be the president of a musical production crew in high school, but that was like 7 years ago.
- Extracurriculars: I’ve captained a billiards team every week for the past year and have been in a league for two years overall. Nothing else extraordinary. I spend most of my time working, studying, and caring for my younger brother.
- Relevant honors or awards: Just the deans list every semester currently.

In your secondary applications, you will have the opportunity to explain the extenuating circumstances above: most secondaries will ask some form of a "What else?" question, for which your explanation would be a perfect topic for. No reasonable person can fault you for taking time to care for your grandmother, just as how no reasonable person can fault you for needing to make ends meet to avoid homelessness. Not everyone was born with a silver spoon in their mouths and your caregiving experience will help contribute to the diversity of the class.

Get a Masters only if you are truly passionate about the topic AND your future career will benefit greatly from the knowledge/experiences gained from that Masters degree. DO NOT get a Masters for the reason that your advisor outlined - that is plain idiotic and a complete waste of your money and time. You have nothing to prove academically as long as your MCAT score is competitive. Your application will, however, benefit from additional research, shadowing, and volunteering (clinical volunteering is not necessary in your case since you already have robust paid clinical experience). Just my thoughts.

tl;dr: your advisor is idiotic.

 

[Angler]

There seems to be a clear theme of undergraduate premed advisors who are ignorant and shouldn't be doing what they're doing.

Kill your MCAT & buff your application just like @Moko recommends. And when you get your A, show this "advisor" what you can do without a Masters.

 

[LunaOri]

If possible, ask your premed advisor/committee to mention these circumstances in their letter as well.

 

[AhLee679]

In your secondary applications, you will have the opportunity to explain the extenuating circumstances above: most secondaries will ask some form of a "What else?" question, for which your explanation would be a perfect topic for. No reasonable person can fault you for taking time to care for your grandmother, just as how no reasonable person can fault you for needing to make ends meet to avoid homelessness. Not everyone was born with a silver spoon in their mouths and your caregiving experience will help contribute to the diversity of the class.

Get a Masters only if you are truly passionate about the topic AND your future career will benefit greatly from the knowledge/experiences gained from that Masters degree. DO NOT get a Masters for the reason that your advisor outlined - that is plain idiotic and a complete waste of your money and time. You have nothing to prove academically as long as your MCAT score is competitive. Your application will, however, benefit from additional research, shadowing, and volunteering (clinical volunteering is not necessary in your case since you already have robust paid clinical experience). Just my thoughts.

tl;dr: your advisor is idiotic.

I appreciate your reply! Honestly, those were my thoughts, but she’s been the advisor for a while now and claims to have overseen many applications. In other words, she “knows what’s going to get in and what isn’t.” Everybody that I have spoken to disagrees with this woman’s opinion, and she is known for destroying pre-med/PA dreams among students here.

In terms of strengthening the application, is it worth doing a bare bones, or even part-time, semester in the spring to focus heavily on additional experiences? I only need 4 major classes and some electives to graduate after this semester, so it’s something that I can afford in that manner.

Thanks again!

 

[Angler]

I'll let the experts reply, but academically, just get the Med School prereqs done & do what's needed to graduate. Concentrate on MCAT studying and your EC's. Formulate your application narrative; saying, "I want to be a doctor" isn't enough.

 

[Goro]

Data point # 376436787644 that most premed advisors have the advising capacity of chipmunks.

Ignore your advisor. You took yourvW for the exactly the reasons they are made for, instead of trying to bulldozer your way through, which would have catered your GPAs.

 

[dgdg]

Hello!



I had a meeting with my advisor a month ago where we discussed my intent to apply to med school this next spring (I’m currently a junior in a biochem program). She seemed concerned about the fact that I had withdrawn from classes in Fall 2020, returned to school in Spring 2022, withdrew again in Fall 2023, then returned in Spring 2023. She flat out stated that I will need to get a masters to demonstrate that I am fit to complete an MD program.

I explained to her that my first withdrawal was to care for my grandmother, who, at the time, was undergoing dialysis and needed assistance in every aspect of her life. After she passed, I managed to rent a house with some old friends of mine and returned to school. The roommates got into a disagreement with each other, moved out, and left me to pay rent by myself, hence the second withdrawal.
I have been working really hard toward this goal for a long time, and I’ve remained focused through a lot of really tough obstacles. It’s kinda frustrating to even think that I would have to go through another two years of school and debt just to do it yet again for four years of school, all because I was willing to take responsibility in my personal life.

All of this is really just a long-winded way of asking for a second opinion. Will these two gaps really impact my application enough to where I should consider a masters program first?

Thanks in advance!

For reference:
- Cumulative GPA: 3.91
- Science GPA: 3.87
- I have not taken the MCAT. I am preparing to do so in the early spring. I know that the MCAT weighs heavily in decisions, so I’d appreciate opinions that consider potential MCAT scores (i.e. don’t apply under 508, etc.)
- State of residence: NY
- Ethnicity: White
- Undergraduate category: first two years private, graduating from state (transferred for financial reasons)
- Clinical experience: Ongoing with 1800+ as an MA/scribe in urgent care. Previous experience with home health care (not sure exactly how many hours, I have it written down somewhere, but at least 250).
- Research experience: Currently developing a thesis and preparing a seminar (two different projects) for my graduation requirements. Between those two I will get, at the very least, 100+ hours by May. Also working with a professor to help him develop a procedure in a clinical psychology study for which I will be an RA.
- Shadowing experience: Scheduled for 16 hours in dermatology next month. Have connections with urology and orthopedic surgery, but I’m waiting until December for those because I don’t have time to fit anything else into my schedule right now.
- Volunteer experience: Ongoing with 100+ (worked with a youth group, now working with underprivileged children. No clinical volunteering). I used to be the president of a musical production crew in high school, but that was like 7 years ago.
- Extracurriculars: I’ve captained a billiards team every week for the past year and have been in a league for two years overall. Nothing else extraordinary. I spend most of my time working, studying, and caring for my younger brother.
- Relevant honors or awards: Just the deans list every semester currently.

In my entire academic and professional career(s), I found assigned advisors gave the worst or least helpful advice. Not sure why, but that is my anecdotal experience. YMMV.
When I found eager, smart, caring professor/mentors on my own, I look back now and see they gave me great advice and support.
Your gaps in education have a good reason. I think it shows compassion, resilience, and determination to achieve your goals without ignoring others. If you can explain your gaps, it will show a maturity that others have possibly yet to prove.
Apply to med school and see what happens! Good luck. You're ready.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

She seemed concerned about the fact that I had withdrawn from classes in Fall 2020, returned to school in Spring 2022, withdrew again in Fall 2023, then returned in Spring 2023. She flat out stated that I will need to get a masters to demonstrate that I am fit to complete an MD program.

You don't need a SMP with your 3.8+ GPA. We don't have an MCAT score, but assuming you do well there, your metrics will not indicate needing an SMP.

The period of time between 2020 and now has been unusual, and you have valid reasons to take your semester withdrawals. They are not for reasons related to your own health and are absolutely reasonable.

You need more shadowing in primary care, but a small part of your scribing hours could be considered shadowing to cover this. You need more service orientation activities (food distribution, shelter work, job/tax preparation, transportation services, housing rehabilitation), minimum 150 hours by submission to avoid getting screened out at many schools.

 

[gyngyn]

Everybody that I have spoken to disagrees with this woman’s opinion, and she is known for destroying pre-med/PA dreams among students here.

Her successful students may well have achieved their goals in spite of her, not because of her.
School advisors can improve their reported outcomes by eliminating as many "weaker" students as possible. Although their denominator becomes quite small, their percentage of "success" is thereby quite high.
Schools (and programs in schools) do this too. I am convinced that this is the reason for "weed-out" classes in undergrad...

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Old video. Enjoy