Affirmative Action? What? Why? Please educate me.

[hphan]

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It came strange to me when I browsed through so many posts regard of Affirmative Action (AA). I’d like to ask what’s AA? What does it give and take? I googled AA, and sadly found out so many controverial discussions toward AA.

As I experienced, US is the only nation that gave so much opportunities to its citizens. I think that’s why I knew so many people wanted its citizenship, they wanted it badly, they fought for it. Once it comes to education, as for natural borns, they had the whole life to study the language (English), and the education that US has to offered. US’s education(K-12) is the best out there: nice facilities, “free” usages of books, “fully” resources regards of libraries and classrooms, and ease of learning and have fun (by school’s activities), even transportation is provided. Jobs are always there for those with “fluently” English speaker and writer.

I came from a country that had none of the above in schools. During K-12, we must pay tuition on our own (doesn’t matter of incomes); no available books for free, buy them or borrow from friends; transportation: walk or bike or parents’; none of the schools has a library; “public” libraries are monthly membership with some “fees”; no “glassy” windows/doors in school; ahhh especially no “left-handed” students, I was one, I still cannot forget the punishment methods that the teachers used on me - nightmares; etc.

Came to America, I was amazed but soon to adapt with the environment. I appreciated the teachers in my high school. I was trying hard to study in every subjects, I did well, however English is still the hardest. I never realized how hard to remember so many vocabularies. I couldn’t make friends, they wouldn’t understand me, they didn’t have time to listen to me. My only friend is my mentorship teacher, she’s also the school’s nurse, very busy.

I became more isolated in high school, then I still hadn’t open myself up during first couples years of community college. I didn’t do so well either, especially English is getting more complicated. My mom never used English with me, today, she asked me how to spell “coming” and “comment” (is it comes with 2 mm or just 1 m?). I came here with no English 8 years ago. Many others came to America same period as me. However, now they’re so proficient in English compared to me. I’m normal but I still don’t get why I learn English slower than everyone else. However I learned math much faster than my classsmates (because it required so little usage of English), and I hate math, politics, and history so much. Back in my country I learned math in this format: “There’re 5 soldiers, each with 1 gun that has 2 bullets, and 2 knives; each bullet killed 2 Americans, each knife can kill 1 American; how many Americans died?” All they taugh in math was killing. Also politics and history.

By now, I still remember the feeling of going to school by school bus. It’s so comfortable, better than walking under the hot sun for 4 kilometers (~3 miles) to school. I couldn’t understand students who took that for fun, they used knives to destroy the leathers of the seats on the school bus, metro bus (what for?), and why didn’t they value their health (drugs, tobacco, alcohol, racing,…), etc.

Again, for natural born students, they’ve exposed to English more often than me, an immigrant status who came unprepared and be isolated. Living with single mom, believe it or not, our household incomes never went above 13,000/year. My mom babysit children, her employers didn’t even pay her for months, she never complaint, she always say “there’s always a reason for that” (I’m telling the truth, her employers are colored, “white Americans” don’t hire my mom because of her English?? and has no reliable transportation). I started off working “illegally” as underage as dishwasher for cash, when I reached legal age for working, I was still a dishwasher with paychecks but is way below minimum wages of the state.

My high school, was highly concentrated of natural born students, I had archieved an GPA of 3.4, applied for so many scholarships, only got $1000/year for 2 years from a community college that I later on attended. Finaids in school did helped me a lot. That’s another reason I was deeply appreciated the US’s gov’t.

It’s funny to say this, but where as I don’t have a job, my grades went up. I found a job, my grades went down, straight down like stock-market drops. Then as it is, I choose medicine. I loved every health profession. However, by experiences with nurses, pharmacists, and doctors; I fell [in love]{edited} with each of the professions. I loved Pharmacists and Doctors more, I strongly believe I will be alike them someday in the future. Everyone here has a similar feeling to share.

Colleges of Nursing, Pharmacy, Medicine are difficult to get in. Ashamed to share my grades here, with GPA of 2.95 or 3.0 (cummulative of all college credits for >140 credits). Compare that to all students out there, everyone in SDN, I’m a grain of sand.

From all of my stories above, I strongly support Affirmative Action, if it give me a chance to prove what I’m capable of, even though my academic status doesn’t show that. I do feel it’s unfair as I placed myself in those “white” students with top grades, I knew how hard it was to obtain B+ grades; thinking about get A- and A grades, amazingly.

Am I being too selfish by just thinking for myself? Can you please educate me a little more in depth of AA? What would it does to me? Why academic arguments became wars among SDNers?

Thank you,
HPHAN.

 

[OoShimmeroO]

Well since you're probably Asian, you don't have any sorta minority status. Maybe if you were Black, Hispanic, or Native American.

 

[Sosumi]

Here's my limited knowledge of Affirmative Action:
In the past (around 20+ years ago), medicine and other professions were dominated by white males. After the 60s, with the advent of the civil rights movement and ERA, colleges and government were encouraged to meet quotas to have underrepresented groups into the professions. You started seeing a lot more women working in professions other than the traditional nursing or secretarial career. Minorities that are underrepresented are highly encouraged and often get special points to enter programs or get government contracts with the logic being that they'll serve their respective community after they graduate or where they work. It works for not just underreprsented ethnic and racial minority, but also for gender and geographic background depending on the field you're in (business, health, etc.).

As stated by the previous poste, in the health professions, Asians are not underrepresented, so you will probably not get bonus points for being Asian. Law and business is where I think Affirmative Action might apply for Asians.

 

[dgroulx]

I think it's great that you learned English in so short of a time and you have done a lot to get where you are today. Those experiences will look really good on a personal statement when you apply to professional school.

I'm in Florida and we don't have AA. Governor Bush repealed it as it is no longer needed. Our state schools admit students strictly on merit. Who ever scores the highest gets in. If you don't have a stellar GPA, you go to community college first then transfer.

 

[Laferno]

Here is what I perceive Affirmative Action to be:

During the civil rights movement back in the 1960s, minorities of all types were trying to get the same rights as the typical while male. However, racism and sexism were rampant through the country, especially in the south (no disrespect to any southerners out there). So, affirmative action was created in order to give underrepresented minorities an equal shot at getting jobs, getting into a college, or anything else that the 'isms' were keeping the minorities unfairly out of.

Quotas were created for a short time and used. What quotas meant was that there had to be a certain number of minorities in a given workplace, college, etc. The universities and places of employment were now required by law to have minorities work for them. This made potentially racist or sexist people have no option but to hire different ethnicities and women. However, there was a downside. Since this whole equal rights for everyone thing was just starting out, there were some cases where there weren't enough well-educated minorities to fill the quotas for certain positions. Also, if a quota is barely met by a business and one of the minorities that works there quits, then that meant that they had to hire a minority to fill the position. Hiring a minority over someone else because of their ethnicity is also a form of racism, sometimes called reverse-discrimination. Throw into the picture that a more qualified person might not get hired or get into a certain college because of a company's need to hire a minority and you have the makings of a political mess.

So flash forward to present day. Quotas have been repealed and affirmative action is still around to a lesser degree. Ideally, affirmative action now states that you can not take into account a person's race, ethnicity or sex when you are hiring someone or selecting them for college. According to proponents of affirmative action, the system balances the opportunity for minorities so that they can have the same chances as everyone else. People opposed to affirmative action feel that the vast majority of racism and sexism is dead and gone, and that affirmative action is now just an outdated policy that does nothing more than occasionally promote the hiring of less qualified individuals simply because they are a specific religion/ethnicity/sex.

As far as I know that is what affirmative action is. I may have some misinformation in there, but I believe most of it is accurate.

 

[DrugMan]

It sounds like everyone has a good feel for the reasoning behind AA and how it affects everyone today. However, if we look at the African American community, they have not been compensated fully for the labor that their ancestors were forced to use to help built our free nation. This country exploited free labor in the forms of slavery, murder, etc.

In other words...the influences of family are the major determinations of one's outlook on what success really is. For hundreds of years the African American community has been held back by slavery, racism, genocide, murder, drugs, etc. In order to change this curse or misfortune it is every American's responsibility to compensate our citizens by creating education and job opportunities for those who have endured or have felt the lasting effects of unjust circumstances. This will help built leaders in all communities and change the outlook of goals that were once perceived as being unreachable become realities.

My outlook is not to offend anyone...it's to shed light on a reality that many people face. 😀

 

[gablet]

One is more accomplished and proud of it when one earns it on his/her own.

Two of the most important lessons that I teach my children is to be responsible for themselves and that they can do/be anything! My father basically told me that I was not smart enough. I had to learn that I can be anything - something I had to learn on my own.

There are many whites that have had much more difficult lives than I did - poor, abused, etc. that have stopped them from succeeding. To single out certain minorities is unfair and only causes resentment.

 

[DrugMan]

One is more accomplished and proud of it when one earns it on his/her own.

Two of the most important lessons that I teach my children is to be responsible for themselves and that they can do/be anything! My father basically told me that I was not smart enough. I had to learn that I can be anything - something I had to learn on my own.

There are many whites that have had much more difficult lives than I did - poor, abused, etc. that have stopped them from succeeding. To single out certain minorities is unfair and only causes resentment.

I am not trying to single out any one group of people, I just listed an example as to why AA is needed in some communities...furthermore, there are certain communities that have been neglected for decades that will never be represented unless it's by people from their own community i.e. Indian Reservations, certain parts of Kentucky and Tennessee. It just goes to show that poverty crosses more barriers than color alone...it's becoming more socio-economically induced. Why do you think that if you work in certain communities you get bonuses in forms of getting your educational loans forgiven and other perks of that nature? I have an Asian friend that qualified for AA because her parents and grandparents risked their lives trying to help save American lives in the Vietnam War. A lot of Hmongs were brought to the US to be compensated for their services in the war and their children are the ones who are really benefiting. Let’s help those who need help rather red, yellow, black or white. 😀

 

[Moolji]

Listen, AA is just another form of racism, its reverse racism against whites. AA was setup so that minorities can be helped to get into schools to diversify it. I believe colleges and jobs should hire people based on their grades and qualifications not their ethnicity. It happend in Michigan University, a white girl didn't get into MU, but a black student did, even though he had lower grades than her. They took the black student only because of his race not his grades. If you want to get into a college or get a job, wether you are black or white, then earn, don't use your race to get in.

Also, I am an Indian, and I believe AA should not be given to Asians(Indians, Chinese, Japanese ect.) I believe we can compete with the whites on their level.

 

[nikkai]

Because the MAN KEEPS US DOWN

Power to the people! 😎




Honestly though, AA is still very much needed in part of the US. Perhaps though, not in the fashion that it is implemented right now since many of the laws are rather out-dated. Those of us in the West and Northern areas don't really know much (knowledge maybe, but not experience) about the racism that occurred.

There are many books on this matter - go to your local library and do some reading. Look at it from a non-selfcentered standpoint (not worded to be offensive, just objective)

 

[DrugMan]

Because the MAN KEEPS US DOWN

Power to the people! 😎




Honestly though, AA is still very much needed in part of the US. Perhaps though, not in the fashion that it is implemented right now since many of the laws are rather out-dated. Those of us in the West and Northern areas don't really know much (knowledge maybe, but not experience) about the racism that occurred.

There are many books on this matter - go to your local library and do some reading. Look at it from a non-selfcentered standpoint (not worded to be offensive, just objective)

😎 I totally agree with you...certain parts of the country are not caught up to modern times when it comes to race relations...I am blessed because I live in CA where the only thing that matters is $$$$$$ and I don't even have that

 

[ultracet]

😎 I totally agree with you...certain parts of the country are not caught up to modern times when it comes to race relations...I am blessed because I live in CA where the only thing that matters is $$$$$$ and I don't even have that

Or do you perhaps think that it is your perception of the other areas of the country that are not caught up??


I have lived my whole life in the South and think decent people are not racist and don't often run into it.


i happen to be from an area of the applachian mountains that was featured in a national geographic magazine for its poverty (equating it to a third world nation).

i guess that also makes me a minority

while it is hard for people to get out of that area and circumstance it is not impossible. there is a community college right down the road and they offer assistance (and even offered full rides to those who worked in the mines when they shut down)


While I do not discriminate on the basis of color I will discriminate based on what part of the country you are from. 😀