AHH...I almost made the interviewer cry. HELP!!

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RURALFAMILYDOC

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He asked me why I wanted to do family medicine in a rural area. He is a rural family doc.

As I was talking, I got chills and he got all teary eyed and didn't write anything down. After I was done speaking, he just went directly into the next question after he stared at me a minute.

Is it bad to elicit an emotional response from your interviewer?

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Could you provide more details please?

what could you have possibly said to elicit such a response?
 
I guess it depends. If you feel like you made an emotional connection and you touched him then I don't see how it could be a bad thing. Your interviewer might be more personally invested in you... that being said it is weird.
 
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Well I said that I felt an obligation to the people in my community (I want to go back to my hometown) because they've been without a family doc for 20 years and people have to travel almost an hour to get to a 25 bed critical access hospital with essentially no resources.
I said that I want to provide care to everyone regardless of ability to pay and having my practice will allow me to do that. Talked about my own family and many of my neighbors being uninsured, and how that motivates me to return.

Gave a few other stats too: Average income for a family of 4 in my town is $25,000. I said I want to be able to provide free care to those who need it because I don't think its right as a family doc making 100,000+ a year to deny treatment to people struggling paycheck to paycheck.
 
Gave a few other stats too: Average income for a family of 4 in my town is $25,000. I said I want to be able to provide free care to those who need it because I don't think its right as a family doc making 100,000+ a year to deny treatment to people struggling paycheck to paycheck.


A prudent interviewer's next question would've been "Ok Starry-Eyed Premed, how do you expect to actually accomplish this?"
 
Why do you think that is a bad thing?

You definitely touched him/her with your story and your goal and I doubt they wrote down anything that would be harmful.
 
Maybe your interviewer had overactive tear glands. I find it hard to believe the guy would be that blown away to almost start crying.
 
maybe his contacts were bothering him? :laugh:

im sure you have nothing to worry about. its in the past as they say. Resign yourself to the whims of fate.
 
I said that I want to provide care to everyone regardless of ability to pay and having my practice will allow me to do that. Talked about my own family and many of my neighbors being uninsured, and how that motivates me to return.

Gave a few other stats too: Average income for a family of 4 in my town is $25,000. I said I want to be able to provide free care to those who need it because I don't think its right as a family doc making 100,000+ a year to deny treatment to people struggling paycheck to paycheck.

:laugh: This is the equivalent of me saying when I become president I'm going to eliminate all taxes, allow everyone free healthcare, and access to free food to feed their families. You are damn lucky he didn't follow up with with "How are you going to pay your rent, staff, medical supplies if your practice income is zero" (and it will be - once people see you provide free healthcare they will flock to you in the thousands).

Sorry, but I don't buy this crying nonsense. You gave the same line that every pre-med gives at their interview about wanting to help people who can't afford healthcare.
 
:laugh: This is the equivalent of me saying when I become president I'm going to eliminate all taxes, allow everyone free healthcare, and access to free food to feed their families. You are damn lucky he didn't follow up with with "How are you going to pay your rent, staff, medical supplies if your practice income is zero" (and it will be - once people see you provide free healthcare they will flock to you in the thousands).

Sorry, but I don't buy this crying nonsense. You gave the same line that every pre-med gives at their interview about wanting to help people who can't afford healthcare.

Maybe he was crying because it's painful to see a pre-med so out of touch with reality.
 
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I've used this several times and you are right, most of them have followed up with "you have to eat" or "how are going to do that." I got into everyone of those schools though because I had an answer to that.

Be the medical director of a free clinic like the one I volunteer at.

Patient prescription programs, charity care at hospitals, and other ways that DOCTORS have to be aware of so that they can get their uninsured and low-income patients care.

They seemed pretty impressed with the fact that I knew about all of these options. In fact, I told them about a time when I was working in a hospital and I pulled one of the doctors aside and told them to tell their patient about the free clinic because the doc was telling the patient to pay $1000+ out of pocket. Doesn't happen.

Thanks for the feedback. Maybe there was something in his eye. Or maybe I spoke like a well practiced politician or motivational speaker. Don't know.
 
I've used this several times and you are right, most of them have followed up with "you have to eat" or "how are going to do that." I got into everyone of those schools though because I had an answer to that.

Be the medical director of a free clinic like the one I volunteer at.

Patient prescription programs, charity care at hospitals, and other ways that DOCTORS have to be aware of so that they can get their uninsured and low-income patients care.

They seemed pretty impressed with the fact that I knew about all of these options. In fact, I told them about a time when I was working in a hospital and I pulled one of the doctors aside and told them to tell their patient about the free clinic because the doc was telling the patient to pay $1000+ out of pocket. Doesn't happen.

Thanks for the feedback. Maybe there was something in his eye. Or maybe I spoke like a well practiced politician or motivational speaker. Don't know.
Maybe I'm missing something here, but your response to "How are you going to provide free care to everyone?" seems to be just a more elaborate restatement of "I'm going to provide free care to everyone."
 
Are you applying for the NHSC scholarship, RURALFAMILYDOC?
 
I'm going to provide free care by being knowledgeable about the options that are out there for the uninsured and low income. Most people without health insurance ARE being caring for somewhere. Most doctors provide up to 40% of their care for free (in case you didn't know).

Yes, I am applying for a NHSC scholarship.
 
Good thing I wasn't your interviewer or I would've ripped you a new one. Do you really think after getting your medical degree, living in the US, experiencing modern day technology and a real paycheck you are really going to go and serve the rest of your career as a doctor in a third-world country, with little or no charge to the patients? I'm sorry but I call BS I think it's a lousy thing to say to try and gain entry into medical school. I can see it being done maybe a few weeks out of the year but there is no way you are going to do the things you claim.
 
Well, I wish you all the best RFD :luck::luck:. I'm sure your interview went well. I hope you get all the support you need in medical school and beyond.
 
Good thing I wasn't your interviewer or I would've ripped you a new one. Do you really think after getting your medical degree, living in the US, experiencing modern day technology and a real paycheck you are really going to go and serve the rest of your career as a doctor in a third-world country, with little or no charge to the patients? I'm sorry but I call BS I think it's a lousy thing to say to try and gain entry into medical school. I can see it being done maybe a few weeks out of the year but there is no way you are going to do the things you claim.

:laugh:Third world country??:laugh: Try again. I'm going to be working on US soil. In case you didn't realize this, there are millions of people in the US not getting healthcare. I'm not taking my skills out of this country. We need to worry about our own first.
 
Ah ok, that changes it quite a bit. My bad, LOL. I was imagining this being some little town in Africa with mud huts and half-naked people running around. :laugh:
 
While I guess I don't understand your reasons for starting this thread, I will applaud you for your attention to rural health. Being informed on options for the uninsured and those without immediate access to care is a good thing. Most interviewers probably can see you are motivated to return to a rural area to practice. That is the main thing, here. You may not be firmly grounded in reality but your motivation is still shining through. Many years from now, you will probably be practicing in a rural area and will be laughing about your naivety, but you will still be practicing in a rural area so kudos to you.
 
:laugh:Third world country??:laugh: Try again. I'm going to be working on US soil. In case you didn't realize this, there are millions of people in the US not getting healthcare. I'm not taking my skills out of this country. We need to worry about our own first.

Christ, you've stirred up a hornet's nest!

I think what the guy's doing is honorable. You might think you couldn't hack it, but that doesn't mean he can't. Furthermore, while he'll never be driving around in a rolls royce, he'll be able to do just fine for himself. If he opens shop in a rural area, he'll still be able to help people obtain Medicaid or S-CHIP, to charge traditional insurance, and even charge on a sliding scale for those who have no insurance. He'll do just fine.
 
I too find it difficult to believe that you are going to subject yourself to living in near-poverty after all of the struggles you go through to get through medical school and residency. But hey, if it's what you really want, go for it and prove us all wrong.
 
They seemed pretty impressed with the fact that I knew about all of these options. In fact, I told them about a time when I was working in a hospital and I pulled one of the doctors aside and told them to tell their patient about the free clinic because the doc was telling the patient to pay $1000+ out of pocket. Doesn't happen.

I tried coming up with some smartass sarcastic comment but I'm just laughing too hard. I could only imagine pulling the doctors aside that I shadowed during one of their examanations to say "Hey I think you're ripping the patient off"
 
Wow, I've seen a lot of cynicism in my life, but to find so much of it here on a site dedicated to aspiring doctors makes me sick. I had to take a step back and remind myself that most of you haters are probably just finishing up college, and haven't yet acquired some much needed perspective. Believe it or not, there are people out there who genuinely want to make a difference, who aren't motivated by money, and who believe that they have a moral obligation to be of service to the poor. Just because you have a vision for your own future medical career that doesn't involve this type of service, you don't need to scoff at others' idealism. It only shows your arrogance, ignorance, and insensitivity, all qualities I would hate to encounter in anyone treating me. I'm sure most of you have already read it, but I recommend "Mountains Beyond Mountains" to anyone who needs a jolt of inspiration.

BTW- I'm walking away from successful career and about to take on a massive amount of debt in order to pay for medical school, and I fully intend to dedicate my career to practicing global medicine. Money isn't everything.
 
Wow, I've seen a lot of cynicism in my life, but to find so much of it here on a site dedicated to aspiring doctors makes me sick. I had to take a step back and remind myself that most of you haters are probably just finishing up college, and haven't yet acquired some much needed perspective. Believe it or not, there are people out there who genuinely want to make a difference, who aren't motivated by money, and who believe that they have a moral obligation to be of service to the poor. Just because you have a vision for your own future medical career that doesn't involve this type of service, you don't need to scoff at others' idealism. It only shows your arrogance, ignorance, and insensitivity, all qualities I would hate to encounter in anyone treating me. I'm sure most of you have already read it, but I recommend "Mountains Beyond Mountains" to anyone who needs a jolt of inspiration.

BTW- I'm walking away from successful career and about to take on a massive amount of debt in order to pay for medical school, and I fully intend to dedicate my career to practicing global medicine. Money isn't everything.

I completely understand what you're saying regarding serving the underprivileged. One of the most rewarding experiences I've had as an undergrad has been volunteering at a homeless clinic in the downtown of my hometown. I love doing what I can to help these people as much as I can, and I fully intend to continue to volunteer my time as a doctor to serving that population.

However, wanting to also practice medicine in a traditional environment as my primary focus doesn't make me greedy or money-grubbing. It is completely reasonable for me to expect to be well-compensated for the years and years I spent with my head buried in books and accumulating debt while my friends were out getting jobs and moving up the corporate ladder. Again, I fully plan on being involved in giving as much of my time and resources as a service, but I don't plan on making it EVERYTHING in my practice.

If the OP really wants to spend their ENTIRE life practicing medicine in that fashion, great for him/her, I wish them all the best. But there are very few doctors who do this, so please excuse me for being skeptical about him/her possibly choosing to change when he/she realizes how much debt they have to pay off.
 
There is too much volatility in this thread and it goes well beyond its intended purpose (which I still don't know). The bottom line is that the OP has valid motivation to help in a rural area, albeit he/she may not know all the answers as to how to do that JUST YET. Few do before formal training and residency. There are no simple answers. On with the flame!
 
kiyomander said:
You'll be a terrible doctor, etc., etc.
You're right. There's nothing arrogant or ignorant about lecturing a doctor as a pre-med on his patients' treatment options or thinking you'll single-handedly beat the health care system into submission.
 
Wow, I've seen a lot of cynicism in my life, but to find so much of it here on a site dedicated to aspiring doctors makes me sick. I had to take a step back and remind myself that most of you haters are probably just finishing up college, and haven't yet acquired some much needed perspective. Believe it or not, there are people out there who genuinely want to make a difference, who aren't motivated by money, and who believe that they have a moral obligation to be of service to the poor. Just because you have a vision for your own future medical career that doesn't involve this type of service, you don't need to scoff at others' idealism. It only shows your arrogance, ignorance, and insensitivity, all qualities I would hate to encounter in anyone treating me. I'm sure most of you have already read it, but I recommend "Mountains Beyond Mountains" to anyone who needs a jolt of inspiration.

BTW- I'm walking away from successful career and about to take on a massive amount of debt in order to pay for medical school, and I fully intend to dedicate my career to practicing global medicine. Money isn't everything.
I've noticed that SDN is not a place to go for encouragement and, by that, perhaps it's just supposed to enable you to handle more cynicism and criticism, but I feel that if you don't prescribe to the very generic, four-year of undergrad, set number and type of ECs, go for the gold kind of plan in your future medical career, you get smacked down quite severely. I think the best doctors that are going to come out of this group of online commentators are going to be the ones that disagree with most of the suggestions available.
 
My apologies for coming off like I don't respect those of you who intend to pursue traditional courses of medicine. I also agree that the obstacles we have to overcome in order to become physicians are insane. Not only do we have to be academically worthy, have to spend hours volunteering and doing research, but we also have to shell out a small fortune to apply to and attend medical school. That is a problem and I totally get why doctors expect to be duly compensated.

I do not endorse all of the OP's opinions or actions. I simply get frustrated when in the name of providing a "reality check," idealism is crushed. I was merely reacting to the posts of the "if I was the interviewer I'd rip him/her a new one" nature, and then the comment about mud huts and half-naked people running around. I just got back from working in rural Africa where I did live in a mud-hut, so maybe I'm a bit sensitive. hahaha
 
I would assume that most people on this forum (with the exception of hSDN) know that medicine is not the way to go if you are just looking for a large paycheck. I think you need some perspective as well. I don't know where you are in regards to premed prereqs, however, if you have made it through the application process then you know how expensive and time-consuming it is. That is simply the beginning. It will only get worse. The OP has great ideas. Many premeds have great ideas: free healthcare/reduced healthcare, curing debilitating illnesses, going on to become world-renowned leaders in our chosen fields and advocates to our future patients. The fact is, after 4 years in college +/- loans, 4 years in medical school + $150,000 in loans, 3-7 years in residency, and knowing that when you get out people will ignore you, hate you, sue you, and think you make too much money in a time when reimbursements are declining, you are trying to pay off debts, raise a family, and medicine is overrun with numerous allied health care professionals climbing the corporate ladder, so to speak, the odds are high that we become somewhat cynical. Look at all of the threads in the Allopathic forum about med students who want to quit. Most cannot, because they are too far in debt to pursue another profession. The OP needs a reality check. In my limited shadowing experience, many physicians have told me to go into a specialty that pays well, works normal hours so I can have a family, and is low stress. Most of these physicians were the same as the OP. You can see for yourself that this is an extremely difficult road, and some would not go through it again. To suggest that someone will still have that starry-eyed premed mentality is almost completely ridiculous.

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

In particular, I'm somewhat offended with the idea that anyone would accuse me of being in medicine "strictly for the money." If I really wanted to get a high-paying job, I'd just go get an MBA from Chicago and climb the corporate ladder at some evil corporation. I DO genuinely, passionately want to help others and care for them; however, I'm realistic in that I know I need money to pay off debt, keep up with my malpractice insurance, have enough to raise a family, send my own kids off to college someday, etc... To suggest that a doctor is corrupt for wanting to make more than an average salary is patently ridiculous.

EDIT: After seeing the post above mine, I apologizing for this coming out as touchy and defensive. It's now clear that he/she never meant to offend anyone.
 
I've noticed that SDN is not a place to go for encouragement and, by that, perhaps it's just supposed to enable you to handle more cynicism and criticism, but I feel that if you don't prescribe to the very generic, four-year of undergrad, set number and type of ECs, go for the gold kind of plan in your future medical career, you get smacked down quite severely. I think the best doctors that are going to come out of this group of online commentators are going to be the ones that disagree with most of the suggestions available.
Honestly, I think the "problem" lies with the fact that most people who come here just plain don't know what they're doing or talking about. I was certainly guilty of that, myself, last cycle. When I found SDN in March, I got a heapin' helpin' of reality. Many pre-meds show up here thinking that they're in great shape with their grades and decent MCAT score and are all set up to save the world only to have someone come in and tell them that getting into med school with a 3.5/28 is going to be a serious challenge. What's more, emulating their primary care physician essentially obligates them to a life of comparatively low pay and long work hours despite having the same-ish amount of education as their medical peers.

Many - probably most - pre-meds don't know anywhere near as much about med school, let alone residencies and actually practicing medicine, as they'd like to think. For someone who's used to being on top of the world academically, being told that everything he knows is essentially wrong can be jarring. Melting away the pre-med idealism isn't always a smooth process, and the difficulty - for those doing the melting and the person getting melted - is fairly proportional to the amount of idealism. You don't like the idea that serving rural communities for free is going to stick you with a huge amount of work and a salary you could've gotten right out of high school? Well, tough. That's how it is. There's a reason primary care is decreasing rapidly in popularity.
 
There are quite a few programs that will support paying for a person's education such as the scholarship that Pianola mentioned. the problem is that if you decide with some real exposure to medicine from the frontlines that you don't want to do Rural medicine later on....

Well then too bad so sad!!! That's what will happen beause at that point those who paid for you expect a committment from you much the same way the military expects to be repaid with service.


So if you do something like that be sre you really will be happy in such a setting.

Another point: A lot of rural areas in America are sooooooooo desperate for doctors including specialists that they are willing to up the salary offers that cities are offerring. Katrina Firlik talked about this in her book "Another Day in the Frontal Lobe". She's a neurosurgeon in Greenwich, Conn. She however said she wouldn't give up a life not that far from NYC for the middle of nowhere where she'd be unhappy. That's what the issue is for a lot of people. It isn't the money offer in living in rural America. It is the thought of Well RURAL AMERICA!! If you are Indian or Asian or Middle Eastern muslims or Latino or any real measure of non white or non black American, but esp. non white American, then you know the kind of racism, the religious discrimination, the lack of open mindedness and ultra conservative atmosphere that can occur in some of these rural towns in America. And that's at the very extreme and just a few examples of what may happen and does happen in some of these places. At the less extreme is the issue of being in a place where there's not too much in terms of diversity of restaurants and places to hang out and cultural life. there's not much to do on a huge farm as there is in a big city. so alot of people are not fond of such a life. Its too serene for some people's tastes and not for everyone. That's why when the money is there people will still not go, leading to our disproportionate spread of doctors across the country.

I think what the OP wants to do is doable if he is making a sizeable income, which is possible if he works with a hospital that pays a good salary. Then he can put a portion of his salary into doing what he wants, esp. if he invests right. But this is only going to be possible if the debt load isn't too much to handle ie. he gets the scholarship. And if he gets such a scholarship, he needs to know that he is in for the long haul and be willing to really live in such an environment for a long time. Most people leave those kind of places and never look back. I know I'm def. one of those kind of people who could never go back to a small town after living in Tampa. At least, though, my town has grown and is no longer a true small town by any means compared to what I witnessed this past summer in Pennsylvania and what I've seen in North florida.
 
Honestly, I think the "problem" lies with the fact that most people who come here just plain don't know what they're doing or talking about. I was certainly guilty of that, myself, last cycle. When I found SDN in March, I got a heapin' helpin' of reality. Many pre-meds show up here thinking that they're in great shape with their grades and decent MCAT score and are all set up to save the world only to have someone come in and tell them that getting into med school with a 3.5/28 is going to be a serious challenge. What's more, emulating their primary care physician essentially obligates them to a life of comparatively low pay and long work hours despite having the same-ish amount of education as their medical peers.

Many - probably most - pre-meds don't know anywhere near as much about med school, let alone residencies and actually practicing medicine, as they'd like to think. For someone who's used to being on top of the world academically, being told that everything he knows is essentially wrong can be jarring. Melting away the pre-med idealism isn't always a smooth process, and the difficulty - for those doing the melting and the person getting melted - is fairly proportional to the amount of idealism. You don't like the idea that serving rural communities for free is going to stick you with a huge amount of work and a salary you could've gotten right out of high school? Well, tough. That's how it is. There's a reason primary care is decreasing rapidly in popularity.

Good post!!
 
Honestly, I think the "problem" lies with the fact that most people who come here just plain don't know what they're doing or talking about. I was certainly guilty of that, myself, last cycle. When I found SDN in March, I got a heapin' helpin' of reality. Many pre-meds show up here thinking that they're in great shape with their grades and decent MCAT score and are all set up to save the world only to have someone come in and tell them that getting into med school with a 3.5/28 is going to be a serious challenge. What's more, emulating their primary care physician essentially obligates them to a life of comparatively low pay and long work hours despite having the same-ish amount of education as their medical peers.

Many - probably most - pre-meds don't know anywhere near as much about med school, let alone residencies and actually practicing medicine, as they'd like to think. For someone who's used to being on top of the world academically, being told that everything he knows is essentially wrong can be jarring. Melting away the pre-med idealism isn't always a smooth process, and the difficulty - for those doing the melting and the person getting melted - is fairly proportional to the amount of idealism. You don't like the idea that serving rural communities for free is going to stick you with a huge amount of work and a salary you could've gotten right out of high school? Well, tough. That's how it is. There's a reason primary care is decreasing rapidly in popularity.
Agreed, however that's still no reason to try and make someone else conform to the same world view. At least there are still people who have this idealism. The study and practice of medicine has been built upon both the shoulders of the selfless and the selfish, and all of those in between. No, we may not have the in-depth knowledge that can only be acquired by actually being a medical student or a doctor, but we're trying, in our own ways.
 
A certain degree of cynicism is needed before anyone undertakes any career, especially medicine. However, at what point does a pre-med take on too much cynicism? Yes, I think the OP has said some things that highlight that he/she may not know the reality of rural medicine or medicine in general but he/she has still been accepted because the motivation is there. This motivation plus years of education and residency will present a physician that is much more grounded in reality and cognizant of the financial risks of starting a rural practice.
 
I would assume that most people on this forum (with the exception of hSDN) know that medicine is not the way to go if you are just looking for a large paycheck. I think you need some perspective as well. I don't know where you are in regards to premed prereqs, however, if you have made it through the application process then you know how expensive and time-consuming it is. That is simply the beginning. It will only get worse. The OP has great ideas. Many premeds have great ideas: free healthcare/reduced healthcare, curing debilitating illnesses, going on to become world-renowned leaders in our chosen fields and advocates to our future patients. The fact is, after 4 years in college +/- loans, 4 years in medical school + $150,000 in loans, 3-7 years in residency, and knowing that when you get out people will ignore you, hate you, sue you, and think you make too much money in a time when reimbursements are declining, you are trying to pay off debts, raise a family, and medicine is overrun with numerous allied health care professionals climbing the corporate ladder, so to speak, the odds are high that we become somewhat cynical. Look at all of the threads in the Allopathic forum about med students who want to quit. Most cannot, because they are too far in debt to pursue another profession. The OP needs a reality check. In my limited shadowing experience, many physicians have told me to go into a specialty that pays well, works normal hours so I can have a family, and is low stress. Most of these physicians were the same as the OP. You can see for yourself that this is an extremely difficult road, and some would not go through it again. To suggest that someone will still have that starry-eyed premed mentality is almost completely ridiculous.

Additionally, since you seem to share the OP's position, how do you plan to accomplish this?


I think that the OP should become a specialist but for a rural environment where he can make the big bucks and still work in a rural envt where the specialists are needed and then if he can afford it use some of it to help treat the poor on the side. That is sort of what an Indian doctor did when he went back to India. but he became a robotic heart surgeon so he was making a lot of money. He also had good business sense and worked his arse off for a few years before returning. he didn't just train, pick up, and go.
 
I don't think anyone here is trying to get the OP to conform. Hell, I hope he achieves his goals and lives as well as he hopes to. We need primary care physicians like crazy. It's hard to gauge intentions over a message board, but I'd wager most people are trying to make sure the OP is aware of how enormously strenuous this life he's looking to bring upon himself is.

This too:
However, wouldn't you like to find out now then years later when you are a burned out, shell of a doctor because you had visions of great things in medicine and then when you actually made it into medical school, you find out that your idea of what being a doctor is like is completely off base?
 
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