Am I just wasting my time?

[gunito]

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I am currently taking Chem II and I'm probably going to get a C. My grade is slightly above the class average. I feel like I'm wasting my time, especially because my gpa is merely a 2.5. I wanna go DO but I'm just really discouraged after getting a 63 on a test which i felt i know what I was doing (the class average is around 65 AND this is a community college). I understand the material, but the math is what's hurting me. That leads me to believe that i would struggle with physics as well. Should i retake chem or aim for a SMP? I would almost rather do an SMP and start in a year than wait 2-3 years for med school.

 

[jasin]

I am currently taking Chem II and I'm probably going to get a C. My grade is slightly above the class average. I feel like I'm wasting my time, especially because my gpa is merely a 2.5. I wanna go DO but I'm just really discouraged after getting a 63 on a test which i felt i know what I was doing (the class average is around 65 AND this is a community college). I understand the material, but the math is what's hurting me. That leads me to believe that i would struggle with physics as well. Should i retake chem or aim for a SMP? I would almost rather do an SMP and start in a year than wait 2-3 years for med school.

Your grades in the science classes matters more than you overall gpa. If you cannot get high grades in those classes then you probably are. btw, chemistry is never a waste of time, but you do need physics, biology, etc.. too.

 

[EdLongshanks]

I am currently taking Chem II and I'm probably going to get a C. My grade is slightly above the class average. I feel like I'm wasting my time, especially because my gpa is merely a 2.5. I wanna go DO but I'm just really discouraged after getting a 63 on a test which i felt i know what I was doing (the class average is around 65 AND this is a community college). I understand the material, but the math is what's hurting me. That leads me to believe that i would struggle with physics as well. Should i retake chem or aim for a SMP? I would almost rather do an SMP and start in a year than wait 2-3 years for med school.

You're not wasting your time because you can do other things with these classes. But you are very unlikely to get into medical school. Now, if you have a good story to go along with these grades, if you are getting a C because you are currently recovering in the hospital with skin graft surgery from burns you sustained while saving children from a burning orphanage. Then by all means continue.

You say that you have a 2.5, if this is from 1 semester, then you might be able to recover. But if you have 30-40 hours with these kind of grades, then you need to reconsider your goals. There are many things that you can do with a college degree. You can teach. You can do a business degree.

Another way you might go about this is to retrench. After this semester, take a break. For example, you could join the army and be a medic for a while, then you can come back with more maturity and have a story to back up your vastly improved grades. This is the only reasonably good chance that I can see for you to become a physician.

 

[gunito]

You're not wasting your time because you can do other things with these classes. But you are very unlikely to get into medical school. Now, if you have a good story to go along with these grades, if you are getting a C because you are currently recovering in the hospital with skin graft surgery from burns you sustained while saving children from a burning orphanage. Then by all means continue.

You say that you have a 2.5, if this is from 1 semester, then you might be able to recover. But if you have 30-40 hours with these kind of grades, then you need to reconsider your goals. There are many things that you can do with a college degree. You can teach. You can do a business degree.

Another way you might go about this is to retrench. After this semester, take a break. For example, you could join the army and be a medic for a while, then you can come back with more maturity and have a story to back up your vastly improved grades. This is the only reasonably good chance that I can see for you to become a physician.

I forgot to mention that this is my post bac. I've pulled my gpa from a 2.2 to 2.5 and this is only one semester.

 

[jasin]

You're not wasting your time because you can do other things with these classes. But you are very unlikely to get into medical school. Now, if you have a good story to go along with these grades, if you are getting a C because you are currently recovering in the hospital with skin graft surgery from burns you sustained while saving children from a burning orphanage. Then by all means continue.

You say that you have a 2.5, if this is from 1 semester, then you might be able to recover. But if you have 30-40 hours with these kind of grades, then you need to reconsider your goals. There are many things that you can do with a college degree. You can teach. You can do a business degree.

Another way you might go about this is to retrench. After this semester, take a break. For example, you could join the army and be a medic for a while, then you can come back with more maturity and have a story to back up your vastly improved grades. This is the only reasonably good chance that I can see for you to become a physician.

Telling him its unlikely he'll get into medical school, even if its true, is not helpful.

 

[jasin]

I forgot to mention that this is my post bac. I've pulled my gpa from a 2.2 to 2.5 and this is only one semester.

Never let anyone tell you can't do something. If you want to be a doctor, if that's your #1 absolute goal in this world, than do it.

 

[sgtbrushes]

Telling him its unlikely he'll get into medical school, even if its true, is not helpful.

I will respectfully disagree. He came to this board seeking an honest opinion. While the question concerned wasting time, the underlying concern was, "Can I become a doctor?"

That being said, if your 2.5 GPA is a result of four years of disciplined hard work, then yes, you may want to look into other opportunities. If you didn't try to get a good GPA, then you should probably be able to raise it quite a bit by putting in the effort now.

Don't worry about getting 1 C in 1 class. You could have a bad professor, have something bad in your personal life, whatever. If you receive grades less than Bs on a regular basis, you may have bad study habits or other larger issues that could make a medical school acceptance difficult.

In addition, if your cumulative GPA of 2.5 is over the course of 120 credits, an additional 120 credits with straight A's raises your GPA to 3.25... so even for D.O., you've got a couple years of grade repairs ahead of you.

 

[akinetopsia]

Being a Pollyanna isn't helpful either.

"You can do anything you put your mind to!" OR "Anything is possible, don't let anyone tell you otherwise!" isn't always appropriate.

With a 2.5, you have a long climb ahead of you. Is it possible to get accepted into medical school with a 2.5? Yes. Is it likely for the average applicant? No.

Bear in mind for M.D. schools, the standards seemingly keep going up. I think the average matriculant has something like a 3.6-3.7 cGPA and a 30-31 MCAT now? They probably also have well-rounded applications (good clinical exposure/experience, good ECs, demonstrated commitment to service, etc.) in addition to the "numbers."

It sounds like you have a lot of hours taken, but congratulations on pulling up the 2.2 to 2.5. Your best bet is to figure out why you're scoring around the class average or below it, seek out tutoring services if you're able, and figure out the best way for you to study. There aren't any shortcuts to do well in the prerequisite classes, you have to read, and retain information. For some classes doing practice problems reinforces the concepts (particularly true in physics & chemistry, especially organic).

The things that will best work in your favor is if there is a break in between your transcript's history of doing poorly and more recent stellar grades, like the 2.2 was a handful of years ago, and more recently you've been getting a 3.8 to a 4.0 and especially in your science GPA. You need to demonstrate the student you are now is not the same as the student you were when you were making that 2.2. That will give you a sliver of hope, as some schools do look at the trends and how you've done in your most recent work, and others will automatically screen you out at a 2.5 cGPA. The other thing that will help is getting the rest of your app in order, probably trying to go above and beyond what most applicants do, and kill the MCAT. There's no substitute for a low cGPA and a high MCAT won't mitigate that damage but it won't be another black mark against your application. Good luck.

 

[gunito]

I'm not going to apply with a 2.5 so i dont know why that was even said. DO schools replace old grades with new grades, so that would help me out. I'm sure many people have been accepted with 3.0 gpa. I know I can do it. If i was dumb, i wouldnt try to become a doctor.

 

[CookDeRosa]

I am currently taking Chem II and I'm probably going to get a C. My grade is slightly above the class average. I feel like I'm wasting my time, especially because my gpa is merely a 2.5. I wanna go DO but I'm just really discouraged after getting a 63 on a test which i felt i know what I was doing (the class average is around 65 AND this is a community college). I understand the material, but the math is what's hurting me. That leads me to believe that i would struggle with physics as well. Should i retake chem or aim for a SMP? I would almost rather do an SMP and start in a year than wait 2-3 years for med school.

>>

First know that it generally doesn't take too much time or effort to talk yourself out of something if that's your goal.

You can succeed or fail, but at least those are real things. You're asking total strangers to predict your success for you. If you don't believe in yourself, you won't make it. That's a fact.

 

[Mbeas]

I will respectfully disagree. He came to this board seeking an honest opinion. While the question concerned wasting time, the underlying concern was, "Can I become a doctor?"

That being said, if your 2.5 GPA is a result of four years of disciplined hard work, then yes, you may want to look into other opportunities. If you didn't try to get a good GPA, then you should probably be able to raise it quite a bit by putting in the effort now.

Don't worry about getting 1 C in 1 class. You could have a bad professor, have something bad in your personal life, whatever. If you receive grades less than Bs on a regular basis, you may have bad study habits or other larger issues that could make a medical school acceptance difficult.

In addition, if your cumulative GPA of 2.5 is over the course of 120 credits, an additional 120 credits with straight A's raises your GPA to 3.25... so even for D.O., you've got a couple years of grade repairs ahead of you.

👍

 

[TriagePreMed]

This will seem hurtful, but yes, you are wasting your time. It sounds like you're taking classes you can't handle and not dropping them when you start seeing that's the case. I strongly suggest you take a look at yourself and see why you're getting these grades. If you're lazy, stop being lazy or give up. Honestly, you already know deep down inside which one it is.

Community College is a great opportunity for you to get good grades while not being obligated to take many classes. If you're like the average student (under 21), it matters very little if your bachelor takes 6 years to complete as long as you get good grades and do other things with your life that are productive (volunteer/work).

 

[jasin]

I will respectfully disagree. He came to this board seeking an honest opinion. While the question concerned wasting time, the underlying concern was, "Can I become a doctor?"

That being said, if your 2.5 GPA is a result of four years of disciplined hard work, then yes, you may want to look into other opportunities. If you didn't try to get a good GPA, then you should probably be able to raise it quite a bit by putting in the effort now.

Don't worry about getting 1 C in 1 class. You could have a bad professor, have something bad in your personal life, whatever. If you receive grades less than Bs on a regular basis, you may have bad study habits or other larger issues that could make a medical school acceptance difficult.

In addition, if your cumulative GPA of 2.5 is over the course of 120 credits, an additional 120 credits with straight A's raises your GPA to 3.25... so even for D.O., you've got a couple years of grade repairs ahead of you.

Just my opinion, but discouragement is never helpful. People need to know legit ways around things, ways to do things right to start with, etc.. not told they can't do it or its not possible.

 

[sgtbrushes]

Just my opinion, but discouragement is never helpful. People need to know legit ways around things, ways to do things right to start with, etc.. not told they can't do it or its not possible.

I really resisted the urge to even dignify this with another response, but alas, I have no will power. He specifically asked a group of strangers on the internet if we thought he was wasting his time. I tactfully told him that yes, if he continues to get Cs in prerequisite courses, then perhaps he should look at other goals, but I also assured him that he shouldn't be too stressed about a single C. In addition, I gave him constructive advice on how to pursue his goal if wants to do so.

Best of luck, gunito.

 

[Neurocentric]

Just my opinion, but discouragement is never helpful. People need to know legit ways around things, ways to do things right to start with, etc.. not told they can't do it or its not possible.

Encouraging someone is great, but when it comes to things like this, you cannot sugarcoat. He asked for honest opinions, and he got them. Realistically, if the grades do not change, medical school will not really be an option. This isn't anyone being mean, this is the truth. The OP has a long road ahead of him, but if he really wants it, then he will do what he can. But he has to realize it isn't going to be easy.

 

[jasin]

I really resisted the urge to even dignify this with another response, but alas, I have no will power. He specifically asked a group of strangers on the internet if we thought he was wasting his time. I tactfully told him that yes, if he continues to get Cs in prerequisite courses, then perhaps he should look at other goals, but I also assured him that he shouldn't be too stressed about a single C. In addition, I gave him constructive advice on how to pursue his goal if wants to do so.

Best of luck, gunito.

Because he wanted an honest opinion. Yes, good luck gunito 🙂 Best of wishes to you in your future endeavors.

 

[jasin]

Encouraging someone is great, but when it comes to things like this, you cannot sugarcoat. He asked for honest opinions, and he got them. Realistically, if the grades do not change, medical school will not really be an option. This isn't anyone being mean, this is the truth. The OP has a long road ahead of him, but if he really wants it, then he will do what he can. But he has to realize it isn't going to be easy.

Honesty is good, but it does not need to be discouraging for it to be truthful or factual.

source:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/honesty

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honesty

 

[Neurocentric]

Honesty is good, but it does not need to be discouraging to be truthful or factual.

source:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/honesty

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honesty

..

You really went and referenced what honesty means?

Here's some honesty for you. SDN is going to chew you up and spit you out if you don't lighten up.

 

[TriagePreMed]

Just my opinion, but discouragement is never helpful. People need to know legit ways around things, ways to do things right to start with, etc.. not told they can't do it or its not possible.

Sometimes you need to be discouraged when the evidence points to inadequacy. The OP is wasting his time going to school, paying fees, etc. by getting C's on pre-reqs if his goal is medicine. He needs to take a hard look. If he's given it his all, time to change career goals. If he hasn't given it his all, he should start studying. If he knows deep inside he's lazy or incapable for some reason, it would be best for him to drop out or take less classes. He can come back and get his degree when he's much older and more mature. If, however, his goal is simply to have a degree to go to work, he can stay on the boat but realize he's not sailing toward medical school.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

I understand the OP's predicament. I feel similar. See my recent post regarding difficulty adjusting to school.

My current experience isn't very good either. I earned a C in general chemistry nine years ago, and I just retook the first part and made a B. Honestly, I think the wrong grade was typed into the computer system because the amount of points I earned didn't equate to a B, and I know the old C was a mercy grade because I should have flat out failed it nine years ago. I frankly didn't have a clue what I was doing nor do I now. Anything quantitative is difficult for me, be it math, accounting (another wash out), or chemistry and likely physics. I didn't go to chemistry nine years ago because I didn't understand the math component of it then either and walking away was easier emotionally. I slugged through it last month, but it was gut wrenching. I can feel the stress in a number of ways.

Now, I'm taking general chemistry II, the first test in this component is Thursday, and I've been trying to get caught up because I more or less have to teach myself everything. I can read the book and follow along with the examples, but when it comes time for me to read a word problem, select what formulas or whatever I'll be using, and place in the appropriate numbers I'm lost.

Frankly, I have little to no algebraic skills beyond 2x=4, what's x. This is frustrating because I'm not really bad at anything else, plus I miss working and being a contriubiting member of society. Perhaps the OP is in my situation, and I'm left wondering what I should do. I sacraficed my career on the assumption that I could do this.

When I first joined SDN I was often admonished about being unwilling to quit work and go back to school because as it was put to me I didn't appear dedicated enough. As time went by I began to think I could do this so I followed suit. Now, I'm deeply regretting this entire foolish venture.

 

[Armywife06]

ArkansasRanger, if you are having that much difficulty with these concepts and courses, what are you going to do about the MCAT. Have you taken it yet? What you are describing having trouble with is exactly how the MCAT is......
Have you thought about getting a tutor for these classes to help you understand the concepts better?

 

[ArkansasRanger]

ArkansasRanger, if you are having that much difficulty with these concepts and courses, what are you going to do about the MCAT. Have you taken it yet? What you are describing having trouble with is exactly how the MCAT is......
Have you thought about getting a tutor for these classes to help you understand the concepts better?

I put an ad out for a tutor on an area classified website that gets tons of visitation. No replies. MCAT? Beats me. I'll worry about that bridge when I come to it, and yes, I was already aware of that. I did prepare for the course by reading three supplemental texts including Chemistry for Dummies, General Chemistry I as a Second Language, and another Wiley publication called something like Teach Yourself Chemistry Concepts or something. I just can't cut the mustard I suppose.

This is embarassing because like I say I do well at everything else I do, and I feel like a total idiot in class. I take that back, I'm not John Travolta when it comes to dancing so I'm not good at that either.

 

[gunito]

The OP is wasting his time going to school, paying fees, etc. by getting C's on pre-reqs if his goal is medicine. He needs to take a hard look. If he's given it his all, time to change career goals. If he hasn't given it his all, he should start studying. If he knows deep inside he's lazy or incapable for some reason, it would be best for him to drop out or take less classes.

A C does not mean that I have no chance. Getting one C doesnt mean that Ill get all Cs. Im fully aware of what I am doing IF i was getting all Cs i would stop. Its one class.

I can read the book and follow along with the examples, but when it comes time for me to read a word problem, select what formulas or whatever I'll be using, and place in the appropriate numbers I'm lost.

I have the same problem. I've tried using key words and practicing questions, but on the test I get thrown a bunch of curves. Its hard to have practice questions that are different than test questions. I'm good at the same stuff you are, maybe Ill get some books too. I can give you some website with info and one with a list of lectures for different science classes. Just let me know.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

A C does not mean that I have no chance. Getting one C doesnt mean that Ill get all Cs. Im fully aware of what I am doing IF i was getting all Cs i would stop. Its one class.



I have the same problem. I've tried using key words and practicing questions, but on the test I get thrown a bunch of curves. Its hard to have practice questions that are different than test questions. I'm good at the same stuff you are, maybe Ill get some books too. I can give you some website with info and one with a list of lectures for different science classes. Just let me know.

I've got folders of information in my favorites section. The science was has some supplements I searched out for gen chem, o chem, and physics. We can swap if you like. I also have a few power points that I found from other teachers. One covers moles. That's how I learned about the mole concept.

 

[Armywife06]

I'm sorry if I sounded like I was being "mean". I really didn't mean to come off that way at all. Don't feel like an idiot, really. Chemistry gets ALOT of people. I'm a chemistry major, so it comes easy to me, but not to everyone. Does your school not have tutors or like supplementary instruction type thing??? I'm really sorry you are having such a hard time. I really didn't mean to sound the way it sounds now that I'm reading what I wrote. 🙁 Just keep trying, everything can be conquered eventually.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

I'm sorry if I sounded like I was being "mean". I really didn't mean to come off that way at all. Don't feel like an idiot, really. Chemistry gets ALOT of people. I'm a chemistry major, so it comes easy to me, but not to everyone. Does your school not have tutors or like supplementary instruction type thing??? I'm really sorry you are having such a hard time. I really didn't mean to sound the way it sounds now that I'm reading what I wrote. 🙁 Just keep trying, everything can be conquered eventually.

I just thought you were being frank which is a quality a lot of people lack. No worries. Sadly, in the summer there is no supplemental instruction. I'm going to keep slugging away for now. I've got too much invested not to. At least if I fail, I'll know I tried, lol. Equilibrium concentrations and acids/bases are the current chapters to be tested. I had no idea there was so much involved. Both chapters started out as cake, but then the equations hit. 😡

 

[Chevy Chase Fan]

When I first joined SDN I was often admonished about being unwilling to quit work and go back to school because as it was put to me I didn't appear dedicated enough. As time went by I began to think I could do this so I followed suit. Now, I'm deeply regretting this entire foolish venture.

So what are you gonna do? Throw in the towel? The way I read this you're looking for any excuse you can to go back to your job b/c you don't like being in class and want to get out before you fail a class and have to feel stupid about it.

I hope you stick it out man. You've given up a lot more than most people to pursue this. I think to live without regrets you need to go down with the ship, if it comes to that.

 

[Chevy Chase Fan]

Both chapters started out as cake, but then the equations hit. 😡

I don't really understand this. Generally these calculations are not all that complicated in a mathematical sense. Perhaps you don't understand the "cake" part of the chapter as well as you think? If you truly understand the broad concepts and have stored the terminology in memory, the equations should not be this difficult.

 

[TriagePreMed]

A C does not mean that I have no chance. Getting one C doesnt mean that Ill get all Cs. Im fully aware of what I am doing IF i was getting all Cs i would stop. Its one class.

Except its not a class. It's a 2.5 GPA.

 

[EdLongshanks]

Before we set ourselves out on this path we have to answer a question. Will I be a better doctor than the person I replace in medical school.

It is not all about academics, but some of it is. It would be unfortunate if, after scraping into medical school on pure determination, we flunk out because we simply don't have the academic ability to memorize the multitude of facts and concepts necessary. Remember that biochemistry is part of that med school curriculum. Can we really pass that class? We can't just think we can pass it, we must know it.

As much as we might wish it to be so, some of us aren't going to make it through this. If there is some doubt about it, then plan B should be an option.

On the other hand, neither plan A or B need be as dark as we think. Arkie, I'm a little concerned about how you are doing. You've gone through an incredible amount of stress recently. As an alpha male cop type, you are unlikely to have admitted that you may be in over your head emotionally. Don't make any rash decisions on your own. I doubt that your academics accurately reflect your ability and right now your emotions don't reflect reality.

 

[EdLongshanks]

Arkie, I'm a little concerned about how you are doing. You've gone through an incredible amount of stress recently. As an alpha male cop type, you are unlikely to have admitted that you may be in over your head emotionally .

Here's a path that might help you. You know that the cops usually have a local pastor or preacher that they trust to help the people who are on the edge. Go talk to that guy.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

So what are you gonna do? Throw in the towel? The way I read this you're looking for any excuse you can to go back to your job b/c you don't like being in class and want to get out before you fail a class and have to feel stupid about it.

I hope you stick it out man. You've given up a lot more than most people to pursue this. I think to live without regrets you need to go down with the ship, if it comes to that.

I'm not looking for an excuse. I'm just lamenting. I plan on sticking it out. Even if I got an F I'd at least know the ultimate outcome of it all.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

Before we set ourselves out on this path we have to answer a question. Will I be a better doctor than the person I replace in medical school.

It is not all about academics, but some of it is. It would be unfortunate if, after scraping into medical school on pure determination, we flunk out because we simply don't have the academic ability to memorize the multitude of facts and concepts necessary. Remember that biochemistry is part of that med school curriculum. Can we really pass that class? We can't just think we can pass it, we must know it.

As much as we might wish it to be so, some of us aren't going to make it through this. If there is some doubt about it, then plan B should be an option.

On the other hand, neither plan A or B need be as dark as we think. Arkie, I'm a little concerned about how you are doing. You've gone through an incredible amount of stress recently. As an alpha male cop type, you are unlikely to have admitted that you may be in over your head emotionally. Don't make any rash decisions on your own. I doubt that your academics accurately reflect your ability and right now your emotions don't reflect reality.

I've got a pretty good memory, can read and retain well, and thus I can memorize quite well. I am just mathematically ignorant. Anything beyond high school algebra I is more or less alien to me. I feel like if the situation was more bent in my favor I could do better or if I had more time to absorb the math I could do better.

 

[avatarftw]

Are you studying correctly? That is, pre-reading for lecture and reading the lecture notes soon (as in the same day) after class? Are you sleeping 8 hours a day, eating right, and exercising?

If you are doing all that you can, then maybe you can't do it.

However, there are countless people that have had rocky beginnings and then accomplished their goal. (get into dental school, medical school, pharmacy, whatever it is)

Good luck. You can do it if you want to. 🙂

I am currently taking Chem II and I'm probably going to get a C. My grade is slightly above the class average. I feel like I'm wasting my time, especially because my gpa is merely a 2.5. I wanna go DO but I'm just really discouraged after getting a 63 on a test which i felt i know what I was doing (the class average is around 65 AND this is a community college). I understand the material, but the math is what's hurting me. That leads me to believe that i would struggle with physics as well. Should i retake chem or aim for a SMP? I would almost rather do an SMP and start in a year than wait 2-3 years for med school.

 

[TFS]

A C does not mean that I have no chance. Getting one C doesnt mean that Ill get all Cs. Im fully aware of what I am doing IF i was getting all Cs i would stop. Its one class.

I have the same problem. I've tried using key words and practicing questions, but on the test I get thrown a bunch of curves. Its hard to have practice questions that are different than test questions. I'm good at the same stuff you are, maybe Ill get some books too. I can give you some website with info and one with a list of lectures for different science classes. Just let me know.

I don't know what classes you have taken already, but you will encounter this over and over again, especially on the MCAT. I'm guessing this is a post-bac class...in which case saying I only got one C doesn't fly anymore, especially at a CC. I personally don't think doing a SMP or retaking will make everything better unless you change something first, whatever that is. If you aren't good at the math, then get a tutor. You can't make excuses for yourself at this point.

 

[jasin]

..

You really went and referenced what honesty means?

Here's some honesty for you. SDN is going to chew you up and spit you out if you don't lighten up.

Sorry you don't like proof, facts, etc.. but I will not stop posting them when needed.

 

[Mr Karatepants]

I've got a pretty good memory, can read and retain well, and thus I can memorize quite well. I am just mathematically ignorant. Anything beyond high school algebra I is more or less alien to me. I feel like if the situation was more bent in my favor I could do better or if I had more time to absorb the math I could do better.

It may be impossible financially, but have you thought about trying to fit in some basic math classes? I would even go so far as to recommend taking bio and math only (maybe two of each?) for a semester or two. It may postpone your application to med school by a year, but if you're having trouble with gen chem math (which is minimal), physics is really going to kick your butt.

I understand the idea is unappealing, but it would be really unfortunate if all that was standing between you and a bunch of A's in your prereqs were a couple math concepts that you just needed to incorporate into your toolbox. I'm personally strong in math, coming from an theoretical engineering degree, and I find that the biochem/bio/chem stuff that confuses the hell out of other students, is a cakewalk for me - all because I can read and use equations just like any other language. You can do it too.

...As an older student, you could probably go from an Algebra I level of math to a pre-calc level of math in one year. Maybe even more...give it a thought.

 

[Neurocentric]

Sorry you don't like proof, facts, etc.. but I will not stop posting them when needed.

But that's the thing.. it WASN'T needed. I don't need a definition of the word "honesty". What I was trying to do is explaining that if you sugarcoat everything to the last word, then a person might think he has a chance that he really doesn't. This isn't like deciding whether or not you should buy tickets for a concert. This is medical school. He wanted to know if he was wasting his time, and wanted honesty. We gave him that. We told him exactly what his outlook was.

Being a cheerleader is not going to do anything. Yes, being supportive is great, but going through this whole Barney "You can do anything!" bull**** is not going to get anyone anywhere. If there is an issue, it has to be dealt with, not hidden under bubblegum and clichéd motivational statements.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

It may be impossible financially, but have you thought about trying to fit in some basic math classes? I would even go so far as to recommend taking bio and math only (maybe two of each?) for a semester or two. It may postpone your application to med school by a year, but if you're having trouble with gen chem math (which is minimal), physics is really going to kick your butt.

I understand the idea is unappealing, but it would be really unfortunate if all that was standing between you and a bunch of A's in your prereqs were a couple math concepts that you just needed to incorporate into your toolbox. I'm personally strong in math, coming from an theoretical engineering degree, and I find that the biochem/bio/chem stuff that confuses the hell out of other students, is a cakewalk for me - all because I can read and use equations just like any other language. You can do it too.

...As an older student, you could probably go from an Algebra I level of math to a pre-calc level of math in one year. Maybe even more...give it a thought.

This is probably the best course of action. I'll say that equations have not come into play at any point in my career since college other than perhaps the work-specific formulas with something like one variable missing which could be determined simply by asking a person their weight or something.

This past week two math terms have come up: quadratic equation which I recall hearing about although after looking at one I don't at all remember it and anti-logs which I can say with certainty that I have never heard of.

No excuses. I'm just out matched here, and I'm sitting and studying for a test thinking "I don't even know exactly what I'm supposed to do here" so I think the best course of action would be to drop. I knew math was going to come into play, but I never imagined it would be much beyond something like converting grams to moles or setting up a molarity problem. I now feel quite stupid and feel like there's a lot of egg on my face I can't wipe off. I never expected this, and I did everything I knew to do to prepare.

I've sat through chem classes reflecting on something fairly often . When I was a brand new rookie I took a guy to jail just because it seemed like the thing to do. We're empowered to use our discretion so I should have just sent him packing, but I knew the bond was small on his charge and figured with a hundred bucks he'd be cut loose, somebody would come get him, and the problem would be solved. What's the big deal right? A hundred dollars is something you could pay with one bill from your wallet or so I thought. We got to jail, and I told him he could get out with a hundred bucks. He sat down on a bench and laughed. He said something I'll never forget, "Man, when you ain't got nothin' a hundred bucks might as well be a million."

With chemistry I feel like what I'm missing here, the math know how that most people seem to readily have, is the hundred dollars standing in the way of me and freedom.

 

[Mr Karatepants]

This is probably the best course of action. I'll say that equations have not come into play at any point in my career since college other than perhaps the work-specific formulas with something like one variable missing which could be determined simply by asking a person their weight or something.

This past week two math terms have come up: quadratic equation which I recall hearing about although after looking at one I don't at all remember it and anti-logs which I can say with certainty that I have never heard of.

No excuses. I'm just out matched here, and I'm sitting and studying for a test thinking "I don't even know exactly what I'm supposed to do here" so I think the best course of action would be to drop. I knew math was going to come into play, but I never imagined it would be much beyond something like converting grams to moles or setting up a molarity problem. I now feel quite stupid and feel like there's a lot of egg on my face I can't wipe off. I never expected this, and I did everything I knew to do to prepare.

I've sat through chem classes reflecting on something fairly often . When I was a brand new rookie I took a guy to jail just because it seemed like the thing to do. We're empowered to use our discretion so I should have just sent him packing, but I knew the bond was small on his charge and figured with a hundred bucks he'd be cut loose, somebody would come get him, and the problem would be solved. What's the big deal right? A hundred dollars is something you could pay with one bill from your wallet or so I thought. We got to jail, and I told him he could get out with a hundred bucks. He sat down on a bench and laughed. He said something I'll never forget, "Man, when you ain't got nothin' a hundred bucks might as well be a million."

With chemistry I feel like what I'm missing here, the math know how that most people seem to readily have, is the hundred dollars standing in the way of me and freedom.

I would hesitate before dropping. Getting W's or F's, as you know, is a difficult thing to overcome - especially when it's in your post-bac, which is supposed to be your chance to make up for past indiscretions.

There are only a few math concepts you need for chemistry, and it's not impossible that you could learn them and pull through in your class. You just need to get on top of them right now. Find yourself a good tutor (this can be easier said than done) and have them walk you through how to solve quadratics and log problems.

A bad tutor will simply show you the equations and how to use them. A good one should teach you what a 2nd order polynomial is, why it is significant, why we need a special way to solve for them, where the solution comes from, and three different techniques for getting the answer. (There are at least that many, with the quadratic equation being the most annoying to use).

Similarly, he or she should explain what logarithmic means, explain its connection to exponentials, make you thoroughly comfortable with the basic rules of exponents and logs, and then show you tricks to solve log problems.

For both types, they should be able to help you with your existing problems but more importantly, create dozens or hundreds of pure log/polynomial/exponent problems for you to practice on until it's something you just do, without any difficulty. Then, you can focus on the science and not the math.

 

[MCAT guy]

I would hesitate before dropping. Getting W's or F's, as you know, is a difficult thing to overcome - especially when it's in your post-bac, which is supposed to be your chance to make up for past indiscretions.

There are only a few math concepts you need for chemistry, and it's not impossible that you could learn them and pull through in your class. You just need to get on top of them right now. Find yourself a good tutor (this can be easier said than done) and have them walk you through how to solve quadratics and log problems.

A bad tutor will simply show you the equations and how to use them. A good one should teach you what a 2nd order polynomial is, why it is significant, why we need a special way to solve for them, where the solution comes from, and three different techniques for getting the answer. (There are at least that many, with the quadratic equation being the most annoying to use).

Similarly, he or she should explain what logarithmic means, explain its connection to exponentials, make you thoroughly comfortable with the basic rules of exponents and logs, and then show you tricks to solve log problems.

For both types, they should be able to help you with your existing problems but more importantly, create dozens or hundreds of pure log/polynomial/exponent problems for you to practice on until it's something you just do, without any difficulty. Then, you can focus on the science and not the math.

for those that are struggling, there is this one course website called cramster that is really good if they have solutions to your book, they work out all the problems.

Realize you will be able to get an A if you do all the problems in the back of your book (not all the ones assigned, all of them) and if you go to sites like cramster or www.khanacademy.com or *********** (website for instruction). There are so many resources now, you just need to use them all and do all the problems, maybe even do them twice.

If you have a horrible teacher and they don't teach well but test hard, then only the naturally smart or those that do extra work will get A's. So be the one that learns on your own and does the extra work.

 

[MCAT guy]

This is probably the best course of action. I'll say that equations have not come into play at any point in my career since college other than perhaps the work-specific formulas with something like one variable missing which could be determined simply by asking a person their weight or something.

This past week two math terms have come up: quadratic equation which I recall hearing about although after looking at one I don't at all remember it and anti-logs which I can say with certainty that I have never heard of.

No excuses. I'm just out matched here, and I'm sitting and studying for a test thinking "I don't even know exactly what I'm supposed to do here" so I think the best course of action would be to drop. I knew math was going to come into play, but I never imagined it would be much beyond something like converting grams to moles or setting up a molarity problem. I now feel quite stupid and feel like there's a lot of egg on my face I can't wipe off. I never expected this, and I did everything I knew to do to prepare.

I've sat through chem classes reflecting on something fairly often . When I was a brand new rookie I took a guy to jail just because it seemed like the thing to do. We're empowered to use our discretion so I should have just sent him packing, but I knew the bond was small on his charge and figured with a hundred bucks he'd be cut loose, somebody would come get him, and the problem would be solved. What's the big deal right? A hundred dollars is something you could pay with one bill from your wallet or so I thought. We got to jail, and I told him he could get out with a hundred bucks. He sat down on a bench and laughed. He said something I'll never forget, "Man, when you ain't got nothin' a hundred bucks might as well be a million."

With chemistry I feel like what I'm missing here, the math know how that most people seem to readily have, is the hundred dollars standing in the way of me and freedom.

math is just a skill. Maybe you should take a few math classes or go to khanacademy and work all the math. You are just out of math practice, while people are taking algebra/calculus/etc, they will naturally have more practice.

 

[akinetopsia]

AR, I think you know what you have to do. If you can get up to speed in math via retaking a course or taking an additional one before pursuing physics it would be really helpful. You're only going to run into more stuff that sounds vaguely familiar that you may not understand how to manipulate to get at the answer.

I was in the same situation when I went back to take physics. I took algebra-based because I hadn't had calculus in 10 years and figured no big deal, I should be fine, right?

The first day of recitation we had a diagnostic self-assessment quiz we took and scored for ourselves in class, they recommended if we got less than 75% right that we talk to the instructor, and see about shoring up our weaknesses. For me, it was the trigonometry and stuff like quadratic equations/simultaneous equations. I spent a good week or two on my own with Schaum's outlines for algebra & trig even though I'd taken calculus (and gotten a B+) ten years before. The trig stuff came back pretty quick and I've had to say the review helped tremendously with physics. YMMV of course, especially if it's been such a long time since you took a math course, but I think I was in the same boat. I don't think I'm a big math person, my degree was in government.

Until you're up to speed on the math though, attempting physics is going to be like trying to run a race blindfolded without a guide, over rough terrain, and with no shoes. Does that sound about right? It sounds pretty impossible to me, but something you can fix. Another important thing is changing your way of thinking, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy if you think you suck at something, or you'll never understand it, you'll probably end up sucking at it and never understanding it.

I know this is a massive derail but good luck.

 

[akinetopsia]

for those that are struggling, there is this one course website called cramster that is really good if they have solutions to your book, they work out all the problems.

Realize you will be able to get an A if you do all the problems in the back of your book (not all the ones assigned, all of them) and if you go to sites like cramster or www.khanacademy.com or *********** (website for instruction). There are so many resources now, you just need to use them all and do all the problems, maybe even do them twice.

If you have a horrible teacher and they don't teach well but test hard, then only the naturally smart or those that do extra work will get A's. So be the one that learns on your own and does the extra work.

Solutions manuals are good and all but there are often mistakes in the solutions (I noticed this because one of my lab partners downloaded the pdf off a torrent client, and sometimes the mistake was as simple as inverting a sign from positive to negative and vice versa), and it is usually a dead giveaway that you're using them when you solve problems in the exact same way that the solutions manual writer did when you get quizzed or tested.

I think they're useful to check your work, but you shouldn't "teach" yourself how to solve problems by reading the solutions. I don't think that is a very helpful approach. At best, you'll be good at mimicking the solutions but you really won't understand what you're doing, it's more like following a template.

 

[gunito]

for those that are struggling, there is this one course website called cramster that is really good if they have solutions to your book, they work out all the problems.

Realize you will be able to get an A if you do all the problems in the back of your book (not all the ones assigned, all of them) and if you go to sites like cramster or www.khanacademy.com or *********** (website for instruction). There are so many resources now, you just need to use them all and do all the problems, maybe even do them twice.

If you have a horrible teacher and they don't teach well but test hard, then only the naturally smart or those that do extra work will get A's. So be the one that learns on your own and does the extra work.

I do all the problems in the back then I get sideswiped on the test with questions that are completely different. I've had test where there are questions from material that we haven't covered yet. Our book doesnt cover a lot of topics, which I didnt realize until i took a test that I started preparing 3 weeks prior to; of course there was stuff that the book mentioned, but didnt explain, nor was it in the notes. This happens multiple times, but oh well.

I also think its interesting how 50% say i should quit cause im not smart enough or in over my head because of a C in a post bacc which will be composed of 90 credits because my ugpa is 2.5. While other people say its not a big deal and i can do it if i put my mind to it. Fortunately for me, i still have a shot.

 

[glamqueen]

I do all the problems in the back then I get sideswiped on the test with questions that are completely different. I've had test where there are questions from material that we haven't covered yet. Our book doesnt cover a lot of topics, which I didnt realize until i took a test that I started preparing 3 weeks prior to; of course there was stuff that the book mentioned, but didnt explain, nor was it in the notes. This happens multiple times, but oh well.

I also think its interesting how 50% say i should quit cause im not smart enough or in over my head because of a C in a post bacc which will be composed of 90 credits because my ugpa is 2.5. While other people say its not a big deal and i can do it if i put my mind to it. Fortunately for me, i still have a shot.

This is why you should not make major life decisions solely based on polling people on an internet message board site. I think you got some valuable advice, though. I think the most valuable thing you can do is look at the stats for people accepted to med school on the aamc website for different GPAs and MCAT scores. That will tell you what you need to have to have a reasonably good chance of gaining entrance. And of course only you can decide what is worth pursuing still or not. Good luck.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

for those that are struggling, there is this one course website called cramster that is really good if they have solutions to your book, they work out all the problems.

Realize you will be able to get an A if you do all the problems in the back of your book (not all the ones assigned, all of them) and if you go to sites like cramster or www.khanacademy.com or *********** (website for instruction). There are so many resources now, you just need to use them all and do all the problems, maybe even do them twice.

If you have a horrible teacher and they don't teach well but test hard, then only the naturally smart or those that do extra work will get A's. So be the one that learns on your own and does the extra work.

I've been doing problems out of the back of the book.

 

[DoctorHoo]

I am currently taking Chem II and I'm probably going to get a C. My grade is slightly above the class average. I feel like I'm wasting my time, especially because my gpa is merely a 2.5. I wanna go DO but I'm just really discouraged after getting a 63 on a test which i felt i know what I was doing (the class average is around 65 AND this is a community college). I understand the material, but the math is what's hurting me. That leads me to believe that i would struggle with physics as well. Should i retake chem or aim for a SMP? I would almost rather do an SMP and start in a year than wait 2-3 years for med school.

gunito,

I'm sorry to hear about your troubles. Are you wasting your time? It depends. Do you think you'll regret not having tried?

Have you considered putting science on the back burner for now and just going back and taking math courses up through Calculus? You mentioned that the math is difficult for you. Science and math are cumulative so it's tough to move onto another concept if you're still shaky on the current one. I know as it's not my best subject either. I hired a math tutor this summer to help me with just this and so far I'm finding it really suits my learning style. Perhaps that will help you too to have a better footing in math.

GPA repair is a very, very long process, I wish you the best of luck if you decide to embark on it.

 

[Chevy Chase Fan]

I've been doing problems out of the back of the book.

so how'd the test go today? any better than the others?

 

[ArkansasRanger]

so how'd the test go today? any better than the others?

lol may as well have been reading chinese