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Anyone else feel like they're not getting anything out of UNDERGRAD?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by axp107, Mar 27, 2007.

  1. axp107

    axp107 UCLA 09': Italian Pryde 2+ Year Member

    Dec 25, 2006
    Phoenix, AZ
    I feel undergrad is useless. You take a bunch of classes just to get As in them... especially the premed classes. Grades are not a problem; I work hard and I earn my As.

    I live for the moment. I study hard for tests, get As .. and that's it. Half of them have barely anything to do with medicine. How is learning molecular biology even going to be useful later on in life. I know current doctors that don't even remember this knowledge from their undergrad years.

    I just work like a dog for grades, not to enjoy my classes, nothing but the grades.. this whole premed competition attitude has left me with nothing but a good GPA. I'm wary of joining clubs and social activities so they don't get in the way of my "studying time."

    It seems the whole medical school application process is to just pick out the hardworking students especially since the classes we take are so useless. It seems like its basically, "Alright.. you took a buncha classes, did well, u can handle the work." That's it.

    I understand there needs to be a system to weed out slackers and such.. but does anyone else feel the way I do?
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  3. TPROrgoTutor2

    TPROrgoTutor2 2+ Year Member

    Dec 17, 2006
    There are hoops and we have to jump through them.
  4. sejin8642

    sejin8642 5+ Year Member

    Oct 18, 2006
    That's a very understandable idea. But your theory applies to not only medicine, but also pretty much every education. In high school, we study math, english, science, social studies, and many other electives that most of jobs in our society do not necessarily need.
  5. Marquis_Phoenix

    Marquis_Phoenix Junior Member 2+ Year Member

    May 6, 2006
    Molecular biology, particularly genomics/genetics, is the basis for future advances in medicine? Whether it be diagnostics, gene therapy, etc.

    Perhaps you ought to improve your time management skills?

    No ****? But that doesn't mean you can't take classes that are "useful" as part of your electives.

    While I sympathize with your sentiments, your arguments aren't particularly compelling.
  6. SuaveMD11


    Mar 14, 2007
    I say enjoy undergrad cuz theyll be the easiest academic years of your life!
  7. Vano

    Vano 7+ Year Member

    Feb 26, 2007
    I absolutely disagree with your opinion but both you and I are entitled to have one. I don't like one-dimensional people, well-rounded is much better that is one of the reasons they make you take all those courses in HS and college, otherwise you're a robot programmed to knowing things relevant to performing your task and nothing else. Yes, you don't have to take courses to be interested in a variety of subjects but simple lack of exposure to them may preclude you from discovering their strong and weak points. By the way, you don't have to take molecular biology and quantitative analysis and biochemistry to be a pre-med. You can pursue just about any major or field you want, most schools' requirements don't go far beyond 1yr of bio, 1yr of physics, 2 yrs of chem and maybe a 1yr of calc. So go ahead pursue history or theatre or sociology or whatever else you're interested in--with those majors you will have time to fulfill pre-med reqs and maybe have a little more time for clubs and parties.
  8. Marquis_Phoenix

    Marquis_Phoenix Junior Member 2+ Year Member

    May 6, 2006
    It's this type of attitude that is driving the US down the hole in terms of global competitiveness. "Our society does not necessarily need" if our society has no desire to increase its competitiveness globally (i.e. outsourcing).

    It also ignores the fact that living in a democracy, we rely on the judgment of these many people with jobs that don't necessitate such electives. If we hope for any glimmer of hope that the direction and resources of our society can be guided in a somewhat rational way... I think it's rather important?
  9. ronehh

    ronehh in the original position 7+ Year Member

    Jun 17, 2006
    go out and get wasted man! get away from school every other week then come back to it.
  10. baylormed

    baylormed On the Search 5+ Year Member

    Dec 4, 2005
    Right behind you
    I agree with you in some respects.

    I do feel like a lot of the things I learn are useless in the long-run, but I do not feel like they are completely irrelevant to my education. In the end, even if don't remember anything of what I was taught, I was given the opportunity to learn new ways of thinkings, new theories, and problem-solving skills that will probably stay in my subconscious throughout my life (even if I don't realize it).

    I think it is easy to underestimate the value of an education when, at least nowadays, a lot of majors are not really focused towards any particular career track (unless you count education/business/engineering, which are professions onto themselves).
  11. sejin8642

    sejin8642 5+ Year Member

    Oct 18, 2006
    I also agree with your opinion but you misinterpreted my point. I mean that informations that we study in high school are mostly not necessary for most of jobs in our society (we don't need to know sine, cosine, tangent for simple calculation:) )
  12. dantt

    dantt Member 10+ Year Member

    Jun 28, 2006
    It is definitely possible to have fun in college and do well too. A quality many schools look for in potential physicians is "love of learning." Your attitudes about "studying time" suggest you will have a miserable experience in medical school.
  13. TMP-SMX

    TMP-SMX Senior Member Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    Jun 12, 2006
    Agreed. It's no wonder many jobs here are being replaced by overseas workers. Half of the people with a BS (literally) in this country cannot write if their lives depended on it. Many also lack necessary knowledge of geography or multiple ways of understanding the sides of an argument. So many people have to get a masters since they didn't learn anything in undergrad.
  14. Steve203

    Steve203 5+ Year Member

    Jan 26, 2006
    This post is kinda sad....I felt that undergrad was one of the best times of my life...I worked 40 hours a week and got OK grades and still found time to party.

    Go to some badass parties and get totally wasted man and then hook up with some hot chicks. I're in college for crying out loud....if you don't do all that stuff during undergrad then when are you gonna do it?
  15. dutchman

    dutchman 7+ Year Member

    Sep 5, 2006
    This is why you should have majored in something you like as opposed to what sounds good for premed. Every last one of my engineering classes are of value to me.
  16. JohnMadden

    JohnMadden Political Refugee 2+ Year Member

    Jan 11, 2007
    If the total value of your undergraduate experience is based solely upon doing gaining admission to medical school, then that's tragic.
  17. ph8

    ph8 the game is afoot... Physician 10+ Year Member

    Apr 27, 2006
    Oh hell yeah. Showing up for the first week of class hung over each day, your "weekend" starting on thursday night every week, having beer-ios for breakfast, etc. Ah, the memories and unexplainable events that come to mind. Undergrad would have been really boring without those "study breaks".
  18. Guest user

    Guest user Banned Banned

    Mar 1, 2007
    Hell yeah, schools a waste of money and time. I could and would learn everything and much much more in 1/4 or less of the time. This is true all the way back (primary/secondary) as well as college. It's ashame the system is so ****ed up. If it were not for the socialization process, I would prefer home schooling straight through.

    -I dident read the post above untill i replied but i dident pose off his start just a coincidence
  19. Critical Mass

    Critical Mass Guest

    Feb 23, 2007
    You will feel much more strongly about your position once you've actually tried to drink from the med school fire hose. You'll be like WTF? Couldn't they have made us know this crap for the MCAT instead of the Williamson ether synthesis? M1 feels just like what lay people think the term "pre med" means!
  20. Kraazy

    Kraazy 7+ Year Member

    Feb 17, 2007
    Word. Dude, seriously, you should (1) do more things that you like for the heck of it; it makes us human (2) find something enjoyable about the things you have to do. Realize that real life (post-undergrad) will be even more demanding in requiring you to do things that you do not necessarily want to do. You will always have to find ways to get some kind of personal satisfaction out of these obligations, or you will be as miserable after your undergrad as you seem to be now.

    Personally, I loved college--I loved my classes and I feel like I could have taken a bunch more if I had had more time. And of course the social experience of college is unparalleled.
  21. Guest user

    Guest user Banned Banned

    Mar 1, 2007
    I truley love learning, but i feel like most of what is tested is just memorizing useless ****. (at my current school, not true of others i have attended in the past) I get and have gotten my real education from reading on my own. To hell with trying to memorize some **** for my professor. I can and will continue to do this **** just to get the grades but i wish i could just teach myself on my own pace and teach myself what i want to learn not the politally correct version. I like England university style alot more because there is alot more freedom and realy are fewer "american style classes"
  22. omegaxx

    omegaxx New Member 5+ Year Member

    May 20, 2006
    Boston, MA
    :thumbup: You get out what you've put in. I've put in a lot (in classes, in student activities, and in community involvements) and undergrad has been a blast. It's definitely the best 5 years of my life.
  23. schooltill30

    schooltill30 Doctor Acula 2+ Year Member

    Mar 15, 2007
    Even though premed classes may be useless in the future, taking them and getting good grades helps to develop your ability to apply yourself. Even if it's something you don't necessarily find interesting or useful, you're showing that when there is a choice to give up and fun, you just keep on pluggin'. Sadly, most undergrads don't have this kind of work ethic. Premed requires to go through an inordinate amount of time making sure your grades are as good as they can be. While it may seem useless, it's giving you skills you never would have had as an English major.

    That said, you still definitely need to take a break once in a while (you know, every other year or so :)). Look at it this way: If you don't take a break, your grades will suffer. How do you like them apples???
  24. BleepTastic

    BleepTastic Throbbing Member 5+ Year Member

    Oct 1, 2006
    New York
    What a sad post. I enjoyed college so much and I feel like I evolved as a person during that time. I cultivated my interests, learned to fight for my beliefs and got a great education, even if I didn't get A's. Taking pre-med classes just to get the A's that get you into med school would just turn you into an automoton. Where's the emotional and intellectual growth? Alas, such an attitude could probably get you into Harvard, whereas I will probably be cleaning your office after 8pm. Oh wellz.
  25. Exactly. I actually happen to really enjoy my undergraduate studies for the most part, but then again I am a curious person by nature. Anyone who doesn't see a point in a broad base of education and knowledge needs to be pulled out of college and reassigned to patching potholes, picking up roadkill or mowing medians on the interstate. It also might be a good idea to not allow them to vote either, as to prevent a recurrence of the current fiascoes brought about by allowing uneducated and close minded morons without a grasp on current affairs to vote.
  26. stixx

    stixx 5+ Year Member

    Nov 27, 2006
    Maybe you shouldn't have done a premed major? :rolleyes:

    Maybe you shouldn't have been a typically social inept premed? :rolleyes:

    Tons of people take interesting yet challenging classes, get As in them because they (shocking!) enjoy them, and party a lot too. . .
  27. bumpintahoe

    bumpintahoe 2+ Year Member

    Mar 26, 2007
    This is why I majored in Chemical and Biomolecular Engineering. Sure I could've been a Biology major and aced everything while partying 4 nights a week, but when I was done I wouldn't feel like I had accomplished anything. I consider maintaining a decent GPA in engineering an accomplishment and eventhough it sucked sometimes I'm glad I did it.
  28. KaraKiz

    KaraKiz I'm Ron Burgundy? 7+ Year Member

    Nov 8, 2006
    Yes, a lot of pre-meds feel the way you do. It is really stressful. Maybe it seems like we are all not taking the issue seriously and making a lot of jokes, but to be honest, that stress was nothing compared to actually going through the application cycle, which will in turn be a piece of cake compared to first year (and all the rest, which I have no experience with, so I'm not going to act like I "know" how hard that is actually going to be - I just expect that it will be somewhat short of "unbearable" and no where near "pleasant".)

    It ALL sucks A LOT. Taking the MCAT sucks. Applying sucks. Med school is hard. You are going to have to put up with a lot more BS than crappy pre-med classes on the road to an MD. I trust it will only continue to suck more. The answer to your question is something only you can answer and its what med schools are trying to figure out. How bad do you want it?
  29. gujuDoc

    gujuDoc 10+ Year Member

    Feb 21, 2004
    I think a broad education is important and statements like the OPs are kind of dumb. The most brilliant people I know are people who are educated in a more wellrounded manner. These people are the ones who do well on standardized tests, who can hold more intelligent conversations on a variety of topics, etc.

    The importance is more then work ethic. Gaining knowledge is never a bad thing.

    Secondly, if you feel like this now then just remember in med school you'll look back and wish for the easier days of premed classes when you are in the midst of med school classes.
  30. MJB

    MJB Senior Member Physician Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    Apr 12, 2005
    A few pieces of advice:

    1. ENJOY THE RIDE. Never forget this one.

    2. Open your eyes and live a little.

    3. Take every opportunity to learn something new as a blessing, many are not so fortunate.

    Part of me really hopes you were joking, but I'm pretty sure you're dead serious. Just my personal opinion, but folks that do nothing but try to "look good on paper" are very, very boring...Do things because your heart is in it..whether that be grades, classes, volunteering activities, etc..

    I'm speaking to you as a 30 year old cancer survivor that's about to be a medical student.
  31. gary5

    gary5 Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Sep 24, 2003
    It sounds like you haven't learn how to have fun. Make some friends, have fun, and get out and do things. Unless you do, the rest of your life will be as empty as it is now.
  32. MJB

    MJB Senior Member Physician Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    Apr 12, 2005
    OP reminds me of the bitter docs I've run into that are convinced that medicine sucks and they should have just "enjoyed their 20's and lived the good life working as an engineer, financial type, lawyer, etc" and making some "real money".

  33. mdvargas

    mdvargas Crystal ball reader 2+ Year Member

    Oct 4, 2006
    I graduate in 6 wks and IMO, I feel I should have had picked a major that's more specialized or "marketable", like computer sci or IT. I've noticed majors are getting too generalized and so when it comes to particular skills and respectable experiences to land the job that pays, you're on your own, undergrad degrees are no longer enough. My buddy is graduating w/ a CS degree and a 45+K job is lined up for him, w/ no prior experience. Me = no acceptance yet or a job that's not even close to that salary range :oops:

    My point: I was a slave to A's and he partied.
  34. Tired Pigeon

    Tired Pigeon 7+ Year Member

    Jan 27, 2007
    The purpose of your undergraduate education NOT the acquisition of specific nuggets of knowledge; rather, it is the development of the capacity for reason, logic, and critical thinking. Presuming you are attending a university and not some type of trade school, this is what a decent undergrad education should provide.
  35. notdeadyet

    notdeadyet Still in California Moderator 10+ Year Member

    Jul 23, 2004
    That is because you need to have more than a checkbook and a pulse to get in to British Universities. American high school education is pretty much universally low level even in honors classes, so at University they have to start pretty much from ground zero. We could only offer the British university model after having secondary education that was worth something.
  36. notdeadyet

    notdeadyet Still in California Moderator 10+ Year Member

    Jul 23, 2004
    Agreed. If you can't learn how to enjoy your undergraduate years, the rest of your life looks pretty bleak...
  37. mdvargas

    mdvargas Crystal ball reader 2+ Year Member

    Oct 4, 2006
    It's Univ.

    While I agree with your definition, what I was trying to say was that many students still believe that an undergrad degree is enough for the high salary or "good catch" jobs. Yea, the college experience is great, and the somewhat acquired capacity for reason, logic, and critical thinking as well, it's just too bad I realized later on this is all I was getting.
  38. paranoid_eyes

    paranoid_eyes 2+ Year Member

    Sep 18, 2006
    at least you're getting A's...
  39. AnEyeLikeMars

    AnEyeLikeMars Member 7+ Year Member

    Dec 2, 2005
    Carrboro, NC
    I wouldn't say it was worthless, but I can sympathize with you. There are times when I wish that I didn't walk onto campus as a premed, because I feel like I've always been looking ahead towards med school. I still had a great time in undergrad, but I felt what your feeling (to a lesser extent).

    However, the problem is with you (and me), not undergrad. It can be whatever you make it. If you want it to be pre-"medical school" and nothing else, it will be. If you want it to be more, it will be.
  40. JackDanielMD

    JackDanielMD 7+ Year Member

    Feb 27, 2007
    Sorry to say, I have absolutely 0 sympathy for you. Every person in this forum has worked hard. You have to cowboy up and deal with it. That being said, you've gotta unwind after a while. If you don't you're gonna burn out...and that will be the end of you. Listen to what everyone else said...go get drunk, hook up with some hotties, go to a football game, put the books away. Trust me, you'll still end up ok if you get a B or two.
  41. MWK

    MWK Over-represented majority 2+ Year Member

    Nov 15, 2006
    Lexington KY
    Sometimes I feel like I'm in your boat, but then I realize a few things:

    Now that we're in collge, many classes that we took in high school were useles. Taking some things in HS don't have ANY bearing on my being a Bio and Chem major. Now that I'm in college, I look back and forward to think what I am taking now---do I need any botany or ecology to be a good physician? I think not. I do need it however to be a Biology major and Bio major does not mean pre-med. Did I really need to take Anthropology my freshman year? No. Theres a trend here.

    Now flash forward 1-4 years. Here you are in an Allopathic school. You might be sitting there thinking "Why do I need to study embryology or XXX?" I want to go into surgery, I don't REALLY need this.

    Now flash forward 5-9 years. You're doing your residency. You're practicing the general surgical arts and you think "Why the hell do I have to do a bowel resection at 2 am, I want to go into CT?

    So there you'll be---35 and have wasted arguably the best 15 years of your life being miserable. Enjoy the ride and realize there will always be crap you dont want to do and you think Its not important for your future.

    And get off SDN, it makes everyone just that much more competetive.
  42. mongrel

    mongrel Assoc. Prof. Dogsuit 5+ Year Member

    Are you kidding me? +pissed+ Undergrad is awesome! I love my pre-med classes (I'm an engineering major) and I love to have fun. I put my hours in studying, like you heavily before a test, and then spend the rest of my time doing things I enjoy-- clubs, sports, hospital, and just general ****ing around. Live and love these days while you've got them.
  43. whoisthedrizzle

    whoisthedrizzle 2+ Year Member

    thats some sage ****ing advice right there man

    people on this board are way too uptight

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