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Anyone watch 20/20 "True Confessions"?
Started by ChittyBang
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Is that the same vet who lost his license and was on here for a bit?
Anyways....I don't completely disagree with everything they said. Some companies do really push to have their vets up-sell, and clients do need to be educated to avoid those situations. The vaccine thing is in many ways true....a lot of them do not need to be annual, and the data sheets are changing to say that. Dentals in some breeds should be done every year, but a 5yr old with mild tartar? Probably not. . They also did, in the end, say most vets are ethical.
I dunno....in my opinion, it could have been worse....and hopefully people realize that was one person's opinion.
Anyways....I don't completely disagree with everything they said. Some companies do really push to have their vets up-sell, and clients do need to be educated to avoid those situations. The vaccine thing is in many ways true....a lot of them do not need to be annual, and the data sheets are changing to say that. Dentals in some breeds should be done every year, but a 5yr old with mild tartar? Probably not. . They also did, in the end, say most vets are ethical.
I dunno....in my opinion, it could have been worse....and hopefully people realize that was one person's opinion.
Among other things, I noticed the prices they quoted for the dentistry seemed extremely low to me. I think a simple dental where I work runs between $400 and $700 depending on the size of the dog and therefore amount of anesthesia. Is my clinic unique or is it all dependent on where you're practicing?
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the prices at my clinic are in the $200-300 range with no extractions
Yeah, I have to agree with SnS.... there are some of those issues in vet clinics with trying to upsell. It really sucks that it is a heavily biased interview from one person and they aren't actually following the vet or working alongside the vet to see what they are doing and why they are saying certain things. Also, I am torn on the dental things when there is just "mild" tartar... because the last thing you want is the client to think it is ok and not see another vet for 2 or 3 years (yes, pets should have annual exams, but many don't get that) and then suddenly "mild" tartar has turned into massive dental disease with multiple extractions and thus taking a $300-400 cleaning up to near $800 or more. I don't think most vets that recommend a dental when the dog is in early stages of dental disease or with mild tartar are trying to "upsell"; many of them are trying to avoid the nightmare that mouth will become in a few years if something isn't done about it.
I once worked with a veterinarian who was "one of those" - overcharging, pushing vaccines and diagnostics, giving clients a hard time if they request an estimate - so I understand why some feel the way they do and may generalize. But he's not everyone. And I have also heard so many other clients at other practices complain about how much their animal's bill is gonna be and they then forgo truly necessary treatments while the doctor just has to bite their tongue and wish the animal well. That is what I dread the most: knowing how badly an animal needs treatment, but letting them go home in poor condition because their owner is a tightwad. And insurance is not always the answer. What is?
Figured I would put this here, since it does a good job of showing what "Dr." Andrew Jones is really about. (He gave up his DVM license because he could not stick to being an ethical professional and playing nice with his fellow colleagues.)
http://pawcurious.com/2013/11/some-...rships-via-throwing-colleagues-under-the-bus/
I love the end there where they show the pit bull dog's teeth trying to indicate she really doesn't need a dental cleaning... oh look, what is that?
http://pawcurious.com/2013/11/some-...rships-via-throwing-colleagues-under-the-bus/
I love the end there where they show the pit bull dog's teeth trying to indicate she really doesn't need a dental cleaning... oh look, what is that?
I read this, and the blog post that Skeptvet wrote, as well as a few more posts by different vet bloggers on the subject of Dr. Jones. It was very disheartening to read some of the comments that were in favor of Dr. Jones and how all veterinarians that don't practice alternative/holistic care are money-grubbing, close-minded professionals that aren't to be trusted. I know there will always be those people that are mistrustful of conventional anything, but still...hurts my heart a little to read their thoughts.
The sad thing is that I am not at all against alternative/holistic medicine approaches (depending upon the situation). I have worked with clients who have found that acupuncture really helps their pets and is the best option they have yet to find. However, there is a need to recognize that conventional medicine and alternative medicine have their own advantages/disadvantages and that the best medicine can often be found by combining the two. And that there is zero need for a veterinarian that is a proponent for one over the other to belittle their colleagues that do not agree. His attitude is completely unacceptable and the irony that he spews around is just silly and absurd. People would have to be dumb to not realize that this interview was nothing more than to get him more money selling is holistic medical approach; it was a marketing scheme by him and nothing more than to gain some quick fame and revenue. His approach was worse than probably any vet that has "pushed vaccines" and the sad thing is that people will fall for it.
What's really ironic is that he talks about how veterinarians use the "C" word to scare clients... but his website selling his DVD or whatever is alllll about how his own dog died from splenic Cancer caused by 1.) vaccines, 2.) NSAIDs, and 3.) veterinarian approved commercial pet food....
Apparently, following the advice of normal veterinarians give your pets cancer. But, if you follow the at-home remedy advice of some dude who lost his license for $9.97 a month, your pet might not get cancer. Or maybe they'll die long before they're old enough to get cancer...
Apparently, following the advice of normal veterinarians give your pets cancer. But, if you follow the at-home remedy advice of some dude who lost his license for $9.97 a month, your pet might not get cancer. Or maybe they'll die long before they're old enough to get cancer...
I watched it and responded publicly as a veterinarian. Feel free to read and share.
http://sharonostermann.blog.com/201...p-is-your-veterinarian-being-honest-with-you/
http://sharonostermann.blog.com/201...p-is-your-veterinarian-being-honest-with-you/
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I apologize in advance for my somewhat off topic post... veterinary dentistry hits very close to home for me...
It saddened me greatly that dental disease was targeted as an over diagnosed disease, and that periodontal treatments are over prescribed. I actually believe its exactly the opposite in most practices today. Admittedly I'm biased since I'm a resident in dentistry and oral surgery, but also because periodontal disease is the single most common disease affecting domestic pets in the world today. The notion that you should not intervene when early disease is present and waiting for the disease to become advanced is absolutely absurd. If you see calculus on the surface of the crown, the likelihood the patient has some degree of periodontal disease (either gingivitis or periodontitis) is reasonably high. Intervening when the disease is mild is far more cost effective for the client and far less invasive for the patient, then waiting for periodontitis to progress to the point where significant intervention is required. The cost associated with full-mouth intra-oral radiographs, dental charting and supra and subgingival scaling is not extraordinary (~$500) and pays off significantly in the prevention of disease, and will absolutely positively impact your patients quality of life and systemic health (contrarily when patients end up seeing a specialist because their disease is so advanced it will likely cost the client $3000 or more). Some clients will elect to be proactive and pay for the service, some clients will not, but we have an ethical obligation to make recommendations based on medically correct information.
It saddened me greatly that dental disease was targeted as an over diagnosed disease, and that periodontal treatments are over prescribed. I actually believe its exactly the opposite in most practices today. Admittedly I'm biased since I'm a resident in dentistry and oral surgery, but also because periodontal disease is the single most common disease affecting domestic pets in the world today. The notion that you should not intervene when early disease is present and waiting for the disease to become advanced is absolutely absurd. If you see calculus on the surface of the crown, the likelihood the patient has some degree of periodontal disease (either gingivitis or periodontitis) is reasonably high. Intervening when the disease is mild is far more cost effective for the client and far less invasive for the patient, then waiting for periodontitis to progress to the point where significant intervention is required. The cost associated with full-mouth intra-oral radiographs, dental charting and supra and subgingival scaling is not extraordinary (~$500) and pays off significantly in the prevention of disease, and will absolutely positively impact your patients quality of life and systemic health (contrarily when patients end up seeing a specialist because their disease is so advanced it will likely cost the client $3000 or more). Some clients will elect to be proactive and pay for the service, some clients will not, but we have an ethical obligation to make recommendations based on medically correct information.
At our last staff meeting, the clinic that I currently work at had a discussion about how we can talk with clients about the abc program and keep their trust in us as their pet's advocate... As a result of the discussion, the new running joke in the clinic is, "Let's just keep and eye on it." Dog comes in with an infected, bleeding mass? Send 'em home, let's just keep an eye on it. Moderate tarter on teeth? Meh, let's just keep an eye on it.
