APMA/AFCAS situation

[air bud]

This was brought up in another thread, but could an attending please elaborate on what exactly happened between APMA and AFCAS? I dont want it to be a he said/she said, but I was hoping for multiple angles on this. Specifically, should a current pod student be wary of being in a AFCAS club vs. ACFAOM club?

EDIT: here is an old thread, what are the new developments now that this has had some time to play out?
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=518345&highlight=acfaom

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[Feli]

Long story short:

Almost all of the highest trained praticing DPMs hold cert/qual by ABPS, and all current residencies are designed to lead to that certification based on case volume and training. The vast majority who reach ABPS cert are also ACFAS members. A lot are additionally APMA members, but some stopped paying dues since it's no longer required for ACFAS renewal.

Since that thread you linked to, APMA held firm that ACFAS couldn't be an affiliate if they were going to relax the APMA membership requirement. APMA then formed ASPS (has a clever acronym pronunciation you will probably hear from pro-ACFAS guys when in clerkships/residency) to be the new surgical affiliate...
http://www.apma.org/MainMenu/News/NewsReleases/NewsReleaseArchives/2008/NR_11-14-08.aspx

As for the meetings, journal, membership, workshop, teaching faculty, admin, etc quality of ACFAS compared with ASPS? Well, you be the judge when you get to the point where you have to pay the dues. I think you'd find very few who could argue with a straight face that JFAS and the ACFAS Annual Scientific Mtg, workshops, etc don't contain a lot of the best F&A surgery info offered by/for DPMs. Pod Institute also can't be discounted... tons of great stuff from them too. Some other conferences like SuperBones, Georgetown Limb, West Penn Symposium (not this year for some reason?), and others are nice to have lecture variety for CME from year to year.

 

[diabeticfootdr]

Long story short:

Almost all of the highest trained praticing DPMs hold cert/qual by ABPS, and all current residencies are designed to lead to that certification based on case volume and training. The vast majority who reach ABPS cert are also ACFAS members. A lot are additionally APMA members, but some stopped paying dues since it's no longer required for ACFAS renewal.

Since that thread you linked to, APMA held firm that ACFAS couldn't be an affiliate if they were going to relax the APMA membership requirement. APMA then formed ASPS (has a clever acronym pronunciation you will probably hear from pro-ACFAS guys when in clerkships/residency) to be the new surgical affiliate...

With all due respect to the positive and well-thought out comments that Feli provides on this forum, I have a different take on this.

When you state "almost all the highest trained DPMs hold certification by ABPS", I'd add "and many of the lowest because they were grandfathered in".

ACFAS was started by APMA. They felt like they didn't need the parent organization any longer and in a manner similar to teenage rebellion, they "ran away from home". APMA's requirement is that all affiliated organizations members are members in APMA, hence they are "affiliated". ACFAS doesn't like what APMA represents, just a bunch of "podiatrists". ACFAS refers to their members as "foot and ankle surgeons". ACFAS held a vote to see if the members wanted to break away from APMA. The ballot language was really confusing, something like ... "Do you support the ACFAS board in keeping your dues lower, etc." or "No, I don't support the ACFAS board, etc." I know, because I was an ACFAS member and I voted. Even with the confusing language, the vote was 52% yes, 48% no.

Furthermore, ACFAS violated their own bylaws (which legally threatens their status as corporation, by the way) because their board voted to not require APMA membership by simple majority, which should have been a bylaws change with 2/3 majority of the members required. But then after the board changed the bylaws illegally, they required 2/3 majority to change it back, which as you see from above, wasn't achieved.

 

[diabeticfootdr]

Also, to follow up on my own comment and answer part of the OPs question: you should be involved in all of the clubs/organizations as a student until you decide which you want to be a long term membership.

 

[Podfather]

With all due respect to the positive and well-thought out comments that Feli provides on this forum, I have a different take on this.

When you state "almost all the highest trained DPMs hold certification by ABPS", I'd add "and many of the lowest because they were grandfathered in".

First of all NO ONE has ever been grandfathered in. I can assure you of that. Everyone who is ABPS certified has sat for and passed the exam. If you are one who complains about the pre 1991 Foot and Ankle people reassessing vs. recertifying and imply that is grandfathering you are incorrect. All of those people submitted cases, sat and passed both the written and oral exams, and have paid for the exam and annual dues. They were certified when self assessment was required every 10 years. Those were the rules when they certified and so ABPS keeps them. But to imply they were "grandfathered" is incorrect. I have a hunch you are not certified?????

ACFAS was started by APMA. They felt like they didn't need the parent organization any longer and in a manner similar to teenage rebellion, they "ran away from home". APMA's requirement is that all affiliated organizations members are members in APMA,

If the APMA (I am a member) does their job why must they mandate membership to be in ACFAS???? ACFAS membership is at an all time high and I just left their annual meeting which was attended by close to 1400 DPMs and was a great educational experience. I have not heard anything about ASPS and last I heard they have only a few hundred members.

hence they are "affiliated". ACFAS doesn't like what APMA represents, just a bunch of "podiatrists".

Not true. Some ACFAS members were forced to resign when they left APMA because of unethical problems within their state associations (being in the state association is also a requirement of the APMA) and jump started this. Also ACFAS had no voting privileges in APMA.

ACFAS refers to their members as "foot and ankle surgeons".

That's what they are??????? Do maxillofacial surgeons call themselves dental surgeons???

ACFAS held a vote to see if the members wanted to break away from APMA. The ballot language was really confusing, something like ... "Do you support the ACFAS board in keeping your dues lower, etc." or "No, I don't support the ACFAS board, etc." I know, because I was an ACFAS member and I voted. Even with the confusing language, the vote was 52% yes, 48% no.

Furthermore, ACFAS violated their own bylaws (which legally threatens their status as corporation, by the way) because their board voted to not require APMA membership by simple majority, which should have been a bylaws change with 2/3 majority of the members required. But then after the board changed the bylaws illegally, they required 2/3 majority to change it back, which as you see from above, wasn't achieved.

ACFAS will remain a important part of this profession with or without the APMA.

 

[Podmeister]

This was brought up in another thread, but could an attending please elaborate on what exactly happened between APMA and AFCAS?http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=518345&highlight=acfaom

What the hell is AFCAS???

For those of you who attended the ACFAS conference in Las Vegas last week...No, I am not the same guy who posed the question, "What the hell is HFL???" (He was one of my classmates)

BTW, great educational meeting with plenty of interesting scientific abstract presentations.

 

[NatCh]

What the hell is AFCAS???

For those of you who attended the ACFAS conference in Las Vegas last week...No, I am not the same guy who posed the question, "What the hell is HFL???" (He was one of my classmates)

BTW, great educational meeting with plenty of interesting scientific abstract presentations.

What's happened??? My Partner attended that conference. I'll have to ask him about it.

 

[NatCh]

ACFAS will remain a important part of this profession with or without the APMA.

Off topic, I find the red text difficult on my eyes. Would you kindly consider a different color?

 

[Podmeister]

What's happened??? My Partner attended that conference. I'll have to ask him about it.

On the last day of the conference, there was a slide presentation full of typos like "cadavor" and "HFL transfer" so my classmate went up to the microphone during the Q & A session, and commented, "What the hell is HFL?
This is an embarassment for the profession and one of the reasons why the orthopods look down on us. Next time, I suggest the speaker double check his slides and spellings."

It should have been FHL= flexor hallucis longus

 

[Podfather]

On the last day of the conference, there was a slide presentation full of typos like "cadavor" and "HFL transfer" so my classmate went up to the microphone during the Q & A session, and commented, "What the hell is HFL?
This is an embarassment for the profession and one of the reasons why the orthopods look down on us. Next time, I suggest the speaker double check his slides and spellings."

It should have been FHL= flexor hallucis longus

Could you please tell me the name of the speaker and the lecture subject. I left that AM and didn't see it. I know someone on the annual meeting committee and he needs to know so that lecturer either gets a sit down or not re-invited. Mt favorite session was the first "Rapid Fire"

 

[Podmeister]

Could you please tell me the name of the speaker and the lecture subject. I left that AM and didn't see it. I know someone on the annual meeting committee and he needs to know so that lecturer either gets a sit down or not re-invited. Mt favorite session was the first "Rapid Fire"

The topic was "Best & Worst Cases of 2009" but I do not recall the speaker's name.

I stayed up late in the casinos the night before and missed the early bird 7:15am Rapid Fire session.

That Dr. Schuberth is one entertaining speaker.

 

[that1guyfromFL]

Could you please tell me the name of the speaker and the lecture subject. I left that AM and didn't see it. I know someone on the annual meeting committee and he needs to know so that lecturer either gets a sit down or not re-invited. Mt favorite session was the first "Rapid Fire"

I spoke with someone who was in this lecture, they provided some much needed perspective.

I'm sure you can find out more, but according to them it definitely was not an open and shut case of some nobody bonehead making the profession look bad.

 

[diabeticfootdr]

Podfather: I have a hunch you are not certified?????

diabeticfootdr: No need for hunches. I've stated on SDN many times that I resigned from ABPS (was qualified) and from ACFAS. ABPS would not listen to the young members committee, their own qualified individuals, or APMA when they decided to change the terms of being board qualified (mandating use of residency resource - as an attending surgeon). Therefore, I voted with my pocketbook, and resigned from both.


Podfather: If the APMA (I am a member) does their job why must they mandate membership to be in ACFAS????

diabeticfootdr: What's that supposed to mean? What job? Like defending all of podiatry on capitol hill? Like getting specific language placed in the healthcare reform bill to classify podiatrists as physicians? ACFAS was a subsidiary of APMA. Shouldn't subordinate organizations members belong to the parent organization?

Podfather: Also ACFAS had no voting privileges in APMA.

diabeticfootdr: APMA decided that ACFAS did not need separate voting privileges since 75% of the voting delegation of APMA were ACFAS members. It is the ACFAS board that was upset that they didn't have separate special voting privileges.

diabeticfootdr: ACFAS refers to their members as "foot and ankle surgeons".

Podfather: That's what they are??????? Do maxillofacial surgeons call themselves dental surgeons???

diabeticfootdr: But in the end, they are dentists by degree and scope of practice, just as we are podiatrists.

In general, I think it was short sighted on both organizations to split. It only hurts the whole profession. I support reconciliation between the groups. But, of the two, I think the ACFAS board was acting the most childish and deceptive by forcing this upon their membership while violating their own bylaws.

 

[PADPM]

podfather,

I am certifiied by the ABPS and believe strongly in that organization, and I have been a member of the APMA since my residency. I'm also a Fellow of the ACFAS. I've not only been a "member" but I've had active roles in each of those organizations over the years. I also believe that the ASPS MAY have sounded like a good idea to a few idealists, but that seemed to fizzle pretty quickly. I've visited their website, and they seem to have basically done nothing but collected dues and had some attempt at a "conference"/lecture at the APMA national and some regional meetings.

I can not imagine they are going to survive, since at the present time they really don't seem to have anything to really offer. The few people I know that joined, also maintained their membership in ACFAS, but just wanted some additional initials after their names and another diploma for their walls, but have no intention on paying dues again this year.

However, I must defend "diabeticfootdr". Although I do agree that many that I've encountered over the years that are bitter with the ABPS have formed their opinions because of their inability to pass the exam, I do NOT believe this is the case with diabeticfootdr.

He is one of the few "attendings" on this site who is not anonymous. It is well known that he is Dr. Lee Rogers. Dr. Rogers in my opinion is very well respected and is certainly well published. I am more than confident that his decision was based on ideology and not his ability to pass the examination. His past academic achievements would certainly lead me to believe those comments.

I happen to agree that I don't believe it should be necessary for ACFAS members to be members of the APMA, though I do believe it's a shame that doctors don't voluntarily support both organizations automatically.

 

[Podfather]

Podfather: I have a hunch you are not certified?????

diabeticfootdr: No need for hunches. I've stated on SDN many times that I resigned from ABPS (was qualified) and from ACFAS. ABPS would not listen to the young members committee, their own qualified individuals, or APMA when they decided to change the terms of being board qualified (mandating use of residency resource - as an attending surgeon). Therefore, I voted with my pocketbook, and resigned from both.

Sit for the exam, pass it, and if you have issues become involved and make a difference. ABPS is loaded with "young members" who have done the above and are making a difference. Yes there are senior members but check the exam commitees and you will see a significant number of younger people You voted "your pocketbook" but when an ACFAS member does that's wrong?


Podfather: If the APMA (I am a member) does their job why must they mandate membership to be in ACFAS????

diabeticfootdr: What's that supposed to mean? What job? Like defending all of podiatry on capitol hill? Like getting specific language placed in the healthcare reform bill to classify podiatrists as physicians? ACFAS was a subsidiary of APMA. Shouldn't subordinate organizations members belong to the parent organization?

I agree the APMA is important and does their job (most of the time). That is why even with my "pocketbook" affected, I remain a member. However if they would not mandate membership this issue would not even have been a problem. Mandating membership is simply wrong. There are some states where the state association has issues and has forced people to make tough choices regarding the APMA. ACFAS should have had voting rights regardless of how many people were already APMA members. They represent their membership and have a niche. If they didn't they wouldn't need to exist. No other profession has such requirements. My point is if the "parent" organization does their job people will join. Why require it? The saprophytes will never join. I do know that neither organization's membership has been significantly affect since the split which proves my point.

Podfather: Also ACFAS had no voting privileges in APMA.

diabeticfootdr: APMA decided that ACFAS did not need separate voting privileges since 75% of the voting delegation of APMA were ACFAS members. It is the ACFAS board that was upset that they didn't have separate special voting privileges.

diabeticfootdr: ACFAS refers to their members as "foot and ankle surgeons".

Podfather: That's what they are??????? Do maxillofacial surgeons call themselves dental surgeons???

diabeticfootdr: But in the end, they are dentists by degree and scope of practice, just as we are podiatrists.

Yes podiatric foot and ankle surgeons are podiatrists just like a maxillofacial surgeon is a dentist. Next time someone needs oral surgery (oh wait dental surgery) they should complain that their "surgeon" does not call themselves a dentist. Wait those orthodontists must be arrogant as well they do not call themselves dentists either. Wow I may never see a dentist again. A bunch of posers!

In general, I think it was short sighted on both organizations to split. It only hurts the whole profession. I support reconciliation between the groups. But, of the two, I think the ACFAS board was acting the most childish and deceptive by forcing this upon their membership while violating their own bylaws.

I agree a compromise could have been made. I know there were attempts made by both sides. Having said that ACFAS and APMA have survived. Forming their own (APMA-ASPS) surgical affiliate so fast has probably created a political situation that will prevent any reconciliation anytime soon. Since you are not a member of course you think ACFAS was mostly at fault. In a divorce the other person is always evil. ACFAS is and will remain the source for surgical education and attract those who are the "foot and ankle" surgeons of this profession. Why is being a surgeon considered an elitist whereas a diabetic oriented or orthoses oriented podiatrist not? Where the rift started was the early non-surgical DPMs dropped the ball and did not the market or promote themselves. Today ACFOAM is doing their job and slowly making the case for their members. Years ago this was not the case. The combined residency models have not helped the ABPOPPM in regards of those seeking certification nor has it helped ACFOAM. The one board people exist because DPMs in a combined residency will never seek double boarded status as predicted. Why is it the ABPS posts their examination numbers and pass rate and ABPOPPM does not? Perhaps you can post how many sat for the ABPOPPM exam vs. the ABPS exam? I respect all aspects of the profession. I have an unusual practice in that 80% of my care is surgically based and my patients are referred mostly by DPMs and orthopedists for complex reconstruction. However, I refer all of my orthoses/braces to an ABPOPPM certified DPM in town. He is awesome and is as important to my patients as I am. I could have sat and probably passed the ABPOPPM exam when their window permitted it. I didn't because I felt that I wasn't qualified for that status even if I passed the exam. I do the same and refer for wounds since there are DPMs who are much better at this care. Look I am pro-profession but feel to say every podiatrist is the same is wrong. Not better or worse just different. The dental model works for a reason and the public and their profession has benefited. When you have a child who needs braces you look for a dentist called an orthodontist and when you need surgery of the mandible a dentist called a maxillofacial surgeon.

 

[Podfather]

podfather,

I am certifiied by the ABPS and believe strongly in that organization, and I have been a member of the APMA since my residency. I'm also a Fellow of the ACFAS. I've not only been a "member" but I've had active roles in each of those organizations over the years. I also believe that the ASPS MAY have sounded like a good idea to a few idealists, but that seemed to fizzle pretty quickly. I've visited their website, and they seem to have basically done nothing but collected dues and had some attempt at a "conference"/lecture at the APMA national and some regional meetings.

I can not imagine they are going to survive, since at the present time they really don't seem to have anything to really offer. The few people I know that joined, also maintained their membership in ACFAS, but just wanted some additional initials after their names and another diploma for their walls, but have no intention on paying dues again this year.

However, I must defend "diabeticfootdr". Although I do agree that many that I've encountered over the years that are bitter with the ABPS have formed their opinions because of their inability to pass the exam, I do NOT believe this is the case with diabeticfootdr.

He is one of the few "attendings" on this site who is not anonymous. It is well known that he is Dr. Lee Rogers. Dr. Rogers in my opinion is very well respected and is certainly well published. I am more than confident that his decision was based on ideology and not his ability to pass the examination. His past academic achievements would certainly lead me to believe those comments.

I happen to agree that I don't believe it should be necessary for ACFAS members to be members of the APMA, though I do believe it's a shame that doctors don't voluntarily support both organizations automatically.

PADPM I respect your opinions and as you know have agreed most of the time and disagreed sometimes. Dr. Rogers is entitled to his opinions but when I disagree I will state my case. I am still actively involved in all the organizations you mentioned. I also have published, lectured, and educated globally. But I am open to those who disagree with my opinions medically or philosophically. In fact believe it or not sometimes I have changed my opinion. The very thing that many state as the reason for quitting something is what happens when people slam their profession or withdraw from the discussion: divisiveness. Once you are divorced the marriage is over. As far as Dr. Rogers passing the test and submitting cases for review, I have no reason to think he would fail. One way to prove that though and get back in the game is to...............................

 

[PADPM]

podfather,

I do agree, and in a prior post somewhere on this website, I had stated that I felt that someone of Dr. Rogers quality should have/could have certainly been an asset to the ABPS by simply passing the exam and attempting to make changes from within, rather than opting to walk away.

It's a shame that he chose to walk, rather than attempt to make changes from within, but that's the path he chose. Unfortunately, in this case I believe neither party ultimately benefitted.

 

[diabeticfootdr]

podfather,

I do agree, and in a prior post somewhere on this website, I had stated that I felt that someone of Dr. Rogers quality should have/could have certainly been an asset to the ABPS by simply passing the exam and attempting to make changes from within, rather than opting to walk away.

It's a shame that he chose to walk, rather than attempt to make changes from within, but that's the path he chose. Unfortunately, in this case I believe neither party ultimately benefitted.

Thanks for all your good comments about this issue, and others.

I did attempt to make changes. I contacted the ABPS office personally on many occasions, but they didn't return calls or emails. Through the Young Members Committee, we contacted them again. Their reply to YMC was that ABPS doesn't answer to APMA. Which is such a BS answer. YMC was merely inquiring about the changes on behalf of their members because ABPS refused to answer individuals questions. When you are BQ, you have no voice, but you still have to pay dues. Why would I want to be part of an organization that doesn't value my opinion, doesn't return calls, and refuses to talk to the YMC? So I made the decision to resign.

By the way, they eventually returned my call after I used some legalese and stated that "they changed the terms of being board qualified by which I agreed and I wanted a refund." They did granted me a refund for which I was grateful.

But, I agree with you that the divisiveness in the profession is not beneficial. We are all podiatrists. We should fit under the same podiatry umbrella, and have subspecialty divisions under that.

 

[diabeticfootdr]

I agree a compromise could have been made. I know there were attempts made by both sides. Having said that ACFAS and APMA have survived. Forming their own (APMA-ASPS) surgical affiliate so fast has probably created a political situation that will prevent any reconciliation anytime soon. Since you are not a member of course you think ACFAS was mostly at fault. In a divorce the other person is always evil. ACFAS is and will remain the source for surgical education and attract those who are the "foot and ankle" surgeons of this profession. Why is being a surgeon considered an elitist whereas a diabetic oriented or orthoses oriented podiatrist not? Where the rift started was the early non-surgical DPMs dropped the ball and did not the market or promote themselves. Today ACFOAM is doing their job and slowly making the case for their members. Years ago this was not the case. The combined residency models have not helped the ABPOPPM in regards of those seeking certification nor has it helped ACFOAM. The one board people exist because DPMs in a combined residency will never seek double boarded status as predicted. Why is it the ABPS posts their examination numbers and pass rate and ABPOPPM does not? Perhaps you can post how many sat for the ABPOPPM exam vs. the ABPS exam? I respect all aspects of the profession. I have an unusual practice in that 80% of my care is surgically based and my patients are referred mostly by DPMs and orthopedists for complex reconstruction. However, I refer all of my orthoses/braces to an ABPOPPM certified DPM in town. He is awesome and is as important to my patients as I am. I could have sat and probably passed the ABPOPPM exam when their window permitted it. I didn't because I felt that I wasn't qualified for that status even if I passed the exam. I do the same and refer for wounds since there are DPMs who are much better at this care. Look I am pro-profession but feel to say every podiatrist is the same is wrong. Not better or worse just different. The dental model works for a reason and the public and their profession has benefited. When you have a child who needs braces you look for a dentist called an orthodontist and when you need surgery of the mandible a dentist called a maxillofacial surgeon.

ASPS was a mistake, for many of the reasons you stated. It is duplicative (ACFAS already exists) and it doesn't fulfill the role of a society. A society should be a source of education (have a meeting), promote research (and have a journal), and promote their membership. ASPS hasn't done any of those in my opinion.

I don't know how many sat for the ABPS, but ABPOPPM was very few. There needs to be changes on their part as well. ABPO + PPM was really a result of the old POR and PPMR residency models not being able to sit for ABPS, so they needed some board certification. POR/PPMR doesn't exist any longer. ABPOPPM is a ridiculously long acronym that no one outside of podiatry (and even many podiatrist) can remember. Since the PM&S, ABPOPPM should share the vision of 2015 and change their name to American Board of Podiatry (or Podiatric Medicine). That would make it more attractive to new residency grads. It is less confusing. I laugh that ACFAS refuses to use the "p word", but ABPOPPM loves it so much they use it twice in the same acronym! Disclosure: I am ABPOPPM certified.

I don't think that being a diabetic podiatrist, a sports medicine podiatrist, or a podiatric surgeon is being elitist. But I do think that avoiding the use of the word podiatry because of embarrassment and looking down on your peers who are not "foot and ankle surgeons" are elitist.

I bought my BMW from a salesman who broke his ankle during the 2 week long process of my negotiation. I said, "you should have called me, I could have helped you." He said, "well I just thought I needed an orthopedic surgeon". He saw a "foot and ankle surgeon" at an ortho group who was really a DPM. I didn't ruin his impression - but I did get a good deal on my car!

 

[that1guyfromFL]

The dental model works for a reason and the public and their profession has benefited. When you have a child who needs braces you look for a dentist called an orthodontist and when you need surgery of the mandible a dentist called a maxillofacial surgeon.

This is a very interesting idea. I'm not intimately familiar with the dental education model, but I believe those dentists who wish to specialize in orthodontics complete a 2-3 year residency after dental school. Same for periodontology and other dental specialties.

Would you be supportive of differentiating between podiatric specialists in the same fashion?

The two obvious options would be keeping the 3 year surgical residency and offering more wide ranging fellowships or by changing from the current residency model to something more like what dental has in place.

On the surface it seems like differentiating between training and qualifications though the use of names would reduce public confusion, at least after they were educated about the differences.

 

[Podmeister]

I laugh that ACFAS refuses to use the "p word",

This reminds me of my first week in residency where the residents normally write "Podiatry Consult" or "Podiatry" in the progress note of the hospital medical chart ...whereas our program director would write in "Foot Sx". Well, guess what, he later became president of ABPS.

To this day, I still document my consult with simply "Podiatry Consult".

 

[PADPM]

This is a very interesting topic. No matter what you want to be called, the bottom line is that the majority of the public and the medical community will still consider you a "podiatrist".

I was at a medical meeting with some major "hitters" in the medical community. I was listening to a "colleague" discussing all his accomplishments. I personallyl don't care for this guy because he will make every effort in the world to avoid telling people he's a DPM.

He was embellishing every story he could, and was talking about all the foot and ankle trauma he treats, and all the reconstructive foot and ankle surgery he performs, etc., etc. When he walked away, one of the other doctors asked who he was, another doctor responded by saying "I can't remember his name, I just know he's a podiatrist".

So, he wasn't thought of as a "foot & ankle surgeon" or a "foot & ankle" specialist. Despite all his bragging rights, the other doctors know he's a "podiatrist".

And although I'm a DPM and have no problem with that designation, I never really could explain the term "podiatric" surgery. Is there a difference between podiatric surgery and foot/ankle surgery?

I believe if there is anything that may need updating, it's the actual name of our board, the ABPS. Do we perform podiatric surgery or simply perform foot/ankle surgery? Is there a difference?

 

[Feli]

You can basically look at it two ways IMO:

1 -Nearly all DPMs now get good post-grad training, and people will realize that "podiatrists" do a good amount of surgery soon enough. We train side by side with MD/DO residents and have excellent ability to be part of the health care team.
2 - We can't wait for the connotation of "podiatry" being nails/corns/calluses to fade away. We need to quickly outrun the profession's past and replace the p-word with more surgical-sounding alternatives as much as possible. That will hasten the transition from pallative care providers to comprehensive F&A physicians/surgeons.

I think that if a lot of gung-ho pod/pre students and senior practitioners who do a good amount of surgery are in camp 2, and a lot of younger attendings/residents are somewhat indifferent.

I just say "podiatry" or "podiatry surgery" most of the time to save my breath. Sometimes I say foot surgery, foot and ankle surgery, podiatric surgery, etc. In the end, you will probably find it saves you a lot of time to just say podiatry. People will realize what you do soon enough. 30 years ago, the DPM who does a good amount of surgery was in the minority while the greater % did little or no surgery, but it will be the opposite soon enough. I can wait for that... and besides, I get a bit tired of answering the pager with "Podiatric Surgery/Foot and Ankle/etc, did someone page" only to get a reply of "ummm, is this Podiatry?"

 

[Foot Doc]

whats the verdict? Too much red print...reminds me of grading Feli's physio tests!



Just kidding!

 

[Feli]

whats the verdict? ...

Haha

What's your gameplan for a few months from now? Are you staying local in KY or goin off to make the big bucks? I saw Dr. Ford started a fellowship year there for recon and DM salvage...

 

[Foot Doc]

Haha

What's your gameplan for a few months from now? Are you staying local in KY or goin off to make the big bucks? I saw Dr. Ford started a fellowship year there for recon and DM salvage...

I'm staying in KY. Got a great offer to join one of the Podiatry groups here I Louisville. Fellowship is doing great but not for me.