APPIC internship stipend living in cities

[diceymice07]

Hello! I am currently a 5th year clinical phd student set to apply for the APPIC 2025-2026 year of internship applications. I have several NYC area and Boston sites on my list currently. I am looking for advice from anyone who has completed (or currently completing) internship in a big city with a 30k stipend... How do you make it work? Do you live with roommates, etc.?

For reference, I have lived in NYC previously (for my master's degree) so I am familiar with how expensive things can be there.

Thanks!!

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[VintageRed]

From when I interviewed, people mostly answered this question by saying that they lived with roommates, took out loans, or had family/partners who were able to help financially.

 

[Sanman]

In order of popularity from my time as an intern so many years ago:

1. Spouse in finance or tech that pays all the bills
2. Rich parents that pay the bills for "school"
3. Student loans
4. Family with a home in the area
5. Live with roommate(s) in an "up and coming" part of the city

There were cheap pockets of the city if you knew where to look. Not sure how true that is anymore.

 

[borne_before]

Hello! I am currently a 5th year clinical phd student set to apply for the APPIC 2025-2026 year of internship applications. I have several NYC area and Boston sites on my list currently. I am looking for advice from anyone who has completed (or currently completing) internship in a big city with a 30k stipend... How do you make it work? Do you live with roommates, etc.?

For reference, I have lived in NYC previously (for my master's degree) so I am familiar with how expensive things can be there.

Thanks!!

You might find that a lot of fellow students come from money, have a spouse who makes a lot of money and thus psychology is sort of a hobby, or are not afraid of debt.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I imagine roommates and/or student loans will be the main solutions if spouse/partner/parent isn't in the cards. Setting something up with one or more of the other incoming interns might be viable.

I can say that making $30k/year work in even a smaller city without roommates can be a bit of a struggle, depending largely on housing costs and whether or not you want health insurance.

 

[R. Matey]

I interviewed at one site in NYC for internship. I just remember the interns going on about the commute from Brooklyn. They also seemed really tired.

 

[PsyDr]

@GregK is there an explanation for why some NY programs pay below the state minimum wage? Do they meet the FLSA definitions?

Fact Sheet #71: Internship Programs Under The Fair Labor Standards Act

www.dol.gov

 

[cara susanna]

I'm gonna be honest: I had some money from a deceased relative who was very supportive of my education.

 

[WisNeuro]

I generally avoided the HCOL sites in internship/postdoc stuff. Luckily, most of the sites that offered the top training for what I wanted/needed weren't there anyway. even in medium COL sites, I still had roommates to keep costs down, among keeping a rough budget. No external help.

 

[Sanman]

@GregK is there an explanation for why some NY programs pay below the state minimum wage? Do they meet the FLSA definitions?

Fact Sheet #71: Internship Programs Under The Fair Labor Standards Act

www.dol.gov

It's a 'stipend' not a salary as we are trainees and not employees. At least that is what was said to me all those years ago when asking about many of those employee benefits that we were hoping for altogether. Funny thing is that some of the standards implemented when rating our performance seemed to e more about productivity than learning.

 

[PsyDr]

It's a 'stipend' not a salary as we are trainees and not employees. At least that is what was said to me all those years ago when asking about many of those employee benefits that we were hoping for altogether. Funny thing is that some of the standards implemented when rating our performance seemed to e more about productivity than learning.

The federal standard for that, is if trainees are receiving education comparable to a standard educational setting, and are NOT doing the work of paid employees. I don’t know what NY states’s standard is, but I’m guessing it’s similar.

Most city internships meet the state minimum wage standards. But there are at least two on the first page that do not, unless they are some part time thing.

 

[szymk1sm]

Hello! I am currently a 5th year clinical phd student set to apply for the APPIC 2025-2026 year of internship applications. I have several NYC area and Boston sites on my list currently. I am looking for advice from anyone who has completed (or currently completing) internship in a big city with a 30k stipend... How do you make it work? Do you live with roommates, etc.?

For reference, I have lived in NYC previously (for my master's degree) so I am familiar with how expensive things can be there.

Thanks!!

I did internship at a medium-to-high COL city (at least it was back in 2017) and I think my stipend was ~$27k. I lived in a less desirable part of town (near the VA vs downtown) and at a newly renovated complex (so prices were cheaper to get people in). I also took out $10-15k in student loans (as I had no spousal or family support while in graduate school). For fun, I utilized a lot of Groupons (if those are still a thing), found the best happy hours in town, and worked out a lot in my apt complex.

 

[borne_before]

I'm gonna be honest: I had some money from a deceased relative who was very supportive of my education.

My parents always helped and emphasized education - often a lot - and I got a partial tuition waver for most of my schooling because my old man worked for a in state university.

 

[pinkbromeliad]

I did internship in a high CoL area-- I dug into savings significantly, had familial support for rent (I couldn't qualify to sign on my own after years of grad income), and had side hustles (I was a TA for online classes to make a little extra money).

It was for a generalist VA internship and, to be honest, I believe it wasn't really worth it and have some regrets. I firmly believe I could have had that same/similar (if not perhaps better) intern experience at many other places in that system. I thought I'd enjoy living in the city after grad school in a rural area, but, cities are not very fun when you're broke in my experience. In other big city sites I applied to, some interns were working at Starbucks on the weekends and looked so very tired. If you're willing, look at a few low-moderate CoL areas, if any of those can also support your training goals!

An aside: While moving in, we drove past a chickfila and they were advertising their hourly rates on their sign-- my mother so kindly pointed out that I could just abandon this whole psychology dream and would make more money slinging god's chicken for the year. Ironically, their ice cream cones are cheap and it became my preferred treat after a bad day at the VA-- "my pleasure!"

 

[LM02]

On the topic of employees vs. trainees on a stipend, the APA guidelines and principles are very clear that internship is supposed to be a training experience (not the equivalent of standard employment in the setting):

Section III, Domain B, 5a and 5b:

5. The program has the responsibility to further the training experiences of its interns and to promote the integration of practice and scholarly inquiry. Consistent with these responsibilities, the program should:

(a) Demonstrate that interns’ service delivery tasks and duties are primarily learning oriented and that training considerations take precedence over service delivery and revenue generation; and

(b) Ensure that the interns’ educational and practicum experiences are consistent with the program’s model, philosophy, and training goals and are appropriate for doctoral training in professional psychology.


So if this is not the experience, it's important because it violates the APA guidelines for accreditation. With respect to the cost of living, many years ago I interviewed at a NYC site and there was subsidized housing offered (I believe organized through the medical school/residency programs). Not sure if anything like that still exists these days?

 

[Sanman]

I did internship in a high CoL area-- I dug into savings significantly, had familial support for rent (I couldn't qualify to sign on my own after years of grad income), and had side hustles (I was a TA for online classes to make a little extra money).

It was for a generalist VA internship and, to be honest, I believe it wasn't really worth it and have some regrets. I firmly believe I could have had that same/similar (if not perhaps better) intern experience at many other places in that system. I thought I'd enjoy living in the city after grad school in a rural area, but, cities are not very fun when you're broke in my experience. In other big city sites I applied to, some interns were working at Starbucks on the weekends and looked so very tired. If you're willing, look at a few low-moderate CoL areas, if any of those can also support your training goals!

An aside: While moving in, we drove past a chickfila and they were advertising their hourly rates on their sign-- my mother so kindly pointed out that I could just abandon this whole psychology dream and would make more money slinging god's chicken for the year. Ironically, their ice cream cones are cheap and it became my preferred treat after a bad day at the VA-- "my pleasure!"

I have to generally agree with you. In graduate training that was largely full of good choices, this was a generally bad choice professionally. It was a good choice in some ways personally. However, I encourage people to think long and hard before going to one of these places. They are generally flooded with professionals, so the experience and early career prospects are worse than finding somewhere less expensive and with more demand for professionals. I could have stayed in the area of my grad program in the south and had a much easier time of things of things workwise.

 

[ClinicalABA]

I was "groomed" in my lab to go to Palo Alto VA for internship. We had a pipeline, and and I was pushed down it pretty far. Interviewed there and wife and I flew out to check out area, rentals, etc. It was totally undoable on the stipend at the time and my wife's potential salary as a PT assistant without taking out huge loans and making huge sacrifices as to where and how we lived (no family or other financial helpAs it turned out, I "matched" (that's another story- not real match!) to an APA accredited program in Boston area that- while not Bay Area expensive- was pretty expensive. We ended up in a really bad apartment in Pawtucket RI, with an hour plus drive to my sites.

 

[Zazulator]

I will add in here, as a current intern, that the actual amount you get after taxes, insurance, etc is ROUGH. I am in a low/ moderate COL area and split rent with my partner and am still barely scraping by. I do not have any family support and refuse to take out loans for this year (though we will see if I change my mind once next semester rolls around haha). If you can do a year in a lower COL area, I would strongly recommend it

 

[psych.meout]

I will add in here, as a current intern, that the actual amount you get after taxes, insurance, etc is ROUGH. I am in a low/ moderate COL area and split rent with my partner and am still barely scraping by. I do not have any family support and refuse to take out loans for this year (though we will see if I change my mind once next semester rolls around haha). If you can do a year in a lower COL area, I would strongly recommend it

You're paying for health insurance?

 

[jdawg2017]

You're paying for health insurance?

Is this not the norm? As a recent former intern at a fairly well-known site in a large metro I had to pay at least a little bit for my insurance (I think it was roughly $100 per month, including vision and dental). Only one site I interviewed at paid the full amount for their interns’ insurance.

Perhaps I’m an outlier because I always get the best insurance I can because I have a chronic illness…

 

[psyduckies]

Is this not the norm? As a recent former intern at a fairly well-known site in a large metro I had to pay at least a little bit for my insurance (I think it was roughly $100 per month, including vision and dental). Only one site I interviewed at paid the full amount for their interns’ insurance.

Perhaps I’m an outlier because I always get the best insurance I can because I have a chronic illness…

My internship site we also had to pay our health insurance. We could opt out- which most of us did because our wages were so low we qualified for free health insurance through the state.

 

[R. Matey]

Is this not the norm? As a recent former intern at a fairly well-known site in a large metro I had to pay at least a little bit for my insurance (I think it was roughly $100 per month, including vision and dental). Only one site I interviewed at paid the full amount for their interns’ insurance.

Perhaps I’m an outlier because I always get the best insurance I can because I have a chronic illness…

I didn't pay for mine during internship, but our compensation package (UCC at a large R1) was weirdly awesome.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

My internship site we also had to pay our health insurance. We could opt out- which most of us did because our wages were so low we qualified for free health insurance through the state.

IIRC, this was the same for me--insurance was extra and I just risked it and opted out.

 

[WisNeuro]

So, there is paying for all of your insurance, and there is paying a portion of the premium. The latter is not uncommon at all, and will mirror most of your jobs post internship.

 

[LM02]

Is this not the norm? As a recent former intern at a fairly well-known site in a large metro I had to pay at least a little bit for my insurance (I think it was roughly $100 per month, including vision and dental). Only one site I interviewed at paid the full amount for their interns’ insurance.

Perhaps I’m an outlier because I always get the best insurance I can because I have a chronic illness…

Most employers require employees to contribute a certain proportion of the total health insurance premium each pay period. At my employer it is income-based, so the people who make the least pay the lowest proportion (but it's still not zero!). It's quite rare for there to be no employee contribution to a health insurance premium.

 

[psych.meout]

Is this not the norm? As a recent former intern at a fairly well-known site in a large metro I had to pay at least a little bit for my insurance (I think it was roughly $100 per month, including vision and dental). Only one site I interviewed at paid the full amount for their interns’ insurance.

Perhaps I’m an outlier because I always get the best insurance I can because I have a chronic illness…

My internship site (large AMC) paid for our insurance entirely (i.e., zero premiums) and included vision and dental (though the dental wasn't fantastic).

I just started post doc at the same site and have exactly the same insurance setup along with zero premiums.

 

[WisNeuro]

My internship site (large AMC) paid for our insurance entirely (i.e., zero premiums) and included vision and dental (though the dental wasn't fantastic).

I just started post doc at the same site and have exactly the same insurance setup along with zero premiums.

In my experience, this is the exception, as opposed to the rule.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

My internship site (large AMC) paid for our insurance entirely (i.e., zero premiums) and included vision and dental (though the dental wasn't fantastic).

I just started post doc at the same site and have exactly the same insurance setup along with zero premiums.

That's impressive. I didn't ask around during my own time on internship, but don't ever remember hearing about anyone's premiums being completely covered.

 

[psych.meout]

In my experience, this is the exception, as opposed to the rule.

Yeah, I only have my n=1 experience to draw from about this. I've spoken with many of my peers about their internship and post doc experiences but insurance stuff never came up. It was mostly about pay, supervisors, etc.

That's impressive. I didn't ask around during my own time on internship, but don't ever remember hearing about anyone's premiums being completely covered.

I'm very impressed by the entire site. That's why I wanted to stay on for post doc and now I'm in the process of interviewing for a faculty position here as well. For the latter, I got lucky because they just unfroze hiring as I was finishing internship and I made a good impression on my internship supervisors so they were thinking of me for one of the new positions once they were announced.

 

[thebalmofhurtminds]

Yeah, that's fairly rare. One of my friends (chemistry PhD) has a job where they pay 100% for her/family insurance and it is a huge perk. She's very reticent to leave for that alone, it saved her a ton.

 

[PsyDr]

IIRC, we had health insurance taken out of our paychecks. They paid some of it.

My bi weekly paycheck was $1 less than my rent. I worked on my days off, and was poor.

 

[psych.meout]

Yeah, that's fairly rare. One of my friends (chemistry PhD) has a job where they pay 100% for her/family insurance and it is a huge perk. She's very reticent to leave for that alone, it saved her a ton.

Oh yeah, my internship and postdoc site pays for spouse and family health insurance too. I just never used it because my wife already has insurance through work and we don't have any kids yet.

 

[LM02]

Yeah, that's fairly rare. One of my friends (chemistry PhD) has a job where they pay 100% for her/family insurance and it is a huge perk. She's very reticent to leave for that alone, it saved her a ton.

Agreed! The only person I know who has had an employer cover the entire premium for their health insurance was a non-psychologist acquaintance who worked for a health coverage equity non-profit advocacy organization, as it was consistent with their values as an organization. But it is very rare and I think it best to temper expectations in this regard, for internship, postdoc, and also future employment.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Agreed! The only person I know who has had an employer cover the entire premium for their health insurance was a non-psychologist acquaintance who worked for a health coverage equity non-profit advocacy organization, as it was consistent with their values as an organization. But it is very rare and I think it best to temper expectations in this regard, for internship, postdoc, and also future employment.

Agreed. Not to derail the thread, but on the flip side, it's somewhat sobering how expensive the full health insurance payment can be if paying for yourself/your family as an independent contractor/self-employed/etc. (and particularly if you're looking at some of the better coverage plans). The stuff ain't cheap.

 

[Zazulator]

You're paying for health insurance?

Yep! Way too old to be covered by parents, make too much to qualify for Medicaid, unmarried so I cannot be on my partner's insurance, and risk-averse so unwilling to be uninsured . I love hearing that some people have landed in places where insurance is fully covered - I hope that can become more of the norm in the future rather than an amazing exception.

 

[Sanman]

Yep! Way too old to be covered by parents, make too much to qualify for Medicaid, unmarried so I cannot be on my partner's insurance, and risk-averse so unwilling to be uninsured . I love hearing that some people have landed in places where insurance is fully covered - I hope that can become more of the norm in the future rather than an amazing exception.

Unlikely for full coverage to happen any time soon. Are you able to find something subsidized on the exchange?

 

[PsyDr]

Yep! Way too old to be covered by parents, make too much to qualify for Medicaid, unmarried so I cannot be on my partner's insurance, and risk-averse so unwilling to be uninsured . I love hearing that some people have landed in places where insurance is fully covered - I hope that can become more of the norm in the future rather than an amazing exception.

You might look at the exchange, as geographic moves meet the requirements of a qualifying event for subsidy.

When she was doing an internship to switch careers, psygal received some fully subsidized insurance through the exchange that wasn’t Medicaid, but she didn’t pay for it either. Her ophthalmologist was kinda shady, but otherwise her healthcare was decent.

 

[Zazulator]

You might look at the exchange, as geographic moves meet the requirements of a qualifying event for subsidy.

When she was doing an internship to switch careers, psygal received some fully subsidized insurance through the exchange that wasn’t Medicaid, but she didn’t pay for it either. Her ophthalmologist was kinda shady, but otherwise her healthcare was decent.

I will look into this! Thank you for the recommendation!