Applying to PsyD programs

[memiller]

Hello,
I am currently in my last semester of my bachelors degree in applied psychology. I have started to apply to PsyD programs throughout the state of Pennsylvania and others states. Does anyone have any advice they could provide when applying to programs and what their process was like?

A little bit about myself and education.
I have worked 4 and a half years helping support individuals with disabilities and mental health conditions in a group home setting. I also have worked for a year doing in home and community supports with individuals who have intellectual disabilities and mental health conditions.

My GPA at community college was 3.84
I was inducted into Psi Beta, And Phi Theta Kappa.
I was the vice president of the psychology club for a year.
I was also a tutor in psychology for about 4 months.
I completed a research poster in class that was co-authored and was going to present it but then Covid occurred.

My current GPA at my 4 year college is a 3.90
I was the vice president of the psychology club for 1 year
Inducted into Tri Alpha, Alpha sigma Lambda, and Psi Chi.
I also volunteered at a homeless shelter for about a month.

I am a first generation college student and am not too familiar with applying to doctoral programs. Any advice on programs or tips would be appreciated! Thank you.

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[jdawg2017]

Your credentials seem pretty dang solid for being an undergrad. What are your interests in the field, and what about clinical psychology are you particularly interested in vs. other fields r
(e.g., social work)?

Also, is there a reason you’re interested in only PsyD programs vs. PhD programs? It’s not always the case, but many PsyD programs carry significant drawbacks vs. PhD programs… namely a lack of funding and needing to pay exorbitant tuition rates. If you don’t like research and want to do therapy pretty exclusively, there are much shorter and cheaper paths to get there. If the research thing is scaring you off from PhD programs I’d say that while certainly many people who get PhDs in clinical psych do go on to have research be a significant part of their career, I also know tons of people who go fully into clinical practice and/or leadership roles.

Just a few things to think about right now. Also, I’d recommend looking up “Mitch’s Guide for Clinical Psych” online. It’s free and very compressive.

 

[memiller]

Your credentials seem pretty dang solid for being an undergrad. What are your interests in the field, and what about clinical psychology are you particularly interested in vs. other fields r
(e.g., social work)?

Also, is there a reason you’re interested in only PsyD programs vs. PhD programs? It’s not always the case, but many PsyD programs carry significant drawbacks vs. PhD programs… namely a lack of funding and needing to pay exorbitant tuition rates. If you don’t like research and want to do therapy pretty exclusively, there are much shorter and cheaper paths to get there. If the research thing is scaring you off from PhD programs I’d say that while certainly many people who get PhDs in clinical psych do go on to have research be a significant part of their career, I also know tons of people who go fully into clinical practice and/or leadership roles.

Just a few things to think about right now. Also, I’d recommend looking up “Mitch’s Guide for Clinical Psych” online. It’s free and very compressive.

Thank you so much for your kind words and advice that you have provided me. I definitely want to do assessments and evaluations. I believe that it will truly be better for my interests that I enter a doctoral program. I have always been interested in becoming a clinical psychologist in private practice and working with adolescents adults and geriatrics. I am interested in depression, anxiety, BPD, suicidal ideation, and many other conditions!

I have considered applying to PsyD programs because I am interested in a more clinical program. I know that I will still have to write and defend a dissertation, however, I think it’s a great fit for me. I have considered PhD programs but I think they would be much more research oriented than PsyD. I am not very interested in academia either. I am not sure if they have practitioner scientist PhDs but if they do and you know of any let me know. I also have lacked some research experience due to Covid and limited opportunities at my college. I was not sure if I was competitive enough for a PhD!

Thank you.

 

[memiller]

Thank you so much for your kind words and advice that you have provided me. I definitely want to do assessments and evaluations. I believe that it will truly be better for my interests that I enter a doctoral program. I have always been interested in becoming a clinical psychologist in private practice and working with adolescents adults and geriatrics. I am interested in depression, anxiety, BPD, suicidal ideation, and many other conditions!

I have considered applying to PsyD programs because I am interested in a more clinical program. I know that I will still have to write and defend a dissertation, however, I think it’s a great fit for me. I have considered PhD programs but I think they would be much more research oriented than PsyD. I am not very interested in academia either. I am not sure if they have practitioner scientist PhDs but if they do and you know of any let me know. I also have lacked some research experience due to Covid and limited opportunities at my college. I was not sure if I was competitive enough for a PhD!

Thank you.

Do you know any good reputable PsyD programs that you could recommend to apply to? I applied to a handful of them! I know very few offer funding.

 

[PsyDuck90]

The amount of research you have to do in a reputable, small-cohort, university based PsyD is relatively similar to the amount you do in a balanced PhD program. Unless the program bills itself as a Clinical Science PhD program, you’re likely fine. Part of what sets the average clinical psychologist apart from the average masters level clinician is the ability to really understand and parse out the research. The best way to understand research is to learn how to do good research. The vast majority of psych PhDs go on to fully clinical positions. Also, rather than ending up in 6-figures of debt you’ll spend forever paying off, you get paid to attend school. Funded PsyDs exist. But they are about as competitive as the balanced PhD programs.

Your return on investment will likely be much higher if you spend 1-2 years as a research coordinator and then apply rather than applying to programs that will leave you in mountains of debt. This is especially so if you want to go into private practice, where you will not benefit from any of the loan forgiveness programs out there.

ETA: I came from a funded PsyD program, and I am currently on postdoc. Along the way, I have met folks from a variety of programs. Pretty much everyone I’ve met from self-pay PsyDs (which is granted a small N in comparison to how many there are) have pretty much all said they gave up hope of ever buying a house. They are also all very nervous about having to start paying student loans now that they’ve graduated and are not making nearly as much to start as they thought they would.

 

[summerbabe]

I was not sure if I was competitive enough for a PhD!

I think that most applicants experience some version of this and that's totally OK! This is a difficult field to get into and there's a also a decent degree of luck involved.

However, I really want to emphasize @PsyDuck90 advice to consider taking a short period of time to boost your research credentials and CV since the other stuff looks good.

Especially if you're not in a 'I need to start graduate school or bust' type of place in life, which really shouldn't be the case because plenty of people experience major life events like getting married and having kids during graduate school so another 1-2 years shouldn't severely impact your life trajectory. But $150,000+ of debt before you ever make a real paycheck will absolutely do that.

This is very anecdotal, small sample size experience but having reviewed a good chunk of predoctoral internship applications for multiple VA internship programs, I've seen some pretty unqualified applications compared to the rest of the applicant pool from non-funded PsyD programs, including ones from the East Coast that you may be looking at.

So essentially, those people are taking on lots of debt (or using existing financial resources that could be allocated elsewhere) to get a second rate education.

And if you spend a year doing research (which can be sufficient to get a publication and boost your CV), then you can apply to both funded and non-funded programs next year and see where the chips fall. Any program that you're currently interested within the self-pay model in will likely still be there and you might find yourself competitive for some funded ones as well. Good luck!

 

[memiller]

The amount of research you have to do in a reputable, small-cohort, university based PsyD is relatively similar to the amount you do in a balanced PhD program. Unless the program bills itself as a Clinical Science PhD program, you’re likely fine. Part of what sets the average clinical psychologist apart from the average masters level clinician is the ability to really understand and parse out the research. The best way to understand research is to learn how to do good research. The vast majority of psych PhDs go on to fully clinical positions. Also, rather than ending up in 6-figures of debt you’ll spend forever paying off, you get paid to attend school. Funded PsyDs exist. But they are about as competitive as the balanced PhD programs.

Your return on investment will likely be much higher if you spend 1-2 years as a research coordinator and then apply rather than applying to programs that will leave you in mountains of debt. This is especially so if you want to go into private practice, where you will not benefit from any of the loan forgiveness programs out there.

ETA: I came from a funded PsyD program, and I am currently on postdoc. Along the way, I have met folks from a variety of programs. Pretty much everyone I’ve met from self-pay PsyDs (which is granted a small N in comparison to how many there are) have pretty much all said they gave up hope of ever buying a house. They are also all very nervous about having to start paying student loans now that they’ve graduated and are not making nearly as much to start as they thought they would.

Thank you so much for this advice. I appreciate it. If I may ask, which funded PsyD program do you attend?

You really have provided great advice!! Thank you.

 

[chicandtoughness]

There are definitely clinically-oriented PhD programs as well! I would recommend getting the Insider's Guide to Clinical and Counseling Psychology Programs, it rates every single APA-accredited program on a scale of 1 (very clinical) to 7 (very research), and you can align your application that way! The app process is such a crapshoot and so few people are accepted each year, you want to make sure you're casting a wide net in programs that are a good match (please identify profs for research matches!!)

 

[memiller]

Thank you. I appreciate it. I think I have that book but I have to look for it. Do you know of any off the top of your head that you can think of? I appreciate it!

 

[chicandtoughness]

Thank you. I appreciate it. I think I have that book but I have to look for it. Do you know of any off the top of your head that you can think of? I appreciate it!

Well, I'd suggest you narrow down by research interest/PI match first, and then look at clinical/research split. Even most (but not all) of the clinically oriented programs will still match you to a PI and that should be your first priority.

But just as a couple examples off of my somewhat outdated copy (this is the 2018/2019 version):

University of Detroit-Mercy (Clinical) -- 2/7
Hofstra University (Clinical) -- 3/7
Colorado State (Counseling) -- 3/7
Univ of North Texas (Counseling) -- 3/7

A large majority of the PhD programs are 4/7 though, which is equal emphasis in both clinical and research, and I think if you want to go the doctorate route you will appreciate the balanced approach in the long run. If you know you don't like research, then you can use the book to steer clear of the 6's and 7's :')