Areas in California suitable for new grad pharmacist?

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apex8

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Calling upon all Californians: new grad pharmacist + recent grad nurse in need of recommendations on areas look into in California.

I'm from NYC, where COL and all is just ridiculous and would like to explore opportunities in other areas, California is at the top of the charts for my significant other and I, but need some ideas as to areas where we would most likely be able to both find employment. We don't need to be in any of the big cities, prefer decent COL area, with decent schooling districts.

Any ideas/suggestions and words of wisdom would be highly appreciated!

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Hi, I'm from Sacramento. It has a pretty decent salary to COL ratio, but the job market here is very saturated for pharmacists.
Fairfield might be a good place to start, it is located between the Bay Area and Sacramento. COL is cheap and the job market is not as bad as Sacramento.

P.S. have you looked into Oregon? There is no sales tax and the job market as a whole is much better than California.
 
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I'll have a long-ish reply when I get home. But need more info...retail vs inpatient for you? Nursing...any specific area of practice? Do both of you need jobs at the same time? Can you move with her income alone sustaining for now and you work per dim?


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Hi, I'm from Sacramento. It has a pretty decent salary to COL ratio, but the job market here is very saturated for pharmacists.
Fairfield might be a good place to start, it is located between the Bay Area and Sacramento. COL is cheap and the job market is not as bad as Sacramento.

P.S. have you looked into Oregon? There is no sales tax and the job market as a whole is much better than California.

Thanks for the insight! I will look into the areas you mentioned. As far as Oregon, I haven't explored that idea as of yet. I will certainly add it to my list of places to look into though!

I'll have a long-ish reply when I get home. But need more info...retail vs inpatient for you? Nursing...any specific area of practice? Do both of you need jobs at the same time? Can you move with her income alone sustaining for now and you work per dim?

Thx Confetti! As far as setting of practice, I'm open to either retail, inpatient, am care, etc. I'm not really going to be picky at first, especially when moving to a new location. I would prefer non-retail if possible but I have the most experience in retail, so that's likely where I would have the greatest opportunity in landing a job.

As far as nursing, my SO currently works in Med-Surg at a respectable hospital in NYC. She would be open to med-surg, labor & delivery, surgery, etc. Mainly an issue of Nurse-to-patient ratio.

As far as moving with her income, she's already working somewhere right now, whereas I just have a retail job lined up in NYC for now. I've considered:
a) working for a while to save up some first before moving
b) looking for work in CA straight out of school and getting set up first and then having her come over when she secures work as well
c) both moving out at the same time (with at least one of us having a job in the new location)
 
You're looking to escape a high living expenses and your top choice is California? Kind of funny, but I wish you good luck. If you find a job they do tend to pay more there than average, although I'm not sure how NYC compares.
 
You're looking to escape a high living expenses and your top choice is California? Kind of funny, but I wish you good luck. If you find a job they do tend to pay more there than average, although I'm not sure how NYC compares.

Yea...haha I know Cali isn't the best option in terms of escaping the high COL, but as much as I'd be happy in some other areas, I would enjoy a nice balance between COL + good location. The SO likes cali a lot too which is another motivating factor... Which leads me to look for somewhere in Cali that could potential provide the balance we seek.
 
Thx Confetti! As far as setting of practice, I'm open to either retail, inpatient, am care, etc. I'm not really going to be picky at first, especially when moving to a new location. I would prefer non-retail if possible but I have the most experience in retail, so that's likely where I would have the greatest opportunity in landing a job.

As far as nursing, my SO currently works in Med-Surg at a respectable hospital in NYC. She would be open to med-surg, labor & delivery, surgery, etc. Mainly an issue of Nurse-to-patient ratio.

As far as moving with her income, she's already working somewhere right now, whereas I just have a retail job lined up in NYC for now. I've considered:
a) working for a while to save up some first before moving
b) looking for work in CA straight out of school and getting set up first and then having her come over when she secures work as well
c) both moving out at the same time (with at least one of us having a job in the new location)

Okay, here we gooooo....

First, you gotta stop calling it "Cali." It's a dead giveaway that you're not from around here, if I hear/read it, it's usually someone from Oklahoma trying to sound cool. That aside...

Second, you have to ask yourself, what about California did your SO really like? If she answers sun/beach/sand, you'll want to narrow your search specifically to Southern California. Technically speaking, yes, we're the same state; functionally speaking, we act like different states...no...different countries. Completely different culture, economic bases, language, recreation activities, driving habits, and other proclivities. Someone seeking sun/beach/sand will be sorely disappointed relocating to the SF Bay Area (aka "The Bay") behind the fog line like Cloud City in Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back; likewise, someone hoping for a bohemian and liberal/progressive haven will be utterly disappointed moving behind the Orange Curtain of Newport Beach, CA.

Someone who fell in love with the bucolic hills of Napa Valley while admiring the way a deep cabernet sauvignon swirls around a wine glass will curl up and cry in the Los Angeles urban jungle.

Okay, with that aside...I'll focus more on Northern California since that's what I know and where I'm at. As a new pharmacist/new graduate, your options are MUCH more limited than your currently employed SO. Oh, by law, nurse ratio cannot exceed 1:5 in California for Med/Surg (1:2 for critical care). Just eyeballing this situation, it's going to be much more likely that she will establish FT employment first and you will come along for the ride and contribute income on a per-diem/locum basis.

Put it this way, PM me and I can get your SO's resume in front of a hiring manager and, assuming she's got about 6 months of experience, is generally competent, and has a BSN, get her hired and started within 2-3 weeks. You on the other hand, without a PGY-1 or at least 2-3 years of inpatient/clinical experience, I'd direct you to one of my recruiter friends that helps fill retail or closed door pharmacy spots.

Very unlikely you will get an am care position (those aren't particularly plentiful, even w/ residency), retail will be most abundant, followed by inpatient jobs if you have at least some experience.

Picking a Location
Setting your employment prospects aside (for now), the #2 driver of housing costs in a particular area are going to be school district rankings. Top tier districts will, by my estimation, add about $200,000-$250,000 in price to a similarly sized/appointed house in a lower performing district. This is tricky to tease out, as the #1 driver of costs = proximity to job centers in San Francisco or San Jose.

If you're shopping on school district alone - have a look at Alameda County along the I-680 corridor (San Ramon, Danville, Pleasanton) or the eastern part of Contra Costa County (Walnut Creek, Concord, Pleasant Hill). These are roughly 35-45 minutes outside of San Francisco, extremely desirable, and extremely expensive.

Your next "out of the way" spot for school district would be Marin County along US-101 north of the Golden Gate Bridge. It's woodsy, quaint, and full of damn anti-vaxx ******* moms. Also very expensive, but pharmacist job opportunities here tend to be a little better. Cities include San Rafael, San Anselmo, Mill Valley, Novato). Further north is Santa Rosa, more out of the way, cheaper, and better job opportunities there. It also rains more there in the winter, oh well.

The peninsula is expensive, located between SF and Santa Clara County (aka Silicon Valley). The I-280 corridor runs by Stanford University and through some of the most expensive regions in the state. I like it because, if you drive along 280 at the right time, the fog rolls over the hills like a giant cauldron and engulfs the entire area within an hour or two just before sunset. It's pretty stunning. Areas include San Bruno, Woodside, and San Mateo through Daly City.

Staying out of the Bay Area
If you got depressed looking at costs of living in these areas, don't worry... I have a third option. Stay out of the Bay Area and head east. Start in Solano County (Vallejo - Fairfield - Vacaville) and progress east toward Sacramento along I-80 and branch toward the foothills a bit along I-80 and US-50, and go north/south on I-5....Roseville, Rocklin, Folsom, Elk Grove, Natomas... Sure, these places don't have the cachet of their proximity to San Francisco, but your costs of living are MUCH better out here.

Sure, it's much hotter in the summer (100's, vs. 55 degrees in SF, 75 along the bay), and yes, the schools aren't as high-powered (as in....dual-immersion Mandarin and computer programming are NOT standard out here vs. in San Jose), but if you do some research and/or are open to Catholic education, your future kids will be fine. Roseville, Rocklin, Granite Bay, and surrounding areas in particular are havens where people cashed out of SF and planted roots. You'll find lots of like-minded professionals with big houses on big lots here. The restaurant scene is also seeing an influx of SF/Oakland ex-pats seeking lower rents. The schools in these 3 cities/areas are pretty good.

Also, I will contradict the post above and state that the job market in Sacramento for pharmacists is much better than in the Bay Area. I say this because all of my recruiter calls/emails are for positions in the Sacramento area.

Additionally, there are many areas in Sacramento that I would not recommend you set foot in. That's a whole 'nother post, but look before you leap. The added bonus here is you can get settled pretty well and then contemplate a move closer to the Bay Area if that's your bag of chips later on. Kids here usually don't start pre-school education programs until age 3 or so, so you have some time.

The Fringes
You might see a lot of postings for jobs way out in the fringes. Be careful, these are freaking far from civilization. They're practically not even in California anymore.

Extreme far north - Eureka, Crescent City, Redding.... this is practically Southern Oregon. Be aware also that these areas are actively trying to secede from the rest of the state. So if you see state flags with two "X's" in a seal that says "State of Jefferson," that's what that is.

Central Valley - Anything south of Stockton is going to be difficult to recruit for. It used to be no one wanted to work there, but things have changed, so they're getting picky (lots more grads to choose from). You'll see ads for Fresno, Visalia, and Bakersfield. It's hot, dusty, and just...too far from anything to be worth it. Housing is cheap, though. Can't speak for the school districts.

At least in Bakersfield, you're only 2hrs north of Los Angeles...definitely an easy drive if you want to decamp for the weekend.
 
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Southern California
I've lived in so-cal for many years and loved it, but damn it's much harder to just live down there for a lot of reasons that I chose to ignore in my youth.

The average pay in the Los Angeles/Orange County metropol is anywhere between 10%-20% lower than similar positions in Northern California. This is mostly attributable to the huge supply of pharmacists residing in these two counties. You'll do better in the fringes, you pay for the privilege of being in the center of everything.

Avoid heading east (Riverside County), all the pollution generated in LA/OC pushes east and gets trapped against the hills there. Hello respiratory issues! Jobs are difficult to come by. Put it this way, if I tried looking for a job down there now, assuming I'm willing to take the pay cut, it would be extremely difficult to find one, even with a strong network. We had difficulty placing a well talented 3 year experienced inpatient pharmacist w PGY-1 training down there...unbelievable.

San Diego is worse for job market, but a better place to live, IMO.

Central Coast
Cities along the coast from Santa Barbara in the south to Santa Cruz in the north comprise the central coast...it's very sparsely populated vs. the other parts of the state, and generally very expensive. Great if you're a retiree who likes to play golf and stare at the ocean all day.
 
As far as moving with her income, she's already working somewhere right now, whereas I just have a retail job lined up in NYC for now. I've considered:
a) working for a while to save up some first before moving
b) looking for work in CA straight out of school and getting set up first and then having her come over when she secures work as well
c) both moving out at the same time (with at least one of us having a job in the new location)

I might be repeating myself in my big ass post, but you need to add option d) that she comes out here first to establish and you come along secondarily and be prepared for some level of unemployment. She will get a job, and she will get a job in an area of her choice (generally speaking, not knowing all of her credentials and details). She will be the bedrock that will pay for housing, food, and other necessities while you struggle to find something to contribute to the household general ledger.

option a) is not a bad one, but I find that it's harder to move once you've been in a place for a longer period of time. Mentally and physically (you just accumulate a bunch of crap, maybe you had to buy a new car, now you have to ship it vs. if you had a crappy car before you can just sell it and move).

option b) this is an idea for you, but one that isn't high on my "will succeed" list. If you do, it'll be in kind of a remote area, if at all.

c) this is like my option d...actually, n/m you already addressed it. Yeah, she'll get the job first, just make sure the house is clean and you cooked dinner 🙂

If you want to move this discussion offline and discuss your SO in detail in private, feel free to PM me.

EDIT: formatting error, closed bracket for quote
 
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Here's a shorter version:

Cost of living: SF > LA > SD
Job opportunities in retail: LA/SD > SF
Beach, sun, hiking: LA/SD
Urban lifestyle (rails): SF
Food: LA = SF
Hollywood: LA
Tech: SF

Check out Santa Barbara too. And yes, LA and SF are very different...culture, attitude, lifestyle. We do have one thing in common tho - we dont care about what people in other states do or think about us. Actually, we rarely think about you guys. We don't live indoor for 9 out of 12 months. We have things to do.
 
Southern California
I've lived in so-cal for many years and loved it, but damn it's much harder to just live down there for a lot of reasons that I chose to ignore in my youth.

just curious, what are the reasons?
 
oh and dont forget about the diversity. You will always feel welcome here.

I also remember California has more nobel prize winners than any other states. Most millionaires too.
 
So it's impossible to get an inpatient job without experience in California? Even for an overnight position?
 
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Also, I will contradict the post above and state that the job market in Sacramento for pharmacists is much better than in the Bay Area. I say this because all of my recruiter calls/emails are for positions in the Sacramento area.

I spoke to some pharmacists and new grads in the Sacramento area and they all told me that Sacramento is very saturated, mainly because of cheap COL. (new grads have loans to pay) The Sacramento recruiter calls you have been receiving, what types of positions are they for?
 
So it's impossible to get an inpatient job without experience in California? Even for an overnight position?

Our hospital only hires residency trained pharmacists, even for overnight. However, we are in a very desirable location (Palo Alto). I have heard of a new grad getting a hospital position in Sacramento.
 
Avoid heading east (Riverside County), all the pollution generated in LA/OC pushes east and gets trapped against the hills there. Hello respiratory issues!

Never understood why Riverside County gets so much hate. Nice, big houses and plenty of parking everywhere. Oh- and no shady/homeless people like there is on every corner in LA. Less than an hour drive to the beaches or the city too.
 
Never understood why Riverside County gets so much hate. Nice, big houses and plenty of parking everywhere. Oh- and no shady/homeless people like there is on every corner in LA. Less than an hour drive to the beaches or the city too.

Because every time I go there, I can't see the big R on the hill due to pollution and it feels like I'm living in a smog bank.

I imagine that's what COPD feels like.

But I lived in Newport for a stretch in what amounts to a packed frat house, but we had a rooftop deck with fresh ocean breezes. I might be biased.


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So it's impossible to get an inpatient job without experience in California? Even for an overnight position?

Fringes and areas away from population centers, you might...depending on your credentials/school.


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I spoke to some pharmacists and new grads in the Sacramento area and they all told me that Sacramento is very saturated, mainly because of cheap COL. (new grads have loans to pay) The Sacramento recruiter calls you have been receiving, what types of positions are they for?

Oncology pharmacists
Mid-management
Home infusion
Closed door long term care


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@confettiflyer , your posts are so much more than I expected and I am extremely grateful for all the information and insight you've shared. I will be PM'ing you soon.

@BMBiology , Thanks for the info as well. As far as diversity, coming from NYC, it would certainly be nice to be in a place that is equally diversified.
 
just curious, what are the reasons?

Traffic - it never mattered to me because I always lived within 10mins of school and work in Irvine. If I sat in traffic headed to LA or SD, it was always with friends and for leisure travel. I was much more flexible in dinner plans in LA (I'd leave after 7-8pm and get dinner at 10pm and my friends were cool with that).

Looking at that now...I guess it's not that I'm ignoring it, it's that life changes. If I transplanted myself back to OC as-is as an older pharmacist with a job (and not a student or super flexible job), this would just irritate me. I'd never go anywhere outside OC on a week/work night.

COL - I was going to type a long response about housing costs, but they're similar up here. I just was never aware of the true cost because I always lived with roommates frat-house style. I ignored them this way.

Superficiality - I would never show up at South Coast Plaza without some douchey AX shirt or other high end clothing. Ever. IT'S THE FREAKING MALL! I didn't realize how superficial I had become until I left, that place transforms you in very subtle ways...I ignored it because I loved it, and I loved money, and I loved the trappings of money.

Looking back, I can't believe I lived and thought that way.




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EDIT: typos
 
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For all the talk about saturation in California, sure, the job prospects for a new grad aren't great in the large population centers, but at least there are a good absolute number of positions available, this being a state of almost 40 million people, so getting something FT shouldn't be that bad if you don't rule out retail and you don't limit your search to the Bay Area or LA/OC or SD.

The Sacramento area is not that bad for reasons discussed previously. Anecdotally most of the new grads in my company are from Touro or Northstate; even if you are floating you're getting 40 hours. Sacramento is often defined in terms of how worse it is compared to the Bay Area but the weather is pretty good compared to the rest of the U.S. (mild winters and hot, dry summers where at least it cools down at night compared to Arizona or Vegas) and the cost of housing is better. It't not like Sacramento is in the middle of nowhere. Proximity to Tahoe, proximity to the Bay Area, not-terrible COL compared to the other major urban centers in California.
 
I think if you are serious about moving down here, do it soon. The job availability will change once KGI, chapman, and central California school graduates their innaugral classes.

I think it's interesting how opinions differ when discussing employment in certain areas. I guess certain people are more marketable than others.

If it were me, I'd move to inland empire, it's closer to la, where I'd want to end up. I'd network while working in inland empire and then try to look for something in LA.
 
I think if you are serious about moving down here, do it soon. The job availability will change once KGI, chapman, and central California school graduates their innaugral classes.

I will definitely keep this in mind. When will these schools be graduating those classes?
 
A very good source told me that Kaiser just on-boarded about 50 pharmacists somewhere in the north/east bay area. I have no idea where you can find 50 pharmacists in the middle of January/February, and I'm thinking a lot of these are going to be per diem/short hour positions.... but the source was a close RN friend of mine who just got hired at Kaiser and said she counted about 40-50 pharmacists in her orientation group.

Just thought I'd toss that out into the mix. I don't know what positions these are (outpatient? am care? inpatient? mix?).
 
It't not like Sacramento is in the middle of nowhere. Proximity to Tahoe, proximity to the Bay Area, not-terrible COL compared to the other major urban centers in California.

Two hour drive to this:
heavenly-lake-tahoe-mtn.jpg


Tahoe <3
 
I think if you are serious about moving down here, do it soon. The job availability will change once KGI, chapman, and central California school graduates their innaugral classes.

I think it's interesting how opinions differ when discussing employment in certain areas. I guess certain people are more marketable than others.

If it were me, I'd move to inland empire, it's closer to la, where I'd want to end up. I'd network while working in inland empire and then try to look for something in LA.

I discussed this with him in PM, but the western edge of Riverside county might be a good fit in terms of a balance between commute and job opportunities. He can anti-commute to San Bernardino, but he has easier access to South LA County (Cerritos/Long Beach/Torrance)/OC along 91 (or even the 241/261 toll roads) without having to move again (though he'd probably want to after a year or two of commute direction traffic).

If he moves directly to deep IE, he's sort of locked in to that area (though at a much lower cost).
 
I discussed this with him in PM, but the western edge of Riverside county might be a good fit in terms of a balance between commute and job opportunities. He can anti-commute to San Bernardino, but he has easier access to South LA County (Cerritos/Long Beach/Torrance)/OC along 91 (or even the 241/261 toll roads) without having to move again (though he'd probably want to after a year or two of commute direction traffic).

If he moves directly to deep IE, he's sort of locked in to that area (though at a much lower cost).

My only exposure to Inland Empire (IE) is the area by UC Riverside. I had couple of HS friends who attended the school and I visited them a dozen times or so. The climate is different than LA, of course (about 7-10 degrees hotter in the summer). The area is full of trees and I thought the smog wasn't that bad, when I was there. Best of all, the commute was about 1.5 hours without traffic from LA. Again, If it were me, I'd settle down there for now, enjoy the proximity to LA on your days off. In the meantime, aggressively apply for jobs in LA. If you end up working for a Chain, you might even attempt to get a transfer to a different district.
 
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