At risk for non-renewel via ACGME...need advice and guidance...

[Doctor_Strange]

Hi there,

Here is the short and dirty: I took my COMLEX Level 3 in March during PGY-2 year and the score will be released to me May 18th. Most take it during PGY-1, but I was allowed to take it during PGY-2, however, I delayed it since I wasn't ready initially beginning of PGY-2 year. My program told me that per ACGME I have to have a passing score to move onto PGY-3. If it is a failure, they won't renew my contract.

What options do I have afterwards? My PD had told me to take it during PGY-2, but never specified when and never wrote it down. I apparently signed a document on this electronic portal that I agreed to this (it had a bunch of different bullet points on it) from our PC (routine document).

I don't think I failed. Never failed my Step 1/2 or COMLEX 1/2. I studied and did a whole q-bank. >3rd %ile is pass so I think I will be fine but still.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[smq123]

Does it have to be the COMLEX? Or would they promote you with a passing Step 3 score, even if you failed COMLEX 3?

 

[rokshana]

Hi there,

Here is the short and dirty: I took my COMLEX Level 3 in March during PGY-2 year and the score will be released to me May 18th. Most take it during PGY-1, but I was allowed to take it during PGY-2, however, I delayed it since I wasn't ready initially beginning of PGY-2 year. My program told me that per ACGME I have to have a passing score to move onto PGY-3. If it is a failure, they won't renew my contract.

What options do I have afterwards? My PD had told me to take it during PGY-2, but never specified when and never wrote it down. I apparently signed a document on this electronic portal that I agreed to this (it had a bunch of different bullet points on it) from our PC (routine document).

I don't think I failed. Never failed my Step 1/2 or COMLEX 1/2. I studied and did a whole q-bank. >3rd %ile is pass so I think I will be fine but still.

unless new, that’s not an ACGME rule.
I didn’t take my step 3 until my 3rd year.

 

[GoSpursGo]

I wonder if this isn't ACGME but instead is their own GME.

Well... I think there really aren't a ton of great options if you failed. To the point that I would just function under the assumption that you passed, because it's bad if you didn't.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

I wonder if this isn't ACGME but instead is their own GME.

Well... I think there really aren't a ton of great options if you failed. To the point that I would just function under the assumption that you passed, because it's bad if you didn't.

Yeah, I am just being neurotic I think. COMLEX Level 3 is a different ball game than Step 3 -- all I need to score is >3rd %ile and my other exams were basically 50th %ile.

I was just surprised to hear this. I thought there would at least be a remediation or probation period to allow a retake, but I guess not.

Edit: In the time I posted I learned it is in fact my institutional policy, not ACGME. I was told it supersedes ACGME...

 

[GoSpursGo]

Yeah, I am just being neurotic I think. COMLEX Level 3 is a different ball game than Step 3 -- all I need to score is >3rd %ile and my other exams were basically 50th %ile.

I was just surprised to hear this. I thought there would at least be a remediation or probation period to allow a retake, but I guess not.

Edit: In the time I posted I learned it is in fact my institutional policy, not ACGME. I was told it supersedes ACGME...

I suspect your institution got burned by a resident (or multiple residents) who delayed taking step 3/level 3 and then either never took it or failed without enough time to retake, hence the institutional rule. And in that respect, if most people take it during PGY-1, you've sort of already eaten into that "probation" period that most would use if they fail the first time around.

Of course, hopefully this is all a moot point and you passed.

 

[Prehealth1011]

You didn't fail COMLEX 3. 350 is a 3rd percentile score

 

[HemeOncHopeful19]

You probably passed but take it as a lesson to read everything you sign for the rest of your life and this situation will end up a net win.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

You didn't fail COMLEX 3. 350 is a 3rd percentile score

Yeah, very true. I freaked out when I wrote this post but after really thinking about it...I studied as much as I could over a few months and literally 3rd percentile is passing. I don't think I performed that incompetently on test day. Maybe 15th percentile or something not great...but scoring 2nd percentile or lower...nah

 

[Iamnew2]

unless new, that’s not an ACGME rule.
I didn’t take my step 3 until my 3rd year.

Not ACGME per se, but a lot of programs do that - depending on the state, for example, CA you need a full license by 3rd year so if you don't pass then that would mean the program might not renew you. I think it's ridiculous, but it's like that at a number of programs.

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

Not ACGME per se, but a lot of programs do that - depending on the state, for example, CA you need a full license by 3rd year so if you don't pass then that would mean the program might not renew you. I think it's ridiculous, but it's like that at a number of programs.

Same in Pennsylvania. You can't get a training license for PGY3 unless you've passed Step 3.

 

[j4pac]

Almost nobody fails COMLEX Step 3. The bottom 3rd percentile of DOs typically know who they are. They’re the folks that had to scratch and claw to even get to that point….usually failing other Steps/remediations/etc

 

[dozitgetchahi]

I think it’s really unlikely that you failed COMLEX level 3…the curve is very gentle, probably because people don’t study for it much. Level 3 was the board test I studied for the least - basically crammed for a week or two by reading boards and wards and doing a qbank - and I somehow did by far the best on it vs any other step (896), which was completely unexpected.

Who knows, you might have even knocked it out of the park. I wasn’t expecting a powerhouse score by any means.

 

[hallowmann]

Yeah, I am just being neurotic I think. COMLEX Level 3 is a different ball game than Step 3 -- all I need to score is >3rd %ile and my other exams were basically 50th %ile.

I was just surprised to hear this. I thought there would at least be a remediation or probation period to allow a retake, but I guess not.

Edit: In the time I posted I learned it is in fact my institutional policy, not ACGME. I was told it supersedes ACGME...

This is a very common institutional GME policy. The programs I was familiar with required either by mid-2nd or before 3rd year to do it.

You didn't fail though. I studied 1.5 wks, took it in March of intern year, and scored something like 150 pts above my prior highest COMLEX level scores.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

Just a quick update: I passed thank God. 518. Not my best outing, but I do not care whatsoever lol