Attrition

[Arcan57]

We just had a new grad leave our group less than a month in, leaving us to cover all the shifts already scheduled for August. Anyone else either left or had somebody leave this early after residency?

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[AmoryBlaine]

Annecdotally I know several very new grads (1-3 years) who are looking for a way out...

 

[GiJoe]

why in the world? EM is the best kept secret in all of medicine.

 

[docB]

Annecdotally I know several very new grads (1-3 years) who are looking for a way out...

A way out of their current job or a way out of medicine? There are a lot of old grads looking for a way out of medicine.

why in the world? EM is the best kept secret in all of medicine.

Yeah EM is one of the better places to be in medicine, if you have to be in medicine.

 

[GeneralVeers]

Every time I try to get out, they keep pulling me back in.

 

[DoctorMedic]

kind of like being really really drunk and you feel that person keep pulling you towards the ground, same thing with EM right?!

 

[Septo Shock]

We just had a new grad leave our group less than a month in, leaving us to cover all the shifts already scheduled for August. Anyone else either left or had somebody leave this early after residency?

Why did he/she leave the program? Got fired? Couldn't handle EM? Lost interest? Preggos?

 

[Phledge]

why in the world? EM is the best kept secret in all of medicine.

If it's such a great secret, how come there are currently 196 people viewing the EM forum? (As compared to FM's 4.)

 

[gutonc]

why in the world? EM is the best kept secret in all of medicine.

Anecdotally, there were quite a few people in my med school class who really shouldn't have been in medicine but felt like, since they'd already finished school, they might as well do something medical. And since EM sucks a lot less than most other specialties, they went for it. They weren't any happier in EM than in medicine in general but it was a path of relatively low resistance.

I lost track of most of those people but I can name half a dozen who were in that group, went into EM and probably aren't practicing any longer.

 

[deleted65604]

I noticed this same trend. People choose EM for "lifestyle", and realize that on occasion, our job sucks, really bad.

Expect any job that pays well over 100$/hour to make you pay with blood, sweat, and tears.

 

[gutonc]

Expect any job that pays well over 100$/hour to make you pay with blood, sweat, and tears.

Agreed...aside from derm path, there's no free lunch.

 

[Megalofyia]

What is this about derm path?

 

[DoctorMedic]

dermatology and pathology are two specialties that pay well and have nice cushy lifestyles. i mean honestly how many dermatological emergencies do you think a dermatologist will get called in for?

 

[Arcan57]

Unfortunately they weren't around long enough for me to get a good sense of the issues involved. Of note, this was not talking about someone quitting EM residency (a relatively common occurence), but someone leaving a group 1 month into being a new attending (which I suspect is more rare, but have no hard data to back up). The statistics always quote a high attrition rate for new grads changing employers within two years but I am curious what the shape of that curve looks like.

 

[DoctorMedic]

grass is always greener on the other side. maybe a job in the area they wanted just opened up, guess you'll probably never know

 

[kungfufishing]

have you considered that your group might be made up entirely of A-holes?

completely kidding.


That is pretty weird - I mean, had the dude even collected a check yet? At the end of my first month out (uh, 12 and a HALF months ago...) I was really still just proud to be here and hoped I could become an asset even though I didn't know where all the rooms were or the names of non hot nurses. Unless there is something really unusually bad about the job it must be the above - maybe there was another job that opened up? I mean, a month isn't enough time to even figure out what you hate about a place.

 

[gutonc]

dermatology and pathology are two specialties that pay well and have nice cushy lifestyles. i mean honestly how many dermatological emergencies do you think a dermatologist will get called in for?

Actually, I meant dermatopathology. It's a fellowship after derm or path (although most fellowships are in derm depts and as such, take mostly derm applicants) and it pays a stupid amount of money for a minimal amt of work.

It's also mind-numbingly dull.

 

[bulgethetwine]

"... even though I didn't know... the names of non hot nurses

Haha some names are just easier to remember.

 

[DoctorMedic]

so are the nicknames you make up for the hot nurses

 

[asmallchild]

Actually, I meant dermatopathology. It's a fellowship after derm or path (although most fellowships are in derm depts and as such, take mostly derm applicants) and it pays a stupid amount of money for a minimal amt of work.

It's also mind-numbingly dull.

Like all good things in medicine though, it's slated to end (decreasing reimbursements on the horizon)

The work may appear to be minimal but the reason why they're able to rake in the dough is through incredible volume much like radiology (of course, you could argue successfully that whipping through more slides on the microscope stage technically shouldn't count as hard work. A lot of the more experienced dermatopathologists don't even switch to higher power and can make the diagnosis just at scanning magnification)

And even as someone interested in derm, I'll tell you even I find it mind-numbingly dull at times

 

[Aloha Kid]

Heck, I'm a new grad, and after my first pay check I thought I could retire!

 

[Arcan57]

I remember that first paycheck. Mostly the month and a half gap between the end of residency and getting paid for July. I probably would have moonlit more if I had realized that it was going to be a month and a half, that would include moving and my son being born, without a pay check.

 

[La Fiera]

We had an attending walk out halfway through his first shift at our program- said he couldn't handle the place!
Another one called was hired, worked 2 days then called in sick the next 3, and pretty much just quit from there!

Makes me wonder how I've made it over 2 years (but as a resident)! Maybe I'm a secret sadist?

 

[Arcan57]

Unless you've moonlit there, it's difficult to get a sense of what it's actually like attending at a particular ED. You can look at stats, but they can be misleading. You know 4 pts/hr will suck but 2 pts/hr may be a breeze, it may be hell. Was it a low or mid-volume ED that has grown but hasn't adjusted staffing? How difficult (and time-consuming) is it to admit patients? All of these are variables that may not be apparent. I still think its a punk move to quit with a month worth of shifts needing to be filled.