Bad Idea?

[VetMom]

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I was planning on taking Organic Chemistry I and II over the summer. I am hearing a lot of horror stories about Organic chemistry and I was wondering what some of your thought were. It this a horrible idea? Should I wait to start it next fall and take fill in classes over the summer?

 

[MeowMix]

I wouldn't classify organic as a guaranteed horrific experience. It could be just fine.

What would be different between fall and summer? More time to study?

 

[VetMom]

I tend to do better in summer courses because I am limited to only a couple of classes that I can really focus on. I hope that this is the case. However, with O Chem. I heard that there is a lot of memorization which requires more time. I don't know, I'm kind of at odds.

 

[MeowMix]

Students often focus on memorization to learn Organic, but actually the better way is to understand the basic principles of what makes reactions happen, and where they happen: positive and negative charge, and how atoms of different elements hold on to or give up charge. If you get this down, you will fly through Organic.

Memorization doesn't necessarily take a lot of time; it is my primary technique for last-minute cramming during med school, where there is no time for conceptual learning.

 

[Beast11]

I was planning on taking Organic Chemistry I and II over the summer. I am hearing a lot of horror stories about Organic chemistry and I was wondering what some of your thought were. It this a horrible idea? Should I wait to start it next fall and take fill in classes over the summer?

You really need to tell us your envisioned timetables-how much time in undergrad, when taking the MCAT, when applying, etc. etc. Focusing on one class at a time (even in the summer) is much like the med experience, so it might be good preparation. But don't expect to have a "do-over/get out of jail free card" (i.e. hate doing Org1, do badly, and then decide to slow down)

Short answer. Doable-yes. Recommended-no. You need to gauge your dedication.

In any event-good luck!

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

I took Organic Chem. 1 and 2 in the summer and got As in both. On the first day (of each) my professor's recommendation was that, if you didn't have 40 hours total to devote to the class per week, it might not be a good idea to take it in the summer because of the [greatly] compressed schedule. Including lectures, I probably did end up putting in close to that amount of time per week. At the end of the day, it's you who knows your academic ability more than anyone here. Organic Chemistry is not "magically more difficult," but it is probably different from anything that you have seen so far (i.e. not much recycled from High School Chemistry of General Chemistry,) which is my speculation about why many find it so difficult. <shrug> Best of luck to you!

 

[gman33]

I'd only do this if you plan on spending most of your summer working on Orgo. The material isn't that conceptually difficult, but you need to have a lot of time to work through problems. You probably need 40+ hours a week outside of lecture time in a compressed summer schedule. If you have the time, go ahead, but don't go in thinking you can be do well in less time. Most of the people I know who did poor in this class, simply didn't put in the needed time. Also, get to know your teacher. Use his/her office hours and get a tutor if needed.

Search the forums for tips on how to study for Orgo.

 

[njbmd]

I tend to recommend that my undergraduate students NOT take any of the pre-med prerequisites during the summer sessions. The reason for this recommendation is that you need to have sufficient depth and breadth of your pre-med coursework in order to do well on the Medical College Admissions Test (MCAT). The summer courses go very quickly and most students don't get the knowledge saturation that they need.

If you are in a great hurry to get through your coursework, take some general education requirements during the summer and leave the pre-med pre-reqs for the regular terms. Of course, for some students, this isn't much of an issue but for the majority, summer pre-med pre-req coursework is not adequate.

 

[VetMom]

I'm pretty much an extreme non-trad. I'm planning on finishing my undergrad May '09. I don't plan on taking the MCAT until then as well. (Which I know is weird, but that is how things worked out for me) I'm worried that if I wait until next fall to start Organic Chemistry, then I will be taking the MCAT while I am still finishing up the tail end of Organic Chemistry II. This is why I wanted to take it over the summer. I also wanted to have a lot of time to be fully prepared to take the MCAT. Do you think that if I take Oragnic Chem. I in the summer and take Organic Chem. II in the fall, that I would be better off? I would still have the whole second half of the summer to focus on covering material from Organic I that I might have missed.

 

[njbmd]

I'm pretty much an extreme non-trad. I'm planning on finishing my undergrad May '09. I don't plan on taking the MCAT until then as well. (Which I know is weird, but that is how things worked out for me) I'm worried that if I wait until next fall to start Organic Chemistry, then I will be taking the MCAT while I am still finishing up the tail end of Organic Chemistry II. This is why I wanted to take it over the summer. I also wanted to have a lot of time to be fully prepared to take the MCAT. Do you think that if I take Oragnic Chem. I in the summer and take Organic Chem. II in the fall, that I would be better off? I would still have the whole second half of the summer to focus on covering material from Organic I that I might have missed.

Most people don't know what they missed until they are sitting there taking the MCAT and not remembering what they studied or are unable remember the information that they need in order to apply it. This is why taking those courses during the regular term is a better idea. Many people believe that they can sit down and memorize for months and ace that test. It generally doesn't work that way as the MCAT tests in a different manner from most coursework.

You get one shot at getting the pre-med "thing" right. Why not make give yourself the best opportunity to be successful both in your coursework and on the MCAT. (You need both for admission to medical school).

Organic chemistry was a rigorous course at my undergraduate institution but I am quite happy that I went through the experience. I attended summer school but I used summer school to knock off general education requirements like psych, logic and history. In the end, I was quite successful with my strategy which is why I recommend it to others.

You are an adult and will do what you want. You asked for opinions in your OP and that is what you have been given but I promise you that nothing is sadder than someone with multiple mediocre MCAT scores no matter what the uGPA. It's a death blow no matter how you look at it and you can't go back and "do-over".

 

[Beast11]

I'm pretty much an extreme non-trad. I'm planning on finishing my undergrad May '09. I don't plan on taking the MCAT until then as well. (Which I know is weird, but that is how things worked out for me) I'm worried that if I wait until next fall to start Organic Chemistry, then I will be taking the MCAT while I am still finishing up the tail end of Organic Chemistry II. This is why I wanted to take it over the summer. I also wanted to have a lot of time to be fully prepared to take the MCAT. Do you think that if I take Oragnic Chem. I in the summer and take Organic Chem. II in the fall, that I would be better off? I would still have the whole second half of the summer to focus on covering material from Organic I that I might have missed.

Organic is a cumulative class-1st semester tends to be a little more on learning structures, names, and the basics (single step reactions). 2nd semester tends to have more of the multistep reactions, instrumental analyses, concepts. That said, the MCAT is probably a little more skewed toward second semester; given that, your "revised" plan might make a little more sense.

Oh-one other thing. Organic is lumped in with the bio section on the MCAT. General Chem is lumped with physics in a different section. There is some viewpoints that physics and organic are the "hardest" sections, and need balance (although many argue that the verbal reasoning is the most important since it tracks a little better with USMLE performance.) If you are a super bio student, then you might be able to mitigate a little less knowledge in organic (remember-the MCAT tends to be passage based-the info is there, you have to "synthesize" an answer rather than trust on straight memorization from undergrad)

Given your revised timetables-you can take the April MCAT and get scores back in reasonable time for a June application. Maybe that will work.

 

[Krisss17]

I agree with njbmd. Why handicap yourself...I've heard on many occasions that doing well in organic chemistry could be a plus in your application. To me, taking organic I alone in the summer is bad, but taking both...well, that's suicide.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

I still don't get why taking Organic Chemistry in the summer is handicapping yourself for anything? Summer classes are just more concentrated. You still cover the same material, have the same tests, use the same textbook, do the same problems, etc. You just do it in less time.

It's possible that some can't handle that density of material and won't get As under those circumstances where they could under normal semester circumstances, and that's fine, but to say that you are handicapping yourself for the MCAT by taking the course in the summer vs spring/fall is ridiculous. They are the same courses.

 

[HSTeacher2MD]

Oh-one other thing. Organic is lumped in with the bio section on the MCAT. General Chem is lumped with physics in a different section. There is some viewpoints that physics and organic are the "hardest" sections, and need balance (although many argue that the verbal reasoning is the most important since it tracks a little better with USMLE performance.) If you are a super bio student, then you might be able to mitigate a little less knowledge in organic (remember-the MCAT tends to be passage based-the info is there, you have to "synthesize" an answer rather than trust on straight memorization from undergrad)

I completely agree. The MCAT focuses on reasoning and will NOT ask you to regurgatate a mechanism or sequence of retrosynthetic reactions. The more understanding you'll have in organic the better you'll do not only on the MCAT, but probably in the course itself. There's a growing trend in the teaching of Orgo to move away from memorizing to more reasoning.

Furthermore, the MCAT does not really focus on material learned at the end of OrgoII. I've had friends take the MCAT while enrolled in first semester Orgo and do just fine (of course, they were also taking a Princeton course at the time as well...)