Barry University 1 year SMP (Fall 2013)

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tiagoe

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Hey All,

I'm totally new to the form - this is my first post!

I'm now applying to the 1 year track, I was wondering.... Those who have been through the program, was it difficult to get accepted (i.e what was your GPA) and were you accepted to med/dental school after?

Is applying now considered "late" for fall admission?

Also, for those who have been accepted do you have any suggestions on how to craft my app (my stats are horrible due to some past medical issues, 2.9 GPA, 305 GRE, writing MCAT in the summer)

Thanks so much!!
 
I was accepted for this fall. My stats are similar to yours: 2.9 GPA 308 GRE.
 
I was accepted for this fall. My stats are similar to yours: 2.9 GPA 308 GRE.

Nice congrats! Did you apply super early? And how long did they take to get back to you, I just submitted my app so playing the waiting game now :lame:

I'm kinda worried bc i still have to complete some of my pre-reqs for med school this summer, but i spoke to admissions and they said once i finish before their program starts I will be fine
 
Nice congrats! Did you apply super early? And how long did they take to get back to you, I just submitted my app so playing the waiting game now :lame:

I'm kinda worried bc i still have to complete some of my pre-reqs for med school this summer, but i spoke to admissions and they said once i finish before their program starts I will be fine
I applied in early March. It took about 2 weeks to hear back.
 
I applied in early March. It took about 2 weeks to hear back.

ok cool, hopefully I get some good news soon 🙂 do you know how successful Barry students have been with getting into med/dental school the same year that they're in the MS program?
 
Barry, I'm sure, is VERY happy to see its one year terminal masters being called an SMP here. Not that there's any reason to call it an SMP.

You can find a one year terminal masters in biomedical sciences anywhere. That kind of program isn't special. This kind of program is special. It's at a med school, and it gets its grads into med school. If you can't tell the difference between Gtown and Barry, you are in big trouble.

Best of luck to you.
 
Barry, I'm sure, is VERY happy to see its one year terminal masters being called an SMP here. Not that there's any reason to call it an SMP.

You can find a one year terminal masters in biomedical sciences anywhere. That kind of program isn't special. This kind of program is special. It's at a med school, and it gets its grads into med school. If you can't tell the difference between Gtown and Barry, you are in big trouble.

Best of luck to you.
I don't think tiagoe meant to refer to Barry as a "real" SMP. My stats are very similar to his, and there is absolutely NO WAY we could get into a "real" SMP like Georgetown. If you don't mind me asking, what things have you heard about Barry? From the looks of your comment I assume it's probably not a lot of good things.
 
I don't think tiagoe meant to refer to Barry as a "real" SMP. My stats are very similar to his, and there is absolutely NO WAY we could get into a "real" SMP like Georgetown. If you don't mind me asking, what things have you heard about Barry? From the looks of your comment I assume it's probably not a lot of good things.
Putting "SMP" in the thread title is a gift to Barry. Doesn't matter if you say "real" or not.

What I've heard about Barry is that it's really easy to get into. What I haven't heard about Barry is that it gets low GPA premeds/predents into med/dent school.

Here's what you need to be smart about: are you looking at Barry as a shortcut? A way to get out of doing the really hard multi-year work you need to do to get into med/dent school? If you were the adcom looking at your app, would one year at a program that's really easy to get into outweigh 4 years of undistinguished undergrad performance and/or a subpar MCAT?

Bottom line, if you need redemption for a low GPA and/or a low MCAT, you can't get there in one year. Stop reading about how fast and easy Barry seems, and start reading the low GPA thread to learn from the abundant GPA redemption experience you can find there.

Barry is the Carib. Caveat emptor.

Best of luck to you.
 
Putting "SMP" in the thread title is a gift to Barry. Doesn't matter if you say "real" or not.

What I've heard about Barry is that it's really easy to get into. What I haven't heard about Barry is that it gets low GPA premeds/predents into med/dent school.

Here's what you need to be smart about: are you looking at Barry as a shortcut? A way to get out of doing the really hard multi-year work you need to do to get into med/dent school? If you were the adcom looking at your app, would one year at a program that's really easy to get into outweigh 4 years of undistinguished undergrad performance and/or a subpar MCAT?

Bottom line, if you need redemption for a low GPA and/or a low MCAT, you can't get there in one year. Stop reading about how fast and easy Barry seems, and start reading the low GPA thread to learn from the abundant GPA redemption experience you can find there.

Barry is the Carib. Caveat emptor.

Best of luck to you.

No, I'm not looking at Barry as a short cut - I have enrolled in an extra year of undergrad classes (upper level sciences etc) to hopefully show my true potential (my 2.9 GPA was due to medical issues I was dealing with during my college degree)... However, with the stats I posted in my original post I don't think I would be able to get into a "real" SMP program, hence Barry seemed to be the next best option to getting me into medical school
 
No, I'm not looking at Barry as a short cut - I have enrolled in an extra year of undergrad classes (upper level sciences etc) to hopefully show my true potential (my 2.9 GPA was due to medical issues I was dealing with during my college degree)... However, with the stats I posted in my original post I don't think I would be able to get into a "real" SMP program, hence Barry seemed to be the next best option to getting me into medical school

With a 3.0 (just a tenth of a point higher than your current GPA) and a great MCAT, you could certainly get into a "real" SMP. Maybe not Georgetown or University of Cincinnati, but you'd have a fine shot at getting in to EVMS, RFU, BU MAMS, or one of the DO SMPs.

What percentage of its grads does Barry get into medical school? Did those grads get into medical school because of Barry or because they had great stats in the first place?

If you can't get into a program that has a great track record of getting a large percentage of its class (at least half) into medical schools, you need more undergrad work to improve your GPA and/or you need to improve your MCAT.

I think that it might be helpful to realize that medical school admissions doesn't work the way that you think it should, it works the way that it works. There are some (a lot of) programs that regardless of how well you do, no matter how hard you work during the year of the program, your med school chances will still largely be determined by your undergrad record. In my opinion, every single program should be assumed to be like this until proven otherwise. That isn't me being paranoid, most one-year and even two-year graduate programs really DON'T help most people with low GPAs get into medical school. The ones that do are what DrMidlife is calling 'real SMPs'.

'Real SMPs' don't usually help people get into prestigious medical schools, or the medical schools that they want. Once you've screwed your GPA up, top-20 schools and California medical schools and California med schools are largely out of reach for you and there isn't a graduate program in the world that can change that. They don't help you do anything else except get into med school. Most of them (with the exception of maybe RFU) can't even help people with low MCAT scores get into med school. They don't fix your ECs either. And you have to do well in them for them to work, and if you do poorly, your dreams of medical school are over. But they do one thing, and they are the only graduate programs that do it: they get people with low GPAs (usually between 3.0 and 3.5) into med school.

What DrMidlife and I are trying to convey to you is that, to paraphrase Jesus, it's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone with a 2.9 GPA to enter the kingdom of medical school. Just because you had medical issues, just because you've had a good year, just because you've done a terminal masters that most med school adcoms haven't even heard of doesn't mean that they're going to overlook your 2.9. Don't underestimate your competition. You need to find some way for a med school to pick you over someone with a higher GPA, who's had four good years at undergrad. So how can you do that? What you need to do is to show that you're better than the schools' students in anyway that's still available to you. You need to have better ECs. You need to beat those students on the MCAT. And you need to beat them in the classroom, in a real SMP at a real medical school.

The price of redemption is steep. But trying to get out of paying it or paying a price that you think is reasonable is going to make things harder for you, not easier.
 
No, I'm not looking at Barry as a short cut - I have enrolled in an extra year of undergrad classes (upper level sciences etc) to hopefully show my true potential (my 2.9 GPA was due to medical issues I was dealing with during my college degree)... However, with the stats I posted in my original post I don't think I would be able to get into a "real" SMP program, hence Barry seemed to be the next best option to getting me into medical school

Yes, you are looking for a shortcut if you are applying to a grad program before you have done more undergrad to raise your GPA so that you can get into a good program.
 
Yes, you are looking for a shortcut if you are applying to a grad program before you have done more undergrad to raise your GPA so that you can get into a good program.
What should he raise his GPA to before applying to an SMP?
 
Because it would allow him to get into an SMP that actually works.
I didn't ask why. I asked what should be his target GPA before he applies to an SMP? I am assuming that you were joking when you said that he could get into an SMP with a 3.0 GPA. That is about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard, no disrespect to you. From what I understand, SMPs are for people with GPAs around 3.3 to 3.5ish.
 
I didn't ask why. I asked what should be his target GPA before he applies to an SMP? I am assuming that you were joking when you said that he could get into an SMP with a 3.0 GPA. That is about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard, no disrespect to you. From what I understand, SMPs are for people with GPAs around 3.3 to 3.5ish.

the emphasis here should be more on qualitative than quantitative (strange, i know, because numbers go a long way). smps are very rigorous so before you take them you want to take a full load of science classes and get As. take classes that are recognizable by medical schools e.g. immunology or biochemistry and NOT ecology. i think this means 2-3 semesters of work. depends on the individual. with a solid mcat score, you can get into an smp with a 3.0. if i felt ready for SMP work after 2-3 semesters of full science classes and got the 3.0 or whatever, i would not want to raise the undergrad GPA further because of diminishing returns on time and money. that's just me. now, the more interesting question is, how do you fare with a solid SMP performance but only a 3.0 undergrad GPA? does the past haunt you? the applicant would very likely get into DO schools or the host medical school if there is a strong linkage. MD admissions would still be tough (save for the high success rate SMPs like RFU BMS) - but at least you end up with something.
 
the emphasis here should be more on qualitative than quantitative (strange, i know, because numbers go a long way). smps are very rigorous so before you take them you want to take a full load of science classes and get As. take classes that are recognizable by medical schools e.g. immunology or biochemistry and NOT ecology. i think this means 2-3 semesters of work. depends on the individual. with a solid mcat score, you can get into an smp with a 3.0. if i felt ready for SMP work after 2-3 semesters of full science classes and got the 3.0 or whatever, i would not want to raise the undergrad GPA further because of diminishing returns on time and money. that's just me. now, the more interesting question is, how do you fare with a solid SMP performance but only a 3.0 undergrad GPA? does the past haunt you? the applicant would very likely get into DO schools or the host medical school if there is a strong linkage. MD admissions would still be tough (save for the high success rate SMPs like RFU BMS) - but at least you end up with something.
What do you think one's chances are of getting into an osteopathic school with a 3.0 undergrad gpa and a ~ 3.7-3.9 gpa in a program like Barry?
 
What do you think one's chances are of getting into an osteopathic school with a 3.0 undergrad gpa and a ~ 3.7-3.9 gpa in a program like Barry?

i'm asking a similar question myself and people tell me they don't have a crystal ball.

i'm not familiar at all with barry. i will do a SMP to get bang for my buck. the downside to an SMP is that med school classes are hard so it is easy to screw up and once someone screws up, they're out for good. this is not uncommon and is always sad to hear about. that's a good case against an SMP imo. a graduate program with easier grading will probably not have the same weight but it will have less risk as well. so this is one advantage of barry over an SMP. maybe some DO schools will be wowed by the graduate gpa. not sure about MD schools. you have to hedge your bets.

i personally don't want to encourage someone to do an SMP if they have not absolutely made certain that they can do well in the program and take the risk. as a side note, i don't feel right to broadly knock all the graduate programs. some programs that are not SMPs have better records while other programs are worthless and collect money. you have to be a smart shopper. good luck!
 
i'm asking a similar question myself and people tell me they don't have a crystal ball.

i'm not familiar at all with barry. i will do a SMP to get bang for my buck. the downside to an SMP is that med school classes are hard so it is easy to screw up and once someone screws up, they're out for good. this is not uncommon and is always sad to hear about. that's a good case against an SMP imo. a graduate program with easier grading will probably not have the same weight but it will have less risk as well. so this is one advantage of barry over an SMP. maybe some DO schools will be wowed by the graduate gpa. not sure about MD schools. you have to hedge your bets.

i personally don't want to encourage someone to do an SMP if they have not absolutely made certain that they can do well in the program and take the risk. as a side note, i don't feel right to broadly knock all the graduate programs. some programs that are not SMPs have better records while other programs are worthless and collect money. you have to be a smart shopper. good luck!
Thanks for your candid advice. I've seen multiple posts on this site from people who have graduated from Barry's program that it is really hard (no I mean insanely difficult) and has destroyed the GPAs of a lot of med school hopefuls. So while the program is not super selective in its admissions, it seems like its curriculum and difficulty of coursework is at least somewhat comparable to an SMP. I applied to Midwestern's M.A. in Biomedical Sciences program and UMDNJ's MBS program also, and I'm still waiting to hear back from them. Midwestern is my top choice since it has an osteopathic school. (I'm aiming for DO, not MD).
 
how about lecom post bacc? it's very popular here on sdn. 13K, great success rate into lecom. downside, it is only a certificate but I personally don't care about that. i plan on calling up the schools to which i will be applying for med school and seek their advice for which programs they regard the most. i'm worried after hearing that barry has destroyed students. if i'm going to do a tough program, i better make sure i am rewarded handsomely if i do well in it. best to call up some schools and hear it from the horse's mouth.

edit: btw, don't give priority to a program just because it is osteopathic. look at the success rate. a lot of non DO programs are DO feeders. that's especially a viable option if you have shadowed DOs and can vouch for your interest in osteopathic medicine. also, I care less about how tough a program is and more about its success rate. i want to maximize the success to rigor ratio.
 
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I've seen multiple posts on this site from people who have graduated from Barry's program that it is really hard (no I mean insanely difficult) and has destroyed the GPAs of a lot of med school hopefuls.
Or, Barry accepts students that aren't ready for the rigor, so of course they don't do well. Like Carib med schools.

The normal state of denial with a 2.x is that you can magically decide to be a 4.0 student just by wanting to. This doesn't work, ever. You have to endure tremendous frustration, and change your character, to become an A student after not being one. At least that's what happened to me and the majority of my SMP classmates.

Show yourself you're ready for the rigor before you try a grad-level academic enhancer of any kind.
 
Show yourself you're ready for the rigor before you try a grad-level academic enhancer of any kind.

Only now did I read the entire thread and your advice is excellent. I completely agree. It's very nice of you to spend so much time on the message boards selflessly helping out other students. That is despite your very busy schedule & life. You actually give advice in good faith whereas some of the advisors I have seen are downright condescending. Thank you!
 
I couldn't find this on their website. Are you sure this is their policy?

I am absolutely certain. I spoke to someone over the phone and I went to their open house last week. Both times I was told of this policy. Downside for you, is that you are not a NJ resident (they accept 80% from NJ) and this policy applies only to this school. I recommend that you call up the DO schools you are interested in and seek their advice. Different schools have different ways so you'll hear different things. DO schools are receptive and willing to answer these questions. That's the only way I would have learned about the policy I shared with you. Too bad I will not be getting a master's.

Just for fun, I'll share that this school has a certain formula, like the LizzyM score that they determine to give interview invites. Then similarly, they have a math formula that factors in interview score, MCAT, GPA, etc. to determine on who to accept. They don't differentiate hours in terms of research vs. volunteering. I did not press any further but I'm guessing that since they go by a formula, a high MCAT can compensate for a low GPA for this school. Their matriculant LizzyM is 28 + 3.6(10) = 64. So if I have a 3.1 GPA and get a 35 MCAT, I'm game.
 
I am absolutely certain. I spoke to someone over the phone and I went to their open house last week. Both times I was told of this policy. Downside for you, is that you are not a NJ resident (they accept 80% from NJ) and this policy applies only to this school. I recommend that you call up the DO schools you are interested in and seek their advice. Different schools have different ways so you'll hear different things. DO schools are receptive and willing to answer these questions. That's the only way I would have learned about the policy I shared with you. Too bad I will not be getting a master's.

Just for fun, I'll share that this school has a certain formula, like the LizzyM score that they determine to give interview invites. Then similarly, they have a math formula that factors in interview score, MCAT, GPA, etc. to determine on who to accept. They don't differentiate hours in terms of research vs. volunteering. I did not press any further but I'm guessing that since they go by a formula, a high MCAT can compensate for a low GPA for this school. Their matriculant LizzyM is 28 + 3.6(10) = 64. So if I have a 3.1 GPA and get a 35 MCAT, I'm game.
You got a 35 on the MCAT?
 
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