basic resp physio perfusion vs diffusion.help

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sadaca

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hey guys, I always mix up perfusion limited and diffusion limited. perfusion limited means its well perfused but not ventilated ? Also, how does it it make sense that a shunt is ventilation defect? Don't we need both perfusion and ventilation for gas exchange?

could someone plz clear up these doubts. it would help me ALOT.

god bless

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hey guys, I always mix up perfusion limited and diffusion limited. perfusion limited means its well perfused but not ventilated ? Also, how does it it make sense that a shunt is ventilation defect? Don't we need both perfusion and ventilation for gas exchange?

could someone plz clear up these doubts. it would help me ALOT.

god bless

Perfusion limited means that you can increase ventilation to infinity and the concentration won't go up. A good example for this is O2 and CO2 in hyperventilation. When you hyperventilate, you blow off a lot of CO2 -> respiratory alkalosis. You would expect then that you would also be increasing PaO2 since your RR and thus ventilation has increased. This doesn't happen because resting PaO2 is perfusion limited. You can hyperventilate all you want, but PaO2 won't increase unless you increase perfusion.

Diffusion limited means that the gas exchange rate will remain the same as long as the partial pressure gradient is maintained.

Edit: And by CO2 I meant CO. CO2 is also perfusion-limited. I took out the sentence for clarity.

An intrapulmonary shunt is a ventilation defect because perfusion is exceeding ventilation. This usually doesn't happen because of intrapulmonary hypoxic vasoconstriction.

fig7.01.gif


So the graph shows the normal O2 diffusion rate (perfusion limited) and an abnormal O2 diffusion rate in which the slope is the same throughout the length of the capillary (diffusion limited)
 
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hi ulikedaggers, thanks alot! Could u further explain what you mean in diffusion limited , with gradient being the same?? Also, for this graph, why is the abnormal slope same throughout?

I was doing goljan audio and he says pulmonary infarction are mostly in lower lobe b/c perfusion is better here. do you get that?

thanks and god bless
 
hi ulikedaggers, thanks alot! Could u further explain what you mean in diffusion limited , with gradient being the same?? Also, for this graph, why is the abnormal slope same throughout?

I was doing goljan audio and he says pulmonary infarction are mostly in lower lobe b/c perfusion is better here. do you get that?

thanks and god bless

The slope is the same throughout the length of the capillary because the gas exchange is diffusion-limited. This means that gas exchange is occurring along the entire capillary. The driving force for gas exchange is the partial pressure gradient between PA and Pa. The classic example of a diffusion-limited gas is Carbon monoxide (CO). Truthfully, I don't know if the slope is the same but thinking of it that way helps me remember that diffusion continues along the entire capillary. The point is that a diffusion-limited gas will be exchanged across the full length of the capillary.

If you take a look at the graph in my previous post you will see that at the beginning of the capillary PaCO is 0. The blue line represents PaCO and there is no CO in the blood as it enters the capillary. If there is CO in the alveolar air there will be a partial pressure gradient driving CO into the capillary. You can clearly see that the blue line in that graph has a positive slope, implying that PaCO is increasing. What you also need to notice is that PaCO increases throughout the entire length of the capillary, unlike PaN2O and normal PaO2. This is because Hb has a very high affinity for CO and Hb happily takes CO out of the plasma and into the RBC. Only dissolved gas contributes to partial pressure and therefore the partial pressure gradient for CO is maintained. Because there's a gradient throughout the entire capillary, PaCO continues to increase through the whole capillary.


Perfusion is better at the base of the lung than the apex of the lung (when you're standing) because of gravity. When you're laying flat, perfusion is pretty much equal everywhere in the lung. When standing, arterial pressure is the highest near the base of the lung. Increased arterial pressure means more blood flow, more open capillaries, and thus better perfusion. At the apex of the lung, arterial pressure is the lowest and capillaries can be compressed by alveolar pressure making it more difficult for blood to flow = lower perfusion.

As for goljan I haven't taken path yet, but this is my guess. Perfusion is different in different regions of the lung (as above), but ventilation is much less variable. This means that the V/Q ratio in the apex of the lung is higher than the V/Q ratio in the base of the lung. So, PaO2 is highest in the apex, and lowest in the base. Since the base has the lowest PaO2 to begin with, it seems reasonable to assume that it is the most susceptible to infarcts. But again, I haven't taken path so I have no clue.
 
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Sometimes, oversimplification helps in grasping concepts. So here is some analogy.

Diffusion limited: Think subway station. Subway comes, plenty of seats inside. Goal is to move 10 people to the next station (i.e. oxygen delivery). People have trouble getting in because 1. they are too fat for the door, 2. the door only opens halfway. As a result, only 2 people end up getting in.

Perfusion limited: Again, think subway station. Subway comes. Goal again is to move 10 people to the next station. You have no problem getting in, but the damn subway is so tiny it only accommodates 2 people. As a result, only 2 people reach the next station. Only way to solve the problem is to increase the capacity (i.e. perfusion) of the subway.

Lastly, ventilation defect (part of your lung not working) -> hypoxic vasoconstriction in that region of the lung -> blood shunts away from the less ventilated region to well ventilated region.
 
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thank you all. ESP ulikedaggers. your explanation hit home with me! I read a few times but now I can see what you mean. Thanks again, and thanks to you I got a kaplan q right on CO diffusion limited, same graph =D.

Just one more thing about this, the ALEVOLAR at the top of the graph on the left..its straight line, its even in first aid. Is that just the pA that contributes to the pressure gradient?? Thanks again . Gob bless
 
Not sure if this was mentioned and correct me if I'm wrong but by Dalton's Law (sum of partial pressures = total pressure) if PCO2 drops due to hyperventilation Pao2 must increase, even though the contribution of dissolved o2 to total o2 content of the blood is minimal.
 
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