being a dentist in the air force -Need Imput

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bostonbryan

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Does anyone know where I can get some infomation about life as an air force dentist? I spoke with one today, however the recruiter was right next to us the whole time. I need to learn more about what it is really like to be a dentist in the service, not some biased sales pitch.

Does anyone know any good websites or possibly the e-mail or phone # of a dentist in the air force?

I asked the recuiter if I could have the number of some dentists in the military, but he said he didn't have access to that information.

Also, I read not to believe anything the recuiter says(see the 1st paragraph from the following page:http://members.tripod.com/~softballteam/armydentist.html) If that is the case, how do I know what or who to believe?

Please help me....


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Bryan,

You've asked some good questions, and that is important because all too often people don't ask these questions until AFTER they've signed on the dotted line.

I don't know much about dentistry in the Air Force, but my father is a physician in the Air Force, so I do have SOME perspective on the whole package. I also have friends whose fathers are dentists, and it seems as though their ideas are not too far from mine, meaning that it seems both dentists and physicians in the Air Force have similar experiences (which would make sense).

My first observation would be to ask why you are considering the Air Force. If it is because you want to fulfill your passion for dentistry AND serve your country (yes it is serving your country) then I would advise you to continue your path to find answers to the questions you have.

If you are looking at the AF because you want to avoide debt in the dental school process, then I would RUN (don't walk, RUN) as far away from the Air Force as possible. As a sidenote, I think the AF treats their health officers the best out of any branch of the armed forces.

A student who chooses to enlist in the AF and a student who doesn't have anything to do with the AF will both come out with the same $$ in their bank account after 4 or 5 years.

Sure, the AF will pay for your education and give you a stipend, but then you have to repay that "scholarship" period with a service period. You can expect to earn $35-50,000 a year during that period, while many of your classmates will be earning double that amount (or higher!). Of course, you don't have loan repayments to worry about, but in 4 or 5 years everything pretty much evens out.

At the end of that period there may be AF enlistees who come out ahead, but odds are that your classmates who stayed away from the armed forces will be earning far more than you and handling their student loans quite nicely.

My advice to stay away from the AF comes because I am the son of a physician in the AF. From personal experience I can tell you that not knowing where you will live can be a signifigant factor.

A recruiter may tell you that you get to "choose" where you will be stationed, but they make no mention of the fact that your choice is typically not even taken into consideration.

Having a family makes the commitment to the Air Force an even greater burden, as dragging a wife and kids across country is never fun, especially when they haven't seen much of you during four or five years of dental school.

Another piece of information to remember is that many dentists and physicians STAY with the Air Force after their time is up, simply because it is a cushy life (in SOME respects, but by no means ALL respects).

The Air Force does the booking of patients and provides you with an office and equipment. Sometimes this equipment is new, but most often it is the best equipment they could get for the lowest price they could muster.

Typically an Air Force dentist doesn't have to worry about payroll, accounting procedures, hiring staff, etc. To many dentists this is extremely appealing!

Remember, though, that in this type of environment your income is going to max out at $65-75,000, and that probably includes bonuses. Speaking from experience I can tell you that my father, who is a specialist, earns 1/3 to 1/4 as much as his counterparts (and fellow classmates!) who are in civilian private practice. So what is more worth it? Would you rather schedule your own patients, do your own books, hire assistants, and pay for office supplies so you could make 3 to 4 times more than an Air Force dentist?

Hopefully this answered some of your questions. Of course, everybody has different experiences, and a large part of that will be based on where you are stationed. My experience, as a kid who had to put up with the crap the Air Force dishes out, is to stay away from the program. Doing it just to relieve the debt load isn't typically a good way to go. You will have VERY little say in your life during those repayment years, so be fully sure you are making the correct decision.

Good luck!
 
ItsGavinC,

Thanks for taking the time to answer my post. Your answers were very insightful and helped me greatly.

I guess I need to really sit down and think about why I would want to join the air force.

Anyhow, thanks again and I have always enjoyed reading your posts in the past on other subjects as well as this one. Maybe we will meet someday at a dental convention or something.


Good luck with Arizona!


laterz, Bryan NYUCD07
 
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ItsGavinC

I also wanted to say thanks. Very good post. It is nice to hear from people who have experienced what military healthcare is REALLY like and not just what the recruiters tell us. Your post will help people like me make an informed decision when it comes time to consider the question that plagues all of us: "What will I do after Dental School!!??"

Thank you. Always a pleasure reading your posts.
 
Just wanted to add that I *might* consider the Air Force route if I weren't married and didn't have children. And even then, I would stay in just long enough to repay the time I owed them.

But, because I am married and have a child, I'm not even considering it. My wife doesn't see enough of me as it is, and moving to timbuktu after d-school, wouldn't really please her.

Besides, I'm a firm believer that we'll all be equal in $$ amounts four or five years after graduating. If anything, those who entered the civilian sector will be AHEAD of those who entered the services. Sure, the service guys will have a better time while in school (doesn't a monthly stipend sound sweet?), but I'd rather suffer now and then control my own life later. The debt load I will have after I graduate will most likely be OVER $200,000; but many before me have paid it off, and I will also pay it off.
 
My understanding was that you make about $75,000 while working for the military. Also, don't you live on base? Doesn't that take care of rent too? Any insights Gavin?
 
to Brand:

Two of my classmates are here at my school on Army's Health Professions Scholarship. (one of them was a former enlisted E-4 with the 2ID in Korea). Their pay will be $31,000 per year when they enter active service after graduation-- That is the pay scale for an O-3 (Captain rank). The pay doesn't hit $75,000 until you are promoted to O-6 (Colonel rank) I believe. (I'll have to look it up to make sure).

Of course, to make Colonel you will have to stay in the service for a VERY long time. 😛

The active duty obligation for the full HPS scholarship is 5 years. After which you go into the reserves. One might be able to make O-4 (Major rank) in 5 years... Definitely not Lieutenant Colonel (O-5) though.

If you live on-base, yep the military pays for your quarters and meals.

HTH!
 
Tom hit it right on the head (as always).
And living on base isn't too bad, depending on where you are stationed. There are some fairly nice places out there, and some that aren't so swell.
 
For those who are curious about military pay, I found a link with the pay tables.

Please note that the allowance for housing is the minimum amount-the actual amount is based on your zip code.

(example: O-3 min=795 w/ dependents. Portland=1190 w/ dependents)

Takes a bit to understand the tables if you're not familiar with the military pay structure and allowances.

🙂

http://www.dfas.mil/money/milpay/pay/2003paytable.pdf
 
UBTom didn't look at all of the pay a dental officer gets.

Base pay for 0-3: $2911.20 x 12 mo = $34934.40
Variable Special Pay: $583.33 x 12 mo = $6999.96
Board Certified Pay: $208.33 x 12 mo = $2499.96
Additional Special Pay: $4000 / yr (this is not paid during a residency)

Total: $48434.32

Additionally there is pay for housing and food but this is highly variable upon where you live. You're not going to get rich in the military but you're not going to be living on the street either.

Pay Charts - http://www.dfas.mil/money/milpay/pay/2003paytable.pdf
Dental officer pay is on page 7
Information on types of pay - https://www.perscomonline.army.mil/OPdc/payinfopaper.htm

Just for a comparison, lets look at someone who has finished their HPSP obligation and decided to sign up for 4 additional years. We'll say this person is a Major now (0-4).

Base Pay: $4145.70 x 12 mo = $49748.40
Variable Special Pay: $583.33 x 12 mo = $6999.96
Board Certified Pay: $208.33 x 12 mo = $2499.96
Additional Special Pay: $6000 / yr
Multiyear Special Pay: $12000 / yr

Total: $77248.32

There is still housing and food allowances but everything together is still not going to make you rich. However, if you wish to serve your country and are in dentistry for reasons other than making as much money as you can then a military career can provide you with a comfortable life. Note: I'm not 100% certain on all values but when I had a question I generally chose the lower value.
 
Um, no.. I got my info straight from the horses' mouths, as the saying goes-- My two classmates who are in the Army HPS program.

For your information, Variable Special Pay is given ONLY after years of "credible" active service specified, which looks like it does NOT include any years you take off from active duty to pursue a specialty or PG program. You will not be paid that extra $583.33 a month UNTIL after serving 3 years "credible" active duty.

Board Certified Pay you CERTAINLY WILL NOT GET when you start serving active duty right after graduating dental school, because you will CERTAINLY NOT be a specialist of any kind at that time, much less board-certified.

Additional Special Pay, I'm not clear on all the terms for that pay, but it looks like if you haven't passed your licensing boards at the time of entrance to active duty or haven't kept up with your CE requirements, you will NOT be paid that either. Ditto if you enter a PG or specialty training program (which can be anywhere from just 1 year for AEGD to 6 years for OMFS!).

You will probably be eligible for VSP and ASP after your 5-year obligation is up, but if you haven't specialized and been board-certified, you are STILL NOT going to get the BCP. You will be hard pressed to get more than $55K as a Major at that point in time.

I'm not saying that military service is an unviable alternative-- In fact I think it's quite fair considering that you are being paid as well as having a "free ride" through dental school while everyone else will have a loan from 150K to $250K to deal with. Just realize that when you start out, you won't be earning much more than $35K/yr if finances and cash flow is important to you.
 
Tom's analysis is correct. $70,000 is the TOPS most AF dentists make, and that is after 10-15 years of service.

So sure, you can come out of dental school without any loans to payback, but you'll only be bringing home 35-40k, and you have NO decision as to where you'll be living, the people you'll be working with, or the types of cases you'll be seeing.

Or, you could go the civilian route and make $70,000 out of school (and that is a low estimate for most of us), and have a say in all of the above points.

I'm certain the those who choose the armed forces and those who go civilian will end up in a dead heat after 2-3 years out of school.

After that, the best quality of life goes to the civilians, hands down.
 
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