being a parent and a med student at the same time

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A lot of kleenex :cry: and a lot of alcohol. 😉
 
What is the kleenex for? Is this a product placement EEL (due to your SDN celebrity status)? haha!!!
 
i dont think people with kids should apply to med school, I just find it really hard to believe that someone with an infant can handle the whole nine yards of going through 8 years of medical school while maintaining a high committment to both medicine as well as their child. I worked really hard during my undergrad, and looking back on it, theres no way i could have had a kid and done as well as i had done. I think its unfair to the child as well as to the would be doctor.
 
Jpc984 said:
What is the kleenex for? Is this a product placement EEL (due to your SDN celebrity status)? haha!!!
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I like the way you think Jpc. I should start getting some sponsors and getting paid!! 😛
 
art4vandalay said:
i dont think people with kids should apply to med school, I just find it really hard to believe that someone with an infant can handle the whole nine yards of going through 8 years of medical school while maintaining a high committment to both medicine as well as their child. I worked really hard during my undergrad, and looking back on it, theres no way i could have had a kid and done as well as i had done. I think its unfair to the child as well as to the would be doctor.
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For right now all I have to say is, wow! I'm about to actually enjoy myself and watch Heroes but I will respond later when I have more time to write a lot. In case you didn't know, my husband and I are both horrible parents because we will both be attending med school either starting at the same time or one year apart. We have a 2.75 year old and a 15 month old. Just for added shock value, we would like to have more!! 😱 I would like to consider myself to be a nice person but some things just get me riled up. But seriously, Heroes...
 
Based on the large smile of your cute child, i find it hard to believe that you or your husband are bad parents. All i am saying is that if i was an infant, and both my parents were in medical school, I probably wouldnt be able to expierience the many joys of childhood. Who's going to take your child to the park, or to the zoo, or to the arcade when you and your husband are inside studyn 24/7? In the end someone is going to get short changed. I just hope you thought about this before you applied.
 
EEL08 said:
For right now all I have to say is, wow! I'm about to actually enjoy myself and watch Heroes but I will respond later when I have more time to write a lot. In case you didn't know, my husband and I are both horrible parents because we will both be attending med school either starting at the same time or one year apart. We have a 2.75 year old and a 15 month old. Just for added shock value, we would like to have more!! 😱 I would like to consider myself to be a nice person but some things just get me riled up. But seriously, Heroes...
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EEL, what are you thinking? Parents should not pursue professions that provide financial security for their children. 😉

My dad was in medical school and my mom was working when I was an infant and it worked out fine!
 
art4vandalay said:
Based on the large smile of your cute child, i find it hard to believe that you or your husband are bad parents. All i am saying is that if i was an infant, and both my parents were in medical school, I probably wouldnt be able to expierience the many joys of childhood. Who's going to take your child to the park, or to the zoo, or to the arcade when you and your husband are inside studyn 24/7? In the end someone is going to get short changed. I just hope you thought about this before you applied.
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When do childhood memories start? 4, 5, 6? The children probably wouldn't remember these events anyways. In addition, they will find time for their children! Many doctors have done it!
 
I have three children all girls ages 10,7, and 4. They have always seen me work full time and go to school fulltime at night. I think it is great that they have a strong female role model. Also it gives them time with their Dad and grandparents...🙂
 
I'm going to do my best not to impregnate anybody while in med school.
 
I don't think people without kids should apply to med school, I just find it really hard to believe that someone without a support system can handle the whole nine yards of going through 8 years of medical school while maintaining a high committment to medicine. I worked really hard during my undergrad, and looking back on it there is no way i could have have done as well as I had done without them. I think it's unfair to single people that have to do it alone.

Oh snap.
 
Though I don't agree with the OP, the issue here isn't "single people," notadoc.

There are plenty of people who are either married or in a long term relationship in med school and thus have an excellent support system in place.

Plus, where does your post leave single parents?
 
I have a hard time seeing why it's anybody else's business what happens in a med student's home. If they want to have three kids, or 20 cats, or sleep in a tent in the library so they don't miss any study time, I think that's their prerogative, as long as they can pass the tests.

That said, I can't say that I envy the parents in our class...they seem to figure things out somehow....there is a LOT of testing in med school, so if a situation isn't working out for some reason, it seems to become obvious pretty quick at least academically.
 
art4vandalay said:
i dont think people with kids should apply to med school....
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I don't think people who haven't had to struggle in life should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't had a "real" job where they totally supported themselves for at least 5 years should apply to med school.
I don't think people who have never had a car payment should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't sat in their underwear, fanning themselves all summer long, because they couldn't afford to turn on the airconditioner should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't had to eat for a week on five dollars should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't been been sick and had no health insurance should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't had to decide whether to buy food or medicine for their child, because they can't afford both, should apply to med school.
I don't think people who drive a car worth more than $50,000 should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't witnessed the death of a close friend or relative should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't once given to charity until it hurts should apply to med school.
I don't think people whose only volunteer experience was done to look good for their application should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't been hospitalized at least once should apply to med school.
I don't think people who have piercings on their face and green or pink hair should apply to med school.
I don't think people who sleep past noon (unless they work third shift) should apply to med school.
I don't think people who have broken up with their boyfriend/girlfriend by text message should apply to med school.

Fortunately, I don't make the rules 😀.
 
I don't think anyone who can't dunk a basketball with two hands should apply to medical school. It is a fundamental skill that comes into play in all areas of medicine. I cannot imagine what my life would be like if I couldn't dunk. I remember my uncle dunking all the time when I was very young. I can't imagine what my childhood would have been like without this experience. Then he got older and wasn't able to dunk anymore. So what do you think happened?

If you guessed "he got leukemia", you would be correct. He underwent treatment and got better, but it is a lesson that I will carry with me for the rest of my life. You don't want a doctor with leukemia working on you, do you? What if you go in for a sprained ankle, and he accidentally treats you with his leukemia medicine?

So maintain your dunking skills.

The puppy... That was a dog. But the industry, my friends... That was a revolution!
 
Sort of on topic. Heroes= awesome tv show, but I'm sad the writer's strike has killed the season early.😡
 
Heroes is the stupidest show I have ever seen. Nothing ever happens.
 
My penny's worth: no one who pushes their judgement onto others should be in medicine. Then again, anyone who pushes their judgement onto anyone else evidently has feelings, and that in itself is a wonderful thing to have in medicine. Because too often I feel like a machine; feeling feelings would be wonderful.

If that makes any sense.
 
scpod said:
I don't think people who haven't had to struggle in life should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't had a "real" job where they totally supported themselves for at least 5 years should apply to med school.
I don't think people who have never had a car payment should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't sat in their underwear, fanning themselves all summer long, because they couldn't afford to turn on the airconditioner should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't had to eat for a week on five dollars should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't been been sick and had no health insurance should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't had to decide whether to buy food or medicine for their child, because they can't afford both, should apply to med school.
I don't think people who drive a car worth more than $50,000 should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't witnessed the death of a close friend or relative should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't once given to charity until it hurts should apply to med school.
I don't think people whose only volunteer experience was done to look good for their application should apply to med school.
I don't think people who haven't been hospitalized at least once should apply to med school.
I don't think people who have piercings on their face and green or pink hair should apply to med school.
I don't think people who sleep past noon (unless they work third shift) should apply to med school.
I don't think people who have broken up with their boyfriend/girlfriend by text message should apply to med school.

Fortunately, I don't make the rules 😀.
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I like most of your rules 👍
 
TexasTriathlete said:
The puppy... That was a dog. But the industry, my friends... That was a revolution!
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Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
 
Vee said:
Though I don't agree with the OP, the issue here isn't "single people," notadoc.

There are plenty of people who are either married or in a long term relationship in med school and thus have an excellent support system in place.

Plus, where does your post leave single parents?
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Apparently you missed the sarcasm and irony in the comment, it was created as a comlete opposite of what the OP had said. Anyone who is dedicated enough should have the opportunity to attend med school if that is what they desire.
 
Thank you DC DOC. I was being facetious. I guess it's hard to be sarcastic on the SDN forum- although, TexasTri seems to do it pretty well.

I believe that anyone who has the desire and the ambition should go to medical school- no matter their situation.
 
notadoc said:
Thank you DC DOC. I was being facetious. I guess it's hard to be sarcastic on the SDN forum- although, TexasTri seems to do it pretty well.

I believe that anyone who has the desire and the ambition should go to medical school- no matter their situation.
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If you can go to med school, do well, and at the same time give your children the attention they deserve, then by all means go to med school. As for scpod, I think that post was totally irrelevant to my point. My question is more for EEL, if you have two infant kids, and you and your husband are both in med school (maybe not in the same state) then how are your kids going to deal with it. I believe everyone should have goals and dreams, but they have to take into account the reality of the situation. And the reality is, you have two kids that need just as much attention, if not more, than the thousands of lives you will treat everyday.

ARE THERE ANY SUCCESS STORIES OUT THERE?
 
notadoc said:
Thank you DC DOC. I was being facetious. I guess it's hard to be sarcastic on the SDN forum- although, TexasTri seems to do it pretty well.

I believe that anyone who has the desire and the ambition should go to medical school- no matter their situation.
Click to expand...

If you can go to med school, do well, and at the same time give your children the attention they deserve, then by all means go to med school. As for scpod, I think that post was totally irrelevant to my point. My question is more for EEL, if you have two infant kids, and you and your husband are both in med school (maybe not in the same state) then how are your kids going to deal with it. I believe everyone should have goals and dreams, but they have to take into account the reality of the situation. And the reality is, you have two kids that need just as much attention, if not more, than the thousands of lives you will treat everyday.

ARE THERE ANY SUCCESS STORIES OUT THERE?
 
What are you getting at? Were you not "taken care of" as a child because your parents were doctors or something? Why are you worried about how she will be living her life while in medical school? Why not just worry about yours and getting in? Why do you have to be so negative?
 
rose351 said:
What are you getting at? Were you not "taken care of" as a child because your parents were doctors or something? Why are you worried about how she will be living her life while in medical school? Why not just worry about yours and getting in? Why do you have to be so negative?
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i already got in thank you very much
 
art4vandalay said:
As for scpod, I think that post was totally irrelevant to my point. My question is more for EEL...
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Sure, it was irrelevant except for the fact that you are opinionated and I showed how opinionated I could be too. As for your question for EEL, it really is neither any of your business nor your concern.

Believe it or not, people successfully go through life every day without you having to worry about their moral values and without having to justify their choices.

In this forum we don't call people out and tell them that they are doing a bad job in their real lives and making poor choices. That's what your post sounds like-- it sounds both condescending and insulting.
 
+1. If you want to act like that there is plenty of room next door in the 40 year old virgin forum.
 
art4vandalay said:
i already got in thank you very much
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You've got quite the unjustified, judgmental stance going here, don't you? I am self-employed and work an exceptionally busy schedule (medical school will actually be a reduction in work load for me - at least volume-wise!!) and have 2 (about to be 3) kids who are very well developed and happy with their lives. Simply because you wouldn't be strong enough to handle medical school and take care of children simultaneously, doesn't mean everyone else is as weak, disorganized, and/or limited in ability as you. Besides, if undergraduate was as rough for you as you say, I feel so very sorry for you upon entering medical school (I think life's going to get very real for you very fast!). I appreciate your philosophical interpretation of juggling children and school, but I think you should be careful when making such staunch judgments of things you seem to have no experience with.

Also, I find aiming your comments specifically toward EEL08 very bad form, seeing as we all know how hard she's worked to get accepted. Is it really necessary to introduce doubt/fear of something you're simply speculating about??
 
I think I like your qualifications for med school SCPOD bc I met each one.👍

I'm actually not sure that ART isn't just trying to work people up for some unknown reason. But I've been continuously amazed at the number of ignorant and judgemental people who post on this forum claiming that no one should go to med school unless they fit some pre-specified little mold. It's ridiculous and sad. I honestly did not realize this mentality was even prevalent until I started reading these boards since most of the people I surround myself with have respect for me and my decisions in life and realize that I am competent enough to decide what is best for my family.

Every parent, no matter how old or young they are when they have kids or if they are in the working world or still in school, are going to have to learn how to balance their lives in order to spend enough quality time with their children and to fulfill the rest of their obligations at the same time. A few of us just ended up having to learn how to do that when we were a little younger than others. If anything, I have already demonstrated what happens and how I perform when I have a lot of stress put on my plate. A 22 year who has never had to do anything but study and prepare for medical shcool really hasn't demonstrated how they perform when things inevitably get tough and should theoretically be a bigger risk than someone who has already demonstrated they can hack it.

A little myth that I feel a lot of young people believe is that it some how gets easier or they become more qualifed as a parent if they wait to have children. The truth is, it doesn't make having children easier or the parent any more qualified. Last I remembered, there was no class to take and get an 'A' in , or standardized test, or handbook telling someone how to be a parent. I'm sure if there was, every pre-med would be jumping up and down to take this class and compare and see who got the highest score to determine who was going to be the best parent. I'm sorry but this does not exist.

I am honestly just disgusted by the ignorance on this forum with regard to parenting (and AA too). I just feel that if you have no children of your own (or have never been a URM) than you really don't know what you are talking about and you should mind your own business, focus on improving your own life, and let people who happen to be in these circumstances focus on their own lives and their children's lives. If you haven't walked in someone else's shoes, you really have no right to judge them, especially people who will be your professional peers.
 
Playmakur42 said:
😕 They say ignorance is bliss. I bet you are all smiles.
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If you want to prove me wrong, how about some SUCCESS STORIES. I would be interested in that, otherwise stop posting how you people with kids can balance jobs and kids, since that is not what i addressed. I think during a 9-5 work day your work stays at work. During a 9-5 med school day, you take your work home with you.
 
art4vandalay said:
i dont think people with kids should apply to med school, I just find it really hard to believe that someone with an infant can handle the whole nine yards of going through 8 years of medical school while maintaining a high commitment to both medicine as well as their child. I worked really hard during my undergrad, and looking back on it, theres no way i could have had a kid and done as well as i had done. I think its unfair to the child as well as to the would be doctor.
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My dad was in residency when I was an infant. I met two fourth year med students at A&M that both had two kids in grade school. I think it's a question of balancing comittment with responsibility.
 
I think it might be possible that you are asking the wrong question in the wrong forum. Afterall we are PRE-med students, not MED students. Maybe you should try fishing in another forum, Just a thought.
 
art4vandalay said:
If you want to prove me wrong, how about some SUCCESS STORIES. I would be interested in that, otherwise stop posting how you people with kids can balance jobs and kids, since that is not what i addressed. I think during a 9-5 work day your work stays at work. During a 9-5 med school day, you take your work home with you.
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I personally know LOTS of people that have kids and are doing just fine as both students and parents. Even single parents.

It takes a special person to do it, but it's most definitely possible....and I tend to agree with many of the items in the list above.

I have to remind myself that there are a lot of people out there that have really never had to fight for anything, or work hard for anything, or really "Do" anything for themselves.

My hats off to folks with children in med school...it's got to be tough. I don't plan to have kids until at least 3rd year.
 
art4vandalay said:
If you want to prove me wrong, how about some SUCCESS STORIES.....
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I don't think anyone really cares about proving you wrong. PT2MD brought up some good examples already, yet those were ignored. I'm inclined to believe that any other "success stories" would be ignored as well. But...while we're on the topic of "success stories" I'd like to add that every single one of us who is in medical school, has been accepted to medical school, or has even interviewed is, in fact, a success story. Every one of us who has graduated from college, had a child, or supported ourselves in the real world is a success story. Why? Because, success means many things to many people. In some countries, a child who lives past puberty is a success story.

No family is perfect...but insinuating that people who defy the odds, struggle through medical schoool and become competent physicians-- all while balancing the duties and responsibilities of a family-- are not a "success"??? That thinking defines "ludicrous", IMO.
 
art4vandalay said:
If you want to prove me wrong, how about some SUCCESS STORIES. I would be interested in that, otherwise stop posting how you people with kids can balance jobs and kids, since that is not what i addressed. I think during a 9-5 work day your work stays at work. During a 9-5 med school day, you take your work home with you.
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OK, while I don't care about proving anything to you, I do know many people who have successfully completed medical school with families. I worked in a teaching hospital and was friends with many residents who had happy well adjusted children. I have three kids now, and have been in school full time for the last few years, as well as working for my husbands company and my young children are happy, well cared for, and we are all very close.

Seriously, would you prefer that people with children go work 60 hours/week for the rest of their lives to scrape by? Personally, I prefer to make a sacrafice for the short period of time that I am in school/residency and put my whole family in a better position afterwards. In the scheme of things, 4 years is a very small portion of our lifetime, and since my kids will also be starting school while I am in school, I'm not missing out on much.

Also, have you ever had a 9-5 job?? I have had many, and I have never had a position where you just leave all of the stress at work, or even all of the work for that matter. No, it's not an ideal situation to have to split your time between parenting and studying, but having a family is definately no reason to have to limit yourself to being a housewife or even to a miserable 9-5 job as you suggest.
 
I think the problem is that some people feel that becoming a doctor is an overnight process, well im sorry but it isnt. Being a doctor requires 8, YES 8 YEARS OF YOUR LIFE. I think people that have kids who decide to pursue medical school just better realize what those 8 years will entail for you AS WELL AS YOUR KID.
 
scpod said:
I don't think anyone really cares about proving you wrong. PT2MD brought up some good examples already, yet those were ignored. I'm inclined to believe that any other "success stories" would be ignored as well. But...while we're on the topic of "success stories" I'd like to add that every single one of us who is in medical school, has been accepted to medical school, or has even interviewed is, in fact, a success story. Every one of us who has graduated from college, had a child, or supported ourselves in the real world is a success story. Why? Because, success means many things to many people. In some countries, a child who lives past puberty is a success story.

No family is perfect...but insinuating that people who defy the odds, struggle through medical schoool and become competent physicians-- all while balancing the duties and responsibilities of a family-- are not a "success"??? That thinking defines "ludicrous", IMO.
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i can define this entire statement in one word, "soapbox."
 
Welcome SDNer's to Art4Vandalay: the most unpopular person on the pre-osteo forum!!!
(And seriously, Art, if you want to get a logical point across.. the LAST thing you do is to attack EEL08-- who is a favorite of SDNers for her continuous kind words and spirit).

Still-- I sort of understand your feelings, in that you think a med student-parent will have to make sacrifices, being that there are only 24 hours in a day, and each med school and parenting can require all the 24 hours alone.

But, that being said-- you are making huge generalizations: 1. you are assuming a parent with free time on their hands (the opposite of a busy med student) would make a better parent? But have you ever heard of those lazy stay at home moms that watch Soaps all day long? I would much rather have a busy mom that attended school full time.

2. Another thing that requires time and effort? A relationship. Are you trying to say that any boyfriend or girlfriend of wife or husband out there is being unfair to their significant other? Because the time they will spend studying anatomy is unfairly taking away the time they should devote to their loved one? Should we all become single when we enter med school?

3. You are assuming that parents wont be able to prioritize their time between parenting and studying. But have you ever heard of those awesome student athletes that say because they had to learn to budget their time between sports and school, BOTH areas grew in excellence?!

4. Are you assuming med school will be a busier time than being an attending? Attendings are very busy too..... so are you implying that doctors should NEVER have children? Because we will be too busy working to care for kids? And futhermore... how about investment bankers, people on wall street, lawyers, truck drivers.... etc? Should anyone that has a job that requires effort and time away from their kids stop having children? Seems that is what you are implying.... tsk tsk.

Anyways... you are being condescending. So no matter your opinion, stop it.

Second, to all moms/dads out there that are in med school or will be attending med school -- I say Congratulations. Congrats for going after your dreams... your children will become better people because they have a great role model.:clap:

EDIT: yes, my words are condescending to your opinions as well (I will agree-- but your ideas on this thread make me see red (and I dont even have any kids!)) but you are being condescending towards a persons core values-- any mother or father out there that desires to become a doctor.
 
art4vandalay said:
I think the problem is that some people feel that becoming a doctor is an overnight process, well im sorry but it isnt. Being a doctor requires 8, YES 8 YEARS OF YOUR LIFE. I think people that have kids who decide to pursue medical school just better realize what those 8 years will entail for you AS WELL AS YOUR KID.
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Thanks for popping in and saving us. You think folks can't count to eight or don't think about how the decisions they make affect their child? Why is this even an issue to you? Really makes me want to say mind your own ****king business and go save someone else.
 
Are you sure??? And here I thought I was gonna be an attending by Winter of '09. Sure the whole process isn't less than 2 yrs? Yes.. thank god he popped in and saved us.:laugh:


PT2MD said:
Thanks for popping in and saving us. You think folks can't count to eight or don't think about how the decisions they make affect their child? Why is this even an issue to you? Really makes me want to say mind your own ****king business and go save someone else.
Click to expand...
 
art4vandalay said:
I think the problem is that some people feel that becoming a doctor is an overnight process, well im sorry but it isnt. Being a doctor requires 8, YES 8 YEARS OF YOUR LIFE. I think people that have kids who decide to pursue medical school just better realize what those 8 years will entail for you AS WELL AS YOUR KID.
Click to expand...

Actually, my friend, being a physician is a lifetime proposition. It only begins with medical school.

I do not presume to tell others how to live their lives, or the choices they make regarding their families. As long as they know what they are doing and are able to do it, more power to them. Personally, I am awed by some of my school mates who have kids and are able to do really well in school. My hat's off to them. 👍
 
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