Best company for disability insurance?

[drindebt]

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I need to get disability insurance before graduating residency. Are all the companies (guardian, mass, principal, etc) all the same? They all have different wording regarding own vs regular occupation and I'm not sure how to decipher who will actual pay if I ever need to file a claim. Anyone have experience with a certain company?

 

[Mbekweni]

I think that they are all very similar in terms of coverage, though some will offer some "sweet spots" in their coverage. Ie Guardian has a graded policy option, so it's way cheaper when you get it and then gets progressively more expensive each year. When I got my policy through them it was cheaper than a level payment for 12 years, with total outlay being equal at 20 years. I'm a bit of a super saver FIRE person and plan to have enough saved up to self insure within 12 years and certainly well before 20 so chose to save some money with their graded policy.

I also know that Principle has a pretty hefty discount for 10 years of coverage compared to the "To age 65". Since the average duration of disability claims is usually 2-3 years, and the fraction of claims lasting over 10 years in likely very low (though I don't have that data) this could be another niche to consider.

Sometimes of the big 5 producers they will put you in a different occupation class entirely for a specialty and this could lead to a wider swing in coverage prices all else being equal (ie 90 day waiting period, coverage to age 65, residual disability rider etc).

 

[Groove]

They are all somewhat similar but I'm not an insurance specialist. We had a guy selling Mass Mutual policies to the residents at a discount back when I was finishing residency and I took out a policy with them, which I have since maxed out to about $16500/mo benefit. I intend to keep it until I'm closer to retirement. It's expensive, but it's great peace of mind.

 

[Apollyon]

@MD Financial Services Scott

That's the guy. Maybe the tag will be like a Bat signal.

 

[cyanide12345678]

Got mine and my wife's disability through pattern disability insurance. They give you quotes from all 5 of the companies with true own occupation insurance. They do add some riders that you can remove as well.

I pay $200 for 10750 coverage with principal. I think my wife's insurance is $77 for $5000 benefit with mass mutual i believe.

 

[creek]

why my quote is $400 for 10,000/month?

 

[Fox800]

I use Ameritas, but they're the only company that would issue a student loan rider for refinanced loans. $10,000/mo with a $2,000/mo loan rider, and partial disability coverage as well.

 

[cyanide12345678]

why my quote is $400 for 10,000/month?

What riders do you have?

 

[scoKraz4]

You want cola rider, own occupation, partial disability, and future increase option. I found guardian and principal had the best offers for me. It varies by your age/health, habits, and the state you live in. Mass mutual could be ideal for you in one state, guardian in another. Get it while in residency as they offer discounts. If you are moving to another state after residency, figure out which state will be cheaper to own it. For me, I am moving to a cheaper state so I purchased the minimum amount to secure my discount and my rates then will increase when I move.

 

[Groove]

why my quote is $400 for 10,000/month?

Consider yourself lucky. Mine is around $650/mo

 

[cyanide12345678]

You want cola rider, own occupation, partial disability, and future increase option. I found guardian and principal had the best offers for me. It varies by your age/health, habits, and the state you live in. Mass mutual could be ideal for you in one state, guardian in another. Get it while in residency as they offer discounts. If you are moving to another state after residency, figure out which state will be cheaper to own it. For me, I am moving to a cheaper state so I purchased the minimum amount to secure my discount and my rates then will increase when I move.

I got rid of partial disability Rider. I personally couldn't conceptualize a situation where im disabled enough where i can work 6 ER shifts instead of 12. To me, either i can work an ER shift or i can't. If i can work a partial schedule, then i can work full time.

 

[thegenius]

why my quote is $400 for 10,000/month?

that's about par, more or less.

I pay $860 for $22,500/month

I got it older and I'm frucking crazy, which makes it harder to write a policy against me. That's why I pay a little more. Mine is through Llyod of London.

 

[thegenius]

I got rid of partial disability Rider. I personally couldn't conceptualize a situation where im disabled enough where i can work 6 ER shifts instead of 12. To me, either i can work an ER shift or i can't. If i can work a partial schedule, then i can work full time.

I commented "Hmm" because it made me think, not "Hmm" I think you are wrong.

 

[DeadCactus]

White Coat Investor has a nice write up as well as a list of recommended insurance agents. I went through Pattern as my agent and had a good experience. There are 3 companies that provide products that match our needs well, find out which is cheapest through the broker and go for that. They can hook you up with life insurance at the same time if you want.

Understanding Disability Insurance for Doctors | White Coat Investor

Disability insurance protects your biggest financial risk. Find out how DI works, how much you should buy, and when you should cancel.

www.whitecoatinvestor.com

Insurance Agents for Physicians | White Coat Investor

www.whitecoatinvestor.com

Tangential opinion, there is so much hand wringing about finances. For most people, it's a waste of time to try to optimize every little detail and get it "perfect". Financial plans fall apart in the mundane details of your daily spending and saving not in the inane details that most people seem to agonize over. Buy disability from one of the 3 major players through a broker, buy a 20 year term life insurance policy for 1-2 million, buy an umbrella insurance policy, and invest $50-100k a year in a Vanguard target retirement account. Save up about $100k in a liquid emergency fund over your first few years out of residency. Avoid consumer debt and lifestyle inflation. There you go, hours of reading and research saved. Again, people don't fail because they put their money into 90% stocks and 10% bonds instead of 80% and 20% or because they bough $10k a month coverage instead of $8k. They fail because they would rather have a Tesla than put money into savings.

 

[Apollyon]

that's about par, more or less.

I pay $860 for $22,500/month

I got it older and I'm frucking crazy, which makes it harder to write a policy against me. That's why I pay a little more. Mine is through Llyod of London.

Were you drinking when you wrote this post? The content is fine, but the spelling and whatnot, you know, the je ne sais quoi, and, also, I speak from experience.

 

[thegenius]

Were you drinking when you wrote this post? The content is fine, but the spelling and whatnot, you know, the je ne sais quoi, and, also, I speak from experience.

Yes I was. I have a mild to moderate hangover HA this morning too.

What does that French mean? Je ne sais quip? Damn autocorrect (on my iPhone)! I can’t even type it out.

 

[Mbekweni]

You want cola rider, own occupation, partial disability, and future increase option. I found guardian and principal had the best offers for me. It varies by your age/health, habits, and the state you live in. Mass mutual could be ideal for you in one state, guardian in another. Get it while in residency as they offer discounts. If you are moving to another state after residency, figure out which state will be cheaper to own it. For me, I am moving to a cheaper state so I purchased the minimum amount to secure my discount and my rates then will increase when I move.

These recommendations work great if you are a resident buying your disability insurance. However if you are an attending there are two adjustments that I would make. First, you don't need a COLA rider. This adds a substantial premium to your monthly cost of coverage and as I had mentioned earlier, the average length of disability is 2-3 years, so you'll never see the benefit for almost all claims. The best thing to do in my opinion is to use the 20% or so cost of the COLA rider and to buy that much more overall coverage. I did the math back when I got my policy and found that if you invest the difference with that increased coverage you get the same COLA benefit, and if you have a shorter term disability ie break your leg and are out for a few months, then you get the benefit of higher payout.

Future purchase increase option gives you the option to increase in the future when your income does, ie when you become an attending. This can cost about 20% of your policy, so again much better to just bite the bullet and get 20% more coverage up front once you are eligible and then drop this extra coverage. With these two changes you can get 30-40% more coverage and pay the same monthly premium.

 

[BoardingDoc]

Yes I was. I have a mild to moderate hangover HA this morning too.

What does that French mean? Je ne sais quip? Damn autocorrect (on my iPhone)! I can’t even type it out.

Je ne sais quoi is a phrase which literally means "I don't know what." It means that something has a certain characteristic or quality which can not be adequately described.

In the example above, @Apollyon was saying that your post indescribably had a certain quality to it which indicated that you were drinking when you wrote it.

 

[MD Financial Services Scott]

I need to get disability insurance before graduating residency. Are all the companies (guardian, mass, principal, etc) all the same? They all have different wording regarding own vs regular occupation and I'm not sure how to decipher who will actual pay if I ever need to file a claim. Anyone have experience with a certain company?

They can be the same but they certainly can all be designed where they don't have strong features. In addition, when you buy a policy you need to make sure it coordinates correctly with any employer plan because things like AMA, AFP, ACS, etc. can allow most employer plans to then not pay you what they were supposed to.

 

[MD Financial Services Scott]

@MD Financial Services Scott

That's the guy. Maybe the tag will be like a Bat signal.

Ha, I certainly wish I had all of batman's gadgets!

 

[MD Financial Services Scott]

why my quote is $400 for 10,000/month?

Depending on your age or if you live in CA it seems kind of high.

 

[MD Financial Services Scott]

Consider yourself lucky. Mine is around $650/mo

Yeah but you had mentioned that yours is also for $16k so the cost per $1,000 is about the same.

 

[MD Financial Services Scott]

that's about par, more or less.

I pay $860 for $22,500/month

I got it older and I'm frucking crazy, which makes it harder to write a policy against me. That's why I pay a little more. Mine is through Llyod of London.

You might want to check around because most of Llyods contracts make you re-qualify medically every 3-5 years and if something comes up you may not be extended a renewal.