Best ECs to help admission

[DropkickMurphy]

That's interesting, seeing as I have a study saved on my computer discussing the fact that lights and sirens response saves on average less than 2 minutes in an urban environment (I believe it was either LA or San Francisco).

I hate to cut this off, but perhaps we shouldn't sidetrack this thread any further. If you all really want to discuss this further, I would suggest you join me over at www.traumacentral.com/forums That way all the other SDNer's who aren't EMS professionals don't have to sift through this discussion to find things useful to them.

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[DropkickMurphy]

I wish all premeds had thick skin, actually make that all people....it would make life so much easier with so many fewer fights, murders and wars.

 

[jackets5]

Lizzy, let me know what school you are affiliated with so i can apply there (if i havent already) next year if i dont get in this time around. Played minor leauge baseball and Division 1A college football (and im serious).

It's not to say that non-athletes won't get recommended for interviews -- and as members rotate off of an adcom what impresses an adcom will change. But being able to handle a e.c. with a heavy weekly time commitment and make good grades & do some other interesting things (off season research, etc) does make a positive impression. For every athlete I see, I think I see 5 musicians and a couple of dancers, a journalist, and an artist.

 

[WholeLottaGame7]

It's funny that you mention that....I was involved in a heated discussion last night (heated only because the guy I was talking with became angry when I had data to back up my position) about whether running lights and sirens has any appreciable effect other than killing and injuring ambulance crews and innocent motorists.

I'm pretty sure that I've read/been told that running code typically saves about a minute in response time, and if you consider the increased chance of injury to your crew, your patient, and bystanders, that's not all that hot. I'm under the impression that a lot of places are starting to be a little more stringent on what calls they run lights/sirens to.

 

[DrBowtie]

Whether or not you agree with Lizzy, the fact still remains that she has more experience than all but a few.

I find it funny that everyone always complains that not enough adcoms come on here and answer questions. Here is someone doing just that and you all are dismissing their opinion.

I for one think her opinions are invaluable since they actually factor into the decisions made.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Lizzy, let me know what school you are affiliated with so i can apply there (if i havent already) next year if i dont get in this time around. Played minor leauge baseball and Division 1A college football (and im serious).

Personally I'd like to see LizzyM make a list of people she would like to see apply and those who she would not want to see apply based upon their SDN personas.

 

[argonana]

BrettBatchelor--blame it on hubris!! LOL I am certainly guilty of it.

 

[tigress]

Whether or not you agree with Lizzy, the fact still remains that she has more experience than all but a few.

I find it funny that everyone always complains that not enough adcoms come on here and answer questions. Here is someone doing just that and you all are dismissing their opinion.

I for one think her opinions are invaluable since they actually factor into the decisions made.

First off, I never complained about adcoms not coming on here (actually I've never seen anybody make that complaint, but I probably just haven't read the right threads). Second, I respect her opinions, and I know that she knows more about the process than we do. But I don't think that justifies her tone, nor do I think her opinions are always THE TRUTH (sure, they factor into the decisions made at whatever school she's on the adcom of, but she's one individual at one school, and people should remember that).

On the one hand, it's great to have insider info. On the other hand, too many sdners are just licking her feet.

(btw, I definitely don't have thick skin. It's something I'd like to be better about, but at this stage I'm not!)

 

[LizzyM]

Just because you're on an adcom doesn't mean ...that you can imply that people are doing things on their "daddy's money."

Also, I sort of wonder why you are spending SO much time on sdn lately.

Why did you decide to come and "enlighten" all of us here?

Well, quick trips abroad to gain clinical experience in a short period of time is a sign of privilege as Risa pointed out a few pages back.

Why do I spend some time here? Insomnia. Less work on my desk at this time of year (the big rush of applications is now just a trickle). I first discovered this forum last Spring and there was so much guessing and misinformation that I found myself trying to assure & reassure applicants. I think that it has given me better insight into what it is like to be an applicant these days. Sometimes it is good to be able to encourage applicants to make the choices that are going to make their applications that much better.

 

[AWhitehair]

research publications
leadership in the community. volunteerism is dime a dozen, true leadership is rare

I agree. Try to take on some leadership position throughout your undergrad years. Among other traits it shows a sense of direction, motivation and responsibility.

 

[tigress]

Well, quick trips abroad to gain clinical experience in a short period of time is a sign of privilege as Risa pointed out a few pages back.

Why do I spend some time here? Insomnia. Less work on my desk at this time of year (the big rush of applications is now just a trickle). I first discovered this forum last Spring and there was so much guessing and misinformation that I found myself trying to assure & reassure applicants. I think that it has given me better insight into what it is like to be an applicant these days. Sometimes it is good to be able to encourage applicants to make the choices that are going to make their applications that much better.

Those sound like very good reasons for coming on. Thanks for lending your opinion. I still think your tone is a bit harsh, though.

Being an applicant messes with my brain.

edit: actually, a better question is what am I doing here at 12:50 am??? (I'm on the East coast, obviously). Answer: my apartment has no hot water tonight (WHY? good question...not like they warned us or anything), so I couldn't shower after I exercised, and then I made dinner late, and argh! I'm usually in bed by 10 or 10:30...this is going to hit me in the face tomorrow

 

[DropkickMurphy]

First off, I never complained about adcoms not coming on here (actually I've never seen anybody make that complaint, but I probably just haven't read the right threads). Second, I respect her opinions, and I know that she knows more about the process than we do. But I don't think that justifies her tone, nor do I think her opinions are always THE TRUTH (sure, they factor into the decisions made at whatever school she's on the adcom of, but she's one individual at one school, and people should remember that).

On the one hand, it's great to have insider info. On the other hand, too many sdners are just licking her feet.

(btw, I definitely don't have thick skin. It's something I'd like to be better about, but at this stage I'm not!)

Sorry I don't lick anyone's feet. But I do believe those that are trying to help us out do deserve as much respect as we can give them short of outright a-- kissing. The problem is that far too many people are so uptight that they might be at a disadvantage, that they put themselves at a disadvantage because of their neurotic fixations. Anyone feels that I am wrong in this assessment please feel free to correct me on it.

 

[DrBowtie]

First off, I never complained about adcoms not coming on here (actually I've never seen anybody make that complaint, but I probably just haven't read the right threads). Second, I respect her opinions, and I know that she knows more about the process than we do. But I don't think that justifies her tone, nor do I think her opinions are always THE TRUTH (sure, they factor into the decisions made at whatever school she's on the adcom of, but she's one individual at one school, and people should remember that).

On the one hand, it's great to have insider info. On the other hand, too many sdners are just licking her feet.

(btw, I definitely don't have thick skin. It's something I'd like to be better about, but at this stage I'm not!)

A few people have requested an adcom forum on this SDN Feedback thread.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=238897

Secondly, "you all" was a general term and not directed towards anyone in particular.

Thirdly, it might not matter to you what Lizzy's opinions are but the fact that adcoms are people and people have opinions on everything should be a lesson learned. People have preferences for things and sometimes they prefer things opposite from you.

 

[riceman04]

i don't think Lizzy's comments were intended to insult anyone and considering she is a member of an adcom (if i remember correctly), her suggestions/comments may carry some weight. however, i do agree that medical "tourism" (i don't necessarily agree with calling it this either) is important. it has been the only thing to come up in every single one of my interviews.

Well if she is a member of an adcom then she definitely did not display any professionalism with that comment...so many people lie on this board anyway...so maybe she lied when she said she was part of an adcom...Like someone said earlier she made a valid point that going abroad and engaging in medical tourism does not necessarily set someone apart from others (while that is great experience I assume it was ephemeral).....I think people do want to see growth and wilingness to accept greater challenges....

To the person who went on the medical tour...did you investigate any programs that may have been offered locally or nationally? Though the common goal is to provide the necessary healthcare (that I personally think is a right, rather than a privilege to be exercised only by the wealthy...oops mispelling I think...) on a worldwide basis there are many healthcare related issues that need to be rectified nationally. But this gets into a whole other topic...so I end here.

I definitely dont mean to throw salt on your (the med tour person's) accomplishments...and in fact I do respect your committment to your goals and your willingness to even make an attempt to give back, with the hope of making a significant difference.

Oh yeah this is what I have been doing for the last 4+ years:
I have been acting as a tutor and mentor to inner city minority students. It has been a life changing experience that I hope to continue even after I earn my MD.
This past year I helped get a program in Los Angeles called the Black Male Academy off the ground...It is a tutoring/mentoring program sponsored by College Bound (which is a program designed to basically increase the enrollment of minority students in college) that specifically focuses on elementary to entering high school males. We tutor the kids in various subjects (I specialize in math/sci/spanish/english) and attempt to introduce them to new ideas and opportunities that will hopefully facilitate their desire to become well rounded individuals. It has been alot of fun.

I am in Philly for a year...but I still stay in touch with everyone. Out here I am part of this program called "Big Brother/Big Sister"...it is also a mentoring program.

I also have a few med. experiences too (volunteering/translating/shadowing)...but that is pretty normal.

Good luck to everyone!

 

[tigress]

Sorry I don't lick anyone's feet. But I do believe those that are trying to help us out do deserve as much respect as we can give them short of outright a-- kissing. The problem is that far too many people are so uptight that they might be at a disadvantage, that they put themselves at a disadvantage because of their neurotic fixations. Anyone feels that I am wrong in this assessment please feel free to correct me on it.

I didn't mean you in particular (with regard to the foot-licking).

I do think people deserve respect, but I think that to a certain degree they also have to earn it.

 

[tigress]

A few people have requested an adcom forum on this SDN Feedback thread.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=238897

Secondly, "you all" was a general term and not directed towards anyone in particular.

Thirdly, it might not matter to you what Lizzy's opinions are but the fact that adcoms are people and people have opinions on everything should be a lesson learned. People have preferences for things and sometimes they prefer things opposite from you.

Yeah, I'm taking everything a bit personally because it's way past my bedtime and I should have stopped posting long ago.

Also, I don't disagree with anything Lizzy said, and (as I've said multiple times) I respect her opinion. But I also think people are taking her opinion as the gold standard, and while it's perhaps the best info we have, it's not the bible of admissions, either. And, as I said above, people's opinions should always be respected, but I was disturbed by the tone in many of Lizzy's posts, and I felt that, on the contrary, she wasn't respecting many of the posters here. I realize she's just trying to help, but that can be done without disparaging remarks.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

I haven't seen any conduct that would warrant an accusation of unprofessionalism. I believe it was honest and justified the assessment that she made, regardless of whether she truly is an ADCOM member or not (I have no reason to doubt her at this point in time).


Also there was nothing disparaging about her comment; she said nothing more than the pointed and apparently unwelcome opinion that med tours are not the most well regarded application padding fodder one can invest in.

 

[LizzyM]

If I seem a bit harsh, maybe it is the effect of having read over 800 appies so far this year. I know that if I'm in a bad mood I don't dare read -- when I have PMS, no one is getting into medical school. Part of being good at this is knowing one's self and being fair.

The travel abroad is one of those things that gets on my nerves sometime. I recall an applicant some years back who had spent a total of 3 weeks in a relatively poor European country working with his dad, a subspecialist, providing free care-- 2 trips over 4 years, IIRC. No doubt they killed the fatted calf for the cousins from America who came over to visit and give care. (they had specifically traveled to the ancestral homeland) The same applicant had spent far more time (several weeks per year for 4 years) traveling to resorts to pursue a hobby. He had no community service or exposure to sick people or the health care system other than the trips abroad with dad. It just rubbed me the wrong way.

 

[riceman04]

If I seem a bit harsh, maybe it is the effect of having read over 800 appies so far this year. I know that if I'm in a bad mood I don't dare read -- when I have PMS, no one is getting into medical school. Part of being good at this is knowing one's self and being fair.

The travel abroad is one of those things that gets on my nerves sometime. I recall an applicant some years back who had spent a total of 3 weeks in a relatively poor European country working with his dad, a subspecialist, providing free care-- 2 trips over 4 years, IIRC. No doubt they killed the fatted calf for the cousins from America who came over to visit and give care. (they had specifically traveled to the ancestral homeland) The same applicant had spent far more time (several weeks per year for 4 years) traveling to resorts to pursue a hobby. He had no community service or exposure to sick people or the health care system other than the trips abroad with dad. It just rubbed me the wrong way.

Oh ok...so maybe you are telling the truth...that's cool that you get you get to be part of this process on a regular basis.

 

[gdbaby]

If I seem a bit harsh, maybe it is the effect of having read over 800 appies so far this year. I know that if I'm in a bad mood I don't dare read -- when I have PMS, no one is getting into medical school. Part of being good at this is knowing one's self and being fair.

The travel abroad is one of those things that gets on my nerves sometime. I recall an applicant some years back who had spent a total of 3 weeks in a relatively poor European country working with his dad, a subspecialist, providing free care-- 2 trips over 4 years, IIRC. No doubt they killed the fatted calf for the cousins from America who came over to visit and give care. (they had specifically traveled to the ancestral homeland) The same applicant had spent far more time (several weeks per year for 4 years) traveling to resorts to pursue a hobby. He had no community service or exposure to sick people or the health care system other than the trips abroad with dad. It just rubbed me the wrong way.

Lizzy, you can decide not to coment if you would like, but in your experience how do Adcoms see peripherally health-related EC's? For example (and I am not trying to imply this is me ): you have a non-trad Medical Anthropologist who spent a year in another country studying the cultural construction of a particular illness. Not direct medical care, but certainly enhances the knowledge-base about illness and healing.

 

[argonana]

One of my posts (formerly #53) just disappeared. Can anyone explain this? Acck!

 

[NapeSpikes]

One of my posts (formerly #53) just disappeared. Can anyone explain this? Acck!

Happens to me all the time, too. I don't know why...

 

[gdbaby]

I think you automatically get entered in the Publisher's Clearinghouse Sweepstakes. And you didn't even have to subscribe to Field and Stream!

 

[NapeSpikes]

Field and Stream? Haha

 

[Phil Anthropist]

One of my posts (formerly #53) just disappeared. Can anyone explain this? Acck!

The poster whom you discussed posts anonymously. You made a guess at this user's affilitation. Whether or not your guess was right or wrong is irrelevant; it's an issue of confidentiality. The posting of such personal information violates
SDN's Privacy Policy. It was best to remove the post altogether than to potentially compromise the user's confidentiality.

This isn't specific to adcom members. The moderators, myself included, have deleted or edited posts about other users that could have been breaches of confidentiality. If true guesses are deleted and incorrect guesses are not, then other SDNers would be able to figure out whether or not the guess was correct. The solution is to delete all such posts. If a user wishes to remain anonymous (including affiliation), that should be respected.

We do our best to enforce SDN's Privacy Policy.

 

[LizzyM]

how do Adcoms see peripherally health-related EC's? For example (and I am not trying to imply this is me ): you have a non-trad Medical Anthropologist who spent a year in another country studying the cultural construction of a particular illness. Not direct medical care, but certainly enhances the knowledge-base about illness and healing.

An anthropologist used to serve with me on an adcom. One of our colleagues earned a PhD in anthro before going to med school.

I think that the thought going thorough a reader's mind would be, "hmm interesting, why switch from medical anthropology to medicine? how long ago did the applicant make the decision? How has the decision been tested? "

It is not so much having a knowledge base about illness & healing although that is an interesting "take" on the experience. It is more like, "who is this person? What experiences have they had in their life? Why have they chosen (or switched to) medicine? What have they learned (and learned about themselves) in those experiences? Do they demonstrate qualities that we like to see in a physician?" There might also be some curiosity on the part of the reader to want to hear more about the experience, "how was that country chosen? why that particular illness? what did you discover? can these findings be applied to improve the health of the population?" When a reader starts asking those questions they become fascinated and think that the applicant ought to be invited to interview because what they've done seems so interesting (actually, it has just generated a lot of questions of the curious kind).

 

[argonana]

Phil Anthropist--and you do a very good job! Sorry about the post...

 

[SailCrazy]

I said I didn't read your application. Interesting that more than one applicant in this cycle has helped with a c-section in the third world. It really isn't unique.

So a third world c-section isn't unique (and therefore valuable) but being the captain is a sports team is?

I should have said that medical tourism isn't as impressive as some people might thing. (I am sorry for using the word "you" in that sentence and I hope you will accept my apology.)

What you should be apologizing for is the crappy comment about daddy's money, not the use of the word you.

A long term commitment to a group that makes trips abroad is good. A three week trip out of the blue to gain some clinical exposure and improve one's language skills is less impressive.

...but certainly not worthless, (or necessarily less worthwhile than being the captain of a sports team.)

 

[SailCrazy]

I think that the thought going thorough a reader's mind would be, "hmm interesting, why switch from medical anthropology to medicine? how long ago did the applicant make the decision? How has the decision been tested? "

I would have guess that you would have suggested that the reader would have wondered how much of Daddy's money that applicant blew on the anthropology degree...

 

[unfrozencaveman]

Actually, after working two years in a Philadelphia emergency room with victims of violent injuries (a childrens hospital, no less.. scary), almost nothing prepared me for standing around emergency rooms in South Africa, doing essentially nothing helpful (as a totally underqualified premed), on a trip financed entirely by father. It was a trip that changed me, and the entire future of my career. Don't knock it until you try it.

 

[45408]

Don't knock it until you try it.

Oh, believe me, I would, if I could. My parents aren't paying for a thing for me these days, even though they could. I wish the US's college system was more like Europe's (free) so that I could work less, study more, and actually travel abroad some day.

 

[unfrozencaveman]

Yeah, dont get me wrong, I consider myself very lucky. It was an awesome experience.

It just seems crazy to me that something like this would be seen as a detriment to an application.

Luckily I was a captain of a sports team.

 

[jammin06]

To the person who went on the medical tour...did you investigate any programs that may have been offered locally or nationally? Though the common goal is to provide the necessary healthcare (that I personally think is a right, rather than a privilege to be exercised only by the wealthy...oops mispelling I think...) on a worldwide basis there are many healthcare related issues that need to be rectified nationally. But this gets into a whole other topic...so I end here.

I definitely dont mean to throw salt on your (the med tour person's) accomplishments...and in fact I do respect your committment to your goals and your willingness to even make an attempt to give back, with the hope of making a significant difference.

I actually did investigate a couple of programs locally, but I guess my approach to this idea is that some of the people who are the worst off here in the US still have it better than most people in 3rd world countries.

The following comment is not made to knock any of the volunteer efforts that you have done (which btw, I think are very commendable). My personal opinion is that while it is important, for example, to increase minority enrollment in universities and give them the opportunity to take advantage of the US education system, I don't know if it's completely comparable to going out on mobile clinics, giving free immunizations to infants who would otherwise go untreated.

But I conclude with the same sentiment as you, that "I do respect your committment to your goals and your willingness to even make an attempt to give back, with the hope of making a significant difference."

 

[jammin06]

Luckily I was a captain of a sports team.

hehe, same here. Actually my personal statement was completely based on a metaphor of comparing life to soccer, with phyisicans kind of being the leader (captain) of the medical team.

 

[unfrozencaveman]

Everyone has their own unique stuff "4 time water polo all american" and that type nonsense, I'm looking slightly more generic.

Oddly enough, I was this exact nonsense.

 

[Uncle_Tbag]

Except when they don't ask anything about your ECs, like almost every interviewer I've had so far. (Not that I'm condoning lying on your applications. I think that's despicable. But you could probably get away with it for the most part.)

And I do think your first comments were rude. Just because you're on an adcom doesn't mean you're always right, or that you can imply that people are doing things on their "daddy's money." You yourself said you didn't read the guy's application, so how can you judge it?

I respect that you're on an adcom and therefore you know a lot of things that we don't. But you're also one person, and whatever your opinion is, it's still YOUR opinion. I'm mostly saying this to remind everybody else out there. Also, I sort of wonder why you are spending SO much time on sdn lately. I don't mean to be rude, but it's something I've noticed. Us pre-meds are overly anxious and fretting about our applications right now; at least that's why I'm around a lot. What about you? Why did you decide to come and "enlighten" all of us here? (That's a serious question. I'm really not a mean person. I'm just a bit wary of the current situation.)

Isn't it funny that the trip in question was funded by "daddy's money" (to be paid back of course lol)? Pretty perceptive. I think Lizzy is being honest with us and not trying to be rude. Should she lie and say that a wealthy kid going overseas for a couple weeks to pad an app is really impressive when it's not?

It's pretty obvious when someone is involved in a bunch of ECs for the sole purpose of getting into med-school. The person who dedicates their lives for years to an EC seems much more likely to be doing it for the right reasons; because they want to and they actually feel a sense of duty, not because they want a better app.

 

[unfrozencaveman]

Right. So instead, for adcoms we are required to shamelessly pander to them in different, more useless ways- MCATs we dont want to take, research we dont want to do...

 

[Uncle_Tbag]

First off, I never complained about adcoms not coming on here (actually I've never seen anybody make that complaint, but I probably just haven't read the right threads). Second, I respect her opinions, and I know that she knows more about the process than we do. But I don't think that justifies her tone, nor do I think her opinions are always THE TRUTH (sure, they factor into the decisions made at whatever school she's on the adcom of, but she's one individual at one school, and people should remember that).

On the one hand, it's great to have insider info. On the other hand, too many sdners are just licking her feet.

I think that last line misses the mark.

You are on an adcom. A kid walks in. She's been in school all her life, never had a job. One of her ECs is travelling all around the World doing medical tourism.

Who would you think paid for the trip? I think parents a safe assumption in some cases.

If someone gave me a few grand so I could spend a month in Africa I would take the opportunity in a second. It would be an amazing experience. But I also think it pales in comparison to ECs where the applicant actually has to work for their achievments.

 

[LizzyM]

The title of this thread is BEST ECs to help admission. What I was saying is not essential to have a lot of [Daddy's] money to do an excellent EC. Some of the best in terms of helping admission cost very little, other than one's time and talent (and the opportunity cost of not working at some lucrative biz rather than doing something that will impress the adcom).

 

[45408]

Yeah, dont get me wrong, I consider myself very lucky. It was an awesome experience.

It just seems crazy to me that something like this would be seen as a detriment to an application.

I doubt it's detrimental. The point has been all along - it's not as impressive as some/many people think it is.

I really wish I could've gone to N'awlins though - my co-workers (also EMTs) were pulling down $10,000 a month, and they weren't responsible for any of their living expenses. Now THAT would've helped......

 

[jammin06]

Isn't it funny that the trip in question was funded by "daddy's money" (to be paid back of course lol)? Pretty perceptive. I think Lizzy is being honest with us and not trying to be rude. Should she lie and say that a wealthy kid going overseas for a couple weeks to pad an app is really impressive when it's not?

For clarification purposes, I would not exactly consider myself wealthy in any regard. Both of my parents work full-time as labroatory technologists. (just so someone (*cough*Lizzy*cough* ) doesn't think that I am the child of some wealthy sub-specialist. The trip cost me about $2500. I worked/raised about $1300 by the time of the trip (so i suppose daddy did fund part of it, *agrees grudgingly*), but i worked in the operating room this past summer to pay him back.

It's pretty obvious when someone is involved in a bunch of ECs for the sole purpose of getting into med-school. The person who dedicates their lives for years to an EC seems much more likely to be doing it for the right reasons; because they want to and they actually feel a sense of duty, not because they want a better app.

I think that since this was not my first time going on an international volunteer trip (previous trip was to rural villages in the sierra madres of mexico), I hope that my dedication to an international cause is not perceived as a desire to boost my app. Granted, I will be the first to admit that the app is one factor to consider, but it should never be THE deciding factor.

 

[riceman04]

I actually did investigate a couple of programs locally, but I guess my approach to this idea is that some of the people who are the worst off here in the US still have it better than most people in 3rd world countries.

The following comment is not made to knock any of the volunteer efforts that you have done (which btw, I think are very commendable). My personal opinion is that while it is important, for example, to increase minority enrollment in universities and give them the opportunity to take advantage of the US education system, I don't know if it's completely comparable to going out on mobile clinics, giving free immunizations to infants who would otherwise go untreated.

But I conclude with the same sentiment as you, that "I do respect your committment to your goals and your willingness to even make an attempt to give back, with the hope of making a significant difference."

I am all for making sure everything is right locally before I even consider providing my services in areas that I know will not have a direct impact on our society.

And while medical tours are a great way of gaining unique med. experience...it is so short lived that most do not really have an opportunity to truly understand just how important their actions are...yes they understand that there is a significant health care discrepancy btwn our country and a 3rd world country...but their scope of the problem is still limited...especially since these tours only last for a few weeks.

I wish while I was at Rice that I took the time to go on one of those spring break trips, but at the same time I feel like my committment to bettering my community (via volunteering at Hospitals, like Shriners, dedicated to providing free health services, etc..., tutoring and mentoring our future) will have a significant impact.

My experiences may not be comparable when comparing their medical significance...but in terms of the impact that I believe they had on me and the others around it definitely is comparable.

Providing an inner city child with the knowledge that will empower him/her for years to come and allow him/her to see past all of the dangerous temptations of joining a gang or doing drugs is good enough for me.

 

[unfrozencaveman]

I don't really think arriving in Africa is the achievement. You actually do work over there remember. Just because someone paid to get you there, doesn't mean you didnt do anything.

 

[jammin06]

I really wish I could've gone to N'awlins though - my co-workers (also EMTs) were pulling down $10,000 a month, and they weren't responsible for any of their living expenses. Now THAT would've helped......

Funny you mention that. I am currently residing in Houston, so I was able to use my EMT skills and be on the front line of triaging patients at the Astrodome when they were being brought over from NO. Now THAT was an eye-opening experience.

 

[45408]

I don't really think arriving in Africa is the achievement. You actually do work over there remember. Just because someone paid to get you there, doesn't mean you didnt do anything.

well, sure, but you could've given the $4000 to a local charity and then volunteered there as well. To each his/her own. I do want to do some kind of medical missions work once I've got an MD though. I've even got my own nurse.

 

[Uncle_Tbag]

Well if she is a member of an adcom then she definitely did not display any professionalism with that comment...so many people lie on this board anyway...so maybe she lied when she said she was part of an adcom...Like someone said earlier she made a valid point that going abroad and engaging in medical tourism does not necessarily set someone apart from others (while that is great experience I assume it was ephemeral).....I think people do want to see growth and wilingness to accept greater challenges....

What a crock.

"Rich kids with global travels supported by trust funds aren't that impressive." How about we all acknowledge her statement was dead-on correct? I don't really care if any trust-fund babies are offended.

This sucks, all of you uptight, holier-than-thou pre-meds might just influence her not to post here anymore. Thanks

 

[SailCrazy]

If someone gave me a few grand so I could spend a month in Africa I would take the opportunity in a second. It would be an amazing experience. But I also think it pales in comparison to ECs where the applicant actually has to work for their achievments.

If you view simply going on such a trip as an achievement, then I agree with you. Those are the types of people for whom the trips don't add much to their applications.

If that is not the case and the trip becomes a profound learning experience that few have the opportunity to experience, then it definitely is worthwhile.

...
Perhapse a better approach would not have been to take potshots at the source of funding for any particular activity, but to examine the motivations and lessons learned by those who participate in them.

 

[jammin06]

I am all for making sure everything is right locally before I even consider providing my services in areas that I know will not have a direct impact on our society.

That's fair. I am content to say that we can agree to disagree. Honestly, at this point it's pretty much splitting hairs. The broad scope is that we both agree that it's good to help people.

And while medical tours are a great way of gaining unique med. experience...it is so short lived that most do not really have an opportunity to truly understand just how important their actions are...yes they understand that there is a significant health care discrepancy btwn our country and a 3rd world country...but their scope of the problem is still limited...especially since these tours only last for a few weeks.

I wish while I was at Rice that I took the time to go on one of those spring break trips, but at the same time I feel like my committment to bettering my community (via volunteering at Hospitals, like Shriners, dedicated to providing free health services, etc..., tutoring and mentoring our future) will have a significant impact.

I think taht you're riight on with the spring break trips. Those are far to short ot understand the scope of what you're doing. I coordinated the pre-medical trip my sophomore year, but it was the month long immersion in Africa that i think truly changed me.

Providing an inner city child with the knowledge that will empower him/her for years to come and allow him/her to see past all of the dangerous temptations of joining a gang or doing drugs is good enough for me.

I find it interseting that you mention the idea of "empowering," because part of the HIV/AIDS education was to teach otehr educators how to educate their students. Same idea as teaching a man to fish vs. giving him a fish. But i think that i was able to have a long-lasting impact on the children there by offering immunizations to curable disease that far to many children die from each year.

*crap, I'm late to class*

 

[gdbaby]

I would have guess that you would have suggested that the reader would have wondered how much of Daddy's money that applicant blew on the anthropology degree...

None SailCrazy, it was all my own. Worked full-time through grad school and got a national grant to do my research. Seeing as how Daddy abandoned this applicant, you may want to start thinking before you comment.

 

[riceman04]

What a crock.

"Rich kids with global travels supported by trust funds aren't that impressive." How about we all acknowledge her statement was dead-on correct? I don't really care if any trust-fund babies are offended.

This sucks, all of you uptight, holier-than-thou pre-meds might just influence her not to post here anymore. Thanks

Bitc$ if I felt like I was holier than thou I would not wast my time cussing at your sorry ass!
Yall mother father's act like you know exactly how the person was able to fund the trip when in all actualilty you probably dont even know the person...as far as I am concered you and Lizzy M are showing nothing but your ability to hate (you guys have definitely earned your PhD....ummmmm Playa hate'N Degree)....all that hateration and holleration is not necessary is this dancerie (hahaha taken from Barbershop....comical....oh but wait you are from Utah....Mormon country....the thought of watching a movie with a majority afr. amer. cast is probably too much for you)

No really, I do not think I am holier than though...and never have...I just dont think it is right for anyone to assume that anyone helped him fund his experiences.