BIDMC/HAEMR away rotation advice

[MNgrrl]

I have been attempting to set up an away rotation for July at BIDMC, BWH, or MGH. In looking at all the application materials, they made it sound as though contacting the people in the department is not advised, and the only way to get a rotation at one of these places is to apply through the registrar. So, I did that back in Feb. and haven't heard anything since...in fact they haven't even cashed my check yet! I know they received it because I even paid for delivery confirmation on the d@#^ thing. I finally broke down and emailed the registrars office, and got a auto-reply back saying they could not reply to everyone's emails individually, and I would receive some sort of mail reply if I had been scheduled. I'm getting very nervous to just keep waiting and hoping, and end up not getting scheduled...

Anyway, the point of my rant (aside from venting general disgruntlement), is to ask if anyone here has successfully set up an away rotation at any of these places, and if so, how did you do it, and when did you hear back???

Alternatively, if anyone has any other helpful information about getting a rotation at any of these programs, I would be eternally grateful!

Thanks!

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[mikecwru]

I have been attempting to set up an away rotation for July at BIDMC, BWH, or MGH. In looking at all the application materials, they made it sound as though contacting the people in the department is not advised, and the only way to get a rotation at one of these places is to apply through the registrar. So, I did that back in Feb. and haven't heard anything since...in fact they haven't even cashed my check yet! I know they received it because I even paid for delivery confirmation on the d@#^ thing. I finally broke down and emailed the registrars office, and got a auto-reply back saying they could not reply to everyone's emails individually, and I would receive some sort of mail reply if I had been scheduled. I'm getting very nervous to just keep waiting and hoping, and end up not getting scheduled...

Anyway, the point of my rant (aside from venting general disgruntlement), is to ask if anyone here has successfully set up an away rotation at any of these places, and if so, how did you do it, and when did you hear back???

Alternatively, if anyone has any other helpful information about getting a rotation at any of these programs, I would be eternally grateful!

Thanks!

The bigger question is, why do a rotation at these places if they treat you like this? Do you want to match there? I wonder what they'll do to you then.

mike

 

[trkd]

That's garbage. I never went by what was said in the application. I just browsed their website. It says no such thing. Sometimes the app says that to keep the programs from getting a storm of calls. That has never stopped me and I have never been told "you shouldn't have called". I just happened to copy and paste this from the website in a non-obvious place (applying for residency link):

Medical Student Rotation in Emergency Medicine
Michael Woodruff, M.D.
[email protected]
Medical Student Clerkship
Co-Director

Jonathan Fisher, M.D.
[email protected]
Medical Student Clerkship
Co-Director

Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center
Harvard Affiliated Emergency Medicine Residency
Department of Emergency Medicine
One Deaconess Road
West Campus Clinical Center, 2nd Floor
Boston, MA 02215
Tel: 617-754-2339
Fax: 617-754-2350

If it were me, I would call ask to speak with either of them (calling always works better). If no answer, I would sent a joint email to them expressing your concern about the lack of communication from the registrar's office and ask if they ever received your app or have you penciled in for the slot. For many of my electives, it would say to send it to student affairs/registrar but the clerkship directors/coodinators often told me to send it to them instead. This makes me think that they want to pencil you in before the registrar has their way with your application. Good luck.

 

[SolidGold]

Where's Haemrhead when you need him? 😀

 

[StudentDoc327]

The bigger question is, why do a rotation at these places if they treat you like this? Do you want to match there? I wonder what they'll do to you then.

mike

Yeah if you are having problems, rotate at BMC instead if you are dead set on something in Boston. That program looks awesome. Im still 😡 I didn't know about it during the application process.



edit: I didn't realize you have only contacted the registrar. You should probably email the student coordinator, im sure he/she would be of better help.

 

[Peter Parker]

MNgrrl,
I think your situation is pretty standard for HMS. A friend who rotated at MGH for an EM away was notified out of the blue something like 2 weeks before his elective started last September ... that after applying many months in advance.

An e-mail to the HMS visiting clerkship coordinator will get you an auto-reply that all July 2007 spots are full -- and that the confirmations/e-mails for these spots have been sent.

Maybe try to find a better and more organized place? Have heard many times that Boston Medical Center is the place to rotate up there.

Good luck.

 

[paramed2premed]

I rotated at BMC last October, and had a great time. I emailed the residency coordinator, and it was a snap. I don't know if I wasn't supposed to do that, but. . .

For another away rotation I followed the rules, sent them my fee (!!!), and then never heard back from them. Obviously, I had lost interest in doing another away, and so did not pester them like I did at BMC, but it was weird that they never followed up.

 

[TylerDurden]

I heard from one of the MS4s that this was up and wanted to reply, as I am currently a resident at HAEMR . This is essentially a systems issue with the med school that we are trying to fix. I have heard that it has happened several times before; for some reason the registrar makes it difficult to arrange away rotations at Harvard hospitals. However, you should not let it discourage you from rotating at the BI. We have medical students both from Harvard and away rotate with us all the time and really enjoy it. In fact several of the incoming interns did away rotations at our institution this year. Just email Mike Woodruff at [email protected] and let him know of your interest. He is aware of the systems issue, and can help you navigate through it. Also, feel free to PM me.

 

[bluejay68]

I'm at the other HAEMR program (BWH/MGH) and these hoops have nothing to do with the residency, so don't let your experience keep you away. At the Brigham, you can try to contact Susan Savransky ([email protected]) for more info; I'm not sure who is her counterpart at MGH (she probably knows).

If you really want to spend a month with us (and you should), keep trying and send me a message if you are still unable to get anywhere. I do know that there are several new students at both MGH and BWH every month (MD and PA), and we also get a lot of international students rotating through as well (Germany, UK, etc), so you may need to adjust your target month for rotating a bit ahead of the standard.

 

[trkd]

I'm at the other HAEMR program (BWH/MGH) and these hoops have nothing to do with the residency, so don't let your experience keep you away.

I have found that inefficiency at the "setting up electives" end of things if rarely a reflection of the residency itself. Advice for all out there, if you think you might like somewhere, do what it takes to get the rotation. Don't be discouraged about the program based on the effort it takes to set it up.

 

[Haemr Head]

You should absolutely call Jon Fisher or Mike Woodruff. I am not sure where the advice not to call them is posted (hopefully not from on the BIDMCEM.ORG website). Please let me know where you saw this because it is dead wrong. Jon and Mike are eager to get these calls as soon as possible and help arrange the rotation because we have little or no trust in the HMS registrars office that is the official way to access the rotations.

The problem is that all student applications for the Harvard affiliated hospitals must go through the Harvard registrar who does not report to our departments or any of the Harvard teaching hospitals. The EDs at MGH, BWH,BIDMC, and Mount Auburn have been very frustrated with the process. The result is difficult communications for outside students and poor turn around time for the applications. Although we are working with the medical school to change this, in the meantime I'd encourage all students wanting to rotate with us to contact the coordinators directly and you *will* get a rotation.

 

[Emergen-C]

All the harvard programs are literally impossible to set up rotations for. you have to apply thru HMS for all of them, list them in order of preference, then WAIT, and WAIT, and WAIT. and then they tell you at the last minute that you got your 5th choice and you say oh screw it. i took that as a sign of how they'd treat me as a resident and ranked them #13 and 14.

 

[MNgrrl]

Sorry it took me so long to get back here -- thank you so much for all of your suggestions!! I really appreciate them, and am happy to hear this is not a reflection of the residency, and is an issue with the registrar. Hopefully I'll be seeing some of you in the near future!

 

[quinsy]

I had the same experience with Yale - I did apply for the rotation after the supposed 'deadline' to apply, but the registrar told me that I could still apply since it was several months before the requested rotation. I never heard back, kept emailing and calling the registrar and eventually 3 days before the start date when she was still telling me that they weren't sure yet, and she made me promise not to contact the people in the department because that was against the rules, I gave up.

The really funny part was that 3 months later (after I had interviewed at Yale and they seemed to really love me), I got this letter in the mail with my application from the registrar stamped REQUEST DENIED. Hey, you jerks! Did you think I was still waiting with bated breath for you to accept me months after the rotation I had available already passed? Thanks a bundle. Ranked them 10th or so as I recall.

I don't advise applying to these places that charge a fee to apply. It doesn't seem worth it.

 

[emclerkship]

I want to emphasize HAEMRHead's comments, and clear up a misconception. Students rotating at BIDMC have to go through the Harvard Medical School Registrar; we are aware that this process is not the easiest and we are working on ways to improve it. If you contact us directly we'll make sure everything goes smoothly and with as little stress as possible. The good news is that the HMS Registrar has NOTHING to do with your life once you're a resident at BIDMC -- you're a resident at BIDMC, not at Harvard Medical School, so the Registrar's policies are in no way a reflection of how we treat our residents. If you want to know what life as a resident at BIDMC is like come rotate with us and/or talk with the residents. The faculty are also happy to speak with any intersted students, so feel free to call or email.

Hope this helps-

 

[somedudeshotme]

There are many great EM programs in that region of the country
(HAEMR, BMC, UMass etc.) and rotating at BMC is a great idea. Good, well established program with many things to offer. I know someone who rotated there and he enjoyed it. I really liked the staff when I interviewed there and because of that, it was high on my rank list. It is also funny how so many people mentioned the difficulty in trying to set up these visiting rotations and I agree.
When I interviewed at a certain EM program in Boston, I thought it was going to be malignant based on my interactions with the less than pleasant secretary. I assumed that if they are going to be rude to a residency candidate then they must treat the residents poorly. This turned out to be false once I talked with staff and residents. Finding a right program is difficult because we try to get "a feel for the program" based on a few interactions with a few people representing the program.

 

[Got Em]

Sorry to pull up this old thread. Does anyone know if there are still problems with getting an away rotation here? Thank you.

 

[SlappyPants]

Sorry to pull up this old thread. Does anyone know if there are still problems with getting an away rotation here? Thank you.

Rotated there as a medical student a few years ago. You can't apply through VSAS but I had no issues doing it by following the steps on their website. Two useful websites for applying are the following:
http://ecommons.med.harvard.edu/org.asp?exclerk
http://www.bidmc.org/MedicalEducati...lyingforthe4thYearMedicalStudentRotation.aspx

I don't remember the application being too difficult. The only part of the entire process that sort of sucked was that my med school didn't have an arrangement with Harvard and so my malpractice insurance from my med school didn't cover me when I was at BIDMC. I had to get my own malpractice insurance for the month through a 3rd party provider. Sounds scarier than it was. Took maybe 30 minutes to set up and cost about 70 bucks for the month if I remember correctly.

EDIT: also, don't bother with any of the contact information listed above in this thread. It's all way out of date.

 

[cyanide12345678]

Before you set up an away there, make sure they will write a SLOE.

 

[SlappyPants]

Do some places not do that? I mean, if a program doesn't have a residency sure, but in general is that even a thing? When I was there the rotation director was very good about reminding us to ask an attending whom we had worked with and who liked us to take the lead in writing our SLOEs. As far as I know, noone had a problem getting theirs.

 

[Gwent]

I am currently a second year resident at BIDMC who also rotated as a student. All students get SLOEs. In fact, the clerkship director makes a point about this throughout the rotation. The web page is up to date with all contact information. When I rotated there, they were very responsive to any email. I know that August and September (I rotated in October) are very tough months given the total amount of requests, but send them an email with your questions. It is important to note that when you apply to the clerkship it is via Harvard Medical School (The webpage has this). This is different than applying to the residency which is affiliated with the medical school but housed at the medical center.

The web page is:
http://www.bidmc.org/Medical-Educat...icine/Medical-Students/4th-Year-Rotation.aspx

Hope that helps.