Biochemistry 1 before Orgo II. are they linked? (is it doable)

[bigman43]

I might be in a peculiar situation and might be able to take Biochemistry 1 before taking Orgo II. This is really strange I know, but I took Orgo 1 in the summer, and i can only take Orgo II in the spring. I might be able to register and take Biochem 1 in the fall.

Is this possible? (i dont want to waste a semester, know what i mean?)

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[Law2Doc]

I might be in a peculiar situation and might be able to take Biochemistry 1 before taking Orgo II. This is really strange I know, but I took Orgo 1 in the summer, and i can only take Orgo II in the spring. I might be able to register and take Biochem 1 in the fall.

Is this possible? (i dont want to waste a semester, know what i mean?)

There is a little overlap but I suspect you can do it. Bear in mind that only about a dozen med schools actually require biochem, so it might not be something you need to rush to get done before apps.

 

[bigman43]

yeah i totally killed orgo 1, i have a very strong "foundation" i guess for orgo 1. but i hate having to wait a semester for orgo II, but perhaps i could take biochem 1.

do you have to absolutely KNOW orgo II to succeed in biochem 1? (most people forget all the stuff after their exams hahahaa)

 

[gujuDoc]

yeah i totally killed orgo 1, i have a very strong "foundation" i guess for orgo 1. but i hate having to wait a semester for orgo II, but perhaps i could take biochem 1.

do you have to absolutely KNOW orgo II to succeed in biochem 1? (most people forget all the stuff after their exams hahahaa)

No not necessarily.

Biochem in a nutshell, at least as it was presented at my school.....

First quarter of the chapters:

Lab techniques such as SDS PAGE, Gel Chromatography, blah blah blah
acid base concepts such as PkA and Henderson Hasselbach, etc.

Second quarter of the chapters:
Enzyme and Protein Kinetics such as Michelis Menton and Cooperativity
Binding site affinity and things relating to enzymes and different type of catalytic properties.

Third quarter of the chapters:
This was the most fun part and part most like ochem. There were a lot of pathways like TCA cycle, Glycolysis/gluconeogenesis, etc.

4th quarter of it:

More cycles

If you took the second semester of biochem you went into details of DNA and RNA metabolism which is a bit more complicated.

 

[bigman43]

so...basically...orgo II isnt required for biochem?

 

[whatintheworld?]

I think I took them both at the same time... no problem.

 

[Jaded03]

so...basically...orgo II isnt required for biochem?

I'd say no. It depends on your program though. You need to understand energetics of reactions. That's all you really need.

 

[gujuDoc]

so...basically...orgo II isnt required for biochem?

To answer you question, what you learn in ochm you will rarely use in biochem. What jade said about energetics is right on.

I took biochem and ochem 2 at the same time and didn't see a lot of overlap. More then half of those reactions we learn in ochem aren't really used in the biochm concepts we learned. Biochem is what you get when you take the most basic concepts of ochm and gchm, combine it with a bit of bio and a bit of other fields of chemistry and mesh it all together.

 

[biobossx99]

depends on the 2nd semester organic chem class. When I took it, it had very little protein and sugar chemistry. As a tutor/lecturer now, the newer professors teach it near the end of 2nd semester organic chemistry.

I think it helps to be introduced to Amino Acid, and Sugar chemistry, since those are two main staple subjects in biochem. But once you hit the genetics and metabolism portion of biochem, it all is useless (ochem).

Saying that, I think having a bio1 background helps. Enzyme Kinetics are introduced then.

Either ways, a few wikipedia searches and some internet searching can help clear any confusion.

Good luck!

 

[Husky85]

No, you don't need O-Chem II for Biochem. Any O-Chem you'd run into in Biochem would be simple enough that you'd be able to figure it out on your own from the biochem textbook or lecture. And energetics just requires common sense to understand it.

I say go for it.

 

[paranoid_eyes]

biochem is all memorization, so no you don't really need ochem

*im going to bet that ochem is an enforced prerequisite for biochem*

 

[bigman43]

it is an official prereq, but i might be able to sneak by. (glitch in the registration system)

 

[shantster]

biochem is all memorization, so no you don't really need ochem

*im going to bet that ochem is an enforced prerequisite for biochem*

Orgo I and II was required to take biochem at my undergrad. The only time that I saw it help was for second semester because we went through a lot of mechanisms for the pathways.

 

[GujuMD]

I took Biochem and Orgo II at the same time. at my undergrad- we had to have orgo I done b/4 taking biochem but for orgo II we either had to have it done or take it at the same time.
a lot of people in my biochem class were taking orgo 2 at the same time.

 

[gujuDoc]

it is an official prereq, but i might be able to sneak by. (glitch in the registration system)

The only time ochm really helps biochm make sense is when you have a much much much advanced level of ochem.

QofQuimica was once telling us (in a thread on the MCAT forum) that her advanced training in a Chem PhD made biochem in med school easier because she could figure out the pathways mechanistically.

However, at the intro level you don't really learn so deep or have the time to learn the pathways that deep to the point of knowing the intricacies of the pathway mechanisms.

In most general biochem classes people tend to do a lot more memorization of the pathways by drawing it out over and over again on paper or white boards til they have it down.

The extent of application in pathways is generally in relation to labelling carbons and tracing the pathway of a carbon throughout the pathway.

For instance, you have a glucose molecule undergoing glycolysis and are asked to figure out the fate of the C1 carbon of the glucose molecule.

however, that does not need every detailed amt of ochem. But again I repeat Biochem is what you get when you mesh parts of ochm, parts of inorganic chm, parts of physical chm, parts of bio and especially molecular/cellular biology, and mesh it all together.

 

[bigman43]

in other words, its kick ass mcat review?

The only time ochm really helps biochm make sense is when you have a much much much advanced level of ochem.

QofQuimica was once telling us (in a thread on the MCAT forum) that her advanced training in a Chem PhD made biochem in med school easier because she could figure out the pathways mechanistically.

However, at the intro level you don't really learn so deep or have the time to learn the pathways that deep to the point of knowing the intricacies of the pathway mechanisms.

In most general biochem classes people tend to do a lot more memorization of the pathways by drawing it out over and over again on paper or white boards til they have it down.

The extent of application in pathways is generally in relation to labelling carbons and tracing the pathway of a carbon throughout the pathway.

For instance, you have a glucose molecule undergoing glycolysis and are asked to figure out the fate of the C1 carbon of the glucose molecule.

however, that does not need every detailed amt of ochem. But again I repeat Biochem is what you get when you mesh parts of ochm, parts of inorganic chm, parts of physical chm, parts of bio and especially molecular/cellular biology, and mesh it all together.

 

[Falco2525]

in other words, its kick ass mcat review?

actually yes it is I took it for that specific reason and i feel it really helped with the bio/orgo part of the mcat as well as some of the gen chem

 

[gujuDoc]

in other words, its kick ass mcat review?

Yeah biochm, in my honest and humble opinion, is far more relevant to the MCAT bio then ochm.

Why??? Because these days the MCAT is focusing on genetics, molecular bio, and physiology more then ochm.

 

[amartinezz43]

youll be fine taking biochem before org 2, just pust time into it

 

[bigman43]

is biochem II good for MCAT too? or biochem I more contributory to mcat material?

 

[njbmd]

I might be in a peculiar situation and might be able to take Biochemistry 1 before taking Orgo II. This is really strange I know, but I took Orgo 1 in the summer, and i can only take Orgo II in the spring. I might be able to register and take Biochem 1 in the fall.

Is this possible? (i dont want to waste a semester, know what i mean?)

I am a Ph.D biochemist that was not "carbon-friendly" as an undergraduate chemistry major. I can tell you that the only thing that Organic Chemistry and Biochemistry share in common is that carbon is a component of some biomolecules. Organic Chemistry is the chemistry of carbon with a strong emphasis on synthesis. Biochemistry is the chemistry of large biomolecules with an emphasis on macromolecular behavior. The two disciplines are very slightly related and not related enough for much cross-over. The second semester of Organic Chemistry is more families and more syntheses as opposed to anything that is going to help you with Biochemistry. Take Biochem before Organic II if you like. Just don't let too much time go between Organic I and Organic II.

 

[sirus_virus]

I am a Ph.D biochemist that was not "carbon-friendly" as an undergraduate chemistry major. I can tell you that the only thing that Organic Chemistry and Biochemistry share in common is that carbon is a component of some biomolecules. Organic Chemistry is the chemistry of carbon with a strong emphasis on synthesis. Biochemistry is the chemistry of large biomolecules with an emphasis on macromolecular behavior. The two disciplines are very slightly related and not related enough for much cross-over. The second semester of Organic Chemistry is more families and more syntheses as opposed to anything that is going to help you with Biochemistry. Take Biochem before Organic II if you like. Just don't let too much time go between Organic I and Organic II.

I noticed that too.