Biopharma/Biotech researcher looking at MD-PhD

[RNA_man]

Hello everyone,

I have been working at a biopharma company in the greater NYC area for the past couple years. I graduated with a bachelors in biology before coming here to work as a research associate. My work is discovery research for new biological tools. It feels very much like the research that I was doing as an undergraduate, which I like and I am in no rush to leave. However, I don't think that I would want to be at this level for the rest of my life. I considered going the premed route in undergrad but that dissipated after doing bench research. I sort of distracted myself from life (and classes) by conducting research. I fell in love with it.

Working with the various departments at my company, I was exposed to a lot of MD-PhD's. After talking with them at great length, I feel that it is something that I would strongly like to pursue. The ability to work with patients while simultaneously working on research directly related to their conditions is something that is very exciting to me.

The main issue is my undergraduate performance, the second being does research at a company count toward the MD-PhD research requirement prior to applying. I graduated with a 3.1 GPA along with lots of resigns on my transcript, I was more interested in the lab than classes. I had other issues also, but I don't want to just make excuses. I also had three years of research experience during undergraduate, one review publication in the works (which has been in the works for like 2 years...) and a bunch of posters and presentations.

I need to improve my GPA first and foremost. Since my company pays up to 10,000 dollars a year of tuition, I have actually been enrolled in a second bachelors degree program (in mathematics) at one of the local schools. I did this before my idea of considering an MD-PhD. I have been taking about one to two courses per semester and am about halfway done with the program. While in the program I have gotten A's in all of my classes, I have not calculated what my total GPA would be after graduating, I'm not even sure how the AAMC does that. There was really no reason to do it other than I wanted something to do after work. I am not sure if this will help me if I choose to apply to MD-PhD programs, but the critical thinking skills I learned are probably more important.

I am now wondering if I should do a master's program in something biology related, but I don't really know where. I looked into some of the schools around me and a lot of them conflict with my work hours. The programs that I saw include Columbia's Biomedical Engineering Program (in particular the CVN program), where they tape the courses or you can attend if you're in the NYC area. Rutger's Masters of Engineering (ME) in Biomedical Engineering, where it is similar to how Columbia does it. I have also looked in NYMC's master's programs and John's Hopkins "online biotechnology masters." My other option could be just to shop around at the different schools for classes to attend in person. I have already complied a list in Excel of classes in the area.

To summarize:
- Will the second degree help even though its in math?
- Should I do a masters or just shop around classes?
- Does working at a biopharma/biotechnology company doing discovery research count towards my application?

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[RNthenDoc]

1: in my experience, extra degrees don’t help much. Master’s degrees that aren’t SMPs for medical school don’t help a ton either. As silly as it is, Med schools care more about undergraduate science than graduate science on the whole (obviously a master’s in anything is impressive, just a diminishing return)

2: I would take science courses until your GPA rises substantially. There is a GPA calculator floating around here somewhere, if I find it I’ll link you.

3: Your relevant work experience absolutely helps, especially if you’ve gotten publications. It’s not enough to overcome a poor GPA/MCAT, but it totally helps, and I would imagine it being almost mandatory for an MD/PhD

@Goro might have some good advice from a school faculty perspective!

If I were you, I would start studying for the MCAT and continue taking science courses that your work pays for, not necessarily to complete another degree but to raise your GPA up. I know some schools screen at 3.3 and some at 3.5 (others may screen higher than that, but those are the two cutoffs I’ve read about), but it sounds like that range is doable for you. When studying for the MCAT, take some practice tests and see where you are. I think there is sometimes a *small* amount of GPA leeway for a stellar MCAT score, but not enough that won’t require you to dig yourself out of the hole a bit first. I think once you’re >3.3 cgpa and >510 MCAT you may have a shot, with increasing returns with a higher GPA. You also need plenty of physician shadowing and volunteer work! If you can make all of that happen in the next 1.5 years, I feel like applying in 2021 is a solid goal.

Another thing to consider is $$$. If you have the ability to *save* money up now it would be a huge help. Even paying for a single year of medical school makes a huge difference in the student loan world, as the interest averages at 6.8%.

Again, goro and other adcom folks may have a better idea of a gpa/MCAT range you need to wait to before you apply, but I really think you have an interesting background and will make a cool candidate.

 

[RNA_man]

1: in my experience, extra degrees don’t help much. Master’s degrees that aren’t SMPs for medical school don’t help a ton either. As silly as it is, Med schools care more about undergraduate science than graduate science on the whole (obviously a master’s in anything is impressive, just a diminishing return)

2: I would take science courses until your GPA rises substantially. There is a GPA calculator floating around here somewhere, if I find it I’ll link you.

3: Your relevant work experience absolutely helps, especially if you’ve gotten publications. It’s not enough to overcome a poor GPA/MCAT, but it totally helps, and I would imagine it being almost mandatory for an MD/PhD

@Goro might have some good advice from a school faculty perspective!

If I were you, I would start studying for the MCAT and continue taking science courses that your work pays for, not necessarily to complete another degree but to raise your GPA up. I know some schools screen at 3.3 and some at 3.5 (others may screen higher than that, but those are the two cutoffs I’ve read about), but it sounds like that range is doable for you. When studying for the MCAT, take some practice tests and see where you are. I think there is sometimes a *small* amount of GPA leeway for a stellar MCAT score, but not enough that won’t require you to dig yourself out of the hole a bit first. I think once you’re >3.3 cgpa and >510 MCAT you may have a shot, with increasing returns with a higher GPA. You also need plenty of physician shadowing and volunteer work! If you can make all of that happen in the next 1.5 years, I feel like applying in 2021 is a solid goal.

Another thing to consider is $$$. If you have the ability to *save* money up now it would be a huge help. Even paying for a single year of medical school makes a huge difference in the student loan world, as the interest averages at 6.8%.

Again, goro and other adcom folks may have a better idea of a gpa/MCAT range you need to wait to before you apply, but I really think you have an interesting background and will make a cool candidate.

Thanks RNthenDoc! That is great advice, thank you! I will take some classes at the local schools. I also did a lot of volunteering during college, so I think that also helps. But I am also volunteering once a week at the local hospital I really enjoy interacting with people! I'll be sure to reach out if I have any more questions!

Thanks!

 

[Goro]

Hello everyone,

I have been working at a biopharma company in the greater NYC area for the past couple years. I graduated with a bachelors in biology before coming here to work as a research associate. My work is discovery research for new biological tools. It feels very much like the research that I was doing as an undergraduate, which I like and I am in no rush to leave. However, I don't think that I would want to be at this level for the rest of my life. I considered going the premed route in undergrad but that dissipated after doing bench research. I sort of distracted myself from life (and classes) by conducting research. I fell in love with it.

Working with the various departments at my company, I was exposed to a lot of MD-PhD's. After talking with them at great length, I feel that it is something that I would strongly like to pursue. The ability to work with patients while simultaneously working on research directly related to their conditions is something that is very exciting to me.

The main issue is my undergraduate performance, the second being does research at a company count toward the MD-PhD research requirement prior to applying. I graduated with a 3.1 GPA along with lots of resigns on my transcript, I was more interested in the lab than classes. I had other issues also, but I don't want to just make excuses. I also had three years of research experience during undergraduate, one review publication in the works (which has been in the works for like 2 years...) and a bunch of posters and presentations.

I need to improve my GPA first and foremost. Since my company pays up to 10,000 dollars a year of tuition, I have actually been enrolled in a second bachelors degree program (in mathematics) at one of the local schools. I did this before my idea of considering an MD-PhD. I have been taking about one to two courses per semester and am about halfway done with the program. While in the program I have gotten A's in all of my classes, I have not calculated what my total GPA would be after graduating, I'm not even sure how the AAMC does that. There was really no reason to do it other than I wanted something to do after work. I am not sure if this will help me if I choose to apply to MD-PhD programs, but the critical thinking skills I learned are probably more important.

I am now wondering if I should do a master's program in something biology related, but I don't really know where. I looked into some of the schools around me and a lot of them conflict with my work hours. The programs that I saw include Columbia's Biomedical Engineering Program (in particular the CVN program), where they tape the courses or you can attend if you're in the NYC area. Rutger's Masters of Engineering (ME) in Biomedical Engineering, where it is similar to how Columbia does it. I have also looked in NYMC's master's programs and John's Hopkins "online biotechnology masters." My other option could be just to shop around at the different schools for classes to attend in person. I have already complied a list in Excel of classes in the area.

To summarize:
- Will the second degree help even though its in math?
- Should I do a masters or just shop around classes?
- Does working at a biopharma/biotechnology company doing discovery research count towards my application?

Forget about MD/PhD. Getting into medical school, whether MD or DO will be a challenge, period now.

Read this:

• Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention