Brain imaging fellowship for psychiatrists?

[Gavanshir]

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I'm very much interested in brain imaging as it relates to psychiatry and I believe there are no brain imaging fellowships open to applications from psych grads. Are there any opportunities out there for psychiatry residents or grads to further specialize in brain imaging?

 

[slappy]

I'm very much interested in brain imaging as it relates to psychiatry and I believe there are no brain imaging fellowships open to applications from psych grads. Are there any opportunities out there for psychiatry residents or grads to further specialize in brain imaging?

Problem is, there aren't many clinical applications for brain imaging in psychiatric disorders at the moment.

 

[splik]

These are research fellowships, typically in structural or functional imaging, (or nuclear medicine) - though there are people as you know who are abusing this technology in clinical and forensic settings and have become the scourge of the profession. some otherwise respectable psychiatrists have entered into the courts (where they likely have no business going), particular in death penalty cases and essentially, and rather cringeworthily saying "his brain made him to it" (essentially) showing some pretty multicolored blobs to jurors. absolute quackery. neuroimaging will never be able to answer the questions that the courts are interested in.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

These are research fellowships, typically in structural or functional imaging, (or nuclear medicine) - though there are people as you know who are abusing this technology in clinical and forensic settings and have become the scourge of the profession.

Amen.
😀

 

[splik]

It's not just him though there are some "academic psychiatrists" who I won't mention but one is at UC Irvine and another is at Penn who have been a particular nuisance

 

[Extralong]

I'm very much interested in brain imaging as it relates to psychiatry and I believe there are no brain imaging fellowships open to applications from psych grads. Are there any opportunities out there for psychiatry residents or grads to further specialize in brain imaging?

This is what I would do:
1) contact departments(radiology, neuroradiology, neurology,etc) that can offer to teach you what you want at your university. Be ready to explain your unique situation, future goals, and what you want to learn
2) talk to your PD about the opportunity that you were able to set up with with whatever department(i.e. Radiology); get ure PD's blessing; you'd be surprised how open other departments are
3) if you manage to get this far, bust your butt and shine like crazy when your there for that half day, or month or whatever
4) get to know people in that department
5) ask for a letter of recommendation and ask if they have any suggestions as to where you can apply or where they went for their brain imaging fellowship
6) apply with your unique background

Just be aware, this doesn't come easy and requires tons of emailing, answering why you want to do this, coordinating everything yourself. And yea, it may not give you the ABMS certification, but doing the fellowship will give you the privileges at hospitals in the future down the line. Applications are always open, you just have to prove that you can put in the work, have the knowledge to be in the fellowship, and show that you have been able to work in that area. Good luck!

 

[Extralong]

Problem is, there aren't many clinical applications for brain imaging in psychiatric disorders at the moment.

You are right, and so we need to start advancing this area of psychiatry. I am really excited to see someone interested in this.

 

[Gavanshir]

Well I'm excited to have found this guy through my research: J. Douglas Bremmer, double boarded in psych and nuclear medicine. He also has an excellent book "Brain Imaging Handbook" written for psychiatrists that I'll be going through this week.

 

[WisNeuro]

Well I'm excited to have found this guy through my research: J. Douglas Bremmer, double boarded in psych and nuclear medicine. He also has an excellent book "Brain Imaging Handbook" written for psychiatrists that I'll be going through this week.

Yeah, Bremner was big in the late 90's early oughts for doing a ton on structural and functional differences in PTSD. Although, further research has been mixed.

 

[Ollie123]

I guess it depends if the goals are clinical practice vs. research.

There are truckloads of people doing imaging work in psychiatry. You will have a harder time finding major medical centers that DON'T have one or more (often dozens?) individuals doing imaging research. We have probably 30-40 investigators across psychiatry and psychology at my institution who fit the bill. Using it in clinical practice is quite different and that is mostly because from a research standpoint we just aren't there yet. The folks using it clinically are generally little more than con artists. (Note that I'm referring only to use with traditional mental health diagnoses - dep./anxiety/psychosis/substance dep./etc.).

That said, don't feel like you need a fellowship dedicated specifically to "imaging" to learn it. Working/collaborating with established researchers in that area is the way to go. A research fellowship in depression where you can work with folks who do imaging studies in depressed patients would probably work just fine.

 

[SeniorWrangler]

The only clinically relevant use I've seen is SPECT scans for people with dementia to help differentiate the type.

 

[WisNeuro]

The only clinically relevant use I've seen is SPECT scans for people with dementia to help differentiate the type.

Even this isn't as developed and ready as most think. Many patterns are still lacking in specificity and don't map on well to objective test results and/or functional findings. Still a lot that needs to be done, and more rigorous longitudinal studies needed to refine the send/spec of these.

 

[splik]

SPECT scans are awful we do them when we can't get FDG-PET scans approved. it's one piece of information along with clinical history exam neuropsych testing genetics and CSF studies that can help make a diagnosis. I am interested to see how the amyloid PET scans fair in the IDEAS study