BS/MD vs BS/DO and MCAT vs. No MCAT

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FutureDoctor_2019

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Seeking advice:
I got accepted into 2 BS/MD and 1 BS/DO 4+4 Early Acceptance Programs:

BS/MD - Cooper Medical School of Rowan U. - MCAT - 30
BS/MD - Drexel Medical School - MCAT - 31
BS/DO - LECOM - no MCAT

I need to make a decision which one should I pick. I am leaning to BS/DO since there is no MCAT required. I think I can handle the GPA requirement but MCAT is the one I am worry about. I feel the safer path is the BS/DO just in case I can't make the minimum MCAT for the two BS/MD programs.

Please advice.

Thanks!
 
The path of least resistance is LECOM's.


Seeking advice:
I got accepted into 2 BS/MD and 1 BS/DO 4+4 Early Acceptance Programs:

BS/MD - Cooper Medical School of Rowan U. - MCAT - 30
BS/MD - Drexel Medical School - MCAT - 31
BS/DO - LECOM - no MCAT

I need to make a decision which one should I pick. I am leaning to BS/DO since there is no MCAT required. I think I can handle the GPA requirement but MCAT is the one I am worry about. I feel the safer path is the BS/DO just in case I can't make the minimum MCAT for the two BS/MD programs.

Please advice.

Thanks!
 
If you don't really care about OMM or other aspects of osteopathic medicine, why not do the BS/MD and if you don't make the MCAT requirement then you are just in the same position you'd be otherwise?
 
If you don't really care about OMM or other aspects of osteopathic medicine, why not do the BS/MD and if you don't make the MCAT requirement then you are just in the same position you'd be otherwise?
I do care a bit about the OMM but that is not my major concern. The thing is for the BS/OD from LECOM, I don't need to take the MCAT at all as long as I meet the GPA (3.5 overall and 3.2 science) requirement. I don't even need another interview. Just transition to LECOM with some formal medical application and a letter from my pre-med advisor.
Thanks.
 
The problem is that there is a pretty big difference between LECOM and say Cooper or Drexel... There are some other DO schools that I would say for sure take the BS/DO route instead but I dont know... I would say at this point to stick with the harder option. They give you 3 tries, and lets say you can only hit a 28 or 29 or something, well even then you would be able to apply to DO schools that are better than LECOM. I know right now the MCAT seems scary but its really just another standardized test. You have to prep for it and work hard, but I am a firm believer that no test should define where you end up. I would argue it is best to not lock yourself down that route right now...

Personally my vote is for Cooper.
 
Seeking advice:
I got accepted into 2 BS/MD and 1 BS/DO 4+4 Early Acceptance Programs:

BS/MD - Cooper Medical School of Rowan U. - MCAT - 30
BS/MD - Drexel Medical School - MCAT - 31
BS/DO - LECOM - no MCAT

I need to make a decision which one should I pick. I am leaning to BS/DO since there is no MCAT required. I think I can handle the GPA requirement but MCAT is the one I am worry about. I feel the safer path is the BS/DO just in case I can't make the minimum MCAT for the two BS/MD programs.

Please advice.

Thanks!

To land these programs you already had to display strength in test taking (SAT/ACT) it is likely that you will also do well on the MCAT. I vote Cooper.

If you prefer the Philadelphia PA area, than I'd vote Drexel.
 
I say go with the DO/BS program because if you change your mind later on... you can still take the MCAT and apply MD if you change your mind but you will also have a safe backup plan and nothing to worry about.

Also, I would keep in mind the importance of working hard at school... do well above the minimum GPA requirements when you go to school... don't take it easy
 
Seeking advice:
I got accepted into 2 BS/MD and 1 BS/DO 4+4 Early Acceptance Programs:

BS/MD - Cooper Medical School of Rowan U. - MCAT - 30
BS/MD - Drexel Medical School - MCAT - 31
BS/DO - LECOM - no MCAT

I need to make a decision which one should I pick. I am leaning to BS/DO since there is no MCAT required. I think I can handle the GPA requirement but MCAT is the one I am worry about. I feel the safer path is the BS/DO just in case I can't make the minimum MCAT for the two BS/MD programs.

Please advice.

Thanks!

Unless you are absolutely set on PBL then I would go Cooper. A 30 is attainable.
 
I don't know...if I had enough foresight to know I wanted medicine in high school and enough drive to apply to and be accepted at multiple programs like these I wouldn't worry about an MCAT requirement. I mean if you have the min. grades required but a 27-30 MCAT then you'd be in the same boat anyway.
 
As stated above, go the BS/MD route. If you don't do well on the MCAT all 3 tries you can still apply to DO schools and have a really good shot. Don't limit yourself this early.
 
If I knew back in high school that LECOM had a BS/DO program where u didn't have to mess with the MCAT, you can bet I would without a doubt take that. Plus, tuition is the cheapest of all DO schools (save TCOM)
 
Worst case scenario, you attend one of these programs and change your mind that medicine isn't for you. Happened to one of my close friends and it sucks. Go where you are comfortable and where you will have the proper motivation to succeed. No distractions. That is where you'll do best.

You're going to have to eventually face the USMLE and (maybe depending on what you choose) the COMLEX, on top of the numerous tests scattered throughout med school and undergrad in your COMBINED program. If you're scared of the MCAT... boy oh boy you are in for quite an awakening (there will always be that someone who says they aren't the same exam or that it doesn't matter or you can't compare the two). Do your own research and go with what's best. You're the one entering college and who's gonna (hopefully) decide on the right program.
 
But if he were to not hit the min with 3 tries, he'd get kicked out of the bs/md program so he'd be applying to DO schools with 3 mcat scores and a mark on his app indicating that he failed a medical program. Can one easily assume he can get into a DO school that quickly should he fail his bs/md program.

Regardless, 3 tries is more than enough to get the min plus I assume you had a high sat score so chances are likely that you'll do well on another standardized test. I can't see you failing out that easily.
 
But if he were to not hit the min with 3 tries, he'd get kicked out of the bs/md program so he'd be applying to DO schools with 3 mcat scores and a mark on his app indicating that he failed a medical program. Can one easily assume he can get into a DO school that quickly should he fail his bs/md program.

Regardless, 3 tries is more than enough to get the min plus I assume you had a high sat score so chances are likely that you'll do well on another standardized test. I can't see you failing out that easily.

I definitely agree. The thing is, I feel that the OP is already being doubtful and trying to duck the MCAT like it's the worst thing in the world but it really isn't. There certainly are no shortcuts in this process and the OP shouldn't worry about avoiding the test. Go where you'll apply yourself, and where you will feel comfortable enough to come to class and actually learn and take it seriously. The grades and scores will come.

Also, what if OP attends one of the programs and hates it there and doesn't want to attend med school there? These are some issues to bring up and I feel if the OP knows what he/she is getting into and isn't worried about how much LESS they have to do, they can make a much wiser decision that they won't regret like my friend did.

Not everybody is ready for college or these programs at the age of 18. I hope it works out for you OP.
 
I'm inclined to say that dropping from BS/MD and applying DO is easier than dropping from BS/DO and applying MD. Applying allopathic is just more competitive stats-wise (most, not all) and because of the shear number of applicants. It's sad to see highly qualified applicants be overlooked by schools [most likely] because of the stupid-high number of applicants. This likely happens in the DO pool as well, but it's just not the same caliber.

Plus, tuition is the cheapest of all DO schools (save TCOM)

This is the ONLY thing that would make me think twice about choosing either MD pathway. Unless you're from NJ (Cooper's in-state tuition matches LECOM) both MD schools will easily be 20k more expensive than LECOM. Which I personally would weigh pretty heavily.

I found a pdf from Drexel's Student Financial Services that states $51,000 for 2014-2015, but it doesn't specify any IS vs OOS rate..

All things considered, and with the uncertainty stemming from your young age, I would definitely choose either BS/MD pathway.
 
Do NOT go BS/DO when you have BS/MD at hand! Getting into competitive residencies will only become harder by the time you graduate from med school, and you should strive to give yourself the best chance.

Moreover, LECOM partners with crappy undergrad schools in their BS/DO.
 
Why go through the misery of MCAT prep and expenses (kaplan is like 2K) when you can walk into a program? What happens if OP takes MCAT and get a 23, 27, then 28? He is screwed for the MD route.

I understand what your saying bout dropping out, but a DO acveptance is still a golden ticket. I would give myself the best chance possible of getting that ticket.


I'm inclined to say that dropping from BS/MD and applying DO is easier than dropping from BS/DO and applying MD. Applying allopathic is just more competitive stats-wise (most, not all) and because of the shear number of applicants. It's sad to see highly qualified applicants be overlooked by schools [most likely] because of the stupid-high number of applicants. This likely happens in the DO pool as well, but it's just not the same caliber.



This is the ONLY thing that would make me think twice about choosing either MD pathway. Unless you're from NJ (Cooper's in-state tuition matches LECOM) both MD schools will easily be 20k more expensive than LECOM. Which I personally would weigh pretty heavily.

I found a pdf from Drexel's Student Financial Services that states $51,000 for 2014-2015, but it doesn't specify any IS vs OOS rate..

All things considered, and with the uncertainty stemming from your young age, I would definitely choose either BS/MD pathway.


LECOM is fine, and while grads from lecom won't snag Johns Hopkins residencies, they can specialize. It's not like the carribean, although the way things are headed it might be in 10 years. Family med might become hard to get into!

Do NOT go BS/DO when you have BS/MD at hand! Getting into competitive residencies will only become harder by the time you graduate from med school, and you should strive to give yourself the best chance.

Moreover, LECOM partners with crappy undergrad schools in their BS/DO.
 
I'm inclined to say that dropping from BS/MD and applying DO is easier than dropping from BS/DO and applying MD. Applying allopathic is just more competitive stats-wise (most, not all) and because of the shear number of applicants. It's sad to see highly qualified applicants be overlooked by schools [most likely] because of the stupid-high number of applicants. This likely happens in the DO pool as well, but it's just not the same caliber.



This is the ONLY thing that would make me think twice about choosing either MD pathway. Unless you're from NJ (Cooper's in-state tuition matches LECOM) both MD schools will easily be 20k more expensive than LECOM. Which I personally would weigh pretty heavily.

I found a pdf from Drexel's Student Financial Services that states $51,000 for 2014-2015, but it doesn't specify any IS vs OOS rate..

All things considered, and with the uncertainty stemming from your young age, I would definitely choose either BS/MD pathway.
Bolded point above.
 
This is not an MD or DO debate per se... It is more about the fact of locking yourself into a program and becoming content before you should. A 30 is really attainable, but even if you cant then you can take your pick of any of the other DO schools (so long as you get above like a 27). But it will not work the other way around - you dont want to settle on LECOM so quickly. Its not that its a bad school, they have made thousands of great docs; but IF you have the opportunity at a school with more stuff, you should look that route. For many of us, we are happy with DO, but what if the OP ends up wanting a stronger hand in research? LECOM WILL NOT fill that need for him. I think this decision is solely about keeping opportunity open, I strongly think Cooper will do that.
 
Personally, I'd never do BS/DO. Why slot yourself this early? Do you want to see how deep you can swim or do you want to stay in the kiddy pool the rest of your life?

It only gets harder the further you go into medical training. You think the MCAT is tough and anxiety provoking? Step 1 is as a difficult exam as the MCAT that has even more riding on it. Step 2 is, IMO, worse than Step 1 with more riding on it each year. Your specialty boards will require 4-6 months of studying in order to pass so that you can get a job. It's best to see how you perform now than wasting 120k and finding out you can't handle Step 1 without having a panic attack.

BS/MD sucks because you'll never have another chance to be in college. Enjoy undergrad and apply to MD and DO after 4 years.
 
Everyone here is acting like anyone can just waltz into a DO seat. Some of the "Low Tiered" programs are still flooded with 4K+ applications each year, and its only going to get worse in 4+ years. Remember LUCOM, you know that school everyone loves to hate and complain about lowering the standards? I called them a couple weeks ago and they said they interview people with 35 MCATs. They reject people too

DO schools are getting harder and harder to get into, and if you have one less hoop to jump through with a guarantee, take it and don't look back. You can always dropout of the program.
 
Thanks for all the responses and advices. What made we worry about the MCAT is that I have a cousin who went through the traditional route, she is graduating this year with a Bio degree, high GPA but without any medical school acceptance. Not sure what she got for her MCAT. I just don't want to be in her shoe 4 years from now. It scares me just think of it.

I am from south jersey and here is more detail of what I got (undergraduate tuition is after the scholarship that I will pay for):

BS/MD - Drexel Medical school (tuition - $51K) via West Chester PA (tuition - $17K)
BS/MD - Drexel Medical school (tuition - $51K) via Robert Morris Univ. PA (tuition - $8K)

BS/MD - Cooper Medical school of Rowan (tuition - $35K) via UScience PA (tuition - $19K)

BS/DO - LECOM (tuition - $31K) via Fairleigh Dickinson Univ, NJ (tuition - $3.5K)

Thanks again!
 
Everyone here is acting like anyone can just waltz into a DO seat. Some of the "Low Tiered" programs are still flooded with 4K+ applications each year, and its only going to get worse in 4+ years. Remember LUCOM, you know that school everyone loves to hate and complain about lowering the standards? I called them a couple weeks ago and they said they interview people with 35 MCATs. They reject people too

DO schools are getting harder and harder to get into, and if you have one less hoop to jump through with a guarantee, take it and don't look back. You can always dropout of the program.

DO schools may be getting harder and harder to get into, but with grade replacement and persistence, you can get in. Same can't be said of MD schools.
 
Everyone here is acting like anyone can just waltz into a DO seat. Some of the "Low Tiered" programs are still flooded with 4K+ applications each year, and its only going to get worse in 4+ years. Remember LUCOM, you know that school everyone loves to hate and complain about lowering the standards? I called them a couple weeks ago and they said they interview people with 35 MCATs. They reject people too

DO schools are getting harder and harder to get into, and if you have one less hoop to jump through with a guarantee, take it and don't look back. You can always dropout of the program.

Given what I've seen from my time on the admission committee, close to 80% of applicants have no business applying. There are at least several hundred applications with GPAs of ~3.0 and MCATs in the low 20s and this is for an MD school.

If you are of average competitiveness (eg MCAT of 30, GPA of 3.6) you are only competing against a thousand or so applicants for a class of 200.
 
Everyone here is acting like anyone can just waltz into a DO seat. Some of the "Low Tiered" programs are still flooded with 4K+ applications each year, and its only going to get worse in 4+ years. Remember LUCOM, you know that school everyone loves to hate and complain about lowering the standards? I called them a couple weeks ago and they said they interview people with 35 MCATs. They reject people too
DO schools are getting harder and harder to get into, and if you have one less hoop to jump through with a guarantee, take it and don't look back. You can always dropout of the program.

I definitely wasn't trying to say this, it is a remarkable feat to earn a seat to any US medical school. I'm just weighing the opportunities he has at hand and everything seems to point toward Cooper. Cost is roughly the same as LECOM, it's located closer to his home, affiliations with Children's Miracle Hospital (if he continued interest in peds) and brands their own tertiary hospital system. And as for the MCAT, past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior, I hardly see that being a huge problem for him. Also, not everyone needs to drop k's on a Kaplan course.

My logic here is that although it is not easy to obtain a DO acceptance, it is harder to obtain MD. So hold the ticket that clears you the most amount of uncertainty, so that if he were to change his mind and apply the opposite route he is maximizing his chances (as a traditional applicant applying DO).
 
I'm going to say neither of these options. BS/MD and BS/DO are both very expensive options and they are rigid programs in which you need to meet certain benchmarks yearly without fail. This means that you'll have little choice in what you get to take and major in, and worst it gives you a debt incentive to remain in the program even if you find out that medicine is incompatible with your interests.

You're a senior in high school, for all you know you'll be happier being an art historian by the end of your 4th year. You'll always be able to by the end of your 4th year say, yes medicine is my interest and apply to that, but in BS/MD you will have no option that doesn't stone wall you into a well of debt.

When it comes down to it, you've likely got full rides to either your state public school or even enormous scholarship incentives at Ivy league schools.

But if you're hell bent on this all, then Cooper is arguably the better option of the three. Lecom for what it is worth is not the hardest school to enroll in and you'll always likely be able to get in pending decent performance in undergrad. And Drexel's requirement is higher by a point which in my opinion makes it at the very least disadvantageous to Cooper.
 
I'm going to say neither of these options. BS/MD and BS/DO are both very expensive options and they are rigid programs in which you need to meet certain benchmarks yearly without fail. This means that you'll have little choice in what you get to take and major in, and worst it gives you a debt incentive to remain in the program even if you find out that medicine is incompatible with your interests.

You're a senior in high school, for all you know you'll be happier being an art historian by the end of your 4th year. You'll always be able to by the end of your 4th year say, yes medicine is my interest and apply to that, but in BS/MD you will have no option that doesn't stone wall you into a well of debt.

When it comes down to it, you've likely got full rides to either your state public school or even enormous scholarship incentives at Ivy league schools.

Notable point but one I guess I assumed OP had already decided upon. With all the subjectivity aside, I don't think paying 70k for UG is that bad especially considering all that there is to gain. Financially those UG loans will have low interest rates and the subsidized portions will remain frozen throughout his education. In the end I would guess [UScience + Cooper] would be roughly equivalent to paying little-to-no UG tuition and eating 50k/year at another med school (just a random example for perspective).

UScience is cheaper than the Ivy League schools, if his current scholarships at UScience still require him to pay 19k/year then I'd expect him to be paying the same if not more at any Ivy League school. --And then he'd have to pay for AMCAS/Secondaries/Interviews and worry about gaining acceptance --then likely having to relocate entirely for his medical education.
 
Admittedly I missed that post with that info. Uscience is from what I've heard supposed to be a strong grade deflating school. Even top tier applicants who get in tend to struggle to get into the green ( 3.5+). And Ivy schools might be cheaper than 20k tbh.
 
2014-2015 Ivy League Tuition
Harvard--43,938
Brown--46,408
Columbia--51,008 (tuition + fees)
Cornell--48,880 (2015-2016)
Dartmouth--48,120 (2015-2016)
Princeton--41,820
Yale--45,800
UPenn--49,536 (2015-2016)
Source: googled individually

UScience--34,336
Soure: http://www.usciences.edu/controller/tuition.shtml
 
2014-2015 Ivy League Tuition
Harvard--43,938
Brown--46,408
Columbia--51,008 (tuition + fees)
Cornell--48,880 (2015-2016)
Dartmouth--48,120 (2015-2016)
Princeton--41,820
Yale--45,800
UPenn--49,536 (2015-2016)
Source: googled individually

UScience--34,336
Soure: http://www.usciences.edu/controller/tuition.shtml


Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth are free. The rest are heavily subsidizes and considered significantly more prestigious than Uscience. And in the world of medical apps and non-med going to Ivy is an enormous boon.
 
Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth are free. The rest are heavily subsidizes and considered significantly more prestigious than Uscience. And in the world of medical apps and non-med going to Ivy is an enormous boon.

This introduces too many subjective aspects to account for, but yeah in light of a full ride at an Ivy League school perhaps that would be a better option.

If OP really wants to attend medical school in his state residence it's right there for him via BS/MD.
 
This introduces too many subjective aspects to account for, but yeah in light of a full ride at an Ivy League school perhaps that would be a better option.

If OP really wants to attend medical school in his state residence it's right there for him via BS/MD.


I'm not saying that he doesn't have that right. I simply don't think an 18 year old can honestly know 100% that he wants to be a doctor.
 
I'm not saying that he doesn't have that right. I simply don't think an 18 year old can honestly know 100% that he wants to be a doctor.
But for the sake of the OPs question, the Md route at cooper is probably best. He would've asked whether or not he should do the BS/doc route if he was concerned about that. The fact is he has already been accepted to multiple programs, and likely it's too late to apply to any other regular colleges anyways
 
But for the sake of the OPs question, the Md route at cooper is probably best. He would've asked whether or not he should do the BS/doc route if he was concerned about that. The fact is he has already been accepted to multiple programs, and likely it's too late to apply to any other regular colleges anyways


Unless he already has other acceptances other than them lined up. I sincerely doubt that the OP decided BS/MD or BS/DO or community college....


Personally I think Cooper is the best plan. But at the same time from what I've heard I wouldn't wish Uscience upon anyone.
 
The problem is that there is a pretty big difference between LECOM and say Cooper or Drexel... There are some other DO schools that I would say for sure take the BS/DO route instead but I dont know... I would say at this point to stick with the harder option. They give you 3 tries, and lets say you can only hit a 28 or 29 or something, well even then you would be able to apply to DO schools that are better than LECOM. I know right now the MCAT seems scary but its really just another standardized test. You have to prep for it and work hard, but I am a firm believer that no test should define where you end up. I would argue it is best to not lock yourself down that route right now...

Personally my vote is for Cooper.
i don't understand the hate for LECOM on SDN....
 
i don't understand the hate for LECOM on SDN....
I really dont hate LECOM, I am just saying in this instance, I think it would be wiser for the OP to go the harder route and not settle quite yet. LECOM makes a ton of great docs, but who knows, the OP could be a rock star and bust out a 36 MCAT and be really competitive for really great schools that most of us would be envious of. He will never know unless he goes through it? I do not think that if someone goes to LECOM then they are settling, I just think that specifically the OP would be settling, simply because he has no idea of his potential yet.

But now that I read my post that you quoted, I could see where it comes off like I dont like LECOM, thats fair. I guess in my mind I was thinking like if he got into a BS/DO program at like PCOM or CCOM, or a state DO school or something, THEN it seems like a harder decision to me between the DO/MD route. But again specifically for this situation, I just feel like there is a vast difference between LECOM and one of these MD schools solely with regards to experiential learning for undergrad and into medical school. I personally would be happy at LECOM but thats because I know for a fact that I want to be a clinician (after years of research experience in undergrad), but we have no idea where the OP is heading in life and its honestly too early for him to decide, best to keep the options open. One of the MD schools will simply give more options.
 
i don't understand the hate for LECOM on SDN....

It's a mid ranged DO school. It'll do what you need to make you a practicing physician. But comparing it to most MD granting institutes that the OP has a strong shot at it and it becomes small.

Simply put you don't need to be the best of your class to get into Lecom. And if the OP exits school with low stats (3.3/27) he can always get into Lecom.

Also OP, why are they telling you what to get in the old system. What are you going to need in the new system?
 
It's a mid ranged DO school. It'll do what you need to make you a practicing physician. But comparing it to most MD granting institutes that the OP has a strong shot at it and it becomes small.

Simply put you don't need to be the best of your class to get into Lecom. And if the OP exits school with low stats (3.3/27) he can always get into Lecom.

Also OP, why are they telling you what to get in the old system. What are you going to need in the new system?

I only got the update info from Drexel but not Cooper. Don't have the letter with me but I think Drexel is asking the new MCAT score of 506 and nothing under 127 or 123 depends on test subjects. Since the new MCAT is still without any historical data, the letter did mention that it might change in the future and Drexel has the right to do so.
Thanks!
 
Also OP, why are they telling you what to get in the old system. What are you going to need in the new system?

The AAMC projected percentiles but considering the way the MCAT is scored there's no way to have an accurate idea until a considerable number of tests are taken. By the time OP applies they will likely have set scores but it'd be interesting to hear what they would say.

31=83 percentile=508 (projected)
 
The AAMC projected percentiles but considering the way the MCAT is scored there's no way to have an accurate idea until a considerable number of tests are scored. By the time OP applies they will likely have set scores but it'd be interesting to hear what they would say.

31=83 percentile=508 (projected)


Right except supposedly the premise of the new Mcat is for average scores to be valued higher or something. So it's makes it a bit harder to grasp in my opinion lol.
 
I only got the update info from Drexel but not Cooper. Don't have the letter with me but I think Drexel is asking the new MCAT score of 506 and nothing under 127 or 123 depends on test subjects. Since the new MCAT is still without any historical data, the letter did mention that it might change in the future and Drexel has the right to do so.
Thanks!

Kinda dangerous admittedly. But then again nothing can be worse than the final few mcats given in 2014-2015.
 
I would like to thank everyone for the advices and suggestions.
As some of you suggested, my plan is to play it safe and take the BS/DO with no MCAT route.
Just worry that what if I get a low MCAT on the BS/MD route. It will ruin my dream as to be a physician.
I will attemp the MCAT test when the time comes and plan it from there.

Thanks again. Very appreciated!!!
 
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