mshellinok

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Greetings, my name is Michele and am new to the forums. My question is regarding the better of the two options, the BS vs. AAS in Nursing. I am not sure which way to go and would like some feedback. I am beginning to pursue a nursing path and hold a BS in Business and an MBA.

I am not sure what would be the best way to go in order to move into nursing supv/admin or deciding to go for an NP.

Thank you for any thoughts and feedback.
 

julie walker

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Mshellinok,

I think your best bet is to do the bachelors in nursing. You will be able to acquire more experience in the profession. You can advance from there and do the courses that will direct you in the path of advanced registered nurse practitioner. This is just my two cents.
 

Farmer Jane

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It depends on the programs in your area. I have significant reservations about direct entry RN to MSN programs, so I don't recommend those. Since you want to pursue management you'll need a BSN eventually so you may as well get it to begin with. That said, if there's an ADN program more available to you, do that and then pick up your BSN via online classes. There's no significant difference in the actual nursing education between BSN and ADN. The biggest difference is in the general education and since you already have one bachelor's you needn't worry about it.

In other words, look at all the nursing schools in your area and pick the one that is most conducive to your life.
 

foreverLaur

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Well an ADN is 2 years and a BSN is 4 years. If I was starting over again, I would get my ADN and then later do an online RN-BSN program while working.

You already have a bachelors degree though, so it would be fastest for you to do a 15 month accelerated 2nd degree BSN program.

http://www.aacn.nche.edu/Education/pdf/APLIST.PDF
 

foreverLaur

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Thing is, most ADN programs are really taking three years.
I was just going off the programs I know of. They are all 2 years (5 semesters). Things may be arranged differently in other areas and that is assuming you complete and pass all your coursework on time and have no need to take time off.
 

julie walker

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Greetings, my name is Michele and am new to the forums. My question is regarding the better of the two options, the BS vs. AAS in Nursing. I am not sure which way to go and would like some feedback. I am beginning to pursue a nursing path and hold a BS in Business and an MBA.

I am not sure what would be the best way to go in order to move into nursing supv/admin or deciding to go for an NP.

Thank you for any thoughts and feedback.
Since you have a bachelors before you can go ahead and do the ADN and as forever mentioned you can always do RN-BSNonline. This is a great idea.
 

Lamictal

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I think it depends on what you want to do once you become a nurse. Personally I'd go for the BSN. That's what I did and it's served me well. I'm an ANP and a PMHNP. I am going to start the DNP next month.

You'll enjoy being an NP. Congrats on your choice of professions. However, you might as well get some of your pre-requisite classes out of the way now by getting the BSN if you plan on becoming an NP at some point. :thumbup:
 

Farmer Jane

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Yes, all the program say online (and on paper) that they are arranged to be complete in two years. What I'm saying is that they really take three.
 

foreverLaur

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Since you have a bachelors before you can go ahead and do the ADN and as forever mentioned you can always do RN-BSNonline. This is a great idea.
Can I ask why you would suggest this person do a 2-3 year associates degree program and then have to do a 10 month RN-BSN program when they could get their BSN in 15 months right now?
 

Farmer Jane

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I agree with you Laur. Plus, RN to BSN programs can vary greatly. I'm finishing my BSN now, and even though I only needed six classes and then a "clinical" it's taken three semesters because of the way it's structured. It's ridiculous.
 

RAMPA

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Can I ask why you would suggest this person do a 2-3 year associates degree program and then have to do a 10 month RN-BSN program when they could get their BSN in 15 months right now?
other Accelerated BSNs are 12 months long :D
 

foreverLaur

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other Accelerated BSNs are 12 months long :D
and i know of at least 1 that is 11 months long and some that are longer than 15 months. I was going with what seems to be the average/norm.
 

bryanboling5

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Can I ask why you would suggest this person do a 2-3 year associates degree program and then have to do a 10 month RN-BSN program when they could get their BSN in 15 months right now?
That was my thought initially. The reason that I chose to do it that way was $$. The accelerated BSN program here is 12-15 months and so crammed full of stuff, there is NO time to have a job. Plus, the tuition is 3x what the ADN program is. I already have a BA and so the ONLY classes I need are nursing. So, I'm actually going part-time for 2 years (can't go faster because classes have to go consecutively) and working full-time. I have a pregnant wife who will be staying home with our son next year, so not working and paying 3x the tuition was not an option.

I've got a local hospital paying my tuition. If I went to the ABSN program, I'd still come up short and have to pay out of pocket. As it is, I've got everything 100% paid for and money left over (they bought me some new stuff for my laptop and if I'm frugal enough next year, I might even get a whole NEW laptop! :D).

I'm planning on working for a few years and then going back for my MSN (Neonatal Nurse Practioner). There is an RN-MSN program here that will complete my BSN and go into the MSN and will actually eliminate a few classes. Any class that is in the BSN program (that I haven't gotten in the ADN program) and is also in the MSN program is eliminated. Why take undergrad stats and then take grad stats a little later?

So, for ME, the ADN program was the best option. If I was in a different position financially, I would probably have done the ABSN.
 

Miss Mab

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And they all pretty much suck.

I think that might be just a bit of an over generalization......

I usually hate when people go, well at MY school we blah blah....but now with some distance from my own ABSN (12 months) I think I have the proper perspective to compare based on my own experience.

The time thing? Yeah, it's 3 full semesters of 8-5 didactic and 2-12's of clinical a week. I don't really think that averages out to anything less than a typical 4 semester ADN program w/summer off. Plus, each state mandates required clinical hours so i got at least the same #(1100) as any other CA student nurse did. And everone needs the same pre-reqs as far as I can tell. We did, anyway(A&P, Micro, Dev. Psych, statistics, chem).
I do think they gloss over basic nursing 'skills', though. However, within a week or so on the floor that issue was taken of.

I only write this in retrospect, however, because I absolutely HATED my ABSN and was sure I was being woefully prpared for the 'real world'. It wasn't until I was out working with the rest of my new grad co-hort that I realized just how adequate the education really was.

In fact, my big issue now with these accelerated deals is they are preparing nurses TOO much in depth if that makes any sense. I actually think they are possibly over-educating nurses for their role on the floor. It was shocking to be expected to learn so much intricate patho, pharm, etc. only to find that you are not expected to know this or that and while any knowledge is fantastic in itself it's a little disheartening to not be allowed much input or have any value placed on what you might offer. (This is also a little of a 'me' thing and why I'm back undecided re NP/PA/MD/etc...I'll probably just go back to flying:)

I used to be a huge BSN entry advocate but i actually now think we should just eliminate the BSN preparation option for nurses and have ADN/Diplomas and then an undergrad pre-health or pre-NP curriculum for studying advanced practice at the post-grad level. Maybe even share the current pre-med curriculum that's in place now. If people want to advocate for minimal prep. then who am I to argue? It's just not for me and something I can't get behind. I only think it's insulting to those who can't, or more aptly won't, follow the argument.

Anyway, having done the accelerated and now on the other side I do get a little peeved with a general 'they all suck' becuase they truly don't, if we're comparing to traditional AA program preparation for nurses at the bedside. Some probably do, and like I said I have no love lost for my own, but I can't begrudge them for providing me a MORE than adequate preparation to the entry level nurse role.
 

Farmer Jane

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I'm basing my statement on 1) working with many new grads from a variety of programs and 2) discussions with two different nurse managers. *My* professional experience has seen accelerated and direct entry grads woefully unprepared. Yes, they catch up--I just don't think the fact that they catch up makes it okay. I'm not talking about skills, btw. I'm talking about seeing the whole picture.

I really can't comprehend feeling over prepared. How does that work? I'm not into functioning with the bare minimum--we need to understand why we're doing something, not just be automatons.

I would like to see entry level BSN, but my conditions will never come to fruition. :laugh: I think we need more science, less fluffy theory. I'd also like to see a required course in logic and critical thinking.
 

Miss Mab

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Yes, because patho, pharm and acute are oh so fluffy....

Nevermind, Farmer Jane, ALL those programs do suck. I'll just ask those two managers....
 

Farmer Jane

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Exactly. Nursing has some science, no doubt. I just don't think it has enough. Some theory is good. The amount we currently have--especially in BSN programs--is ridiculous.

ETA: Two managers is just a part of it. I simply do not think that 12 or 15 months is enough to grasp and apply the totality of nursing.
 
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mshellinok

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Thank you all for great input and snapshots into course work and the realities of moving from school to actually performing the job....effectively. I am just getting the science classes going and will not be applying to a program for a good two to three semesters, so having the time to really look at programs is a nice luxury.

I agree with the logic and critical thinking requirement. I elected to take that as an elective in my undergrad program and it makes a difference in taking the time to step back and provide some quick and responsible analysis to make the best decision possible.
 

Josh L.Ac.

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Don't believe the hype - my accelerated BSN program was pretty easy...although somewhat abbreviated.


We only covered about 30 minutes on the field I went into - Pain management. While it seems odd that "teh 5th vital sign" got such limited coverage, I was comforted that we covered spirituality with 5 different lectures, and culturally-sensitive nursing with 4 different lectures.
:laugh:
 

fab4fan

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I'm basing my statement on 1) working with many new grads from a variety of programs and 2) discussions with two different nurse managers. *My* professional experience has seen accelerated and direct entry grads woefully unprepared. Yes, they catch up--I just don't think the fact that they catch up makes it okay. I'm not talking about skills, btw. I'm talking about seeing the whole picture.

I really can't comprehend feeling over prepared. How does that work? I'm not into functioning with the bare minimum--we need to understand why we're doing something, not just be automatons.

I would like to see entry level BSN, but my conditions will never come to fruition. :laugh: I think we need more science, less fluffy theory. I'd also like to see a required course in logic and critical thinking.
If it were up to me, there wouldn't be any nursing theory at all. It's all hocus-pocus. Teach me something real, that I can actually use, not some goofy, ethereal gobbeldy-gook that I'll be forced to memorize temporarily.
 

Farmer Jane

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I can *one* semester, 3 credits, of nursing history and theory with a focus on history. Beyond that it's just idiotic.
 

core0

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I can *one* semester, 3 credits, of nursing history and theory with a focus on history. Beyond that it's just idiotic.
My one semester of nursing theory was the end of my nursing career. The sad thing is that there are some good things in nursing theory, however they get buried in so much BS that you can't find them.

David Carpenter, PA-C
 
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Good advice on this thread...
my 2 cents.
1. david carpenter is the man - ala pa forum.com and all nurses... and moon lighting at sdn.. david i'm a troll admirer of your postings... appreciate your eloquent responses~
2. my wife has been going through the similar entry into nursing with future goal of becoming an nurse practitioner (np).

my opinion is that if you have a prior bachelors that you might be well off to conduct the associates degree RN program. This can be beneficial because of lower cost (typically) at a community college, ample amounts of clinical time, lesser time in the school house and then having the ability to join the workforce, identify/solidify your future interest/intent as a NP and then applying/matriculating in an RN to MSN program in order to become an CNS or NP.
I personally feel that those with a non-nursing bachelors can benefit from avoiding the BSN and taking the RN and then RN to MSN program.
There are so many programs out there that this might only apply based on your geographical location...but in my families scenario - it's the top shelf choice.
 

emedpa

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another good option for those desiring to become midlevels from a nursing background( at least for california folks) is the dual pa/np program at uc davis.
2 yrs, 2 midlevel certs. 1 masters degree.
 

fab4fan

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I can *one* semester, 3 credits, of nursing history and theory with a focus on history. Beyond that it's just idiotic.
I just can't do the theory. I'm sorry, but there it is. I don't care who has what vision of whatever--they can keep it to themselves. I want skills, science.

I can see my degree plan is going to go really well. :rolleyes:
 

Jawbone

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No kidding about the theory. I just finished wading eyeballs-deep through $2200 worth of it last month in my 2nd semester of grad school. Now onto clinically relevant material to benefit my professional career.
 

fab4fan

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No kidding about the theory. I just finished wading eyeballs-deep through $2200 worth of it last month in my 2nd semester of grad school. Now onto clinically relevant material to benefit my professional career.
You'll have to give me some tips on how to feign interest. I don't think I can count on my Irish blarney to get me through all of it. I'm pretty good at spinning BS, but I need all the help I can get.
 

Jawbone

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You'll have to give me some tips on how to feign interest. I don't think I can count on my Irish blarney to get me through all of it. I'm pretty good at spinning BS, but I need all the help I can get.
It's called surfing the web on your laptop during class, while looking up periodically and nodding when the teacher meets your gaze.

Stuff like that can be easily coughed up for a test when studied off powerpoint slides the night before.
 

wisconsindoctor

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Greetings, my name is Michele and am new to the forums. My question is regarding the better of the two options, the BS vs. AAS in Nursing. I am not sure which way to go and would like some feedback. I am beginning to pursue a nursing path and hold a BS in Business and an MBA.

I am not sure what would be the best way to go in order to move into nursing supv/admin or deciding to go for an NP.

Thank you for any thoughts and feedback.
You can do the AAS if you want. But if you want a different job down the line (nursing related jobs), many of them just asking for a nursing degree, but a good number of the higher level jobs require an MSN. So you will want to make it goal to get the BSN.
 

wisconsindoctor

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What is this nursing theory that everyone talks about? I never took a nursing class. So I have no idea.
 

dfk

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What is this nursing theory that everyone talks about? I never took a nursing class. So I have no idea.
i'm sure inserting sarcasm here is what's warranted.
as for nursing theory, it's about 155 years of bullsh!t...
 

fab4fan

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What is this nursing theory that everyone talks about? I never took a nursing class. So I have no idea.
A lot of dead nurses (and some still living who haven't had the good sense to fall over yet) spouted off tangential, concentric circumlocution that has something or other to do with nursing, but those of us who actually take care of patients are still trying to figure out it all means and how it's supposed to make us better nurses. At least that's what I think nursing theory is.

My theory is: Try not to kill your patient. Try not to let anyone else kill your patient. Try to discharge your patient in one piece. With all valuables.