Can you check me on a couple things

[southwind]

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Sup!

First post, this place is huge!

It's highly self-evident that I need one of these post-bac programs and I am taking some science and math for dummies classes to prepare.

I research things to death, but I was wondering if you guys could help me find a program that fits me:

1. Two-year (or self paced) program for the "magic 8" plus a couple
2. No SMP's, I have NO science classes
3. I have NO clinical / shadowing experience
4. I ain't taking Calculus, waste of time
5. Linkage would be nice, not required
6. Will be clinical / shadowing during program, any help here = good
7. Prefer it didn't cost over 12-13K
8. Good rep, low stress, etc, would help
9. Not graded on a curve, what the crap is that all about?
10. I don't like big cities, but will suck it up
11. Haven't taken GRE but I can

So far I've found Harvard Extension and UConn, and UConn only b/c I could move my family there with one phone call. Seems pretty tight on out of staters though!

Harvard's cost structure is fascinating...I can go to classes and pay living expenses there for way less than the cost of most others' tuition alone, including here in my home state! What the crap!

Just wanted to make sure I'm not missing any great programs.

Thoughts?

Stats: 4.0 from a upper mid-tier school, I am from Arizona where there's only one program, an SMP, so I'm out of state for all.

(ok maybe not 4.0, but 200+ credits with one B and one C, so whatever)

Appreciate any help!👍

 

[DrMidlife]

If I could do it over I would have done Bennington or UT Dallas. The cheapest plan is to take classes at a public university, assuming you can get enrolled. Aside from linkage, formal programs only offer things you can get on your own.

Have you looked at the list of postbacs on AAMC? The big names are Bryn Mawr, Goucher and Scripps.

4. I ain't taking Calculus, waste of time
9. Not graded on a curve, what the crap is that all about?

I predict that you're going to hate med school.

6. Will be clinical / shadowing during program, any help here = good

Leaning on your school to provide this is silly. You can contact hospitals or clinics and ask about volunteering, and get shadowing opportunities from there. I'd feel incredibly limited if I had to go through some admin at a school to get access.

7. Prefer it didn't cost over 12-13K

That seems arbitrary. Doing it cheap means going public and figuring things out on your own. Doing it formal with linkage and prestige means spending some money.

Stats: 4.0 from a upper mid-tier school, I am from Arizona where there's only one program, an SMP, so I'm out of state for all.

(ok maybe not 4.0, but 200+ credits with one B and one C, so whatever

Call it what it is and don't be a tool.

Best of luck to you.

 

[jslo85]

If I could do it over I would have done Bennington or UT Dallas. The cheapest plan is to take classes at a public university, assuming you can get enrolled. Aside from linkage, formal programs only offer things you can get on your own.

Have you looked at the list of postbacs on AAMC? The big names are Bryn Mawr, Goucher and Scripps.

I predict that you're going to hate med school.

Leaning on your school to provide this is silly. You can contact hospitals or clinics and ask about volunteering, and get shadowing opportunities from there. I'd feel incredibly limited if I had to go through some admin at a school to get access.

That seems arbitrary. Doing it cheap means going public and figuring things out on your own. Doing it formal with linkage and prestige means spending some money.

Call it what it is and don't be a tool.

Best of luck to you.

I second that on UT Dallas. I don't feel I have any other advice beyond that because of the many limitations/restrictions that you have placed on this. The more expensive programs (Goucher, Bryn Mawr, etc) are expensive for the reason that they are highly sought after by many due to their virtual guarantee of getting you into medical school provided you get into their program and successfully complete it.

 

[southwind]

Tool? That's awesome.

Let me handle that first, what I meant by that was that I have not yet bothered to formally compute my GPA's via AMCAS formula, which is something I will have to do when applying to med schools. This will take me several weeks to gather that info; I have been attending school since 1989, including foreign schools and distance, a dozen or so one-offs and military stuff. Ay yi yi!

The calculus of Calculus is something that I formally computed and wrote out, after looking at every single medical schools' web site, every one that is listed as accredited (about 125 IIRC). (I did not know about the MSAR book until I was over halfway done). Only one school I was interested in had the requirement (Duke). So fugeddaboudit!

I have my own way; I rejected Utah for instance because they are complete douchebags (and plus I'm not Mormon). Check them out if you want and you will see immediately. That's too bad; that's the next state north of here and I love Utah in general.

Hate it? Doesn't matter; I just have to do it. I really dig science and I've done similar things. I can get on top of everything short of straight up Calculus. I'm taking Algebra again right now just to be sure. Let's get it ON.

If I gotta do a curve sometime then I will, but for post-bac pre-med? Rather not til I have to.

Ah, the most help I'd be looking for by the way is a list of places to call or drop by on some bulletin board. I'm quite used to kicking doors in but would rather be using brain power for studying, that's all.

I looked at Scrip/Gouch/Bryn, the top guys, they don't fit me. Scripps is the only 2-year.

HES is cheaper than my (in) state schools, even with living expenses to move there! Because here they charge graduate tuition. The one formal post bac in state is over $35K! That sucks because it's all of 20 blocks away from me.🙁 It's an SMP anyway.

I have a list here (post-baccs) that I did off the AAMC website, according to Microsoft Excel the average cost of attendance to one of these post-bacs is $15,485.

But I'm looking for values or hidden gems that may be mis-labeled, or the info is too new to sort correctly (i.e. they added a new program since the site was updated).

In other words looking for hidden gems like what you guys just provided. UT Dallas isn't listed on AAMC. Looks great! Checking that out muy pronto.

Thanks yo. Keep 'em coming.👍

 

[southwind]

UT Dallas looks like a great program, would be about ~7K a semester for me so around 28K for four? Excellent reputation it seems. Self paced, very nice. Will definitely look into it hard!

Bennington is in Vermont (home of low crime and Robert Newton Peck) which I would love, but would be difficult to get in and out of. They list their cost straight up for 9 classes in one year (three semesters) though, kind of nice...24,975. Kinda fast though at first...

Love these two. Interesting...

 

[DrMidlife]

I hear ya on transcripts - I've got 6 back to 1984. Particularly with military and foreign records (my sister's got these) you'll want to own the lead time to get a transcript sent to admissions offices, starting with your postbac. What I did was order some for my own records, so that I'd know how long it would take (max was 2 months). Note that foreign coursework has to be evaluated, and typically you want it to show up as transferred coursework on a US transcript for best results. Look for posts in nontrad, by ScottishChap, for more info.

Make sure that you include EVERYTHING in your GPA calcs. If it's on a college transcript, it counts.

Have you thought at all about staying in AZ? A big campus like ASU or UofA would have a lot of resources for premeds (clubs, activities, speakers, MCAT prep etc). There are a variety of ways to go to these schools - nonmatric, non-degree-seeking, 2nd bachelors etc.

If you want to take advantage of TX programs, definitely work there before you start school so you've got residency. Otherwise you're just another OOS chump trying to get into their sweet and plentiful low-cost med schools.

It's not out of the question for you to do prereqs at a community college, because your GPA is really high. Generally CC prereqs are a no-no, but if you come flying in with a 3.95 and a really high MCAT, nobody's going to question where you took your prereqs. Particularly if you can talk about Kabul or whatnot in your essay.

I understand the drive to be at a solid, structured program, and UTD might be perfect for you. For me, in retrospect, the MOST important thing was to find a school where I'd get A's. Nothing else is even remotely as important. Your GPA is your fate, and it's more permanent than a tattoo.

Lastly, look at the GPA enhancement sticky. I built that list with an eye for programs where you can recover from a low GPA, but it overlaps with some off-the-beaten-path premed programs that might be interesting to you.

Best of luck.

 

[southwind]

Have you thought at all about staying in AZ? A big campus like ASU or UofA would have a lot of resources for premeds (clubs, activities, speakers, MCAT prep etc). There are a variety of ways to go to these schools - nonmatric, non-degree-seeking, 2nd bachelors etc.

It's not out of the question for you to do prereqs at a community college, because your GPA is really high. Generally CC prereqs are a no-no, but if you come flying in with a 3.95 and a really high MCAT, nobody's going to question where you took your prereqs.

For me, in retrospect, the MOST important thing was to find a school where I'd get A's. Nothing else is even remotely as important. Your GPA is your fate, and it's more permanent than a tattoo.

Lastly, look at the GPA enhancement sticky. I built that list with an eye for programs where you can recover from a low GPA, but it overlaps with some off-the-beaten-path premed programs that might be interesting to you.

Best of luck.

Yeah. I still dunno - it definitely cuts both ways. One the one hand, AZ is where the home and family and in-laws and friends are. On the other hand, AZ is where the home and family and in-laws and friends are.

Capisce? 😎 It's a focus issue. I plan on treating it like more or less back to back four-month deployments. I can put up with anything for four months!

We have all of two med schools here, U of AZ (Tuscon) and Midwestern (DO). Education here kind of sucks, there isn't a whole lot of that kind of thing going around. I can certainly kick doors down for opportunities on my own, in fact with a chronic condition I know a ton of docs who would help me out. But Boston (or Dallas or NC) has tons of hospitals that do the student-vol thing all the time.

Come to think of it, that cuts both ways too - being one of few breaking ground somewhat vs. one of many in a established pattern. Le Sigh.

I read a thread here that said for your EC's / vols to do some regular stuff and something somewhat off the beaten path and that's what adcoms/interviewers will likely focus on because it's neat or different. I like this way of thinking. I think I may get the EMT and go vol overseas or at the Super Bowl or the Oscars or something, along with the regular stuff.

Grades - you are damn skippy. I pretty much suborned everything to grades, made it my mission. And once I get the ke-nollidge from de-kollige, I'll do that for MCAT. I'm gonna crush that thing or die trying. 😀

THANKS for helping (and reading le diatribe).

 

[southwind]

Sorry - hit the button too fast again.

I ran the numbers again - the Harvard program is still cheaper than ASU, even when you factor in moving there!

Post-bac per credit at ASU last year was $509 (big increases coming, so says the newspaper). That's just over $2000 for a 4-credit class, then books, lab fees, etc.

The major advantages to the HES program are the - by nearly unanimous agreement - downright fantastic faculty, and the fact that it's Boston, where there are more big colleges and/or medical schools, labs, hospitals, etc, than you can shake a stick at.

BU, UMass, BC, Tufts, MIT, Northeastern, Harvard, oh my. KnowwhutImean?

The downside is that it's Boston...ay, again with the dichotomy...

 

[MD to be 1 day]

DrMidlife, why did you mention that would you would have chosen Bennington or UT Dallas? Just curious 🙂 Thanks!

 

[drizzt3117]

In your situation, Id choose HES. It's a great program with good success rates and you'll have lots of opportunities to get good clinical experience.

 

[DrMidlife]

DrMidlife, why did you mention that would you would have chosen Bennington or UT Dallas? Just curious 🙂 Thanks!

Bennington looks like a small, personal program where the odds of having actual conversations with faculty and (gulp) being known aren't zero. That would have made a big difference for me. I don't know anybody who has done the program, so this could just be all in my head. But no other program has given me the same impression.

UTD strikes me as energetic and organized and not too big. Like they put a great deal of thought into what the existing prereq programs don't offer, to career changers, GPA comebacks, etc. I have a friend who went there and was very successful coming out of it.

In either of these cases, I wish I would have moved there, worked to get state residency, and then started school full time. What I wish I hadn't done was stuck with the huge penitentiary-style medical complex down the street, my state's only med school, where you can walk around for weeks without anybody saying a word or even looking at you, where resources are so scarce that defense is the first priority, and where dealing with students is viewed by faculty and staff as intensely painful. I did not thrive.