Cardiologist and former med school interviewer available to answer questions

[Far7anR]

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Thanks for your help with answering all these questions.

I had a rough start in my first half of M1 and I had a W in Anatomy (and so I am completing it this semester instead) and a lot of C's as well. However, I still have physio, path, pharm, neuro, micriobio, immuno, genetics and a couple of others left for the next year and a half.

As an IMG, if I get my game together (and I have, btw) from here on out and do well in the rest of my classes as well as the boards, is cardio still something possible for me in the future? What should I look for in an IM residency that would help make a cardio fellowship easier for me and how can I make myself appealing to that kind of IM residency despite my rough start?

Also, what exactly do you look for in research that makes an applicant appealing for an IM residency?

 

[Nanoo]

This is an incredible opportunity that you're providing for us- thank you very much for your time. I am spending a couple of gap years living abroad for the purpose of reconnecting with my heritage and am volunteering/interning in a hospital while I am out here.

1) Recently I've come across a lot of strongly negative feelings towards applicants who go abroad rather than stay at home to 'help out in their own backyards.' How often did you come across and what was your opinion generally on applicants who went abroad for prolonged periods of time? I'm not talking about 2 week medical mission trips but rather 6 months+ living abroad.

2) I've found that mentioning doing anything 'hands on' abroad leads people to immediately assume that an applicant is taking advantage of the poorer conditions of a less developed country. Personally for you, is there in fact a tendency to quickly assume the worst when an applicant mentions that they have had clinical experiences abroad?

 

[Fakhter]

Hey thanks for doing this. When you were interviewing canidates did Community College credits make a differnece in whether or not an acceptance letter is mailed?

 

[HeartDoc14]

Since you've given great advice in regards to mastering the pre-clinical and clinical years, would you also happen to have advice on how to do well on step 1? I know it's a little early to think about this, but I have really appreciated your advice thus far.

1. The best preparation for step 1 is doing well in the classroom, especially second year.
2. I'll assume that you have a reasonably long block of time, free from classroom responsibilities to study. When it comes time to formally study for Step 1, make a detailed schedule of what you're going to study and when, and try to stick to it. Place some "buffers" or catch up days in your schedule to ensure that you can stay on target. Reserve an hour each study day, at the end of the day, to review what you studied on previous days. Leave several days at the end to review everything, and during that time, do a lot of practice questions and focus more on what you studied at the beginning of your study period. Study from many sources: review books, notes, CDs, flash cards, etc. Take notes on everything, and then take notes on those notes, then compress your notes even further, and eventually wind up 15-20 pages of notes that contain the most high-yield information that you haven't yet memorized. Take advantage of spare time by reviewing these notes before you fall asleep, while in line at the grocery store, on the treadmill, etc.
3. Take good care of yourself during your USMLE study period -- eat well, get enough sleep and reserve time to exercise.
4. Be prepared for test time. Have everything ready (your clothes, snacks, transportation, etc) well in advance, and arrive early. Mental preparation cannot be over-emphasized.

You probably won't have the same study time reserved for Step II; fortunately it's easier, and a little less important.

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thanks for your time with this thread, your information is very interesting and helpful.

What has been your experience been like interacting with interventional radiology, procedural wise? Are there turf battles with certain procedures or is there a certain line drawn somewhere on who does what where you practice? How do you feel about it as a specialty compared to interventional cards or cardiology in general?

Fortunately, at this time, there are clear boundaries between what a cardiologist does and what IR does. I don't see that changing at all in the foreseeable future. The cardiologist also has the advantage in that he/she is a source for procedure self-referral; unlike IR.

Interventional radiologist is a great field. The work is interesting, exciting, and compensated well. I prefer interacting more with my patients and enjoy some degree of longitudinal care; in that respect, cardiology has the advantage.

 

[HeartDoc14]

To what extent does medical school reputation/ranking (amongst MD schools) matter?

If you're interested in an academic career, medical school reputation matters a lot. If you're looking to train in a more prestigious residency (especially in a competitive specialty), medical school reputation matters somewhat, though the top students at less highly-rated medical schools still often match in very competitive residencies.

In most instances, when you go to apply for a job, where you went to medical school is of little importance.

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thanks for your help with answering all these questions.

I had a rough start in my first half of M1 and I had a W in Anatomy (and so I am completing it this semester instead) and a lot of C's as well. However, I still have physio, path, pharm, neuro, micriobio, immuno, genetics and a couple of others left for the next year and a half.

As an IMG, if I get my game together (and I have, btw) from here on out and do well in the rest of my classes as well as the boards, is cardio still something possible for me in the future? What should I look for in an IM residency that would help make a cardio fellowship easier for me and how can I make myself appealing to that kind of IM residency despite my rough start?

Also, what exactly do you look for in research that makes an applicant appealing for an IM residency?

1. If you "get your game together", do well in your rotations, and do well on the boards, you can still match in a reasonably competitive residency. If you know that you want to specialize in cardiology, doing your residency at a place that has a cardiology fellowship is often a good idea, because fellowship programs often match from within. During your residency interviews, inquire about the success rates of their residents in matching into cardiology. Do well in your clinical rotations (especially your medicine and surgery rotations), do well on the boards, gets some solid letters of recommendation, and you should be competitive for a solid IM residency program.

2. Research is good, but getting a publication out of that research is what will help your application most. It doesn't take much: during your clinical rotations, look for a couple of interesting cases to submit for case reports. Those count as research!

 

[AktionPOTENTIAL]

Thanks for doing this and responding thoroughly! How do you view applicants who are healthcare professionals such as nurses and X-ray/MRI techs who are now pursuing a career in medicine?

 

[Fakhter]

Awww man you skipped my question

 

[Fakhter]

If you're interested in an academic career, medical school reputation matters a lot. If you're looking to train in a more prestigious residency (especially in a competitive specialty), medical school reputation matters somewhat, though the top students as less highly-rated medical schools still often match in very competitive residencies.

In most instances, when you go to apply for a job, where you went to medical school is of little importance.

What residencies do you consider prestigious ?

 

[ChiDO]

What residencies do you consider prestigious ?

You do realize the list will be 100% different for every medical specialty and sub-specialty. Silly question, however, it does NOT correlate with your research "top 20" medical schools.

 

[Far7anR]

Thanks for your response! A follow-up - what exactly is a case study, and who are you supposed to present it to?

We get case studies all the time in class for didactic reasons - to give a practical example of how theory manifests itself in real medicine, but I never realized physicians use case studies for anything amongst themselves.

 

[Fakhter]

You do realize the list will be 100% different for every medical specialty and sub-specialty. Silly question, however, it does NOT correlate with your research "top 20" medical schools.

Wait what? I'm confused

 

[Instatewaiter]

What residencies do you consider prestigious ?

You do realize the list will be 100% different for every medical specialty and sub-specialty. Silly question, however, it does NOT correlate with your research "top 20" medical schools.

Yes it does correlate, it just doesn't perfectly mirror.

Some top IM residencies:
Hopkins
MGH (harvard)
UCSF
The Brigham (harvard)
Columbia
Duke
Penn
UTSW
UCLA
Stanford
UTSW

 

[HeartDoc14]

This is an incredible opportunity that you're providing for us- thank you very much for your time. I am spending a couple of gap years living abroad for the purpose of reconnecting with my heritage and am volunteering/interning in a hospital while I am out here.

1) Recently I've come across a lot of strongly negative feelings towards applicants who go abroad rather than stay at home to 'help out in their own backyards.' How often did you come across and what was your opinion generally on applicants who went abroad for prolonged periods of time? I'm not talking about 2 week medical mission trips but rather 6 months+ living abroad.

2) I've found that mentioning doing anything 'hands on' abroad leads people to immediately assume that an applicant is taking advantage of the poorer conditions of a less developed country. Personally for you, is there in fact a tendency to quickly assume the worst when an applicant mentions that they have had clinical experiences abroad?

1. I'm not familiar with this bias. Being out of the country for 6-12 months would have no bearing on the strength of your application, in my opinion, especially if you used that time constructively. It may may your application more interesting, and give you a lot to talk about during your interviews.

2. I'm not aware of that bias either. Especially if the other areas of your application are solid (grades, MCAT, LOR's)

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thanks for your response! A follow-up - what exactly is a case study, and who are you supposed to present it to?

We get case studies all the time in class for didactic reasons - to give a practical example of how theory manifests itself in real medicine, but I never realized physicians use case studies for anything amongst themselves.

A case report is an article written about an interesting or unusual case, diagnosis, presentation, etc that is submitted to a peer-reviewed journal for publication. Many journals publish case reports. On the wards, always look for something interesting, and ask your residents/attendings if you can "write it up".

 

[HeartDoc14]

What residencies do you consider prestigious ?

Every specialty has its "top" programs. Talk to your medical school advisors/counselors about the top programs in the specialties you're interested in.

If you're interested in internal medicine, the top programs on the west coast are UCSF, University of Washington, Stanford, UCLA. On the east, it's MGH, BWH, Johns Hopkins, Penn, Duke. Other prestigious programs are U Chicago, UT Southwestern, Vanderbilt, Wash U. I've probably missed a few.

Sometimes, an institution may be very prestigious in one field, but their other residencies may not be as prestigious. For instance, Thomas Jefferson apparently has an outstanding dermatology department. Cleveland Clinic has one of the top cardiology programs, but their internal medicine residency is no where as prestigious.

 

[911 Turbo]

When you were a premed I'm sure you remember that one annoying, super competitive premed in your class whose aspirations to become a physician were based on family pressures or a need for a higher level of prestige/power...... do these people manage to filter through medical school and residency? Are they still as annoying?

 

[HeartDoc14]

Hey thanks for doing this. When you were interviewing canidates did Community College credits make a differnece in whether or not an acceptance letter is mailed?

It's not uncommon for students applying to med school to start off in community college, and then transfer into a 4 year university (though that's obviously not the norm). You community college grades carry the same weight when calculating your GPA, so in the initial screening, you're not really penalized for taking community college classes. However, your application will not look as strong if you took many or all of your science prerequisites at a CC, as those classes may not have been as academically rigorous as those at a university, and may not be as good of a predictor of your ability to succeed in med school. You should take as many of these classes as you can at a university, as you don't want to appear as if your hiding your deficiencies by taking harder classes under less competitive circumstances.

 

[HeartDoc14]

When you were a premed I'm sure you remember that one annoying, super competitive premed in your class whose aspirations to become a physician were based on family pressures or a need for a higher level of prestige/power...... do these people manage to filter through medical school and residency? Are they still as annoying?

Often yes, and yes.

I will say, however, that the road to becoming a practicing physician is such a long journey (11-15 years if you include premed), and the rewards of money and prestige are so far in the distant, that those who who are motivated solely by money and title are often weeded out, somewhere along the way, by attrition. But not always.

 

[HeartDoc14]

Awww man you skipped my question

Sorry. See above for my answer.

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thanks for doing this and responding thoroughly! How do you view applicants who are healthcare professionals such as nurses and X-ray/MRI techs who are now pursuing a career in medicine?

Nurses, pharmacists, techs, EMT's, etc often do very well in medical school. I don't look at these experiences as negative at all, especially if the application is strong, and the applicant appears to be applying to medical school for the right reasons.

 

[Nanoo]

1. I'm not familiar with this bias. Being out of the country for 6-12 months would have no bearing on the strength of your application, in my opinion, especially if you used that time constructively. It may may your application more interesting, and give you a lot to talk about during your interviews.

2. I'm not aware of that bias either. Especially if the other areas of your application are solid (grades, MCAT, LOR's)

Thank for you answering my questions. I am highly relieved to hear that this bias is not as wide spread as I had thought. There are a few threads going around at the moment listing the cons of going abroad and how doing it could instead hurt you in the long run so I was getting scared.

I would appreciate if you could answer some more questions that have been on my mind recently.

1) When reviewing a re-applicant, is there a preference for people that come right out and say they are a re-applicant in their PS, or it is something you are already well aware of and see as just unnecessarily taking up space? I suppose what I am asking is whether re-applicant essays are generally stronger if they focus on being a re-applicant and what they have done to improve themselves since they last applied or whether their essay is better off without drawing that attention to their re-applicant status.

2) What would you say is the most important/impressive component of a re-applicant's application? New PS/ rewritten activities descriptions? Or entirely new/different activities? Drawing attention to the perseverance/resilience/etc needed to face re-application after rejection? Of course acknowledgment and changes in the area(s) of weakness of the last application are important, but I guess I'm asking if there's something specific that really stands out.

Thanks again!

 

[smiley27]

HeartDoc14,

For a non-traditional applicant (5+ years out) that gas a 2.9 ugpa but strong upward grade trend in a postbac (3.7+) --

1) In your opinion, will a stellar mcat and a strong postbac performance convince you, as an interviewer that the candidate is prepared academically?

2) Or has the low gpa candidate dug herself in too deep of a hole and will be lucky to even get an interview?

 

[msj6403]

I'm glad you asked that question. As a re-applicant and someone who went overseas multiple times including a semester abroad, I am happy that I wasn't the only one with similar questions.

OP will elaborate further, but here are my thoughts to your questions:

1) I don't think it's necessary to state that you are a re-applicant in the PS. My PS this year will be very different from the last year's, not because I said I am a re-applicant and did this and that to improve my application, but because I understood myself more after the first round and realized what I really wanted to say. I think that recent activities will speak on their own without addressing them in the essay.

2) I read this somewhere in SDN, but from what I remember, it is recommended to re-write your activities and PS, even if they are only slight changes. The most impressive components could be different from applicants to applicants depending on their weaknesses and how they addressed them. It's hard to weigh which one is more impressive, 5+ point jump in MCAT or dazzling PS/life experiences during a gap year(s).

Thank for you answering my questions. I am highly relieved to hear that this bias is not as wide spread as I had thought. There are a few threads going around at the moment listing the cons of going abroad and how doing it could instead hurt you in the long run so I was getting scared.

I would appreciate if you could answer some more questions that have been on my mind recently.

1) When reviewing a re-applicant, is there a preference for people that come right out and say they are a re-applicant in their PS, or it is something you are already well aware of and see as just unnecessarily taking up space? I suppose what I am asking is whether re-applicant essays are generally stronger if they focus on being a re-applicant and what they have done to improve themselves since they last applied or whether their essay is better off without drawing that attention to their re-applicant status.

2) What would you say is the most important/impressive component of a re-applicant's application? New PS/ rewritten activities descriptions? Or entirely new/different activities? Drawing attention to the perseverance/resilience/etc needed to face re-application after rejection? Of course acknowledgment and changes in the area(s) of weakness of the last application are important, but I guess I'm asking if there's something specific that really stands out.

Thanks again!

 

[msj6403]

Thank you again for your time and responses to my previous questions.

My question is about medical school system as a whole, and I just wanted to hear your opinions on this. I understand that "the first two years are NOT useless AT ALL" in part because they are "the foundation of medical knowledge." I completely agree with you on this.

However, what would be your comments when an attending says:
"After eight years [of learning from a physician(s) side by side after graduating from high school], the apprentice-system graduates would be far superior in ability to make clinical decisions, communicate with patients, perform procedures and overall be a good doctor."

He is not implying that learning basic sciences is irrelevant, so I think we can all agree that they are very important. The main question seems to be about how to deliver such information as well as clinical skills effectively.

In other words, what are your overall views on our current system in recruiting future doctors and training them? If they can be improved, what would they be?


His original comments can be found in:

<http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=13686440#post13686440>

It's refreshing when a person can think outside the box. I would estimate that out of the MS3's I lecture to, >95% stare in blank confusion and <5% get it when I remind them that medical school is actually two separate concepts. On one hand, it is a system where one acquires the SKILLS and KNOWLEDGE to practice medicine. It would be awesome if that's all it were. On the other hand, it is a system where one jumps thorough hoops and obeys arbitrary rules set by a bureaucracy in order to gain PERMISSION to practice medicine. Two very different concepts. It is certainly possible to have a world where the first part is present without the second part (and at one time in the history of this country, it WAS).

Imagine if experienced doctors have the option of searching for high school graduates with good learning skills, people skills and street smarts, then taking them on as apprentices who would follow them around for 8 years, learning on the job to manage patients, do surgery, communicate with patients etc. In fact, there could be some every year so that the senior students help teach the junior ones, taking full advantage of the SEE-DO-TEACH paradigm.

Along the way, there would be reading assignments for the basic science concepts, some practical testing/assessment and formal or informal lectures. The tests are not so much intended to "weed out" who can have permission to go on, but rather to assess which areas to refocus on. Sure, those few who are totally disasters would be let go, in the exact same vein where a small fraction of medical students are not allowed to graduate.

At the end, the apprentice could be subjected to the same form of evaluation as the graduates of the current old-fashioned curriculum to see if they can get a certificate. I would venture to say that after eight years, the apprentice-system graduates would be far superior in ability to make clinical decisions, communicate with patients, perform procedures and overall be a good doctor. Granted those in the current old-fashioned curriculum would arguably know more about how to synthesize an aldehyde and how to draw the Krebs-cycle.

This system of competing educational systems would be such that if you kept churning out graduates who were UNABLE to pass their evaluation at the end, then your school system would eventually die out. It wouldn't even be so structured as to always require 8 years. If a program is so efficient and the students are so sharp that they can achieve it in 4, then that's great.

Another key difference is those in the apprenticeship track would not be in debt because for these eight years, instead of paying exorbitant undergrad and med school tuition, they would be earning a small stipend for their labor or at the very least breaking even.

Ask yourself this. Who is actively blocking this from happening? Who is blocking competition in the medical education sector and preserving the old school monopoly? What is their motivation for maintaining their monopoly?

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thank you again for your time and responses to my previous questions.

My question is about medical school system as a whole, and I just wanted to hear your opinions on this. I understand that "the first two years are NOT useless AT ALL" in part because they are "the foundation of medical knowledge." I completely agree with you on this.

However, what would be your comments when an attending says:
"After eight years [of learning from a physician(s) side by side after graduating from high school], the apprentice-system graduates would be far superior in ability to make clinical decisions, communicate with patients, perform procedures and overall be a good doctor."

He is not implying that learning basic sciences is irrelevant, so I think we can all agree that they are very important. The main question seems to be about how to deliver such information as well as clinical skills effectively.

In other words, what are your overall views on our current system in recruiting future doctors and training them? If they can be improved, what would they be?


His original comments can be found in:

<http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=13686440#post13686440>

After I read this post, I had to look go back to read the original post, to see the context of the conversation, and was shocked to see that the original comments were written by a physician. I don't want to get into a long debate about the inadequacies of the current system for training physicians, but here are my thoughts...

Practicing medicine is not just a skill; it's a science and an art that requires evolution of thought, understanding, reasoning, and maturity. I can think of no other true academic professionals that are trained solely by being an apprentice (lawyers? engineers? school teachers?) Training physicians the way that electricians or handymen are trained will create just that: medical technicians.

As a medical student, I want to learn physiology from an expert in physiology. Even though I'm not going to specialize in ID, I want to learn from an infectious disease expert. Assigning me to one physician for 8 years really places a cap on how much I'll learn; I'll be limited to what that physician can teach me. If your counter-argument is that I can rotate between physicians, well then, now you're approaching a system similar to what we have today. I'm a cardiologist that has worked with MANY medical students and residents. I can assure you that those that get the most out of a cardiology rotation are those that come in with a strong understanding of both general and cardiac specific physiology and pathophysiology. If you place a student fresh out of high school with me for 8 years, he/she is going to miss out on a ton of learning, simply because I can't teach neurophysiology as well as a neurophysiologist or nephrology as well as a nephrologist. And there is so much crossover between specialties, that you're inevitably going to create lesser physicians.

Another problem with this proposed system is the financial aspect. I love working with medical students, but they slow me down. A lot. Students don't make me more productive, they make me less so. So much so that I'm probably only able to see 50% of the patients I would see working alone. For 8 years, you're going to have to pay me at least 800K to teach an apprentice. That's going to have to be paid for via tuition. Who is going to test these students? Who is going to grade those tests? More tuition.

Most schools now have problem-based learning as part of the curriculum, but the utility of this is limited, and the reviews are mixed. What you're proposing is 8 years of one-on-one PBL. While I think there is a role for PBL, it's pretty clear that it often requires a lot of squeeze for just a little juice. While it's true that I'm not able to draw the Kreb's cycle anymore, I did learn a lot about cellular metabolism that I still use today. At one point, I learned everything I possibly could about basic physiology and biochemistry, and while I don't remember all of it, I remember a hell of a lot, and it makes me a better physician. Even though I'm not delivering babies, I rotated on an OB service in medical school and studied my ***** off, and that helps me when today when treating a pregnant woman with arrhythmias.

 

[HeartDoc14]

HeartDoc14,

For a non-traditional applicant (5+ years out) that gas a 2.9 ugpa but strong upward grade trend in a postbac (3.7+) --

1) In your opinion, will a stellar mcat and a strong postbac performance convince you, as an interviewer that the candidate is prepared academically?

2) Or has the low gpa candidate dug herself in too deep of a hole and will be lucky to even get an interview?

In my opinion, entering into a post-bacc program or graduate program is a little bit like starting over. I would place far more emphasis on your post-bacc performance and MCAT scores, and less on your undergrad GPA. This may not be the case for the "elite" medical schools, but many schools will look at your post-bacc performance very favorably. It also probably depends on which post-bacc program you're in, and whether that program is associated with a medical school. In your situation, your MCAT scores may be even more important, acting as an unbiased barometer of your likelihood to succeed.

 

[MusicJunkie]

Thank you for all the responses! I know this is an amazing resource for a lot of us.

1) Do you have any tips for budgeting your time well while in medical school? Or anything pertaining to staying sane through med school/residency, especially during high stress periods?

2) Is there anything you suggest we get involved in in medical school (ie. research, volunteering, clubs, etc)?

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thank for you answering my questions. I am highly relieved to hear that this bias is not as wide spread as I had thought. There are a few threads going around at the moment listing the cons of going abroad and how doing it could instead hurt you in the long run so I was getting scared.

I would appreciate if you could answer some more questions that have been on my mind recently.

1) When reviewing a re-applicant, is there a preference for people that come right out and say they are a re-applicant in their PS, or it is something you are already well aware of and see as just unnecessarily taking up space? I suppose what I am asking is whether re-applicant essays are generally stronger if they focus on being a re-applicant and what they have done to improve themselves since they last applied or whether their essay is better off without drawing that attention to their re-applicant status.

2) What would you say is the most important/impressive component of a re-applicant's application? New PS/ rewritten activities descriptions? Or entirely new/different activities? Drawing attention to the perseverance/resilience/etc needed to face re-application after rejection? Of course acknowledgment and changes in the area(s) of weakness of the last application are important, but I guess I'm asking if there's something specific that really stands out.

Thanks again!

1. If you've applied to that school before, they will almost certainly be aware. I wouldn't focus on your "reapplicant" status, but don't shy away from the conversation. Have insight into why you were not successful the last time you applied, and improve that part(s) of you application. Your improvements will be obvious to those reviewing your application. However, if your new application can't stand on its own, even if it's improved, you may not be successful.

2. It almost sounds like you're treating your "re-applicant status" as a disease, that you need to explain, and that has required "perseverance/resilience/etc". Many, MANY people reapply each year. Unfortunately, you're not going to gain any sympathy points for discussing the hardship of rejection. (I'm sorry if I sound harsh, but if I'm thinking it, others probably will too.) Here's what I can tell you: many people get into medical school after years of trying. If it's what you really want, don't give up. But you're going to have to improve the weak part(s) of your application. Adding some extracurricular activities or improving your personal statement is probably not going to be enough. If you had 10 interviews but no acceptances, you're probably not doing well in your interviews. If you applied to 25 schools, but only got 1 interview, then you're either applying to the wrong places, your MCAT scores are sub-par, or your GPA is too low.

Few things (aside from felony convictions) are deal-breakers. The exception to that is poor MCAT scores. If your MCAT scores are very low, and you can't improve them, you may find it extremely difficult to get in to an allopathic medical school in the US. However, if your scores are solid, but your grades are poor, there are a LOT of ways to improve your GPA and get in. Try a post-bacc program, a Masters or PhD program, or a second Bachelor's degree.

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thank you for all the responses! I know this is an amazing resource for a lot of us.

1) Do you have any tips for budgeting your time well while in medical school? Or anything pertaining to staying sane through med school/residency, especially during high stress periods?

2) Is there anything you suggest we get involved in in medical school (ie. research, volunteering, clubs, etc)?

1. It depends really on what type of student you want to be. Do you want to graduate with honors? Get AOA? Do you need to match at the top residency? Or are you just hoping to graduate with reasonable grades, get a good education, and secure a respectable residency? If you plan on being one of the top students, you're going to have to study more, so time management becomes far more important. Overachievers generally study on their own, rather than in study groups. Get a head start on studying at the beginning of each cycle. READ BEFORE LECTURE. Don't study on the couch, on your bed, or in a comfy chair. Many successful students find it more productive to study away from home (library, Starbucks, hospital) where they're not distracted by roommates, TV, etc. I can't tell you how many hours you're going to need to study each day, since everyone learns differently, but you'll quickly find out. I would suggest that for the first term, you should study more than you think necessary, until you find a system that works for you, and until you can built a realistic schedule.

Medical school is intense, and your brain needs some rest. Find an activity that you enjoy, and give that to yourself every week. Even if it's only for an hour or two. That doesn't include exercise (which you also need to do to stay sane).

2. Get involved in activities only if you have a passion for them. I doubt anyone has ever matched in a program because they were in the Surgery Club, AMSA, etc. Research can be valuable, but the vast majority of medical students don't do any meaningful research, and many of the top academic students often don't have to participate in research in order to match in their desired programs. It's very hard (though not impossible) to be academically successful in medical school AND do meaningful research, unless you're in a PhD program. However, if you're an only an average student, and not a great test taker, doing research may help you get a residency spot that you might not have otherwise been competitive for.

 

[premed8888]

How important would you say medical school rankings are in getting a good residency? I know the common answer that it is what we make it, but from your experience. What about HBCUs and other medical schools that do not have an official ranking? I personally dislike ranking wars and believe they are often wrongly biased.

 

[HeartDoc14]

How important would you say medical school rankings are in getting a good residency? I know the common answer that it is what we make it, but from your experience. What about HBCUs and other medical schools that do not have an official ranking? I personally dislike ranking wars and believe they are often wrongly biased.

While it's true that rankings are subjective, and often flawed, medical school reputations are somewhat important, often rightfully so. UCSF, Harvard, Hopkins, etc are highly rated medical school for several unarguable reasons: excellent faculty, top-notch hospitals to train in, and very competitive students such that the top students are clearly the "creme de la creme". But top students from many less prestigious schools often match in very elite programs. So if you're at a lesser known school, but perform very well, your chance at matching at a top program is quite good. Just apply to many of them. You may not get the #1 residency in your chosen field, but you'll likely match in a top 10-20 program. I went to a top 5 residency program, and while many in my residency class went to Harvard, Yale, Duke, UCSF, etc. for medical school, there were also several graduates from far less prestigious medical schools.

If you're looking at a lesser known school, or a HBCU, ask to see where their graduates have been matching over the past several years. Its probably the best way to know what your options will be.

 

[premed8888]

While it's true that rankings are subjective, and often flawed, medical school reputations are somewhat important, often rightfully so. UCSF, Harvard, Hopkins, etc are highly rated medical school for several unarguable reasons: excellent faculty, top-notch hospitals to train in, and very competitive students such that the top students are clearly the "creme de la creme". But top students from many less prestigious schools often match in very elite programs. So if you're at a lesser known school, but perform very well, your chance at matching at a top program is quite good. Just apply to many of them. You may not get the #1 residency in your chosen field, but you'll likely match in a top 10-20 program.

If you're looking at a lesser known school, or a HBCU, ask to see where their graduates have been matching over the past several years. Its probably the best way to know what your options will be.

Thank you very much - It helps!

 

[premed8888]

Thank you very much - It helps!

What about preliminary medicine and preliminary surgical residencies - A lot of students, especially those interested in surgery, have been matching into preliminary programs at a school I am looking at. What does this mean and is there a use in preliminary programs?

 

[HeartDoc14]

What about preliminary medicine and preliminary surgical residencies - A lot of students, especially those interested in surgery, have been matching into preliminary programs at a school I am looking at. What does this mean and is there a use in preliminary programs?

It depends. A lot of residencies require a preliminary year (Radiology, Anesthesia, Rad Onc, etc) before starting the actual residency program. So the students you're referring to may be planning on going into one of those fields. On the other hand, preliminary years are also often filled by applicants who weren't able to match in categorical positions in surgery or medicine. (This latter situation is more common in surgery.) If the school you're looking at is having difficulty matching their graduates into categorical spots, I'd have some concern.

 

[HeartDoc14]

I'm not sure if people have run out of questions, or if this thread is getting lost on page 2. I figured I'd make it active one more time before I stop checking for questions. Anyone?

 

[Xenops]

Thank you very much for this thread! I found it very useful.

I was wondering how much of a difference an up-ward trend in GPA makes when the general GPA is low? Also considering when the rest of the application is solid

 

[HeartDoc14]

Thank you very much for this thread! I found it very useful.

I was wondering how much of a difference an up-ward trend in GPA makes when the general GPA is low? Also considering when the rest of the application is solid

It definitely helps, but only after the application gets beyond an initial screening. If your overall GPA is too low, your application may not get examined closely enough for anyone to realize that you've turned a corner.

 

[premed8888]

What is your take - Do MCAT cut-offs exist?

 

[Daodejing]

I'm not sure if people have run out of questions, or if this thread is getting lost on page 2. I figured I'd make it active one more time before I stop checking for questions. Anyone?

I haven't searched whether these questions have been answered or not yet, so apologies if they have. I figured I'd just keep the thread alive and thank you for your time and candid responses.

1. Knowing what you know now, if you were back in med school what would you do differently? Can be as general/specific as you like.

2. Based on my very premature knowledge and exposure, I'm currently leaning PP over academia but still want to know fully what I'm getting myself into before committing myself to it. Therefore, I'm interested in taking a Medical Business elective during pre-clinicals. Granted PP may/may not be a viable option by the time I get out of residency/fellowship because of the strong shift toward ACO's and hospital employment, I still feel some specific knowledge on how a practice works would be helpful. Would you recommend this? Are there any other electives during pre-clinicals or clinical years that you would suggest a medical student to to take?

 

[Sea Otter]

How much do pre-clinical grades really matter for residency? (I'm choosing between a P/F school and a H/HP/P/F school)

 

[premed071291]

I know about some bias that exists for a graduating DO student to get into an MD residency, but what about someone who has completed a DO internal medicine residency and is looking to get into an MD cardiology fellowship? How difficult is this to do?

 

[daymann]

I'm the chief of cardiology for an HMO. A few years back, I was in private practice for a year, and before that was in an academic position at a large military teaching hospital.

Procedural work IS often clinical diagnostic work, but I think I know what you mean. I spend about 40% of my time seeing patients in clinic, 40% doing procedures and seeing hospital inpatients/consults, and 20% doing administrative work.

Here's a typical day:
I usually start in the hospital at 7:45 to 8am, if there are patients that need to be seen in the morning. Otherwise, I go directly to the clinic.
Clinic usually starts at 8:30.
I see patients until around 12-12:30.
Often I have a lunch meeting.
In the afternoon, I usually have 2-3 procedures to do. Sometimes more, sometimes less.
I see my hospital patients in between and after my procedures.
When I'm done in the hospital, I often go back to the office to read echocardiograms, stress tests, etc.
Sometimes I have an afternoon meeting, interview, etc.
My day ends anywhere from 4:30pm to 6:30 pm depending on the day. Average is around 6pm. Of course, if someone is crashing, if may be later, but that will often go to the "on call" cardiologist.

This was very informative, thanks. 👍 One more question: How should I prepare myself to apply for a cardiology fellowship during med school? What in med school will affect my fellowship application? (Step 1?)

 

[MedQu33n]

I saw this forum, and thought there might be people with questions I can help. Feel free to ask anything about med school, residency, etc.

First, may thanks for taking the time to do this! It's wonderful to have the opportunity to ask these questions directly to someone with hands-on experience.

1. What are a few questions that you would ask an applicant with average and below stats?
2. Should personal statements address/provide a reason for average and below grades/MCAT score or should it only focus on the highlights of the individual's educational career?
3. After doing post-bacc. program with a GPA of 3.7+ and an above average MCAT score, how much weight might an admissions committee place on previous undergraduate coursework with a below average GPA?
3. What was your lifestyle like as a resident?

 

[disorder]

what's the current/future job outlook for all the sub-specialties of cardiology?
is it true that you can only find jobs in "undesirable" locations for cardiology?

 

[dessimay]

Thanks for taking the time to answer all these questions. I know this has been asked but my questions will be a little more lengthy. I understand this is just one person's opinion and answers will vary across the board but it'd be nice to get a general idea as I weigh my options.

1. Would it be favorable if an applicant had 3+ years of experience in emergency nursing and was interested in pursuing emergency medicine (open to other options though)?

I'm definitely going to pursue a higher level of education but after researching many curriculums I feel that medical school will provide a stronger foundation and more rigorous education than NP school would. Having that rigorous curriculum and extensive education is something I value because I want to choose the path that I believe will prepare me to be the best provider I can be.

2. Also, would it be a big red flag if most pre reqs were completed at a CC/State school one at time while working as a nurse (as well as volunteering or pursuing hobbies that I'm passionate about at the same time)?

3. Having already been in the healthcare field, how necessary would it be for me to have shadowing experience? I see what emergency physician's do on a daily basis, communicate and work with them, and also saw various other specialties and surgeries/procedures while in nursing school. Obviously I would need a LOR but I'd rather spend my time pursuing continuing education, hobbies, and/or community oriented tasks.

4. I graduated with a bachelors of science in nursing from a prestigious nursing school (their medical school is very well known in the southeast as well). I had a 3.9+ nursing gpa, before that a 3.3 gpa (same undergrad as the nursing school) with no clear passion for nursing, medicine or science yet, and before that a 3.4 at state school while playing baseball on a scholarship. Would being able to handle courses while having played ball or graduating from a well known bsn program possibly make up for having taken those pre reqs a little more spread out than I would've liked?

5. This one is just for fun. I'm curious what your general take on nursing school is like. Sometimes it gets bashed for having too much fluff and I partly agree. But I really think my school prepared me well for a professional healthcare career. I kind of look back at it as a mini medical school program. I think the school is to blame for my desire to pursue medical school. If we hadn't taken pharmacology/pathophysiology, other classes revolving around the common treatment/patho of diseases, and applied what we learned to clinical, I probably wouldn't be as passionate about the idea of medical school or NP school.

6. I'm kind of disappointed that all of my nursing classes fall under NRSG category rather than science categories. Obviously some of them rightly belong there but there are others like the Patho and Pharm that were strictly science based and I thrived in those. Do you just look at cumulative gpa and science gpa or once you reach a certain point in the application process would you go down the list/transcript and personally see those pharm and patho courses? I only ask this because while I seem to excel in classes related to healthcare and working in the hospital, I have struggled more with pure chemistry and physics. I understand physics when say it applies to the heart/lungs. But It'd be nice to know if you're able to see that ability to handle classes more related to healthcare rather than just pure physics or chemistry problems by looking at my whole transcript.

Thanks again for taking time out of your schedule to impart some knowledge on all us hopefuls!

 

[baksy]

Truly appreciate you sharing valuable insights with us - thank you.

How do you look at someone who took two years after undergrad to work as a management consultant? Do most medical admissions folks share this perspective?

I'm worried that some admissons folks may perceive this as a deviation from medicine or even a sell-out. I consciously made the decision to join the healthcare practice of a large consulting firm to learn more about the business and regulations side of healthcare before going to medical school to be a more informed physician.

Greatly appreciate your input!

 

[HeartDoc14]

What is your take - Do MCAT cut-offs exist?

Of course I can't speak for all schools. I don't think there are strict cut offs, but there is often a threshold below which admission is extremely difficult.

 

[HeartDoc14]

I know about some bias that exists for a graduating DO student to get into an MD residency, but what about someone who has completed a DO internal medicine residency and is looking to get into an MD cardiology fellowship? How difficult is this to do?

Easier. For the very competitive cardiology programs, completing a DO residency will pose a challenge, but again, I know a lot of DO's that have matched in cardiology fellowships and excelled.