Cardiology Salary?
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Sooo many variables, anywhere from 250k to high 6 figures.
Academic? Private? Hospital employed?
General noninvasive? Interventional?
Academic? Private? Hospital employed?
General noninvasive? Interventional?
Hello, pre-med here. I was wondering how common (or uncommon) are hospital employed cardiologists? I know everyone talks, for any specialty, academic vs. private, but I’m wondering just how easy (or hard) is a job as a hospital-employed cardiologist is to find. Thank you
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Hospital employed now very common. Overall market for general cardiologist is very good. Obviously there are still private groups out there but more and more private groups either joining together in large multi-specialty groups or being bought by hospital groups.
How’s the job market for rather rural locations (south east, Great Plains, our west etc or evening Midwest. Idagf where I live as long as not a big city
General rule of thumb For hospital employed in non major metro city (nyc, Chicago)
General: 500-700k (total package)
Interventional: 600-800
less for bigger cities and Cush set ups
more for rural areas where you’re production driven
1m plus still available (esp in Texas)
market for fellows is hotter than ever. You guys are the Targets #1 for hospital employees systems. You have zero baggage, use to being subordinate, and someone they can mold to their liking..
General: 500-700k (total package)
Interventional: 600-800
less for bigger cities and Cush set ups
more for rural areas where you’re production driven
1m plus still available (esp in Texas)
market for fellows is hotter than ever. You guys are the Targets #1 for hospital employees systems. You have zero baggage, use to being subordinate, and someone they can mold to their liking..
mind me asking where you got those numbers? I hear 300-400 more often, though from somewhat unreliable sources
Combo of reviewing multiple surveys, my own job search as well as talking in no to colleagues. Obviously there could be some regional bias but I don’t know of an IC who makes less than 500k. Only a few less 600k. I can’t imagine doing this job for less than 6.
I think you would have to have the cushiest gig in the country or be a total ***** to make less than 400k in today’s world. Otherwise save yourself the headache and be a hospitalist.
in my experience, incomes are a lot higher in the real world than people realize.. but geographic arbitrage also comes into play.
with that said The job/income/location— pick 2 of 3 usually rings true
I think you would have to have the cushiest gig in the country or be a total ***** to make less than 400k in today’s world. Otherwise save yourself the headache and be a hospitalist.
in my experience, incomes are a lot higher in the real world than people realize.. but geographic arbitrage also comes into play.
with that said The job/income/location— pick 2 of 3 usually rings true
agree with this. in my experience the surveys underestimate real non academic income, including medaxiom (which is the more accurate of the surveys). and there are still lucrative private groups out there who make >>90th percentile of whatever is listed on those surveys.
Depends on where you are. California?
General salaries only.
Kaiser 250-380k base. You get paid more at Norcal KPMG.
Sutter 350-400k base.
Stanford? don't know, but I hear it's low.
UC's. Depends on which. 150-250k base.
Private eat what you kill. Probably somewhere close to 500k.
General salaries only.
Kaiser 250-380k base. You get paid more at Norcal KPMG.
Sutter 350-400k base.
Stanford? don't know, but I hear it's low.
UC's. Depends on which. 150-250k base.
Private eat what you kill. Probably somewhere close to 500k.
is this for general or interventional?
Which area of the country is this? I haven’t seen these numbers as starting salaries from my recent search.
How are the salaries for Texas for interventional?
For non-academic jobs gen cards starting ~300-350k in large cities (including texas), interventional tack on another 50-100K. Very variable though. I've heard of 100k difference in the same city for similar job. I've heard of PP guys hustling making $1M+.
I mean are you including insurance, hospital parking, and moving costs, electricity you use or are we talking salary.
General.
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Medaxiom (a company of the American College of Cardiology) posts their compensation survey for free. Gives you a good idea of the market. (HINT. Market is very good for cardiology). Cardiology is going to be approx 500 graduates short per year to meat demand with short term demand being -7000 cardiologists per government estimates based on a large cohort of cardiologists ready to retire and baby boomers needing services (approx 1/3 of cardiologist are now 60+). Salary has gone up every year in the last 10 except 2012 and trend is not expected to stall due to the shortage. Most integrated (employed) cardiologists are tied to some percentile of blended survey data so don't hang your hat on any one. Our institution blends MGMA, AGMA, and Sullivan Cotter. Each have nuances.
Could you please breakdown the package, like what the base salary is, bonus etc
Also, any idea on the compensation package for peds cards?
No one has a clue
Potential Negatives:
Hospitals will use it as leverage. Docs will be skiddish and desperate since many lost a bunch in market. Older guys won’t retire And will tighten market to a degree. Concept of routine follow ups Will be questioned. More push for midlevels to take over general cardiology for cost control
Potential Positives:
This might break up hospital systems. They’ll always need STEMI coverage. Tele medicine might open up new markets, hospitalS may be driven to increase market share Because they’ll be desperate for revenue (push back to production over value based contracts)
Overall this will likely shake things up for the worse. How much? Who knows.
Potential Negatives:
Hospitals will use it as leverage. Docs will be skiddish and desperate since many lost a bunch in market. Older guys won’t retire And will tighten market to a degree. Concept of routine follow ups Will be questioned. More push for midlevels to take over general cardiology for cost control
Potential Positives:
This might break up hospital systems. They’ll always need STEMI coverage. Tele medicine might open up new markets, hospitalS may be driven to increase market share Because they’ll be desperate for revenue (push back to production over value based contracts)
Overall this will likely shake things up for the worse. How much? Who knows.
Huh? Why would hospital systems break up? If they go bankrupt, they will get bailed out by the government or be nationalized. It will certainly not go back to independent, small private hospitals like in the 90s.
So, if the hospital systems collapse, then we will be facing likely nationalized healthcare.
I don't think this happens. More likely scenario is that they will get bailed out, and systems will clamp down hard on physician salaries going forward.
I think the sooner one realizes that NOTHING will be the same as it was before the better.
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throwaway1000000
Full Member
Would have felt worse if the reimbursement cut only applied towards cardiology but it's is probably true for most high paying fields including ortho, derm etc
The reality is that doctors COULD have the most influence they've had ever after their role in this. Dr. Fauci has been the only one from federal government to state government that has shown any type of true and honest leadership. Doctors will get screwed over AGAIN financially after sacrificing their lives for government incompetence? If we were savvy like the nursing lobbies this is the time to organize and drive up the value of physicians.
Likely very complicated and hard to predict what will happen in the future in terms of salary/compensation. Telemedicine likely going to be a major addition to patient care.
One thing for sure though is the opinion and value of physicians, at least in the general public's view, has transformed for the better. Doctors are literally laying down their lives with this crisis and this is not lost on media and the general population. On that same note, the numerous reports of 'gag orders' on physicians and orders to continue to practice without PPE are placing hospital administrators in an equally poor light.
I agree that once this is over - things will, and should, dramatically change (hopefully) for the better.
One thing for sure though is the opinion and value of physicians, at least in the general public's view, has transformed for the better. Doctors are literally laying down their lives with this crisis and this is not lost on media and the general population. On that same note, the numerous reports of 'gag orders' on physicians and orders to continue to practice without PPE are placing hospital administrators in an equally poor light.
I agree that once this is over - things will, and should, dramatically change (hopefully) for the better.
I mean, sure. But not gonna happen. With the exception of a few, most doctors are too scared to even give their names when they get interviewed by the media.
This is what happens when you have a $700k mortgage, two car payments, student debt, and two kids in private school. You do whatever you can to maintain the comforts of your existence. Revolutions are never started by the well fed.
Look at how the public treated 9/11 first responders... forgotten within 6 months, and not even given free health care (until many years later) for all the health issues they suffered. You think just because a few companies are giving out free coffee and plastic shoes, and some people are posting nice things on Twitter that they will actually give a s*** about us after COVID is over?
When things get bad for main street (and they will be), they will not care what you did for them during the pandemic. They will vote for whatever the politicians hand them, and most likely it will not be in our favor.
Yes hospitals are going to be bailed out. But as admin is slow and scrambling Through this, this “potentially” creates an opportunity for others to garner market share. In my market there was a recent push with private equity funding ASCs and OBL (office based labs) as recent legislation has been more favorable for this.. This is due To (According to some) of CMS recognizing that they screwed up by empowering hospitals to take over private practice which has cost them a whole lot more money than anticipated. Now obviously there is going to be huge doubts on what PE there is out there...
With that said Chaos creates opportunity. How this will plays out no one knows but at the end of the day physicians are what generate revenue and the govt may continue to push towards opening things up for docs who are innovative
Now, with that said I’m not saying things will be better For docs financially but the climate prior to covid and the worsening trend of out-of-control hospitals and administrators was only getting worse and worse from a work environment and autonomy standpoint... this MAY shake things up for the better in that regard .. that said it might be a whole lot worse too.
With that said Chaos creates opportunity. How this will plays out no one knows but at the end of the day physicians are what generate revenue and the govt may continue to push towards opening things up for docs who are innovative
Now, with that said I’m not saying things will be better For docs financially but the climate prior to covid and the worsening trend of out-of-control hospitals and administrators was only getting worse and worse from a work environment and autonomy standpoint... this MAY shake things up for the better in that regard .. that said it might be a whole lot worse too.
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deleted980918
This applies to all specilties. Proceduralists like ortho, derm, GI, plastic... are essentially out of cases for the forseeable future as long as COVID is a still a thing and will be taking a hit from their RVUs.
throwaway1000000
Full Member
Maybe physicians will be able to own hospitals now...I wonder if the system can be more efficient if physicians run their own health centers
Don't really care about the pay. Would be happier working more autonomy in a less regulated market.
You're overlooking some direct market forces.
1) Cardiology, Ortho, and Oncology care service lines bankroll most hospital systems
2) The shortage of new cardiologists is real. AGMA reported in May that new hire cardiology compensation went up 14.38% from 2018 to 2019 alone! Cardiology pay the last 2 years has gone up roughly 3-4% per year depending on survey despite flat to slightly increased productivity (paying more per RVU). 25% of cardiologists are over 60 and 50% are over 50... Hospitals see this data too and know they need to stay ahead on the recruitment and retention curves
3) The Covid deficit has put even more pressure on hospital systems to turn on their money making engines again... you can't do that if you are understaffed in Cardiology...
My prediction, the low margin systems that were already struggling will struggle even more, perhaps consolidate or require bailouts, but the 3-4% margin hospitals will tighten their belts in areas that don't compromise their ability to milk high profitability services again. Physician salary market forces have never moved up or down in as chaotic a fashion as broader economic indexes in part due to the buffering of the legal statutes of Stark, fair market value, and commercially reasonable standards... heck, the delay on the survey data alone relative to many employed physician 2-5yr contract cycle lengths leads to a lot of salary reporting inertia and new contracts getting negotiated against that same stable backdrop of benchmarked salary data... You need several years of downward survey data to create momentum to drive down the employed reimbursement and the last few years have been nothing but increases.
1) Cardiology, Ortho, and Oncology care service lines bankroll most hospital systems
2) The shortage of new cardiologists is real. AGMA reported in May that new hire cardiology compensation went up 14.38% from 2018 to 2019 alone! Cardiology pay the last 2 years has gone up roughly 3-4% per year depending on survey despite flat to slightly increased productivity (paying more per RVU). 25% of cardiologists are over 60 and 50% are over 50... Hospitals see this data too and know they need to stay ahead on the recruitment and retention curves
3) The Covid deficit has put even more pressure on hospital systems to turn on their money making engines again... you can't do that if you are understaffed in Cardiology...
My prediction, the low margin systems that were already struggling will struggle even more, perhaps consolidate or require bailouts, but the 3-4% margin hospitals will tighten their belts in areas that don't compromise their ability to milk high profitability services again. Physician salary market forces have never moved up or down in as chaotic a fashion as broader economic indexes in part due to the buffering of the legal statutes of Stark, fair market value, and commercially reasonable standards... heck, the delay on the survey data alone relative to many employed physician 2-5yr contract cycle lengths leads to a lot of salary reporting inertia and new contracts getting negotiated against that same stable backdrop of benchmarked salary data... You need several years of downward survey data to create momentum to drive down the employed reimbursement and the last few years have been nothing but increases.
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deleted941485
Fast forward 2 months...yeah it didn’t.
Hospital systems got hit but the larger ones are out looking for a buy which indicates they weren’t too bad off from COVID
Major medical staffing companies toyed with bankruptcy and then were bought by other staffing companies. Reducing competition.
PP had a hard time getting relief funds and will probably sell out to who and whatever is willing to buy them at this point
Hospitals took relief funds and still cut salaries. Thank you for your service. My god the last thing I’d ever want to be in life is a hero.
700k? That’s super cheap.Multiply that by 2x-3x in a real city. But I hear ya.
Can you PM me the MGMA spreadsheet?
SMH. The thirsty people came out. Jk, ill PM.
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deleted980918
me too. Thank you! 🙂
Overall a very high-paying specialty.
Non-invasive = $350,000-$400,000/year
Invasive = $400,000-$500,000/year
Interventional = $600,000-$900,000/year
These are approximate estimates of the numbers I've seen for practicing cardiologists. You don't even need to subspecialize and you're income will still be in the higher earnings bracket of most specialties. High 6 figures are not unheard of for seasoned IC practitioners.
Non-invasive = $350,000-$400,000/year
Invasive = $400,000-$500,000/year
Interventional = $600,000-$900,000/year
These are approximate estimates of the numbers I've seen for practicing cardiologists. You don't even need to subspecialize and you're income will still be in the higher earnings bracket of most specialties. High 6 figures are not unheard of for seasoned IC practitioners.
I will like to know the diffence between invasive cards and interventional
can anyone explain
The difference is in the term itself.
Invasive you can enter the vasculature (RHC, LHC) but you do not intervene. You do not balloon, stent, TAVR, MitraClip, Watchman, PFO/ASD closure, etc.
EP Midwest
1st year in private practice- grad EP fellowship 2019
YTD gross salary $670K (RVU production based over guarantee, not including bonus which is 10-15% more) in 2020
This is despite a shortage of elective procedures for 2-3 mo due to COVID
Reasonably busy
Get home before 5 most days
Excellent work life balance
Cardiology is still pretty good in terms of money.
1st year in private practice- grad EP fellowship 2019
YTD gross salary $670K (RVU production based over guarantee, not including bonus which is 10-15% more) in 2020
This is despite a shortage of elective procedures for 2-3 mo due to COVID
Reasonably busy
Get home before 5 most days
Excellent work life balance
Cardiology is still pretty good in terms of money.
Is this a location in some remote flyover state or a mid sized city?
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Proceduralists are working normally. My friend is a GI doc. There was a short time he was in the er. But he's been back to scoping
mercadomd87
New Member
I am currently looking for IC jobs and thus far the salaries offered to me and my friends across the US have been around the 350-450k range (pre-negotiation), this is in desirable cities (Chicago, LA area, Orlando, Vegas, Houston etc). On the other hand I have other friends signing contracts for 500k+ in smaller cities or 700k in the middle of nowhere.
I know many IC attendings who just graduated and are making a base of 350k (medium-large cities).
600k+ salary in the city sounds amazing are those for IC physicians who have been out in practice for a few years now? maybe partners now?.
Regards and stay safe.
-Adrian
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deleted980918
Are those 350k salaries offered to you base or incl production bonus?
mercadomd87
New Member
Base salary only.
what type of jobs have you been encountering this year with those salaries? Employed positions at hospital or private practice?
