Career fair last Friday was abysmal.

[BuffaloPills]

Advertisement - Members don't see this ad

Attended a career fair last week on campus and the market is bleak, this was my experience.

All retail chains are hiring their interns who took scholarships, then interns who didn't, then the application pool. They have the upper hand. All retail chains were looking for shakers and movers, the motivated type. The DMs said they could care less if you've been with the company for 20 years...if your slow and not meeting their expectations they'll gladly bring a Type A new grad to take your much desired location in a highly saturated area. Kinda F'd up.

All hospital interviewers were looking for residency trained and couldn't emphasize enough the need for students to do them. When giving the scenario, " So consider I was fortunate to land a clinical position right out of school w/o residency, practice for 5 years in that position and apply against a new PGY1 grad.....who gets preference? The answer was residency grad no question.

I guess, I'm gonna apply for residency since PharmD,MS,MBA is clearly not enough to give me a comparable edge to PGY1 grads.

Clinical positions...ok I get it PGY1 certainly superior....but admin or staff positions?...that was an eye opener. When I asked how my MBA would weigh compared to residency, the answer was residency is preferred.

Though, retail DMs loved the MBA and asked me more questions about that than pharmacy. They said they want leaders and business oriented people. "We need good pharmacy managers, anybody can be a retail pharmacist, we need business oriented applicants"---retail HR.

Real life sucks

 

[Its Z]

nah...nonsense. we all know just getting a pharmd is enough for any type of pharmacist jobs out there. there are thousands of hospital clinical specialist and director positions waiting in line for those newly minted pharmds because they are highly trained and ready to lead and change the healthcare..especially with all those retiring boomers. retail? i heard they cant get enough pharmacists right now.

 

[owlegrad]

nah...nonsense. we all know just getting a pharmd is enough for any type of pharmacist jobs out there. there are thousands of hospital clinical specialist and director positions waiting in line for those newly minted pharmds because they are highly trained and ready to lead and change the healthcare..especially with all those retiring boomers. retail? i heard they cant get enough pharmacists right now.

You are really on a roll, Z.

 

[BMBiology]

Wait a minute, does this mean i won't get a BMW as a signing bonus?

 

[BuffaloPills]

nah...nonsense. we all know just getting a pharmd is enough for any type of pharmacist jobs out there. there are thousands of hospital clinical specialist and director positions waiting in line for those newly minted pharmds because they are highly trained and ready to lead and change the healthcare..especially with all those retiring boomers. retail? i heard they cant get enough pharmacists right now.

Dude, Z...I cant tell if your sarcastic or not...I used to read your posts for enlightenment...but lately, you've taken a weird turn

 

[BMBiology]

Z is just being mean. He's just being himself.

 

[Old]

Dude, Z...I cant tell if your sarcastic or not...I used to read your posts for enlightenment...but lately, you've taken a weird turn

Just a bit of sarcasm. Anyone who has been a pharmacist has been saying about their treatment at retail and the glut of pharms out there. Coupling that with all the students saying about working hard, networking and getting good grades will make all the difference in getting that 100k job and how there are a ton of jobs with the baby boomers getting older etc etc etc. Probably just saying" we told you so".Going to get much worse. I have no idea where all these new grads are going to work.

 

[Its Z]

Just a bit of sarcasm. Anyone who has been a pharmacist has been saying about their treatment at retail and the glut of pharms out there. Coupling that with all the students saying about working hard, networking and getting good grades will make all the difference in getting that 100k job and how there are a ton of jobs with the baby boomers getting older etc etc etc. Probably just saying" we told you so".Going to get much worse. I have no idea where all these new grads are going to work.

Head, nail, hammer.. y'know. The Saying.

 

[BuffaloPills]

then get new material...you keep saying the same thing over and over again when anyone posts something related to the current job market...granted one could argue im posting the same thing as others, even so...we're all aware of the current market...im just letting people know 1st hand what i experienced as a P4 to help other students be more informed

 

[Its Z]

then get new material...you keep saying the same thing over and over again when anyone posts something related to the current job market...granted one could argue im posting the same thing as others, even so...we're all aware of the current market...im just letting people know 1st hand what i experienced as a P4 to help other students be more informed

So you post what I've been saying for the past some years... nothing new. Yet you expect me to get new material. Get real.

When you have something new that we know nothing about, then come back and post.

 

[Its Z]

Dude, Z...I cant tell if your sarcastic or not...I used to read your posts for enlightenment...but lately, you've taken a weird turn

Not at all. I've been consistently this way ever since.

 

[BuffaloPills]

Sorry, i must have missed it, my fault.

 

[streetpreacher]

Attended a career fair last week on campus and the market is bleak, this was my experience.

I surely hope this didn't come as a shock to you if you have read these forums much.

 

[BetseyJohnson]

While we're on the topic, how important are job fairs to securing employment? I know for a lot of positions, one needs to already have a PharmD degree to even apply. When should P4s really begin to worry about their lack of job offers?

 

[BuffaloPills]

I surely hope this didn't come as a shock to you if you have read these forums much.

Nah, not a shock at all. I was well aware thanks to this forum, prolly more so than a good percentage of my classmates......just my first dose of reality in 4 years.

I'll be fine, im not worried...just need to adapt and not waist effort/time complaining.

 

[Its Z]

While we're on the topic, how important are job fairs to securing employment? I know for a lot of positions, one needs to already have a PharmD degree to even apply. When should P4s really begin to worry about their lack of job offers?

where have you worked as an intern or tech and do you have a job now?

 

[benjee]

What if somebody with both RPH/MD,completed primary care medical residency only , board certified , now want to work as a rph ?since the pay of rph is higher than being a primary care MD ,plus much less of liability concern. would any of those employers hire these people?

 

[Its Z]

What if somebody with both RPH/MD,completed primary care medical residency only , board certified , now want to work as a rph ?since the pay of rph is higher than being a primary care MD ,plus much less of liability concern. would any of those employers hire these people?

Wow...

 

[MountainPharmD]

Though, retail DMs loved the MBA and asked me more questions about that than pharmacy. They said they want leaders and business oriented people. "We need good pharmacy managers, anybody can be a retail pharmacist, we need business oriented applicants"---retail HR.

Real life sucks

Translation:

We want people who will fill as many prescriptions as they can as fast as possible without getting distracted by little things like patient counseling, drug interactions or any other task related to the actual practice of pharmacy.

 

[rph3664]

What if somebody with both RPH/MD,completed primary care medical residency only , board certified , now want to work as a rph ?since the pay of rph is higher than being a primary care MD ,plus much less of liability concern. would any of those employers hire these people?

When you take into account all the hours MD/DOs spend working outside regular office hours, chances are a pharmacist does have a higher hourly salary. OTOH, there might be more to the story. I once met a physician who also had a pharmacy degree (although he had long ago let that license lapse) who took a leave of absence from his residency when his father, who was also a pharmacist who had his own store, died suddenly. He did this to keep the store open until they could find a buyer.

One of our local Wal-Mart pharmacists is also a lawyer, so they better not pull any funny stuff with him! In the fall semester of his L-3 year, it occurred to him that the things people say about lawyers had a lot of basis in truth, but he did go ahead and finish law school, and took the bar exam. He's never practiced law either, at least not formally.

 

[lorain]

thanks for the heads up, i would agree with that assessment

Im finishing up my mba, and it really doesnt help much until i get a residency completed (i already knew this b4 i started my studies again)...thru a contact, i got a job offer from a pharma company, but it wasnt what I wanted to do

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

What if somebody with both RPH/MD,completed primary care medical residency only , board certified , now want to work as a rph ?since the pay of rph is higher than being a primary care MD ,plus much less of liability concern. would any of those employers hire these people?

Unless you fine people make much more than I think you do, this isn't true - at least in my area.

 

[capaxone]

You have to understand the job market today is very very different from 5 yrs ago. Overall, the supply is > the demand, thus I am not surprised to see this stinky job market. Also, with more than 120 pharmacy colleges (which we should probably need 80 colleges only!!!) pumping out new grads crazily like today, there will be unemployed pharmacists, and a lot of them in 2-3 more years.

 

[Its Z]

Unless you fine people make much more than I think you do, this isn't true - at least in my area.

That's what I say...let's fine them heavy penalties and taxes!

 

[fullmetalphrm]

You have to understand the job market today is very very different from 5 yrs ago. Overall, the supply is > the demand, thus I am not surprised to see this stinky job market. Also, with more than 120 pharmacy colleges (which we should probably need 80 colleges only!!!) pumping out new grads crazily like today, there will be unemployed pharmacists, and a lot of them in 2-3 more years.

After skimming the 'sky is falling' thread, does this mean that one who really applies themselves during pharmacy school and complete a year or two of residencies will not be able to find a job, or does it mean that you are just not guaranteed a job unless you find a way to stand out from the other PharmDs out there?

 

[Its Z]

After skimming the 'sky is falling' thread, does this mean that one who really applies themselves during pharmacy school and complete a year or two of residencies will not be able to find a job, or does it mean that you are just not guaranteed a job unless you find a way to stand out from the other PharmDs out there?

For a job that's worthwhile at least.

 

[MountainPharmD]

Unless you fine people make much more than I think you do, this isn't true - at least in my area.

I think they were refering to net pay. After a primary care doc's expenses such as office rent and bills, office staff, malpractice insurance ect. the take home pay is very close to a retail pharmacists pay. I do not think there are many primary care doc's that are pulling in net pay of over 150k a year. Hence the whole primary care doctor shortage debate because the pay is so much lower than a specialist.

 

[benjee]

Unless you fine people make much more than I think you do, this isn't true - at least in my area.

It's all true in my area, northeast coast. I am talking about this year salaries of both rph working a a retailed chain and a BC pediatrician in outpt setting .A friend of mine was telling me her salary of a rph while complaining the workload unless she lied to me. Then an ex-colleague of mine was telling me her salary while asking me what I'm making even we work in different department, after she heard about it ,she quit and work in different state. I don't think she needed to lie to me her salary. yeah, the rph's salary is higher than that of a BC pediatrician by 2 dollars/hr !! this dose not include the dues needed to be paid by the MD.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

It's all true in my area, northeast coast. I am talking about this year salaries of both rph working a a retailed chain and a BC pediatrician in outpt setting .A friend of mine was telling me her salary of a rph while complaining the workload unless she lied to me. Then an ex-colleague of mine was telling me her salary while asking me what I'm making even we work in different department, after she heard about it ,she quit and work in different state. I don't think she needed to lie to me her salary. yeah, the rph's salary is higher than that of a BC pediatrician by 2 dollars/hr !! this dose not include the dues needed to be paid by the MD.

Ah ha, there's your problem. Pediatricians are the worst paid doctors in all of medicine.

Also, what dues? Most offices I've worked in will pay licensing fees before even calculating gross pay.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

I think they were refering to net pay. After a primary care doc's expenses such as office rent and bills, office staff, malpractice insurance ect. the take home pay is very close to a retail pharmacists pay. I do not think there are many primary care doc's that are pulling in net pay of over 150k a year. Hence the whole primary care doctor shortage debate because the pay is so much lower than a specialist.

Guess it depends on which primary care we're talking, I'm going with FP since that's where the primary care focus is these days.

Gross take home for FPs in SC is 150k, which includes part timers as well. For full time FPs who've been in practice 5 years and over, the average is closer to 175k gross. Since gross pay is only subject to taxes and the like, and a pharmacist's pay is subject to those same deductions, the numbers should get closer together but not incredibly so.

 

[Its Z]

Don't turn this thread into "who makes more" pissing match you dummies.

Back on track.

Pharmacy job market sucks at the moment.

Now carry on!

 

[ispeshaled]

Don't turn this thread into "who makes more" pissing match you dummies.

Back on track.

Pharmacy job market sucks at the moment.

Now carry on!

What advice do you have for those who, despite the market suckiness, are just starting out and still want to pursue a career in this profession?

Pray to Allah, Buddha, Jesus that the market will turn around in 2015??

I think I'll start praying now

 

[charfdorn]

What advice do you have for those who, despite the market suckiness, are just starting out and still want to pursue a career in this profession?

Pray to Allah, Buddha, Jesus that the market will turn around in 2015??

I think I'll start praying now

Make yourself a competitive candidate. Get good grades, join student organizations, and work as an intern. Pharmacy students can be so clueless about how the real world works.

 

[willrocks]

Don't turn this thread into "who makes more" pissing match you dummies.

Back on track.

Pharmacy job market sucks at the moment.

Now carry on!

Is it simply beyond you not be a prick to anonymous students looking for help on...a student message board? I am genuinely curious: is how you get your rocks off, or do you just lack anything better to do with your free time?

 

[willrocks]

"It's Z"- Let's assume you are just genuinely dense and think that your comments are productive to various job market threads. Notice that any time somebody posts regarding the market, users like yourself jump in and start spewing negative, one-sided input. The conversation quickly deteriorates, the original user has lost interest, and other users who may have something useful to contribute can't be bothered. Some people do come here looking for advice. They would be better off if your internet connection was down.

 

[owlegrad]

Make yourself a competitive candidate. Get good grades, join student organizations, and work as an intern. Pharmacy students can be so clueless about how the real world works.

I would argue that only the last one will help you find employment. The first is good for residencies. The second is helpful for networking and such, but is a little overrated in my opinion.

For employment: work>>org>grades.

For residencies: grades>org>>work

 

[Its Z]

Is it simply beyond you not be a prick to anonymous students looking for help on...a student message board? I am genuinely curious: is how you get your rocks off, or do you just lack anything better to do with your free time?

i will have a great response for you when i get back from interviewing pharmacists.

 

[MountainPharmD]

Don't turn this thread into "who makes more" pissing match you dummies.

Back on track.

Pharmacy job market sucks at the moment.

Now carry on!

Listen here thread jack king. I will jack this thread in any direction I want and you will like it!

Now YOU carry on!

 

[MountainPharmD]

i will have a great response for you when i get back from interviewing pharmacists.

What are you interviewing pharmacists for?

 

[rph3664]

Make yourself a competitive candidate. Get good grades, join student organizations, and work as an intern. Pharmacy students can be so clueless about how the real world works.

Human resource departments are even more clueless about how the real world works. Try being a B.Sc.Pharm. with 15 years of experience and see how easy it is to get a job.

 

[Its Z]

What are you interviewing pharmacists for?

to wax and buff my RV.

nah...staff position down south.

 

[Its Z]

What advice do you have for those who, despite the market suckiness, are just starting out and still want to pursue a career in this profession?

Pray to Allah, Buddha, Jesus that the market will turn around in 2015??

I think I'll start praying now

pharmd then PGY 1&2 and mba or mha

 

[charfdorn]

I would argue that only the last one will help you find employment. The first is good for residencies. The second is helpful for networking and such, but is a little overrated in my opinion.

For employment: work>>org>grades.

For residencies: grades>org>>work

I agree 100%.

 

[joetrisman]

pharmd then PGY 1&2 and mba or mha

I'm starting to get the notion that going back and getting a PhD in micro/immuno and teaching at a pharm school (or other school) might be a better plan than trying to do something with my pharm D. The healthcare reform along with diploma mills might kill jobs and salaries in the long run but I don't think anything will ever kill the education industry.

 

[Its Z]

i just heard a segment on npr this morning about layoffs in universities...of course alot of that was in liberal arts.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

i will have a great response for you when i get back from interviewing pharmacists.

Got anything I can do yet?

 

[Its Z]

Got anything I can do yet?

its rough out here. u licensed in ca?

 

[WVUPharm2007]

its rough out here. u licensed in ca?

You just have to open **** up in the state where they can't just do the MPJE like everyone else, huh?

I tapped my expenses getting that TX license.

I've recently gotten more aggressive in my job hunting. Calls, recalls, thank you for the phone interview emails...it doesn't seem to help.

I'm about to call the Indian Health Service. **** it.

 

[MountainPharmD]

You just have to open **** up in the state where they can't just do the MPJE like everyone else, huh?

I tapped my expenses getting that TX license.

I've recently gotten more aggressive in my job hunting. Calls, recalls, thank you for the phone interview emails...it doesn't seem to help.

I'm about to call the Indian Health Service. **** it.

Join the military. Hell being in the Airforce is almost like being a civillian. You would probably forget you were in the military after a few months. They would pay for you to do a residency aslo.

 

[charfdorn]

I'm starting to get the notion that going back and getting a PhD in micro/immuno and teaching at a pharm school (or other school) might be a better plan than trying to do something with my pharm D. The healthcare reform along with diploma mills might kill jobs and salaries in the long run but I don't think anything will ever kill the education industry.

Really? You think healthcare reform is going to kill pharmacy jobs?