Career path in Optometry

[xenomblack]

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Hey guys,
with my understanding, after graduation from an optometry school,
you'll be most likely to have a stuck income (around 100 grand a year)

In terms of developing your career to have better income,
is optometry good?

For example, dentists can go into orthodontics, or oral & Maxillofacial surgery
to make more money and specialize.

 

[r_salis]

If you start your own practice (owning the dispensary, hiring ODs to work for you, opening multiple locations, etc.), the sky's the limit in terms of your income.

 

[smith351]

Hey guys,
with my understanding, after graduation from an optometry school,
you'll be most likely to have a stuck income (around 100 grand a year)

In terms of developing your career to have better income,
is optometry good?

For example, dentists can go into orthodontics, or oral & Maxillofacial surgery
to make more money and specialize.

$100,000/year sounds great to me. I'd be perfectly happy with that. I'm going to practice in the military and the pay starts at ~$51,000, but I'm not complaining because I'm not doing it for the money. As far as developing your career, you might want to look into academia or working in a group practice with other OD's and DO's. 🙂

 

[JeffChou]

What types of jobs are available after graduation also? I'm sure that there isn't so much variation since most students will become optometrists for a company or go into a partnership. There's also education and research.

What I'm trying to get is a very broad view of the things someone can do after getting their O.D. Consulting (or something similar?), research, what else?

I'm sure that if I get an OD I'd just be an optometrist but I'm just trying to survey the field of opportunities.

Thanks a bunch. 👍

 

[POJO]

What types of jobs are available after graduation also? I'm sure that there isn't so much variation since most students will become optometrists for a company or go into a partnership. There's also education and research.

What I'm trying to get is a very broad view of the things someone can do after getting their O.D. Consulting (or something similar?), research, what else?

If you're interested in consulting in industry, I would recommend that you concentrate as much as possible on corneal physiology and contact lens science or optics. It is the contact lens and ophthalmic lens companies who are the big players in ophthalmic industry and are bigger employers of optometrists now than the drug companies.

 

[swiftiii]

Ha, I can only wish for $100K a year. I talked to my doc today (a recent grad) who said many of his classmates are still looking for work. I don't what the true reality of it all is, but many newbies are "forced" to work at Wal-Mart and other corporates to pay off student loans. Sure, the money is eventually in private practice, but it is hard to produce one if you have to take on so much debt during school.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics the best place to make money is in a physician's office ($124K in 2004), but those positions are extremely hard to come by when you are just starting out. Specializations will definitely help you out, but those usually require residencies, which only pay approx. $25K. In the long run, it may be worth it though. As to what you can specialize in, that is what I am going to school to find out 🙂

 

[hoosier1]

That sounds a bit inflated... The average salary should be around 80,000! 🙁

 

[blazenmadison]

That sounds a bit inflated... The average salary should be around 80,000! 🙁

according to the 2005 American Optometric Association Economic Survey, the average net income for optometrists in 2005 was $148,923.

they probably surveyed the top 10% of optometrists.

 

[catzeye523]

according to the 2005 American Optometric Association Economic Survey, the average net income for optometrists in 2005 was $148,923.

they probably surveyed the top 10% of optometrists.

Sound like it. The optometrist I shadowed was telling me how you can only hit the 6 figure mark if you're in a private practice, or if you see that many patients as an independent O.D. But if you're stuck in a corporation like Lens Crafters, you will just start at around $65,000. That's what she says...I've been seeing so many different averages everywhere that I really don't know what to think.

The handout of the top 20 highest paid jobs that was given at ICO also showed that the average pay of optometrists was over $100,000, but I get the feeling they did that just to advertise the profession very well.

I guess we'll never know how much we will get paid until we're out of optometry school and on the job!

 

[aarlan]

I don't what the true reality of it all is, but many newbies are "forced" to work at Wal-Mart and other corporates to pay off student loans. Sure, the money is eventually in private practice, but it is hard to produce one if you have to take on so much debt during school.

This is the new model we will be facing, and as students we need to be painfully aware of it. Many new grads flock towards the chain stores (WalMart is just one example) for the perceived wage stability they provide. The problem is that as more ODs turn to this type of practice (with poor hours, and the fact that you are 'forced' to take every lousy insurance under the sun), the consequences will be twofold...1)more people will view optometry and related eyecare services as just another thing they can get done at a superstore(just like getting a haircut or getting your photos developed), which is slowly cheapening the profession (IMHO), and 2) as private practices slowly vanish and corporate interests continue to dictate what services you provide and limit how much you can make, the prevailing wage that ODs make will drop. Most of the input that I hear is that private practice is too hard to break into, or that we need to make $100K+ right out of school. The fact is that if we all swarm to the big boxes with the idea that in 5 or 10 years we will switch back into a private practice, we may not have any more opportunities to do so.
I have heard of more than my fair share of folks intending on going corporate for a short temporary stint, and end up stuck.
My hope is that more ODs will shun the corporate route and work with or open a private practice. Is it more work and headaches...absolutely. Is it less money for the first 5-10 years...absolutely. Is it healthier for our profession and our long term outlook...I believe so.

Just my .02

AA

 

[catzeye523]

This is the new model we will be facing, and as students we need to be painfully aware of it. Many new grads flock towards the chain stores (WalMart is just one example) for the perceived wage stability they provide. The problem is that as more ODs turn to this type of practice (with poor hours, and the fact that you are 'forced' to take every lousy insurance under the sun), the consequences will be twofold...1)more people will view optometry and related eyecare services as just another thing they can get done at a superstore(just like getting a haircut or getting your photos developed), which is slowly cheapening the profession (IMHO), and 2) as private practices slowly vanish and corporate interests continue to dictate what services you provide and limit how much you can make, the prevailing wage that ODs make will drop. Most of the input that I hear is that private practice is too hard to break into, or that we need to make $100K+ right out of school. The fact is that if we all swarm to the big boxes with the idea that in 5 or 10 years we will switch back into a private practice, we may not have any more opportunities to do so.
I have heard of more than my fair share of folks intending on going corporate for a short temporary stint, and end up stuck.
My hope is that more ODs will shun the corporate route and work with or open a private practice. Is it more work and headaches...absolutely. Is it less money for the first 5-10 years...absolutely. Is it healthier for our profession and our long term outlook...I believe so.

Just my .02

AA

I agree with you, but at the same time, with well over $200,000 in debt right out of optometry school, who can really produce the money to buy into a private practice? I'm afraid I wouldn't have the balls to do it like most people, and may end up having to work at one of those chain stores just to get myself out of debt first. A lot of people out there want to have that stability, even if they have to sacrifice working those crappy hours. But then of course, there are others who are lucky enough to find an already existing private practice instead of having to start from scratch.

I totally agree with you on the point you made about the chain stores that cheapen the profession. It sucks how optometrists are doctors too, but they are not making nearly as much as dentists, medical doctors, or even pharmicists. And when I say that, I mean to compare the overall average salaries.

I don't mean to sound greedy just talking about money, because I am interested in optometry, and this is what I want to do. I just feel that the amount of respect and salary differences between this profession and the others I mentioned are unfair.

 

[KHE]

I agree with you, but at the same time, with well over $200,000 in debt right out of optometry school, who can really produce the money to buy into a private practice? I'm afraid I wouldn't have the balls to do it like most people, and may end up having to work at one of those chain stores just to get myself out of debt first. A lot of people out there want to have that stability, even if they have to sacrifice working those crappy hours. But then of course, there are others who are lucky enough to find an already existing private practice instead of having to start from scratch.

I totally agree with you on the point you made about the chain stores that cheapen the profession. It sucks how optometrists are doctors too, but they are not making nearly as much as dentists, medical doctors, or even pharmicists. And when I say that, I mean to compare the overall average salaries.

I don't mean to sound greedy just talking about money, because I am interested in optometry, and this is what I want to do. I just feel that the amount of respect and salary differences between this profession and the others I mentioned are unfair.

Life is unfair. Ain't nothing you can do about it.

If you really really want to work in a private practice, you need to start your research not months, but years before you graduate from school.

The danger of thinking "I'll work commercial to pay down debt since private offices don't pay as much" is that after 4 or 5 years working in a commercial office, the private offices are still going to be paying crap. And by then you may have a spouse, house, car, child etc. etc. and may get trapped in the commercial cycle.

If you really feel that your only bet is to work commercial, do it with the goal of opening a practice cold in a few years, not of switching to employment in a private practice because you will not likely find a private office that can come close to matching your commercial salary.

 

[aarlan]

Life is unfair. Ain't nothing you can do about it.

If you really really want to work in a private practice, you need to start your research not months, but years before you graduate from school.

Exactly right.
Many newly minted ODs I know came out of school waiting for success to whack them upside the head...then were disappointed when it didn't. You need a long time of planning, negotiating, learning etc. before you go into a private practice.

The danger of thinking "I'll work commercial to pay down debt since private offices don't pay as much" is that after 4 or 5 years working in a commercial office, the private offices are still going to be paying crap. And by then you may have a spouse, house, car, child etc. etc. and may get trapped in the commercial cycle.

If you really feel that your only bet is to work commercial, do it with the goal of opening a practice cold in a few years, not of switching to employment in a private practice because you will not likely find a private office that can come close to matching your commercial salary.

I do have a question for you KHM...there is a difference between the marketing needs and the focus of a commercial vs private. Do you think that 4-5 years in corporate is adequate to prepare someonve for a private office? I would submit that cutting your teeth in a private atmosphere for a time period would acclamate you to the different pace and different focus that a private practice requires (either during or after the corporate stint).
I also would caution against going corporate at all, since it can be a morass that is difficult to extricate yourself from once you are sucked in.

AA

 

[xmattODx]

Exactly right.
Do you think that 4-5 years in corporate is adequate to prepare someonve for a private office? I would submit that cutting your teeth in a private atmosphere for a time period would acclamate you to the different pace and different focus that a private practice requires (either during or after the corporate stint).
I also would caution against going corporate at all, since it can be a morass that is difficult to extricate yourself from once you are sucked in.
AA

I'm not KHE but I wouldn't say that commercial/corporate practice is useful as a preparatory tool for private practice unless you plan on running a commercial style private practice. That is in commercial work you generally refract and refer as the bottom line is seeing as many patients as possible to generate revenue on low paying exams. You will forget a tonne in commercial practice. You will forget disease, you will forget binocular vision, you will forget peds. etc. The less time you spend in commercial the more successful your transitiion to private will be. Note: I am not belittling commercial practitioners, I am one.

 

[catzeye523]

everyone makes a great point...I definitely have a lot of thinking and planning to do within the next 4 years.

 

[ny_grl]

Sound like it. The optometrist I shadowed was telling me how you can only hit the 6 figure mark if you're in a private practice, or if you see that many patients as an independent O.D. But if you're stuck in a corporation like Lens Crafters, you will just start at around $65,000. That's what she says...I've been seeing so many different averages everywhere that I really don't know what to think.

The handout of the top 20 highest paid jobs that was given at ICO also showed that the average pay of optometrists was over $100,000, but I get the feeling they did that just to advertise the profession very well.

I guess we'll never know how much we will get paid until we're out of optometry school and on the job!

Most of the O.D's I have worked (those employed by other O.D's) with in New York get paid $400/day
Commission and stuff is extra

I heard from an O.D. that commercial facilities actually pay you more, but the scope of doing a variety of things; disease management, dilation, VT, and other challenging things is a lot more in a private practice, but they pay less than commercial practices.

 

[swiftiii]

I'm not KHE but I wouldn't say that commercial/corporate practice is useful as a preparatory tool for private practice unless you plan on running a commercial style private practice. That is in commercial work you generally refract and refer as the bottom line is seeing as many patients as possible to generate revenue on low paying exams. You will forget a tonne in commercial practice. You will forget disease, you will forget binocular vision, you will forget peds. etc. The less time you spend in commercial the more successful your transitiion to private will be. Note: I am not belittling commercial practitioners, I am one.

That is truly a good thing to hear. The big boxes will never fully take over, because they will never offer the quality of care that an independent optometrist would. Your points show that the only point of working corporate is to make some money, not gain experience (unless you are only looking for that narrow type of experience), which I see equally as necessary for new graduate.

BTW I have included a link to what I would think is a more likely breakdown for salaries in the profession.
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes291041.htm

 

[KHE]

Exactly right.
Many newly minted ODs I know came out of school waiting for success to whack them upside the head...then were disappointed when it didn't. You need a long time of planning, negotiating, learning etc. before you go into a private practice.



I do have a question for you KHM...there is a difference between the marketing needs and the focus of a commercial vs private. Do you think that 4-5 years in corporate is adequate to prepare someonve for a private office? I would submit that cutting your teeth in a private atmosphere for a time period would acclamate you to the different pace and different focus that a private practice requires (either during or after the corporate stint).
I also would caution against going corporate at all, since it can be a morass that is difficult to extricate yourself from once you are sucked in.

AA

The only skills you will improve on while working commercial is your ability to work quickly and your ability to deal with beligerant people. Commercial practice will prepare you very little for private practice but there is nothing about working in a private office that you won't pick up in just a few short weeks. (proper billing and coding and things like that)

I am not a fan of commercial practice, but I think it fills a need. There are many ODs out there who do not have the desire to own or run a business. My wife is one of them. She works for an HMO. Why should she work as an independent contractor for some private practice OD and get paid $60k per year when she can make $95k working 35 hours a week for the HMO, get a generous benefit package and not worry about the administrative headaches?

 

[TarzanBoy]

$100,000/year sounds great to me. I'd be perfectly happy with that. I'm going to practice in the military and the pay starts at ~$51,000, but I'm not complaining because I'm not doing it for the money. As far as developing your career, you might want to look into academia or working in a group practice with other OD's and DO's. 🙂

Is the military providing free housing, food and medical?

 

[ProZackMI]

. . . It sucks how optometrists are doctors too, but they are not making nearly as much as dentists, medical doctors, or even pharmicists. And when I say that, I mean to compare the overall average salaries.

I don't mean to sound greedy just talking about money, because I am interested in optometry, and this is what I want to do. I just feel that the amount of respect and salary differences between this profession and the others I mentioned are unfair.

Waaaahhh, mommy, he has more cookies than me! Waaaahhh, daddy, her X is better than my X!

Life isn't fair, is it? Lots of folks have advanced degrees but make **** money. The question is, what are you going to do about it? If you work hard, you can make a good income and have a balanced life doing what you enjoy. Ultimately, there are a multitude of factors that will contribute to your overall financial success (e.g., your skill, your personality, your ambition, your geographic location, your competition, your work ethic, the type of practice you have, the type of patients/clients you treat, etc.). You have find the right formula for success.

Some people are happy with their careers, but don't make a ton of money. Others make heaps of money, but aren't happy with their careers. I know this doesn't help you, but don't worry about how much dentists and PharmDs make, worry about yourself and what you can bring to the table. It's never a good idea to compare yourselves to others, especially in terms of income.

 

[Ryan_eyeball]

Waaaahhh, mommy, he has more cookies than me! Waaaahhh, daddy, her X is better than my X!

Life isn't fair, is it? Lots of folks have advanced degrees but make **** money. The question is, what are you going to do about it? If you work hard, you can make a good income and have a balanced life doing what you enjoy. Ultimately, there are a multitude of factors that will contribute to your overall financial success (e.g., your skill, your personality, your ambition, your geographic location, your competition, your work ethic, the type of practice you have, the type of patients/clients you treat, etc.). You have find the right formula for success.

Some people are happy with their careers, but don't make a ton of money. Others make heaps of money, but aren't happy with their careers. I know this doesn't help you, but don't worry about how much dentists and PharmDs make, worry about yourself and what you can bring to the table. It's never a good idea to compare yourselves to others, especially in terms of income.

Very well said ProzackMI

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

What types of jobs are available after graduation also? I'm sure that there isn't so much variation since most students will become optometrists for a company or go into a partnership. There's also education and research.

What I'm trying to get is a very broad view of the things someone can do after getting their O.D. Consulting (or something similar?), research, what else?

I'm sure that if I get an OD I'd just be an optometrist but I'm just trying to survey the field of opportunities.

Thanks a bunch. 👍

AFTER A MEETING WITH 120 OD'S MOST WORK AT WALMART/COSTCO/LENSCRAFTERS ONLY 5 HAD THERE OWN OFFICE. OTHERS WHERE EMPLOYED BY CORPORATE, OD'S , MD'S

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

The Problem Is Ods Are Afraid To Open There Own Practices. I Can't Believe How Few People Are Self Employed . When I Was In School 80% Wanted There Own Office,i Just Found Out It's About 7% Of My Class.

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

That is truly a good thing to hear. The big boxes will never fully take over, because they will never offer the quality of care that an independent optometrist would. Your points show that the only point of working corporate is to make some money, not gain experience (unless you are only looking for that narrow type of experience), which I see equally as necessary for new graduate.

BTW I have included a link to what I would think is a more likely breakdown for salaries in the profession.
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes291041.htm

BUT THERE WON'T BE ANY INDEPENDENT ODS IF EVRYONE IS WORKING AT WALMART AND IF THEY DON'T OPEN THERE OWN OFFICES

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

The only skills you will improve on while working commercial is your ability to work quickly and your ability to deal with beligerant people. Commercial practice will prepare you very little for private practice but there is nothing about working in a private office that you won't pick up in just a few short weeks. (proper billing and coding and things like that)

I am not a fan of commercial practice, but I think it fills a need. There are many ODs out there who do not have the desire to own or run a business. My wife is one of them. She works for an HMO. Why should she work as an independent contractor for some private practice OD and get paid $60k per year when she can make $95k working 35 hours a week for the HMO, get a generous benefit package and not worry about the administrative headaches?

I PAY 100,000 PLUS BENIFITS