Career switch from software engineering to medicine

[texanaustin]

Hello everyone,

I am in my early 30s and am trying to go from software engineering to medicine/dental.

Little bit about me..

1. Undergrad and graduate school in computer science and mathematics from Ivy league school. (don’t meet any med or dental school prerequisite), ~3.5 GPA
2. No debt, own a house, current annual income ~230k in Austin, TX (but who knows what’s gonna happen?), savings around 300k.
3. Am married, but have no kids.
4. Not a US citizen but recently received a green card. Whole CS and engineering track was mainly due to this.
5. A couple of years working as a medic in the army.. I really liked what I did even though the pay was awful.

I did some googling and it seems like I have two options here.

1. Post Bacc
2. Take courses from community college or 4 years university.

I want to prepare for MCAT/DAT & prerequisites while working full time, but schools in TX seem to all require full time enrollment and are very far away from me. So I can’t go with option 1.

So my question is,

1. Am I too old/late to start?
2. Do medical or dental schools value courses taken from CC?
3. How about online degrees?

Thank you!

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[bomba]

Money isn't everything, but the opportunity cost associated with making this career change would be significant. If we assume a static salary of $230k, over four years of medical school and 3-5 years of residency you're looking at an opportunity cost in excess of $1.5 million. That's just assuming your current salary and doesn't factor raises or lost investment potential. If I was in your shoes, I'd stick with CS and find deeper meaning through volunteering.

Some important information you left out is why medicine and why now? I think that will help others give you an honest assessment/guidance.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Yeah, thank you for your service as a medic. Was it with the US military?

Do some significant shadowing in civilian health care in the US before committing. You have to know this is worth the journey.

 

[BritainKittenMittens]

Too old in what respect? You'll be around mid 30's when you get accepted assuming you start now. I've seen it done before, and I definitely think you can get into an MD/DO school, especially because you have TX residency (I'm assuming, I don't know what the qualifications are). TX schools have a huge bias for their residents.

Whether it's worth it is up to you. As someone mentioned, it's gonna be over a mill down the drain (if not more), and it's a **** ton of work.

But to answer your question, I don't think schools would care if you just took classes outside of a formal postbac, even if you did it at a CC. You have enough in your background to show that you're bright, but if your classes are easy you have to make sure you get almost all A's (including A-'s, but preferably A's), and rock the MCAT (I don't know if they'll still use this in the future tbh).

I have to ask since you mentioned Ivy schools, but do you care about prestige? If you don't and are okay with DO schools or even dental schools, you'll most likely get in somewhere.

EDIT: Also, I will add that doing postbac classes while working full time at a demanding job is very, very hard.

 

[texanaustin]

Hi everyone,
Thank you all for sharing info and advice.
I will address some questions..

1. Why medicine and why now?
   1. I felt very fulfilled from helping people during my time as a medic in the US army. Also, I always wanted to work in medicine, but it wasn’t much of an option for an international student who wanted to stay here in the US. Receiving a Green Card really reignited this dream.
2. Do I care about prestige?
   1. For MD/DO schools, no I do not care about prestige. Only reason I attended an Ivy league school is maybe to have an “easier” time meeting and studying with brilliant folks, and getting my first job here. Top 50 would be more than enough for me, or so I heard from my MD friend.

I am definitely aware of opportunity costs, and fortunately, the company I work for is known for good work-life balance (on average, I spend around 40 hours a week). A couple of courses per semester should be manageable.

EDIT: Also, I don’t see how software engineers will survive 10 years from now (imo, AI will replace majority of us), and am not a fan of working as a people's manager.

 

[Perlman123]

Hi everyone,
Thank you all for sharing info and advice.
I will address some questions..

1. Why medicine and why now?
   1. I felt very fulfilled from helping people during my time as a medic in the US army. Also, I always wanted to work in medicine, but it wasn’t much of an option for an international student who wanted to stay here in the US. Receiving a Green Card really reignited this dream.
2. Do I care about prestige?
   1. For MD/DO schools, no I do not care about prestige. Only reason I attended an Ivy league school is maybe to have an “easier” time meeting and studying with brilliant folks, and getting my first job here. Top 50 would be more than enough for me, or so I heard from my MD friend.

I am definitely aware of opportunity costs, and fortunately, the company I work for is known for good work-life balance (on average, I spend around 40 hours a week). A couple of courses per semester should be manageable.

EDIT: Also, I don’t see how software engineers will survive 10 years from now (imo, AI will replace majority of us), and am not a fan of working as a people's manager.

I'm a software engineer but going to medical school in summer of 2023. I think ultimately you have to ask yourself, how many mindless standups meetings can you withstand. I honestly can't sit through another code review where people argue over code standard. You wonder if this will be worth it, but everyone here is assuming we die around 70. What if you die at age 40 or 50

I say just take postbac first. Who knows maybe after studying for the MCAT for 3months you realized you want to stay in software. That's the approach that I did, just one step at a time. Life is short so you want to make sure you enjoy this journey. Sounds like you not enjoying software, so why not try this postbac path and see what is like. With your income the postbac classes won't be much for you. For me personally, my reasoning for the switch to the premed path is that even if MD doesn't work out, i'm sure you can market your skillset as an MD and software engineer to work at biotech company.

Hope that helps. I don't think anyone can really tell you if this is the right path. But studying medicine will sure be more interesting on like being tech lead or managing engineers like you said

 

[Fluidity of Movement]

Yeah, thank you for your service as a medic. Was it with the US military?

I get the impression that they are from one of the organized US territories, or from American Samoa.


This would be pertinent information though to help them select schools, being a stateside former Whiskey has a lot of weight to it.

 

[Fluidity of Movement]

Hi there and hello! Good to see another Whiskey around here. I'm not an expert and you should seek out the ones around here who are.

So, right off the bat yes you can absolutely be a doctor. I would be targeting DO schools and then look at MD depending on how your grades / mcat goes. You honestly have a lot of advantages that may outweigh other things.

I'll toss this plan out to the community, though I would have an advisor double check your transcript to make sure you don't have a sneaky physics or bio class lying around there somewhere!

summer23: Chem 1 + 2
Fall 23: Bio, Ochem, Physics, Psych
Spr 24: Bio, Ochem, Physics, Soc
Summer24: Biochem + Mcat
Fall 24: Apply DO

You would still need to look at shadowing and some level of volunteer xp if you don't have anything presently. Some alterations could be taking a lower-level biochem in spr24, and just self-studying sociology over summer. But that would be one HELL of a spring to try to do all of that.

If you want to keep working you will need at least two years to do this. The above would already be VERY difficult to do in one year, so having two years even working part time could be difficult.

I won't comment on uni versus CC, there are too many factors at play. I will say though if living too far away is the main issue, then move closer XD

 

[juniordentist]

Omg please don't change to dentistry...

You are on a good work situation. Reasonable hours and 230k a year? This really is a very good situation to be in. If you are not happy with this, I would say there are factors outside of your job that need to be changed. The grass is not always greener...

I am an orthodontist. I did dental school young and then studied 3 years ortho starting at 31. It is so much harder studying older. For many reasons. For me, it was harder to stay focused. I couldn't study long hours like I used to do easily young. And I am passionate about ortho. Also, I struggled with the wasted time. I had some days where I felt "wow I barely learned anything today, I just got caught up in tedious things. I totally could have worked as a dentist today and made $1000. Instead I'm spending money on this degree". You will have countless days like this in a dental degree degree. You will sit there and go "why tf did I leave my high oaying job for this".

Finally, opportunity cost is massive. You are going to go backwards for 4 years. You could earn a million dollars in that time. Instead you want to go 500k in debt. This in itself should be enough to deter you. It is such a bad financial decision. Yes, money isn't everything... but seriously... why do this to yourself? You will NEVER recover financially. I honestly wonder if this is a troll post. Why would you do this terrible financial decision.

You will graduate dental school and realize you are the bottom of the field. It is competitive. It is not an easy path, dentistry is getting harder with every year. You will be the bottom of the chain, competing against 26 year old dentists who have more experience than you.

Please don't so this to yourself

 

[Fluidity of Movement]

You are on a good work situation. Reasonable hours and 230k a year? This really is a very good situation to be in. If you are not happy with this, I would say there are factors outside of your job that need to be changed. The grass is not always greener...

How are they being "set back" any years if going to school and being a doctor is what they want to do? It sounds like every day they stay in CS is a "set back" to me.

Who cares about money if you just want to take care of patients. They will be fine on that front regardless.

The path to medicine is littered with successful people in their 30s who heard the call. The person is clearly one of duty and service. If it's something they truly want, then there isn't a single reason in this world to not go for it.

 

[bomba]

How are they being "set back" any years if going to school and being a doctor is what they want to do? It sounds like every day they stay in CS is a "set back" to me.

Who cares about money if you just want to take care of patients. They will be fine on that front regardless.

The path to medicine is littered with successful people in their 30s who heard the call. The person is clearly one of duty and service. If it's something they truly want, then there isn't a single reason in this world to not go for it.

I would argue that there are significant downsides to pursuing a medical career at any age, but especially for established nontrads. However, if one is fully aware of the personal and financial sacrifices necessary to pursue this path, but still not deterred, then go for it. While @juniordentist was perhaps being a bit dramatic, I didn't find it an unreasonable response given the magnitude of this scenario (e.g., opportunity cost in excess of $1.5 million, etc). Sure, money isn't everything, but let's not pretend it isn't an extremely important factor--especially when considering the implications of this decision for retirement planning. Again, not saying this person shouldn't pursue medicine, just that it's important to be informed, deliberate, and brutally realistic when making such a significant decision.

 

[Fluidity of Movement]

I would argue that there are significant downsides to pursuing a medical career at any age, but especially for established nontrads. However, if one is fully aware of the personal and financial sacrifices necessary to pursue this path, but still not deterred, then go for it. While @juniordentist was perhaps being a bit dramatic, I didn't find it an unreasonable response given the magnitude of this scenario (e.g., opportunity cost in excess of $1.5 million, etc). Sure, money isn't everything, but let's not pretend it isn't an extremely important factor--especially when considering the implications of this decision for retirement planning. Again, not saying this person shouldn't pursue medicine, just that it's important to be informed, deliberate, and brutally realistic when making such a significant decision.

I will pretend that it's not an extremely important factor, because we are all talking about objectively huge salaries. Most people I know make 15-20/hr. The national average is somewhere around 25. Most folks don't have savings over $1,000-10,000.

I don't know what folks are feeling "financially strained" because they won't have saved up millions of dollars by the time they are 50, but it's a perspective reality check compared to the greater population.

Not that I'm judging anyone who desires that level of financial security, but to impose that value on everyone else is a bit myopic imo when we see time and time again that mental health issues and people being trapped in careers they hate leads to poor outcomes.

I will always favor people following what they want to do, and medicine is (almost) always worth it financially. Someone who starts praticing at 50 will still have 15-25 years of career earning potential, depending on when they want to retire. That's a lot of cash, even for a peds.

 

[Snoozles]

I'd say start on the pre-reqs this summer, worst case scenario you take some chemistry/biology and decide it isn't worth it. It will take you a minimum of 2 years before you could potentially matriculate. You can fill that time with the necessary clinical exposure and constantly re-evaluate your goal.

Fwiw, I worked in software before and although it provided a good living and generally satisfying life, the thought of being 40 or 50 years old and still doing a daily stand up or making an inconsequential user story sounded like nightmare fuel. I start med school this summer.

 

[bomba]

I will pretend that it's not an extremely important factor, because we are all talking about objectively huge salaries. Most people I know make 15-20/hr. The national average is somewhere around 25. Most folks don't have savings over $1,000-10,000.

I don't know what folks are feeling "financially strained" because they won't have saved up millions of dollars by the time they are 50, but it's a perspective reality check compared to the greater population.

Not that I'm judging anyone who desires that level of financial security, but to impose that value on everyone else is a bit myopic imo when we see time and time again that mental health issues and people being trapped in careers they hate leads to poor outcomes.

I will always favor people following what they want to do, and medicine is (almost) always worth it financially. Someone who starts praticing at 50 will still have 15-25 years of career earning potential, depending on when they want to retire. That's a lot of cash, even for a peds.

To avoid getting too far off topic from the original intent of this thread, we'll just have to agree to disagree. We have radically different views on personal financial planning, and that's okay.

 

[gyngyn]

1. Am I too old/late to start?
2. Do medical or dental schools value courses taken from CC?
3. How about online degrees?

1. no
2. It's ok for career changers
3. You don't need another degree.

I've worked full time (often more than 80 hours a week) as a physician for 40 years and never made anything close to 230K!

 

[Fluidity of Movement]

To avoid getting too far off topic from the original intent of this thread, we'll just have to agree to disagree. We have radically different views on personal financial planning, and that's okay.

I'm not disagreeing you with you friend

Just stating that vast majority of folks do not have the privilege or good fortune to become multi-millionaires. So for most Americans achieving your level of personal finance views are literally impossible.

I think conversations about money are very on-topic especially for non-trads where financials can be more pressing. Just that someone shouldn't stay in a bad career just for the sake of being rich, when they've already signaled that being rich is not their priority (like OP did several times).

For people to then come on and tell them it's better to be rich, I feel, is toxic to our non-trad community, and is not the type of virtue signaling that embodies this profession. (Not specifically directing this at you or anyone else in particular).

But there are plenty of people who come in here who do need sound financial advice where they have ten kids and a big mortgage and maybe going into medicine is a poor choice for them overall due to finances and them valuing their family and finances more than their career and personal interests.

Peace and blessings to us all.

 

[Vistian]

1. Am I too old/late to start?
2. Do medical or dental schools value courses taken from CC?
3. How about online degrees?

LM 75, 41 y/o former software engineer with 10 MD acceptances this cycle, here.

1. No!
2. Value? No. Accept as fine? Yes.
3. Unsure, but brick-and-mortar is probably better.