Case dropped

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meow1985

Wounded Healer
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Update to everyone who followed my posts about being named in a malpractice case.

The thing got dropped, with prejudice, without any payments or settlements.

But I'm not happy. I'm pi$$ed. Because the damage to my psyche and my reputation is done.

I wish I could counter-sue for malicious prosecution, which I'm quite sure this actually was, but of course the wise thing would be to let sleeping dogs lie. There isn't really a way to undo the damage, and who wants to be "that doctor" who sued their patient?

(To be clear, I have no intention of actually counter-suing.)
 
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Update to everyone who followed my posts about being named in a malpractice case.

The thing got dropped, with prejudice, without any payments or settlements.

But I'm not happy. I'm pi$$ed. Because the damage to my psyche and my reputation is done.

I want to counter-sue for malicious prosecution, which I'm quite sure this actually was, but of course the wise thing would be to let sleeping dogs lie. There isn't really a way to undo the damage, and who wants to be "that doctor" who sued their patient?

A suit against you being dismissed with prejudice is the closest a judge can come to saying "yeah, the case against you was horsesh*t. Short of having them send a baliff round the plaintiff's house to kick them in the shins a few times, what legal redress do you think is even possible?

What financial assets is someone launching suits like this likely to have, do you think?
 
There are some interesting articles about physicians counter suing the attorneys who bring frivolous lawsuits. As I recall even the most egregious example the physician did not triumph.
 
Schedule a consult with a lawyer. Odds are you'll learn what you just summarized, but it could also be therapeutic to get this closure of hearing from the expert.

And you only have to be charged $1000 for it!

Seriously this is what pisses me off about lawyers and the law. I've seen great lawyers really do what great lawyers are supposed to do. E.g. save the day cause they can cite some little known prior case where the same thing happens. I've seen great lawyers. If I were in a jam I'd be happy to get a great lawyer and pay the fee.

Most of the time I see the lawyer do what I could've done such as write a letter to the other party and it costs several hundreds of dollars for a freaking letter. Why? Cause they have to talk to you to understand the situation behind the letter and that takes time, like $200+/hr time. And that's all that had to be done! A LETTER! Most of the time when I'd go to court the lawyer spent just a few minutes going over the case and was giving very minimal brain-power into what they were doing.

People would counter and say doctors charge, yeah but guess what? I'm not writing a freaking letter that most people could've written themselves. Most people don't know how to do a MSE, ROS, and then prescribe the med the science backs up. So then the counter would also be why not write the letter yourself? Cause when the letter is written by a lawyer it adds credibility and legal terror to the other party. That's it. It's not a meaningful substantive thing but more of the emporer's new clothes thing "Oh no it's from a lawyer!"

Also when I stabilize patients, and all they need is a refill I try to minimize contact to save the patient time and money. Lawyers try to extend time as much as possible. You call them for 5 minutes for something stupid like "did you send the letter out?", they charge you for a minimum of 30 minutes of work.

This is why several places hire lawyers on a salary basis so the lawyer can't kill you by the death by 1000 cuts in charges.
 
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Update to everyone who followed my posts about being named in a malpractice case.

The thing got dropped, with prejudice, without any payments or settlements.

But I'm not happy. I'm pi$$ed. Because the damage to my psyche and my reputation is done.

I want to counter-sue for malicious prosecution, which I'm quite sure this actually was, but of course the wise thing would be to let sleeping dogs lie. There isn't really a way to undo the damage, and who wants to be "that doctor" who sued their patient?

Dismissed with prejudice exonnerates you. And even if you had done something wrong, it wouldn't have ruined your reputation. Any damage done to your psyche is really your own issues. You were freaking out about it beyond belief and as multiple people pointed out, your response revealed issues you should probably work on in yourself (not medical advice).
 
Schedule a consult with a lawyer. Odds are you'll learn what you just summarized, but it could also be therapeutic to get this closure of hearing from the expert.

I think the OP would be better suited picking this apart in therapy than a lawyer's office. There's nothing a lawyer is going to offer that isn't going to worsen the impact/conclusion of this.
 
And you only have to be charged $1000 for it!

Seriously this is what pisses me off about lawyers and the law. I've seen great lawyers really do what great lawyers are supposed to do. E.g. save the day cause they can cite some little known prior case where the same thing happens. I've seen great lawyers. If I were in a jam I'd be happy to get a great lawyer and pay the fee.

Most of the time I see the lawyer do what I could've done such as write a letter to the other party and it costs several hundreds of dollars for a freaking letter. Why? Cause they have to talk to you to understand the situation behind the letter and that takes time, like $200+/hr time. And that's all that had to be done! A LETTER! Most of the time when I'd go to court the lawyer spent just a few minutes going over the case and was giving very minimal brain-power into what they were doing.

People would counter and say doctors charge, yeah but guess what? I'm not writing a freaking letter that most people could've written themselves. Most people don't know how to do a MSE, ROS, and then prescribe the med the science backs up. So then the counter would also be why not write the letter yourself? Cause when the letter is written by a lawyer it adds credibility and legal terror to the other party. That's it. It's not a meaningful substantive thing but more of the emporer's new clothes thing "Oh no it's from a lawyer!"

Also when I stabilize patients, and all they need is a refill I try to minimize contact to save the patient time and money. Lawyers try to extend time as much as possible. You call them for 5 minutes for something stupid like "did you send the letter out?", they charge you for a minimum of 30 minutes of work.

This is why several places hire lawyers on a salary basis so the lawyer can't kill you by the death by 1000 cuts in charges.

I don't know, I think if we're going to say that doctors should be paid $200/hr (and private pay, even more), then we need to respect lawyers charge the same for their expertise. Their letter is our prescription.
 
There are cheaper lawyers out there that are good.

No need to hate on lawyers for doing a better job at protecting the integrity of their profession simply because we let ours go. I.e. levels of service, insurance power creep, midlevels, Certificates of Need, etc.
 
There are cheaper lawyers out there that are good.

No need to hate on lawyers for doing a better job at protecting the integrity of their profession simply because we let ours go. I.e. levels of service, insurance power creep, midlevels, Certificates of Need, etc.
Yeah, lawyers are definitely way better at this than us:


 
VA, that is notable snap shot. But we most also be cognizant of future trends. Income could be completely gutted in health care, due to multiple reasons and little semblance of the profession remains. The profession continuing its march forward would be the lawyers that preserved their payment structure.

It's not necessarily about the now but the future trend.
 
VA, that is notable snap shot. But we most also be cognizant of future trends. Income could be completely gutted in health care, due to multiple reasons and little semblance of the profession remains. The profession continuing its march forward would be the lawyers that preserved their payment structure.

It's not necessarily about the now but the future trend.
Physician income has been going up steadily for quite some time.

Now obviously that doesn't mean it will for all time, but I'm not all that worried. Partially because since we have to do residency our numbers are always going to be more limited than most fields (law and pharmacy being the most obvious where the lack of that is a problem). Partially because despite the continued rise of corporate medicine, insurance, CON, and everything we're still doing better than we were 10 years ago. Plus, you and I can go to cash-only quite successfully if it comes to it (I have before and I know you have a PP but can't remember if you take insurance or not, switching to cash only isn't too hard).

The only thing that has to real potential to tank our income in the long run would be socialized medicine done poorly and even then unless cash-only is outlawed we could do OK.
 
There are cheaper lawyers out there that are good.

No need to hate on lawyers for doing a better job at protecting the integrity of their profession simply because we let ours go. I.e. levels of service, insurance power creep, midlevels, Certificates of Need, etc.

Tell the law school graduates earning $40,000 a year with debt comparable to med school doing document review in a windowless basement 50 hours a week that they have done a great job protecting their guild interests.

EDIT: @VA Hopeful Dr already made this point, but it still stands.
 
Physician income has been going up steadily for quite some time.

Now obviously that doesn't mean it will for all time, but I'm not all that worried. Partially because since we have to do residency our numbers are always going to be more limited than most fields (law and pharmacy being the most obvious where the lack of that is a problem). Partially because despite the continued rise of corporate medicine, insurance, CON, and everything we're still doing better than we were 10 years ago. Plus, you and I can go to cash-only quite successfully if it comes to it (I have before and I know you have a PP but can't remember if you take insurance or not, switching to cash only isn't too hard).

The only thing that has to real potential to tank our income in the long run would be socialized medicine done poorly and even then unless cash-only is outlawed we could do OK.

Plenty of physicians on the NHS make out alright with their private practice hours, though there are limitations on how much time they can put in there I believe.
 
Tell the law school graduates earning $40,000 a year with debt comparable to med school doing document review in a windowless basement 50 hours a week that they have done a great job protecting their guild interests.

EDIT: @VA Hopeful Dr already made this point, but it still stands.
The same thing happens in medicine. How many fresh graduates from residency walk themselves into the slaughter of the Big Box Shop as their first gig? Many of the listings you see on the routine job sites churn thru fresh grads. That lawyer chose the 40K job. They can go open their own practice and achieve more. Their guild interests are still intact.
 
The same thing happens in medicine. How many fresh graduates from residency walk themselves into the slaughter of the Big Box Shop as their first gig? Many of the listings you see on the routine job sites churn thru fresh grads. That lawyer chose the 40K job. They can go open their own practice and achieve more. Their guild interests are still intact.

I don’t think you understand the law market.
 
The same thing happens in medicine. How many fresh graduates from residency walk themselves into the slaughter of the Big Box Shop as their first gig? Many of the listings you see on the routine job sites churn thru fresh grads. That lawyer chose the 40K job. They can go open their own practice and achieve more. Their guild interests are still intact.

There's a difference between making 150k doing actual, y'know, medicine for a Big Box and making 50 a year taking vitals or doing ED triage. The lawyer took that job because the alternative was being unemployed. How many psychiatrist who don't have criminal convictions or board sanctions and are willing to work full-time are involuntarily unemployed? because a hell of a lot of JDs are.
 
Plenty of physicians on the NHS make out alright with their private practice hours, though there are limitations on how much time they can put in there I believe.
Right, and a two-tier system would be acceptable if we have to. What I did not want is M4A as proposed which won't allow that.

It's why I said socialized medicine if done poorly.
 
I know some law school graduates who really struggle. I know two who went back into teaching and got PhDs. One then left and went to a 6 month coding bootcamp and makes more than they could have as a professor. JD->PhD->6 month boot camp. Crazy. But he's doing well.
 
Dismissed with prejudice exonnerates you. And even if you had done something wrong, it wouldn't have ruined your reputation. Any damage done to your psyche is really your own issues. You were freaking out about it beyond belief and as multiple people pointed out, your response revealed issues you should probably work on in yourself (not medical advice).
You feeling okay? Your posts lately have quite an edge to them.
 
You feeling okay? Your posts lately have quite an edge to them.

Meh, that wasn't meant to be bitchy. I actually like that poster. I was just stating what we stated at the time that thread was around.

Some of my other posts have been bitchy I guess, but we've had a lot of trolls in recent weeks and I have less tolerance for trolls than I used to.
 
Meh, that wasn't meant to be bitchy. I actually like that poster. I was just stating what we stated at the time that thread was around.

Some of my other posts have been bitchy I guess, but we've had a lot of trolls in recent weeks and I have less tolerance for trolls than I used to.
People are bored
 
There are some interesting articles about physicians counter suing the attorneys who bring frivolous lawsuits. As I recall even the most egregious example the physician did not triumph.

Guys! And Gals!
When I said "it is the wise decision to let it go," I meant that. It upsets me that basically anyone can sue anyone for any reason, and that there isn't a screening modality in place to weed out lawsuits before they start. If what you say is true, there's little recourse in the medical field, and there's no expungement process for civil matters, as far as I know. But I have no intention of doing anything about it - even consulting a lawyer. I'm paying homage to the emotional side of things, but I recognize that my desire is not productive.

And you only have to be charged $1000 for it!

Seriously this is what pisses me off about lawyers and the law. I've seen great lawyers really do what great lawyers are supposed to do. E.g. save the day cause they can cite some little known prior case where the same thing happens. I've seen great lawyers. If I were in a jam I'd be happy to get a great lawyer and pay the fee.

Most of the time I see the lawyer do what I could've done such as write a letter to the other party and it costs several hundreds of dollars for a freaking letter. Why? Cause they have to talk to you to understand the situation behind the letter and that takes time, like $200+/hr time. And that's all that had to be done! A LETTER! Most of the time when I'd go to court the lawyer spent just a few minutes going over the case and was giving very minimal brain-power into what they were doing.

People would counter and say doctors charge, yeah but guess what? I'm not writing a freaking letter that most people could've written themselves. Most people don't know how to do a MSE, ROS, and then prescribe the med the science backs up. So then the counter would also be why not write the letter yourself? Cause when the letter is written by a lawyer it adds credibility and legal terror to the other party. That's it. It's not a meaningful substantive thing but more of the emporer's new clothes thing "Oh no it's from a lawyer!"

Also when I stabilize patients, and all they need is a refill I try to minimize contact to save the patient time and money. Lawyers try to extend time as much as possible. You call them for 5 minutes for something stupid like "did you send the letter out?", they charge you for a minimum of 30 minutes of work.

This is why several places hire lawyers on a salary basis so the lawyer can't kill you by the death by 1000 cuts in charges.

This is a bit off-topic, but if I were to run a cash practice with full control over how I do things, I would charge patients for my time like a lawyer does. Need me to fill out a form or write a letter so you can miss a commitment or get accommodations? That'll be $50 per 10 minutes of time. Some of those forms are wicked-long. Call me after hours in crisis? (In this universe, I have a hybrid DBT model where I'm available during off-hours for skills coaching as well as medical advice). If I talk to you for 15 minutes, that's half the price of an appointment. I need to spend time on the phone with pharmacies and insurance companies because only a doc can solve the problem (vs support staff)? Same deal. Mychart / email? Same calculus. Some people actually do this, though maybe not all of it at once, whether they serve the ultra-rich or are in more run of the mill private practice.

I actually think it's a good thing to charge patients and payers for extra time. Some people need more care, objectively, because they are more ill and need more support and more services. I want to be incentivized to help those people, and I don't want to resent it for giving them "free" care. Like, I want to write that letter. It makes me feel good to have my efforts pay off in the form of a patient getting in for a service, getting the meds they need, staying out of the hospital if there's an easier way for them to stay safe. But all of that is *care* - care others who aren't me can't do. So why can't I be paid for it.

The solution is, I think, is hourly pay and getting paid for *everything* you do, even if it's not within the scope of traditional appointments.

Ok, done soapboxing.
 
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