CAU Psyd Program

[Sarahmariefl]

Hello everyone I'm interested getting a Psyd in either clinical or counseling psych. I live in florida and I looked at many universities I know a few people that went to argosy in tampa. Also think the gre is pointless so I prefer not to take it. My undergrad GPA is a 3.8 and I am saying that because I know certain people who think that others want to avoid the gre are the unintelligent ones.

Anyways I am looking into Carlos albizu university. They don't have a bad reputation it's a small university that doesn't even offer student housing and the Psyd programs are APA accredited the school is also regionally accredited does anyone attend/attended this school?

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[erg923]

I would be weary of a university that has no tenure track for its faculty. Suggests low quality/unaccomplished faculty, high turnoverk, etc.

And I dont know who you asked, but apparently many internship training programs agree that there students aint that hot...
http://appic.org/Portals/0/downloads/APPIC_Match_Rates_2011-14_by_Univ.pdf

PS: No one likes the GRE. But we took it anyway. Suck it up.

 

[MCParent]

Hello everyone I'm interested getting a Psyd in either clinical or counseling psych. I live in florida and I looked at many universities I know a few people that went to argosy in tampa but I prefer not to attend that college.

Nova southeastern univ is competitive and it's the most expensive I also think the gre is pointless so I prefer not to take it. My undergrad GPA is a 3.8 and I am saying that because I know certain people who think that others want to avoid the gre are the unintelligent ones.

Anyways I am looking into Carlos albizu university. They don't have a bad reputation it's a small university that doesn't even offer student housing and the Psyd programs are APA accredited the school is also regionally accredited does anyone attend/attended this school?

I'm not sure why you think it doesn't have a bad reputation. Erg posted the match rates; it also has what should be a terrifying EPPP match rate for potential applicants; http://c.ymcdn.com/sites/www.asppb.net/resource/resmgr/EPPP_/2012_ASPPB_Exam_Scores_by_Do.pdf

 

[erg923]

Its also worth noting that GRE is not "pointless" obviously, as robust research exist that shows it predicts sucess in th first years of grad school. Beyond that, its not much.

But it is a useful, standardized screener, which is exactly what you need when you have to whittle 200 applications to 50 applications.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

be wary, that school is considered one of the worst accredited programs.

 

[WisNeuro]

Yeah, I've seen a handful of applications from here for internship and postdoc positions, they don't even make the first cut.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

CAU has a very poor reputation within FL and also nationally. The APA-acred. match rates and EPPP rates are also quite poor from what I recall.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

Thanks for everybody's response, I guess I overlooked a lot of things. So therefore I will not be applying to CAU! I did take the time to look at Nova's match rates and I am not impressed, their rates should be much higher. I was shocked to even see that Argosy in Tampa has much better match rates!

 

[erg923]

Nova's Ph.D stats look ok. Overpriced of course....

 

[Sarahmariefl]

Nova's Ph.D stats look ok. Overpriced of course....

Sadly, I am more interested in a Psyd. Nova may be a little too overpriced for me, especially for those rates. With the tuition they charge, I would expect to see 100% matched to APA internships.

 

[erg923]

Novas Ph.D is about is clinically geared as its gets, from what I've heard

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

NSU's match numbers have tanked in the past 6-8 yrs, which should be very concerning to anyone looking at the program. Being able to secure an APA-acred. internship is the standard in the field, so any program that cannot confidently do that should be avoided like the plague.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

NSU's match numbers have tanked in the past 6-8 yrs, which should be very concerning to anyone looking at the program. Being able to secure an APA-acred. internship is the standard in the field, so any program that cannot confidently do that should be avoided like the plague.

Agreed! Considering that I am only interested in a Psyd, would anyone like to give me some options as to what university I can actually apply too? As you can see Florida does not have a very good....educational system, it would also be kind of difficult to relocate to another state.

 

[WisNeuro]

Agreed! Considering that I am only interested in a Psyd, would anyone like to give me some options as to what university I can actually apply too? As you can see Florida does not have a very good....educational system, it would also be kind of difficult to relocate to another state.

For a Psyd in Florida? The only one I would kind of recommend is FIT. If that doesn't work, it would either be going out of state or picking another career.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Agreed! Considering that I am only interested in a Psyd, would anyone like to give me some options as to what university I can actually apply too? As you can see Florida does not have a very good....educational system, it would also be kind of difficult to relocate to another state.

Unfortunately, if you're geographically inflexible, the odds are going to be stacked against you every step of the way. One of the most important aspects of your competitiveness and attractiveness to sites at all training levels is "fit" with the program. If you're geographically-constrained, it can be very difficult (unless you're lucky or there are a lot of faculty/programs nearby) to demonstrate a strong fit based on research and clinical interests.

Also (and this speaks to your 100% internship match expectation), the internship application and matching process in psychology is becoming very competitive. Only approximately 75% of all applicants matched at all between 2011-2014 (and the numbers for the 10 years prior to that were very similar), and of those who did match, only approximately 75% again matched to accredited internships based on the limited number of these sports (91% for Ph.D. students, 57% for Psy.D. students, and 67% for Ed.D. students). Most folks tend to apply to around 15 sites, and I can almost guanratee you aren't going to find 15 sites in a single state for which you'll be competitive and a good fit.

And then you need to consider potential moves for post-doc and employment. This can be a bit more flexible than grad school and internship, but I think most people here would agree that when it comes to jobs, you can usually only pick or dictate (at most) two from: 1) location, 2) pay, 3) type of work/position. The exception might be setting up your own private practice, although that's a whole different ballgame.

Edit: And I agree with WisNeuro's post. If you do opt to go out of state, both Baylor and Rutgers are often touted as two of the "premier" Psy.D. programs. There are a handful of others that have been mentioned in similar threads previously (you could search the forums to find these), and there's also PGSP in CA...although like Nova, it's very expensive for both tuition and cost of living.

 

[MCParent]

It's so refreshing to see a poster who takes in relevant new data and appropriately adjusts their positions I was half afraid the response would be "I only want to hear good things about the program!"

 

[Sarahmariefl]

It's so refreshing to see a poster who takes in relevant new data and appropriately adjusts their positions I was half afraid the response would be "I only want to hear good things about the program!"

I'm not sure if this is directed towards me, but I know there are certain people on here that are WAY more knowledgeable than I am. So I will take what advice I am getting for my own good. Hopefully, that would make for a great psychologist

 

[Sarahmariefl]

For a Psyd in Florida? The only one I would kind of recommend is FIT. If that doesn't work, it would either be going out of state or picking another career.

I noticed you said "kind of recommend". What do you mean by that? Would FIT not be much of a good choice?

 

[Sarahmariefl]

Also, undergrad obviously for most people isn't too difficult. Would anyone mind sharing how the level of difficulty is for graduate course work? Honestly, I have kind of low self confidence when it comes to education.

EDIT: So no one would recommend Argosy in Tampa?

 

[MCParent]

Agreed! Considering that I am only interested in a Psyd, would anyone like to give me some options as to what university I can actually apply too? As you can see Florida does not have a very good....educational system, it would also be kind of difficult to relocate to another state.

There are a lot of good programs in FL. I went to UF. UF's clinical program is pretty research focused but they still produce a lot of clinicians. My program in counseling psych at UF was also quite research focused, though we still produced a lot of clinicians. USF's counseling psych program is strong as well.

 

[MCParent]

I'm not sure if this is directed towards me, but I know there are certain people on here that are WAY more knowledgeable than I am. So I will take what advice I am getting for my own good. Hopefully, that would make for a great psychologist

It was; it's just that often this kind of question isn't really a question, and the poster becomes upset at being disagreed with. Yes, I think that attitude will make you a better psychologist and a better person.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

There are a lot of good programs in FL. I went to UF. UF's clinical program is pretty research focused but they still produce a lot of clinicians. My program in counseling psych at UF was also quite research focused, though we still produced a lot of clinicians. USF's counseling psych program is strong as well.

I would prefer programs more into the clinical aspect, I think I can learn better that way. I really wish USF offered a Psyd, but I am not too interested in the Phd programs.

 

[CaliMac]

I would prefer programs more into the clinical aspect, I think I can learn better that way. I really wish USF offered a Psyd, but I am not too interested in the Phd programs.

There are many misconceptions about the PsyD degree; I have learned a lot from this board. You may consider searching for something like "PhD vs PsyD" here and see what it yields.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I would prefer programs more into the clinical aspect, I think I can learn better that way. I really wish USF offered a Psyd, but I am not too interested in the Phd programs.

One thing I would suggest considering is that even in some of the more research-focused programs, most students tend to go on to primarily clinical careers. That, and most Ph.D. programs nowadays would be considered very balanced in that they offer, on average, as much or more clinical experience as Psy.D. programs (with the added bonus of funding). Thus, by including Ph.D. programs in clinical and counseling psych in your search, you're going to expand your range of options quite considerably.

 

[erg923]

All but two people who have responded have PhDs. We all practice and only one is a full time academic. Half of scientist-practitioner model is "practitioner," right?

 

[DynamicDidactic]

As AA mentions, data shows that there is no difference in clinical hours between PsyD and PhD. However, PhDs have significantly higher internships match percentages and lower failure rates for the EPPP. These are probably our best indirect measures of clinical acumen during training.

You state that "I would prefer programs more into the clinical aspect" and I am not sure how that would not happen in a clinical PhD program. However, some students want less emphasis on research. However, scientific is not antithetical to clinical. But forgetting the difference in degrees you probably just want to look for programs with the good funding, accredited-sites match rates, and EPPP scores. Past that, the difference in the letters is less important.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

I know that for the Phd it involves doing a dissertation and it is primarily focused on research, so it is because of that as to why I feel no interest in it.

 

[erg923]

Actually PhDs have more predoc clinical hours, generally. Partially accounted for by taking one year longer than psyd programs though. The only difference I noticed when taking to Psyds is less science, not more clinical knowledge/skill/experience. Psyd curriculum may offer elective classes that are more clinically geared.

 

[erg923]

and it is primarily focused on research,

Then how am I practicing? Lol

 

[DynamicDidactic]

Actually PhDs have more predoc clinical hours, generally.

do we have anything showing that the difference is significant?

 

[erg923]

Psyd have dissertations too by the way....

 

[erg923]

do we have anything showing that the difference is significant?

APPIC 2011 survey data. Sig? Idk. 100 more or something like that?

 

[DynamicDidactic]

APPIC 2011 survey data. Sig? Idk. 100 more or something like that?

I know about that. But I always just viewed it as even since we don't have the SDs and can't say one is significantly greater.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I know that for the Phd it involves doing a dissertation and it is primarily focused on research, so it is because of that as to why I feel no interest in it.

Keep in mind that the daily practice of psychology (or, more accurately, psychological science) requires frequent use of scientific principles, techniques, and knowledge. This is why active participation in the scientific process is still required in the majority of clinical, counseling, and school psychology programs.

Also, I'd personally just suggest you try to be open-minded about research. "Research" can look very different as an undergrad vs. as a grad student vs. as a post-doc vs. as a practicing professional. Interest can also significant wax or wane depending on the specific subject matter.

To answer your earlier question about coursework: grad school coursework in psychology is significantly more difficult than undergrad coursework in psychology. However, at least in my experience (and that of most of my classmates), the coursework wasn't the most difficult part of grad school. Quite the opposite, actually. Everything else we did, in my mind, was more strenuous (and, at times, invigorating) both intellectually and time-wise.

 

[erg923]

Competent practice of clinical psychological science requires interest and competence in the basic science of psychology, including methodology, statistical principles, contingent and instrumental learning theories, psychometrics, etcetera. There is not really away around this.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

I've read in several places that Psyd's do not require dissertations like Phd's, now I am confused on what degree I should actually apply for. Most people also say that Phd's are most competitive is that even true?

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I've read in several places that Psyd's do not require dissertations like Phd's, now I am confused on what degree I should actually apply for. Most people also say that Phd's are most competitive is that even true?

The average Ph.D. program is going to be more competitive than the average Psy.D. program, yes. This is in large part due to the smaller class sizes, which is also why Ph.D. programs are generally able to fully fund their students.

The dissertation requirements are going to vary widely from program to program, and you'll probably have to check each one out individually. I can say that from my perspective and in my experiences, applications of folks not completing empirical dissertations are typically ranked much lower than those from folks who completed a dissertation.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Some background info on the difference in degrees: http://psychologygradschool.weebly.com

 

[Sarahmariefl]

Keep in mind that the daily practice of psychology (or, more accurately, psychological science) requires frequent use of scientific principles, techniques, and knowledge. This is why active participation in the scientific process is still required in the majority of clinical, counseling, and school psychology programs.

Also, I'd personally just suggest you try to be open-minded about research. "Research" can look very different as an undergrad vs. as a grad student vs. as a post-doc vs. as a practicing professional. Interest can also significant wax or wane depending on the specific subject matter.

To answer your earlier question about coursework: grad school coursework in psychology is significantly more difficult than undergrad coursework in psychology. However, at least in my experience (and that of most of my classmates), the coursework wasn't the most difficult part of grad school. Quite the opposite, actually. Everything else we did, in my mind, was more strenuous (and, at times, invigorating) both intellectually and time-wise.

Do you mind telling what else you did? Now I feel even more nervous, if I can not handle the level of difficulty.

 

[erg923]

This thread is filled with truth.

Yes, psyds require a dissertation. Sometimes is a scaled down version, but it's there. Yes , phd are generally more competitive.

 

[erg923]

Do you mind telling what else you did? Now I feel even more nervous, if I can not handle the level of difficulty.

What do you want to know, exactly?

 

[DynamicDidactic]

I know that for the Phd... is primarily focused on research,

I believe for-profit schools have done a good job spreading misinformation about PhD programs. The scientist-practitioner model posits that professional psychologists should be knowledgeable in both scientific research and clinical practice, and their work should reflect this integration. It's not that clinical work plays second fiddle to science.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

What do you want to know, exactly?

In undergrad you basically don't even have to study to pass your courses (sadly). How often does one need to study in grad school? Does it take up your whole day, on top of participating in other things?

 

[erg923]

In undergrad you basically don't even have to study to pass your courses (sadly). How often does one need to study in grad school? Does it take up your whole day, on top of participating in other things?

Well, I hope you aren't suggesting you want to get a doctorate where you barely have to study/work?! That would be a great way to hurt patients though...

Graduate school in this field is full time, 40+ hours per week. Reading, studying, writing, researching, seeing patients. If you can find a short cut let me know.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

Well, I hope you aren't suggesting you want to get a doctorate where you barely have to study/work?! That would be a great way to hurt patients though...

Graduate school is full time, 40+ hours per week. Reading, studying, writing, researching, seeing patients. If you can find a short cut let me know.

Ha no way! I have already been told that you cant BS through grad school. I did not realize that it was like a full job, but now I understand.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Ha no way! I have already been told that you cant BS through grad school. I did not realize that it was like a full job, but now I understand.

Well, depending on the program, I don't know if I'd go that far. There are certainly classes where you can get by with minimal (by grad school standards, mind you) work. However, the difference is that you'd really only be hurting yourself and your future patients at that point, so it's in your bests interests to just try to learn as much as you can. You'll very possibly feel overwhelmed simply by just how much it is you're told to know, read, learn, etc., particularly during the first year or two. Heck, I still feel that way at times. However, over time you'll eventually learn that neither you nor anyone else knows everything. The purpose of grad school isn't to teach you said everything, but rather to turn you into an active, lifelong learner so that you have the tools to seek out and/or create that knowledge for yourself.

As for what you actually do, as erg said, it's generally a full-time job, which is why most funded programs won't let you hold employment outside of school. I honestly don't know how much time I spent studying, but if I averaged it out over the course of grad school, it'd probably equate to a couple hours outside of class for every hour spent physically in class. Beyond that, as erg mentioned, you'll be spending time reading (for class, research, patient work, etc.), conducting research, teaching/TAing, conducting clinical activities, writing (lots and lots of writing), and participating in supervision.

 

[erg923]

I did not realize that it was like a full job, but now I understand.

Which is likely an unintended consequences of the Psy.D. training model. The notion that you can subtract all this stuff and have it still be a commensurate degree.

 

[WisNeuro]

I noticed you said "kind of recommend". What do you mean by that? Would FIT not be much of a good choice?

I don't recommend PsyD in general. Just no reason for it in today's world. It may have served a purpose 20+ years ago. But there are just too many good balanced PhD programs that offer full tuition remission plus a stipend.

 

[Sarahmariefl]

I don't recommend PsyD in general. Just no reason for it in today's world. It may have served a purpose 20+ years ago. But there are just too many good balanced PhD programs that offer full tuition remission plus a stipend.

Well it's a new program, what makes you say "it may have served a purpose 20+ years ago?"



Thanks for your information, well thanks to everybody really. I only posted this thread today and got great feedback, I was so sure about getting a Psyd but now I am more open minded to getting either a Phd or a Psyd.

 

[ikibah]

This is the best thread ever. All threads should be like this.